Robbed by officials in last minute again

clitheroeclaret2 · Post by **clitheroeclaret2** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:13 pm

Firstly at Turf, now offside in last minute

Sky showed it as being clearly offside, about time officials could use it for such decisive moments

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:14 pm

Scandelous ! Clearly off-side... ROBBED !

Cirrus_Minor · Post by **Cirrus_Minor** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:17 pm

Offside by Arsenal - AGAIN!!!!

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:26 pm

Lino had some making up to do.

Miss the offside, give the pen.

Same with all the top teams.

We didn't deserve anything, but you need the officials to do their jobs!

bartons baggage · Post by **bartons baggage** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:36 pm

Come on turtle was it offside or not.

Clarettintedlense · Post by **Clarettintedlense** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:40 pm

How many times are linesmans up with play. Rarely. Its a joke. I aat on the longsidr against sunderland to get a perspevtive of this. First half at one end second at other. The linesman on both ends was never up with play.

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:47 pm

MACCA wrote:Lino had some making up to do.

Miss the offside, give the pen.

Same with all the top teams.

We didn't deserve anything, but you need the officials to do their jobs!

Why didn't we deserve anything ?

Guitargeorge · Post by **Guitargeorge** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:49 pm

Thought we played very well against a team costing hundreds of millions.

maidenover · Post by **maidenover** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:53 pm

Got away with Andre's foul tbf

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:54 pm

RocketLawnChair wrote:Why didn't we deserve anything ?

Just an opinion. Thought we created very little.
Both certain pens, arsenal could of had another.

Dark Cloud · Post by **Dark Cloud** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:57 pm

We're always going to be hoping to get a point or even 3 at these places when we're never going to "deserve it" or be the better team. It's ridiculous to expect that we'll get something at Arsenal or Spurs or Chelsea or Liverpool or Manure and we'll all say "well on the balance of play we were the better side". That just ain't going to happen. BUT what we DO need and deserve is a bit of luck AND for the officials to help us out by giving us the tight/questionable/decisive decisions when it matters. And they simply aren't!

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 5:00 pm

That's your opinion fair enough. I just think given the resources of both clubs which surely has to be a consideration when your going off who created what I thought we were worth a point

mybloodisclaret · Post by **mybloodisclaret** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 5:06 pm

I think everyone is just bitter as again we were robbed. Gutted.

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 5:15 pm

Thought we played quite well but we are never going to win by more than one nil. We don't ever look like scoring many so if the other side score first it's an uphill battle

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 5:20 pm

bartons baggage wrote:Come on turtle was it offside or not.

This time, yes. And it wasn't even a foul.

ewanrob · Post by **ewanrob** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:15 pm

Agree with Macca, far to deep, gave them far to much time on the ball and the front 2's ball retention was pretty poor. Why Start a game with an 11 that offered very little against Southampton, was crying out for Sam and Joey. Top marks for the back 4 again, and I really hope the injustice of that spurs us on.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:33 pm

Officials have cost us 2 points against Arsenal this season.

These points could still be crucial and worth £ millions.

Time for an instant replay for decisions such as this to help the officials make the right decision.

With the Koscielny incident today, and the one in October, it would have taken seconds to clear up and the officials (and me) could sleep easier.

MT03ALG · Post by **MT03ALG** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 6:38 pm

As Ralph Coates stated, the officials have cost us 2 points against Arsenal.
On the bright side a lucky win (without any help from the biased officials) at some stage later in the season will give us 3 points to compensate for the inept officials in both matches against lucky Arsenal.

summitclaret · Post by **summitclaret** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:11 pm

Well I have just had time to watch their pen on TV. Okay it was offside and should have been a free kick to us. However, if you watch the incident at full speed from the main camara, their players is no stood up straight and puts his head down. Ben has eyes only for the ball and gets it just before his foot is headed. Very harsh pen imitation.

Its hard to take 2 last minute controversial goals against them. I was looking for justice and still am. As someone said let this spur us on.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:18 pm

Very annoyed at the time

But these things do happen, and we have to take the positives from the display and learn the lessons.

I'm not going to go down the Sam Allydyce route of blaming the officials for everything that is ever given against them, and be in favour or video replay, as its would ruin the game we all love.

