I love Dyche - but why won't he use Defour?

HyperClaret · Post by **HyperClaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:05 pm

Defour played 70 minutes during the week and was ready to go on the bench - we are lacking a creative flair in midfield atm and if Dyche isn't thinking of him at 70 minutes when we are creating absolutely nothing against SUNDERLAND then I'm a bit worried!

ablueclaret · Post by **ablueclaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:06 pm

Doesn't fit the framework.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:07 pm

Game was crying out for him. I suspect Bartons yellow didnt help as it was Hendrick who needed hooking

Guller Bull · Post by **Guller Bull** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:08 pm

Away point. Point nearer to survival. Player not properly fit.

KefkaClaret · Post by **KefkaClaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:08 pm

You'll need a hour long presentation to convince me that Defour shouldn't start when he's fit, he's easily our best midfielder.

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:08 pm

Guller Bull wrote:Away point. Point nearer to survival. Player not properly fit.

This.

RVclaret · Post by **RVclaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:08 pm

Bizarre to say the least.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:10 pm

described as touch and go in terms of match sharpness so understandable he wasn't used. important point earned.

Giftonsnoidea · Post by **Giftonsnoidea** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:11 pm

Lets see when he next makes an appearance....

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:31 pm

If we had fallen behind then criticism of Dyche may well have been justified since we would have needed something special, but IMO it simply wasn't worth risking him given that we don't play again for a fortnight. Worst scenario was that he came on, broke down and then missed the next month. He could be very influential in the upcoming home games.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:32 pm

Guller Bull wrote:Away point. Point nearer to survival. Player not properly fit.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Royboyclaret · Post by **Royboyclaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:35 pm

Unlikely that Defour will kick a ball again for Burnley.

Which is sad. Very sad.

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:41 pm

Royboyclaret wrote:Unlikely that Defour will kick a ball again for Burnley.

Which is sad. Very sad.

Why is it unlikely?

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:42 pm

Unlikely. What horsesh*t.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:44 pm

Royboyclaret wrote:Unlikely that Defour will kick a ball again for Burnley.

Which is sad. Very sad.

i don't believe that for a moment

JamesSherbourne · Post by **JamesSherbourne** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:47 pm

Does seem odd to me.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:50 pm

If he wasn't going to play for us again, Dyche wouldn't have put him on the bench.

Belgianclaret · Post by **Belgianclaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:56 pm

Imagine he was didn't want to risk him yet.

We need his quality up the field though, as our last pass was truly awful today.

Brady had plenty of space and a couple of very good opportunities, but his final ball was dreadful - clearly out of form. However, the same can be said of quite a few others today.

Not a nice game to watch, two very average teams, but important not to lose.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:57 pm

Defour was never going to come on in that game. Dyche primarily protects what we have, the draw, rather than push for the win.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:08 pm

We actually did push for the win but I wasn't expecting Defour to come on unless we had to bring him on.

I think he'll get some training in now, get another game and I don't think it will be long before he proves royboyclaret wrong.

jdrobbo · Post by **jdrobbo** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:10 pm

I would rather have a fit Defour ready to play the run-in in a fortnight than have brought him on at 70% against Sunderland today.

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:18 pm

Brady was the correct change. We were crying out for width, more than a ball playing midfielder.

Hendrick was fine today and at least gave us some go forward. If anyone was getting hooked, it should have been Barton whose use of the ball from deep was hopeless. But Defour would have been a gamble today - i don't know how well he'd pick up the pace of the game as a sub - and poor as we were, it wasn't a day for gambling.

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:39 pm

ClaretTony wrote:We actually did push for the win but I wasn't expecting Defour to come on unless we had to bring him on.

I think he'll get some training in now, get another game and I don't think it will be long before he proves royboyclaret wrong.

I don't think the centre half giving it back to Heaton and him smashing the tits out of it up the middle is pushing for a win, it's more I hope we might nick it.

lrac · Post by **lrac** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:57 pm

ClaretTony wrote:We actually did push for the win but I wasn't expecting Defour to come on unless we had to bring him on.

