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JohnMcGreal

We were never likely to get the Brexit we wanted, but it wasn't helped by the bitching and whining of the losers. If negotiations had been led by someone who believed in Brexit, backed by a team that supported Brexit, and with the backing of the people for the democratic referendum result we would ...

JohnMcGreal

RingoMcCartney wrote:
17, 410, 742 Brits disagree

That doesn't mean they're right.

JohnMcGreal

This sad story demonstrates the appalling state of politics in this country. We won two world wars by pulling together and putting our differences aside. We now face a similar potential seismic change to the nation and all we see, at a time when all parties should be pulling together, all sorts of ...

JohnMcGreal

ecc wrote:Is he really just plain thick or a damn good actor?

To his brain-dead supporters, he's a highly intelligent man. To everyone else with a functioning brain, he's as thick as pig 5hit.

JohnMcGreal

there sorted for you macca! Just out of interest John. Do you agree with Laura Smith Labour MP when she declares to, an easily roused, far left audience- "Comrades, we must topple this cruel and callous Tory government as soon as we can. “And if we can’t get a general election we should organise wi...

JohnMcGreal

There is an alternative to not collecting rubbish for weeks, to not burying the dead, to power supply outages and cuts, to the national transport network being ground to a halt and the whole nation brought to its knees by this " little push " It's something that you don't appear to be over familiar...

JohnMcGreal

RingoMcCartney wrote:They used to be the British working class party.

They've become the Islington dinner party.

They won over 11.3 million votes in last year's general election. That's one big Islington dinner party...

JohnMcGreal

Hats off to all the Clarets who still bother to turn up at cup matches these days, you're pretty much the only ones associated with BFC who do.

JohnMcGreal

RingoMcCartney wrote:Fair play to you.

But there is an alternative view.

A no deal Brexit may not turn out to be the "cliff edge" the doom mongers promise us. It may actually be a succesful economic spring board.

Many obviously don't want to find out. Optimists like me, are.

You misspelt 'reckless fools'

JohnMcGreal

Change the thread title to 'Labour betray their remain voters'

http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2018/09 ... -stitch-up" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

JohnMcGreal

I get all that & understand certain parts, it's become a growing concern that May being a remainer wasn't the appropriate person to be leading the show as her judgement & leadership was skewed from what the remit was supposed to be, on that basis everything FROM the initial crucial vote hasn't made...

JohnMcGreal

What would that acheive? If you're against labour it makes more sense to want another party to win, I don't think I will be the only person to feel that way if labour endorses the second referendum, as a leaver I'm not frightened of the decision being overturned it's the principle of not respecting...

JohnMcGreal

Jakubclaret wrote:Some people might not want to decide again & actually feel the first vote should be enough & respected, I certainly do.

Don't vote in the next one then, if that's how you feel.

JohnMcGreal

SmudgetheClaret wrote:87% of Labour members not voters I wonder what percentage of labour voters ticked the leave box ..

It's a smaller percentage than the number of conservative voters who ticked the remain box.

JohnMcGreal

Hart 8
Lowton 7
Tarkowski 8
Mee 7
Taylor 7
Gudmundsson 8
Westwood 8
Cork 7
Lennon 9
Vokes 7
Vydra 8

Wood 6
Barnes 8

What a difference a week makes. That was a very, very good performance, and the perfect response to last week's showing at Wolves. The season starts now.

JohnMcGreal

I don't fully understand the goings on in this Brexit debate, but Tusks Instagram photo of the cake speaks volumes for the type of people we're dealing with. Time to tell them to get ******. No comprehending required, pond life personified. Who would have thought that after all these years mocking ...

JohnMcGreal

claretandy wrote:Again, show me where the leave campaign used the word "promise"

Are you pretending to be stupid, or are you for real?

JohnMcGreal

I spotted that dsr as well...the clear reluctance of some to do all they can, to avoid using the phrase 'second referendum'...it always make me smile.. :) John McGreal prefers the phrase above..'refer this back to the general public..' WTF ? Call it what it is man..have some conviction. If there is...

JohnMcGreal

And it has to be said, you refuse to accept that the Brexit that was promised before the referendum is not the one that is going to be delivered. It's easy to forget this amid all the noise, but it's such an important point that bears repeating over and over again. What the Leave campaign promised ...

JohnMcGreal

hampsteadclaret wrote:They want/need us as much as we want/need them - they do NOT hold all the aces...both sides want a [decent] deal.

Ah. They used to need us more than we needed them. But now they need us as much as we need them.

Are you slowly climbing down, Hampstead?

JohnMcGreal

That speech sounded like a desperate cry for help.

JohnMcGreal

Lancasterclaret wrote:One of the most annoying things about this whole show is listening to Brexit MPs saying "this would be so much easier if Ireland just left as well".

Who said that? I must have missed it.

JohnMcGreal

A hard Brexit is the only way out of this mess & for may to step down, regarding Johnson & gove I think they became marginalised in a sense disregarding position when may got the keys to 10 downing Street, although as of late gove seems to be snaking his way back in & seems to have may onside. No i...

JohnMcGreal

No workable plan was in place prior as Cameron & his cohorts were so self assured & arrogant leave actually winning wasn't even a possibility, hence the lack of a cohesive structured plan & the divisive nature of the politicians/electorate has only exacerbated the EU issue more. You'd think that al...

JohnMcGreal

claretandy wrote:we would have to vote for it too, May has said there won't be one so unless she goes then there won't be one.

That's nice, but ultimately the decision to have another referendum won't be hers:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ope-eu?CMP

JohnMcGreal

claretandy wrote:Not enough time for a second referendum

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ore-brexit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Which is why the EU are prepared to suspend or extend Article 50.