Gutting though, but we should use our performances in games like this to spur us on to survival

Steve-Harpers-perm · Post by **Steve-Harpers-perm** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:52 pm

Agree let's hope it fires us up and we get that elusive away win soon.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:56 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:I'm not going to go down the Sam Allydyce route of blaming the officials for everything that is ever given against them, and be in favour or video replay, as its would ruin the game we all love.

Ruin the game? You mean making it fairer and stopping cheating wouldn't be a good thing?? The Officials would probably welcome it as a safety net for things that they have missed.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:59 pm

agree 1000000000% Ralph.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:59 pm

If they can find a way that doesn't affect the speed of the game, I'd be all for it.

I don't think that is possible at the moment.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:10 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:If they can find a way that doesn't affect the speed of the game, I'd be all for it.

I don't think that is possible at the moment.

The incident today would have been cleared up in less time that it took to consult with Oliver Giroud's barber

Ref to linesman: "What did you see?"

Linesman to Ref: "Sun was in my eyes!"

Ref to 4th Official: "What do you say?"

4th Official to Ref: "Give me 10 seconds"

4th Official to Video Ref: "Scores on the doors Trev?!"

Video Ref to 4th Official and Ref and Linesman: "Offside. No Penalty"

Total time... 14.6 seconds

Simples !

ngsobob · Post by **ngsobob** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:13 pm

They're wired up. A man in a van sees the replay virtually instantaneously and tells the fourth official/ref. Most likely when play is stopped e.g. as with the award of the penalty. In a matter of seconds, he's been told there was an offside. Similarly at the Turf, he's told offside and handball. Not likely to be practical when the ball is moving. And umpires seem to be getting along with it in sports such as cricket and tennis.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:19 pm

Ralph, do that for every decision during the match*

*because that is how it will end up

if they can do it that quick all the time, then fine.

But you know as well as i do that you have pundits now having different opinions, and that is with a zillion camera angles.

Devils_Advocate · Post by **Devils_Advocate** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:23 pm

Even in this scenario it wouldnt have been a simple as just freezing the picture when the sky editor chose to and deciding if he was on or offside. They would have been rolling the footage backwards and forwards frame by frame trying to judge the exact point when the ball could be classed as being played forward which in a two dimensional picture its not always that easy to do in the same way as trying to judge video evidence at cricket as to if a catch carried

Burnleybabe · Post by **Burnleybabe** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:26 pm

Point was he was offside. Linesman was in line with him and should have flagged.

Free kick to us. we have a pont

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:28 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:Even in this scenario it wouldnt have been a simple as just freezing the picture when the sky editor chose to and deciding if he was on or offside. They would have been rolling the footage backwards and forwards frame by frame trying to judge the exact point when the ball could be classed as being played forward which in a two dimensional picture its not always that easy to do in the same way as trying to judge video evidence at cricket as to if a catch carried

This ^^^

They won't make instant decisions for fear of getting the slightest little detail wrong. It would be a nightmare.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:30 pm

No one is saying that it shouldn't have stood (well, apart from Arsenal fans)

Its just that we have to be very careful about how we use video technology

summitclaret · Post by **summitclaret** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:30 pm

I'd rather key decisions were right. You could knock off the time players spend moaning about decisions and refs warning/booking them.

You would get about 5 mins back per game if subs could come straight on without stopping play ie one off one on controlled by the 4th official.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:37 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Ralph, do that for every decision during the match

Not in the least.

Goals (YES)

Penalty shouts (Yes)

Sending Offs (Yes)

Soft Mary slipping on his hair gel (No)

Give each Manager 2 or 3 calls per half or per game... we'd be quids in this season!

It could be made to work. Why take second best when technology allows us to eliminate bad decisions?!

Rats_cle · Post by **Rats_cle** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 10:39 pm

There's also the knock on effect from that decision, its also robbed the teams in the frame for the title of two points.

clitheroeclaret2 · Post by **clitheroeclaret2** » Sun Jan 22, 2017 11:01 pm

RalphCoatesComb wrote:Not in the least.

Goals (YES)

Penalty shouts (Yes)

Sending Offs (Yes)

Soft Mary slipping on his hair gel (No)

Give each Manager 2 or 3 calls per half or per game... we'd be quids in this season!

It could be made to work. Why take second best when technology allows us to eliminate bad decisions?!

So simple and yet like goal line technology will take the authorities 20yrs to bring in & use

scouseclaret · Post by **scouseclaret** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 12:11 am

Linesman bang in line with play - should see offside.