I think he'll get some training in now, get another game and I don't think it will be long before he proves royboyclaret wrong.

You are joking .We went for a point .You were there as i were .We could have lost

HelloHiGoodbye · Post by **HelloHiGoodbye** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:57 pm

Defour isn't fit. Not much point in playing him today.

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:03 pm

Defour is off in the summer.

ClaretAL · Post by **ClaretAL** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:17 pm

I think everyone agrees that we are Defore's foot in the door for him to shop window himself to the premier league, that must be a reason Dyche has him on the bench or hooks him at 70 minutes.
For me the biggest travesty is Barton in front of Westwood considering the future of Barton. Don't get me wrong I love Barton to bits and he has brought loads to us, but Barton should be on the bench not westwood

Royboyclaret · Post by **Royboyclaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:32 pm

"Defour isn't fit. Not much point in playing him today."

We'll see how fit he is when the next Belgium team is announced.

HelloHiGoodbye · Post by **HelloHiGoodbye** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:36 pm

Royboyclaret wrote:"Defour isn't fit. Not much point in playing him today."

We'll see how fit he is when the next Belgium team is announced.

The one announced yesterday? He isn't in it.

Belgianclaret · Post by **Belgianclaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:36 pm

Royboyclaret wrote:"Defour isn't fit. Not much point in playing him today."

We'll see how fit he is when the next Belgium team is announced.

He's not been selected

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:42 pm

''he was being saved for the Sunderland game'' oh wait...... posters on here have used that line a few times and its nonsense. The sad truth is a quality player like Defour cant get in the team because he isnt suited to a defensive kick and rush system. Playing him left wing was laughable, im fed up of moaning about the same sh## because nothing has changed away from home yet and it never will until Dyche leaves. Some may not like what I think is the harsh truth but everything stats/result wise over the PL seasons under Dyche backs up my point. I'm happy to debate with anyone who disagrees but the proof is in the pudding.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:47 pm

KRBFC wrote:''he was being saved for the Sunderland game'' oh wait...... posters on here have used that line a few times and its nonsense. The sad truth is a quality player like Defour cant get in the team because he isnt suited to a defensive kick and rush system. Playing him left wing was laughable, im fed up of moaning about the same sh## because nothing has changed away from home yet and it never will until Dyche leaves. Some may not like what I think is the harsh truth but everything stats/result wise over the PL seasons under Dyche backs up my point. I'm happy to debate with anyone who disagrees but the proof is in the pudding.

What are your views on Pulis, Allardyce etc.?

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 7:53 pm

Spijed wrote:What are your views on Pulis, Allardyce etc.?

That style of football isn't for me but at least they produce wins away from home. The dire static long ball is bearable when we're winning but in general I find it predictable and boring. I have to be realistic with the strength of the squad which is why I never moaned under Cotts.

SGr · Post by **SGr** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:04 pm

Weirdest decision re Defour was Stoke away, where he didn't bring him on at all. Same again today. Bizarre.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:06 pm

KRBFC wrote:That style of football isn't for me but at least they produce wins away from home. The dire static long ball is bearable when we're winning but in general I find it predictable and boring. I have to be realistic with the strength of the squad which is why I never moaned under Cotts.

But then again Dyche seems to be beating other managers hands down with our home form!

You don't do as well at home based on luck.

KefkaClaret · Post by **KefkaClaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:12 pm

I think the battering at West Brom really affected Dyche and how he used Defour away from home, since that game we've always set up in a way just to get a point. I disagree massively with him, I think it would be a massive shame if we lost Defour.

cockermouthclaret · Post by **cockermouthclaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:14 pm

ablueclaret wrote:Doesn't fit the framework.

Then as you've spouted on many occaisions in the past ablueclaret the "framework" must be wrong. We need players who can pick out a man pass the ball accurately and move to give that player options and the opposition problems. Defour from what I have seen!

cockermouthclaret · Post by **cockermouthclaret** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:23 pm

taio wrote:described as touch and go in terms of match sharpness so understandable he wasn't used. important point earned.

