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KateR

martin_p wrote:Ok, tell me the terms of the deal then. Are we leaving with a deal? No deal?

Objection m'lord, argumentative!!

ohhh wait a minute, now I see a theme

KateR

It works absolutely fine for the principle point I was making, and you know full well it wasn't an analogy for the intricacies of Brexit as a whole. All analogies are reductive, and do me a favour and point out where it falls down before jumping on your high horse. First of all I do not have a high...

KateR

Why would they or anyone want a party political general election to resolve the binary cross party referendum issue of Brexit? Confirmatory referendum, bring it on I say. Love it :) Yes the opposition don't want a GE because they are afraid of losing, so let's change it in to something else, I know...

KateR

Too early to read anything into it. Its a positive that they haven't decided there is no point continuing though. But it always falls apart when the UK PM talks to the DUP/ERG when it comes to any compromises. (essentially its an customs border in the Irish sea) Let's hope it leads to something in ...

KateR

If you're not a member of the golf club, suddenly it's a lot more expensive to play a round. Besides political posturing I find the word "friendliness" a strange one in this context. It's simply about protecting the integrity of the "club" and its members. You can still play, but it'll cost you. so...

KateR

To be fair, the Remain side was a lot more realistic about the EU's likelihood of being friendly and co-operative. Lancaster told us from an early stage that the EU wouldn't play ball, because to them the political aspects, especially the loss of power, would outweigh for them the economic aspects....

KateR

No one claims to have all the answers But you can base your answers on reality or you can base them on stuff that isn't true or won't happen. Very very true, but you can also base your answer/thoughts on all the experts on both sides of the argument, those same experts who are guessing as to what w...

KateR

Sorry If it's been done before. The YouGov analysis for the Evening Standard of 300 surveys shows “concrete” evidence that the country shifted against quitting the European bloc https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/brexit-news-latest-britain-against-leaving-eu-as-poll-of-polls-says-most-now-wan...

KateR

I never said there would be a 27 mile tailback. The issue in Ireland is that there cannot be a hard border.....tailbacks are irrelevant. Switzerland (as you yourself say) have a hard border....so that is no good as a model. I agree you never said that I was answer part you and others with my post, ...

KateR

The Swiss Confederation has adopted various provisions of European Union law in order to participate in the Union's single market, without joining as a member state. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Switzerland–European_Union_relations ---- There is no evidence that we'll get any form of FTA without a...

KateR

martin_p wrote:Because Norway accepts a lot of EU rules and regulations despite not being a member.

I deliberately did not mention Norway because it's not a good example, so I am not sure why you brought them back in to discussion rather than answering the 2 questions I asked.

KateR

Any system must pass the test of proving that there is nothing in the lorry that doesn't appear on the paperwork. This will always need a physical check somewhere. How does Trusted Traders work then? How do Switzerland manage there border, they have a hard border, yet somehow they don't have a 27 m...

KateR

Are you referring to the 1960s or pre 92? Your company may have had to apply for a visa, in a specific country, for you to do a specific job and perhaps have to include in that application why you specifically qualify. That is so far away from being able to go to any EU country and apply for any jo...

KateR

I’m sorry but would have to disagree with your assumption that it’s part of the slow evolution of a country, it’s an assumption that a country could possibly have chosen that route, but taking quality of water, for example, the U.K. were forced to make improvements to meet EU standards, there is no...

KateR

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/09/boris-johnson-could-be-summoned-london-assembly-jennifer-arcuri I’d like to see him answer questions about the failed garden bridge too - forty million in public money went where exactly. The Arcuri questions involve a lot less money, but there will ...

KateR

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2019/oct/09/brexit-latest-news-boris-johnson-plans-emergency-saturday-sitting-of-parliament-after-eu-summit-live-news - so if Johnson is ruling out campaigning for a no deal exit, isn’t he (according to some on here) undermining his own negotiating position...

KateR

We could have walked away from negotiations yes, but we always had other options when we did so. It was never a case of walking away and making ourselves poorer, it was ‘we‘ll walk away and talk to another company instead’ (usually for the award of contracts in my case). This is why I feel it’s wro...