Ref miles from incident looking through a crowd of players. He obviously doesn't get a good view as he takes ages to give it (he pointed to the spot instantly for the Barnes pen, which happened right in front of him).

Linesman should have a decent view doesn't appear to give pen. Don't know if it's changed now they're all wired up, but a linesman used to put his flag across his chest to signal a pen, which he clearly doesn't do.

Looks like a bit of a "leveller" from the ref to me.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 12:19 am

RalphCoatesComb wrote:Ruin the game? You mean making it fairer and stopping cheating wouldn't be a good thing?? The Officials would probably welcome it as a safety net for things that they have missed.

But that would have hurt us today because we'd have conceded a penalty for the trip by Gray?
I'm all for the correct decisions to be made but technology certainly isn't the answer imo, I would struggle to watch a stop and start game, it's the reason I cannot watch most other sports.
I think a more reasonable suggestion would be to double the number of linesmen, to help them keep up with the line.
I don't understand how running the line works, how do they keep track of when the ball leaves the players boot and keep up with the line at the same time, does the referee signal when the ball is kicked? if it's a long ball from one end to the other it must be difficult to make that split second decision. Following the line constantly while looking the other way to time exactly when the ball is kicked.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 12:27 am

ewanrob wrote:Agree with Macca, far to deep, gave them far to much time on the ball and the front 2's ball retention was pretty poor. Why Start a game with an 11 that offered very little against Southampton, was crying out for Sam and Joey. Top marks for the back 4 again, and I really hope the injustice of that spurs us on.

It's all very well to look at today's match and say what the manager did wrong. But on the other hand, we went into the last minute of injury time, away to Arsenal, level at 1-1; I think we'd all agree that we were very unlucky not to draw from that position. So can you seriously look at the score of 1-1 at the Emirates and start thinking what went wrong?

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 12:37 am

dsr wrote:It's all very well to look at today's match and say what the manager did wrong. But on the other hand, we went into the last minute of injury time, away to Arsenal, level at 1-1; I think we'd all agree that we were very unlucky not to draw from that position. So can you seriously look at the score of 1-1 at the Emirates and start thinking what went wrong?

To be fair we have scored 1 goal from open play this season away from home and we keep coming to the same conclusion and hearing the same ''we were unlucky today''. I don't believe we can keep saying ''we were unlucky today'' as the saying goes, you make your own luck. We have to take responsibility and make our own luck, make it so that we aren't in a position against 10 men retreating and inviting pressure at 1-1, not easy against teams like Arsenal but there are definitely things we need to learn.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 1:14 am

KRBFC wrote:To be fair we have scored 1 goal from open play this season away from home and we keep coming to the same conclusion and hearing the same ''we were unlucky today''. I don't believe we can keep saying ''we were unlucky today'' as the saying goes, you make your own luck. We have to take responsibility and make our own luck, make it so that we aren't in a position against 10 men retreating and inviting pressure at 1-1, not easy against teams like Arsenal but there are definitely things we need to learn.

You can't see any signs of imrovement, then? It seems to me that we are getting better.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 1:22 am

dsr wrote:You can't see any signs of imrovement, then? It seems to me that we are getting better.

Yeah we're definitely improving but lets be honest, it couldn't have got worse from the performances we saw at West Brom, Southampton and Leicester. I don't know if we're good enough away from home to be winning games though which I guess doesn't really matter if we continue to pick up the points at home like we have.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 1:42 am

The last three games definitely suggest we're not good enough to be winning away at Tottenham, Man City or Arsenal. Which doesn't bode well for the Liverppol game, either. But on the other hand, it could be argued that Middlesbrough, Sunderland, Hull, Swansea, and Crystal Palace are possibly easier games than Spurs, Man C, etc?

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 2:20 am

dsr wrote:The last three games definitely suggest we're not good enough to be winning away at Tottenham, Man City or Arsenal. Which doesn't bode well for the Liverppol game, either. But on the other hand, it could be argued that Middlesbrough, Sunderland, Hull, Swansea, and Crystal Palace are possibly easier games than Spurs, Man C, etc?

If we continue to improve away from home then we could easily collect points against those sides. It could also be our players ''playing the occasion'' away at these big sides, we just have to show that level of performance against the lesser teams which so far we have failed to do. We have played all of the top sides apart from Liverpool away from home which bodes well.