JohnMcGreal

I'm sticking to thinking that another vote vote before the first one is even enacted, would be as democratically unconstitutional , as no government has been elected on a mandate to permit it. As it would be increasingly divisive. And this will put the Remoaner cat amongst the Remoaner pigeons. Wou...

JohnMcGreal

So the Chequers deal is dead in the water, and we're back to leaving without a deal.

I'm starting to think that another vote is inevitable.

JohnMcGreal

Afraid? I'm not. But the 2016 referendum took place on the basis it was a once in a generation vote. Both sides new the ground rules. There was no pre-agreed criteria that if the percentage vote was a certain parameters , it would be have another try. There is already a massive disconnect between t...

JohnMcGreal

Ringo - why are you so afraid of letting the general public have a final say in this process?

JohnMcGreal

But the "Remain" side won't have an ACTUAL DEAL. I know there is hope that the EU will be a tremendously benevolent organisation willing to bend over backwards to help us back in; but the evidence suggests otherwise. For the umpteenth time, they won't be helping us back in or letting us back in, be...

JohnMcGreal

RingoMcCartney wrote:All well and good.

The referendum has already happened.

We're out.

Are we?

JohnMcGreal

When it comes down to it people in the main voted on how they believed being in the EU affected them in their job in their town on their street. If you were affected badly you by in large voted to leave If you weren’t affected you voted remain Ultimately for all the intellectual arguments it is qui...

JohnMcGreal

Wanted a new referendom because you lost is like us wanting a rerun of the recent game v Man U . We lost and so did those who voted remain. Time to move on.As a leave voter I am angry its dragging on so long. That's not the reason why we should have a new referendum. The case for a new people's vot...

JohnMcGreal

Hart 8
Bardsley 3
Tarkowski 7
Mee 6
Taylor 3
Lennon 3
Cork 4
Hendrick 5
Gudmundsson 4
Vokes 5
Barnes 3

Vydra 6

We were very lucky to come away from that with just a 1-0 defeat, because that ought to have been a right pasting.

JohnMcGreal

Poor Nigel must really be on his arse if he's struggling to attract crowds in the most racist country in the world.

JohnMcGreal

Now I know why I left England almost 40 years ago. The Left Wing PC brigade have overtaken it, like they are trying to do in most of Europe however, things will eventually become balanced as in Italy & Sweden etc. Time to unsubscribe from Clarets Mad - it used to be about BFC and the local area. Pl...

JohnMcGreal

But I think you overexaggerate the influence of the press. Brexit had the press onside - maybe. But Remain had the government and the BBC and probably social media too - facebook and twitter tend to follow what is trendy, and EU membership is trendy especially among the young. Well, Leave had the g...

JohnMcGreal

I challenge any remainer to tell me, accurately, what the EU will look like in 5 years. It's a political behemoth and at this point, virtually unstoppable. It's own defence forces. More power over countries who don't fall into line with their principles. More centralisation. Expansion. Even, and th...

JohnMcGreal

I don't think that there's any evidence anywhere to support that view. Speaking personally it's way down my list, (though should probably be higher). Amongst my reasons would be: 1. Our international standing and reputation. 2. National security 3. Standing shoulder to shoulder with our neighbours....

JohnMcGreal

Maybe it's a longer term view. People often make decisions to make themselves poorer in the short term so they can be better off in the long term - eg. leaving a reasonably paid job with few prospects to take a worse paid job with better prospects. But how long is the longer term view, dsr? As a co...

JohnMcGreal

All of the projections I saw indicated initial turbulence. I can't vouch for what you read. Obviously it all fit on the side of 1 bus, so I can understand your silly comments right now. Surely nobody on either side expected leaving would result in economic stability (or gain) in the 18 months/2/5/1...

JohnMcGreal

Sorry to butt in but John Let’s not forget the not so small matter of approximately 40 Billion to leave? My post was laced with sarcasm. I always knew that leaving the EU would hurt this country. It's the main reason why I didn't vote for it. What's surprising is that there are people like Damo who...

JohnMcGreal

I voted to take a financial hit for the benefit of my grand children. I'd say I'm on that side already. Though I'm sure you would disagree What financial hit? I thought we'd be £350 million per week richer? I thought you all voted to leave the EU so things could get better? Are you saying you delib...

JohnMcGreal

dsr wrote:I think this belongs on the "ridiculous blind optimism" thread. I don't see any evidence from the other 27 that they are all well-disposed to the UK, to the extent that they will be happy to let is back in with no concessions at all.

But they wouldn't be letting us back in. We haven't left.

JohnMcGreal

What would be the EU position on the Euro opt-out, the Schengen opt-out, and the budget rebate? You mean all the things that made our EU membership the best deal we'd ever get, anywhere? I'd hope that they'd be prepared to let us continue with our existing arrangement, but I imagine our politicians...

JohnMcGreal

If we voted remain in a second referendum (which, of course, won’t happen) we would get right royally screwed by the EU. Why? Because we have shown that large parts of the country wanted out but we have voted to come crawling back, which will indicate to the Euro elite that we need them more than t...

JohnMcGreal

I agree with the post that said Dyche has cost us a chance in Europe by covering his own backside. I don't agree with that. The team he put out in Athens was well in the game until it self-destructed in a crazy 15 minute spell. The team he put out on Thursday night created enough chances to win the...

JohnMcGreal

Murger wrote:A complete joke if we let him go. Who plays on the wing if Lennon gets injured?

Joe Hart.

JohnMcGreal

Pretty sure there was talk from the club either last season or maybe even the season before that they had begun to set up a scouting network in Europe to identify transfer targets.

Yesterday just got me thinking about it, and seeing as it's produced bugger all, do we assume it's been binned off?

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