KateR

I have always gone with a successful negotiation is where both sides are happy with the outcome absolutely agree, no question. My experience has been that it is what we ended up with in 99% of negotiations. However one bad experience where red lines and legalities ensured we were no able to execute...

KateR

Absolutely it will be the same in terms of what we give to and get from the EU. There’ll be some grumpiness for a while, the the EU don’t want us to leave so I expect the overwhelming feeling on their side is one of relief. I’ve searched for where you’ve asked me the question before and you haven’t...

KateR

This is a bizarre argument to make. Trying to suggest the ability to work in any EU country without needing a visa is nothing to do with joining the EU is so clearly incorrect that I don't really understand why you're trying to make that argument. Aggi, sorry I was obviously not clear I replied on ...

KateR

The ability to work in any EU country without needing a visa, free healthcare in any EU country, improved health and safety rules, cleaner water, cheaper produce, increased investment in our local infrastructure, EAW, cheap flights, cheap labour, more flexible workforce, cultural investment, expans...

KateR

If you can point to where you’ve asked me this question before I’ll apologise, but you haven’t. The benefits are simple, frictionless, tariff free trade with the EU has made food and good cheaper. Certain EU directives have helped, such as abolishing mobile phone roaming charges in the EU or the wo...

KateR

But Johnson has been sacked from jobs more than once for lying. I thought his strained relationship with the truth was pretty well established! Oh, and if you can point me to the articles showing the success of leave I’ll happily read and debate them. Martin, how about just for once you answer the ...

KateR

Lancasterclaret wrote:At some stage you might accept that Labours problem isn't Brexit.

I agree totally however Brexit has exposed Labours problems in my opinion.

KateR

Give over man - your embarrassing yourself. Just look how Lancaster is trying to be reasonable and have a think. You are wasting your breath, both Andrew and Martin are remainers at all costs, anything that delays leaving is good and supported, they continue to post only what other remainers or art...

KateR

If Borris were to get a deal what exactly can he campaign on? As it currently stands it's "People v Parliament", but once we leave what next? If BJ gets a deal then parliament has to ratify it so a lot depends on what happens at that point Assuming parliament do ratify it then surely JC & Co will b...

KateR

Moving on from NI discussions and thoughts, assuming we get to the "we can't agree a deal scenario, highly likely and we then go extension, regardless of length but let's just assume 3 months to 2 years. Can anyone see a deal being reached within the extension? I can't but would like other inputs/th...

KateR

The irony of the current situation is that if NI had a referendum to stay in the EU's SM and CU they would probably vote to stay in (trade border in the Irish Sea). The DUP obviously wouldn't be happy but that is democracy. Massive financial investment into NI might sweeten the bitter pill. This in...

KateR

None of the above There is a Brexit deal out there that means the referendum result is respected and the GFA is unaffected. That has been the reality since 2016 as the prerequisite for any deal (been said a lot on here) Mays deal sorted it (which is why I backed it, even though its far from ideal) ...

KateR

Nope Again, you need to understand that a "No Deal" is the Uk choice, and the EU have to react to it. You won't, but it doesn't matter as you are not likely to change your mind. The problem you have is that everyone who is as capable of ignoring reality like you, Ringo, Crosspool, Colburn etc is on...

KateR

I have no idea why they are supported by those who want a deal. A lot of people on here say they want a deal, but will talk up stuff that is completely unrealistic and then blame the EU when they confirm it isn't realistic. To me, if you can make that distinction and still ignore the reality, then ...

KateR

What if Labour were allowed to negotiate a Norway style deal that met the referendum criteria of leaving the EU and the EU agreed to it. Would you expect the ERG to support it in Parliament on the basis it will be getting Brexit done and allow us to enact the vote? You need to remember that this To...

KateR

So it's not reductive to simply count the number of times a deal was rejected in order to construct an argument that this one should be accepted? You know most people understand the concept of "if you keep doing the same time and again don't expect any change" When I said the EU stance is irrelevan...