JohnMac · Post by **JohnMac** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:57 am

You do realise those bottom 5 teams will be relishing the opportunity to play us at their own ground and will see it as a massive opportunity to regain some ground on us.

I'm not sure we have improved away from home, a loss is still a loss and we don't create more than an odd scoring opportunity.

We won't be favourites for any of them and probably won't be picking up too many points unless the 'Keep it tight, don't concede and hope for a draw' tactic is ditched. We need to be going for it from the first minute in all these games, 5 or 6 points would be massive in the grand scheme of things.

THEWELLERNUT70 · Post by **THEWELLERNUT70** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:16 am

Each manager should get two challenges per half. All this rubbish about causing disruption to the flow of the game. Virtually all the instances where a challenge would be made would follow what would be a natural break in play (penalty /foul/offside).
Take the decision away from the increasingly inept officials.
It's no coincidence that week in week out,season after season you know which referees will be at the centre of a s#$%storm because they aren't upto the task. These officials obviously need help. Even more so now with the speed of the game and how much money is at stake

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:17 am

JohnMac wrote:You do realise those bottom 5 teams will be relishing the opportunity to play us at their own ground and will see it as a massive opportunity to regain some ground on us.

I'm not sure we have improved away from home, a loss is still a loss and we don't create more than an odd scoring opportunity.

We won't be favourites for any of them and probably won't be picking up too many points unless the 'Keep it tight, don't concede and hope for a draw' tactic is ditched. We need to be going for it from the first minute in all these games, 5 or 6 points would be massive in the grand scheme of things.

I'd rather see us go for it and lose 4-0 than keep losing by the odd goal. High tempo from the off, if we get licked, we get licked. We have been licked numerous times this season playing scared (Soton, Leicester, Chelsea). It's hard to judge whether we have actually improved, the results would suggest so (we're not getting beat 4-0) but we have also been playing against 10 men for a large part of the past 2 away games and still lost.

ClaretLoup · Post by **ClaretLoup** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:23 am

JohnMac wrote:
I'm not sure we have improved away from home, a loss is still a loss and we don't create more than an odd scoring opportunity.

We won't be favourites for any of them and probably won't be picking up too many points unless the 'Keep it tight, don't concede and hope for a draw' tactic is ditched. We need to be going for it from the first minute in all these games, 5 or 6 points would be massive in the grand scheme of things.

The lads had seven shots on target yesterday and we lost to a controversial goal in the eighth minute of injury time. They very nearly held a team in the top three.

We biffed a lot of those teams at the bottom at TM. Given our current points cushion it is the opposition who will be cacking themselves when Burnley turn up.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:26 am

JohnMac wrote:I'm not sure we have improved away from home, a loss is still a loss and we don't create more than an odd scoring opportunity.

We won't be favourites for any of them and probably won't be picking up too many points unless the 'Keep it tight, don't concede and hope for a draw' tactic is ditched. We need to be going for it from the first minute in all these games, 5 or 6 points would be massive in the grand scheme of things.

If you can't see that yesterday was a better performance than, say, West Brom (also televised), then I'm not sure what else there is to say.

Except of course that we weren't negative yesterday. We played two up front, we had shots into double figures, and we deserved a draw. I'm told that the only team to have that many shots on target this season was Liverpool. How good do you want it to be?

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:32 am

I thought we played really well yesterday, 6 shots apiece on target is a lot better than earlier in the season.
I'd still like to see Tarks in front of the back four, we need to push the midfield higher in support of the front two, without leaving ourselves wide open. We were very poor on the second ball, but probably down to the fact they were a yard faster than us all over the pitch. Much as I love Deano I would prefer to play Joey who reads the game better than anyone else on the team. Defour has to be played in the middle or sell him, he's wasted on the wing.
We have most of the bottom half of the table to play away still, on current form that elusive win is only a matter of time. So much to be happy with despite yesterday's result.

minnieclaret · Post by **minnieclaret** » Mon Jan 23, 2017 10:45 am

Clarettintedlense wrote:How many times are linesmans up with play. Rarely. Its a joke. I aat on the longsidr against sunderland to get a perspevtive of this. First half at one end second at other. The linesman on both ends was never up with play.

This had nothing to do with his position. There is a photo, on fb, he is in line with Koscielny, who is a yd offside, as the FK is struck. Everything in sight for him. He just didn't do his job.