KateR

The reductive nature of this argument, essentially based on a numbers game, is just perfect. You just want to leave, and you don't care how. And I dare say you don't know why. It was not rejected by leave MP's only. You are being argumentative just for the sake of it and throwing insults as you go,...

KateR

The Irish border can only be sorted if we accept that the customs border is in the Irish Sea. Even I know that is impossible for a Unionist and Conservative Party to accept, which is why May came up with the whole of the UK being in it. Thats how to sort this, but its getting people to understand t...

KateR

But the refusal of the UK to admit that the Irish border issue makes its Brexit options pretty narrow hasn't helped Kate. In 2017, the UK Government guaranteed to the EU that it wouldn't put infrastructure in NI. In 2019, it broke that promise to please 10 DUP MPs and about 30 ERG members. Its not ...

KateR

Perfectly summed up by the Ireland question that people don't seem to understand is what is, to brexiters, the EU "refusing to negotiate". what is it you fail to understand, negotiation, 2 or more groups/people trying to come up with a mutually agreeable solution, for you it is EU have stated this ...

KateR

gullible, nice dig at people, you could also counter with the Remain group have done a fantastic job with project fear on the cowards that don't like change. I mean they don't like change why, was it because of the idyllic lives they were leading? Some people believe there is a change in order to im...

KateR

It's all doom and gloom, let's stay, I'm mean everyone was living in Utopia and had nothing to moan about, everyone should want to go back to the days when politicians never lied.

KateR

given where we are in the table, I'm happy to keep as is, as it seems to be working as far as I can see. Jay will get his chance to start at some point in the league but just needs to be patient, not as though he was banging in goals for fun in the previous seasons he was playing for other teams but...

KateR

Why is it incumbent on the EU to find a solution to the Ireland question that both satisfies their primary concern (protecting the single market) and preserve political harmony and the integrity of the Good Friday Agreement. It's nothing to do with the EU refusing to let us leave with a "FAIR" deal...

KateR

Just for a change I thought I would do some scenario planning, tyring to put myself in BJ & Co's shoes given how parliament is and the latest deal they put tot he EU last week. I believe we all know where we are so just looking at the rest of the month and putting major pieces in place, feel free to...

KateR

http://www.hesgoal.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Works well, not always in English though also not available until last minute usually. I use when away quite often, good picture and spam free

KateR

The mantra from the remain group is “BJ is a proven liar, we have caught this naughty boy in a lie”. It’s there doctrine from previous such as fool, buffoon, etc all stated as there methodology to have people relook at his popularity and try to destroy that and at the same time throw laws about, gen...

KateR

Spijed wrote:And making their case for independence far stronger in Scotland.

Stronger Scotland, one of the best oxymoron's I have seen for a long time, thank you for making me laugh today

KateR

They are not my thoughts kate. I've not got even remotely the level of knowledge about this that PM Foster has. I recognise that. Part of the problem again is that plenty of contributors to this thread don't have the ability to understand where their competence level on this is. And with all the re...

KateR

there is no square circle, it's just people who have never negotiated anything beyond a car or house that seem to be experts who read something once. I can not tell you how many times my husband researched a car, decided he wanted it, got the price trolled the internet for similar, knew exactly the ...

KateR

Not my thoughts Kate, the thought of the European editor of the Daily Telegraph A major part of the problems we are having is that real issues are being swept aside as "minor points" or a "technicality". The Irish border is neither, especially to the Irish and the EU and UK plans appear to ignore w...

KateR

Back to the deal The analysis of the actual deal is cracking on and of course, the more it is scrutinised, the more problems arise. https://twitter.com/pmdfoster/status/1180036248062353408" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; I don't think that anyone said what has been offered would be a...

KateR

definitely should be consistent across the board, if it is a fine then it should be a sliding scale based on your last annual accounts, ohhh wait a min that means BFC would have a huge fine, let me think about this a little more, well run clubs should not be penalized. So maybe in every case a repla...

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