Having trained and then played 70 minutes midweek surely he could have played a part, once more there were times we rode our luck "important point gained" or two important points lost?

BennyD · Post by **BennyD** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:35 pm

If SD doesn't want to play him, he will have a very good reason as to why not. I trust SDs judgement implicitly.

Right_winger · Post by **Right_winger** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 8:59 pm

we had next to no creativity today. Also I noticed how slow we are on the transitions. Seems time and time again when we load up the penalty area we get easily countered yet we can't counter like that ourselves.

Defour would certainly have helped in the final third. Iv no idea why he seems to be out for so long considering he has been training for a few weeks now.

Don't think Dyche can use him tactically to how he wants us to play.

Wile E Coyote · Post by **Wile E Coyote** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:02 pm

more worrying is the fact that he clearly has an abundance of flair and talent and the others don't.
13th now, nine games left.
I know its a tough league, but we are going to rely on creative players sooner than later. Gray, Barnes, Vokes. Not really doing it when it counts are they ?
Brady ? Barton? Boyd? Just where exactly is the incisive,running, cleverness and guile to slip through top notch defences, let alone sunderlands?
We could do with a couple more with Defours touch and finesse. If he's injured or unfit, that is a different matter, but choosing to leave him out seems daft.

boyyanno · Post by **boyyanno** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:19 pm

I expect to see him leave in the summer, shame as he's clearly class. The annoying thing for me is signing Defour showed an intent to embed a different kind of player into the team (technique over work rate). Yet at times Dyche has seemed very reluctant to do it. Today's game could have turned on a moment of quality, as could many others this season. He wasn't 100 % today but there have been other strange selections. We've done fantastically well to get to where we are, however if we want to stay up and secure a good finish we need to start playing without the shackles of the framework away from home. In the second half today we had a break pushing forwards in a very good position, yet we had no one in support and it ended back with Heaton. Managers have been playing differently home and away for years, most of them do, repeating the same performances with little result over and over does not seem like a good plan.

Sfw · Post by **Sfw** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:32 pm

The innuendo of not being dyche fit etc is a myth.
The guy would walk in to our team but unfortunately problems with the hamstring is historical. This is the reason we only play him for limited amount of time also this is the third hamstring issue he has had with us.

Winstonswhite · Post by **Winstonswhite** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:37 pm

"I expect to see him leave in the summer, shame as he's clearly class"

He clearly WAS class.

Defour has admitted himself he's not the same player and he's had to learn to move differently since the bone in his foot recovered poorly.

He's an exceptional talent but I honestly don't think he's up to it week in week out.

Winstonswhite · Post by **Winstonswhite** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:44 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... x-ferguson" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If you read that article from October- which was written in a positive theme - you realise now he's a bit of a sick note.

boyyanno · Post by **boyyanno** » Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:45 pm

I'd still say he is class, at least in comparison to most of our squad. When he's played he's shown enough to suggest he has more quality than most in our team. I never thought we'd get 90 mins from him every week, but I do think we could have utilised him far more than we have.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:11 pm

RocketLawnChair wrote:I don't think the centre half giving it back to Heaton and him smashing the tits out of it up the middle is pushing for a win, it's more I hope we might nick it.

I'd agree with you if that's how we played - but we don't

Walton · Post by **Walton** » Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:20 pm

There was a moment in the game where we had the ball at the top end of the middle third, passed it back to halfway, and then from half way passed it all the way back to Heaton, possibly the longest pass of the match.

It was ridiculous.

RocketLawnChair · Post by **RocketLawnChair** » Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:27 pm

ClaretTony wrote:I'd agree with you if that's how we played - but we don't

We ran onto a lot of second balls either hammered forward by Heaton or one of the back four. When we did pick up the second ball it was generally one of our midfielders or wide men and we looked nothing short of clueless in the second half when this occurred. We either ran straight into a cul de sac in the middle of their back four or we returned the ball backwards to try again.

I am not saying we weren't trying to win CT but we certainly weren't pushing for it by raiding down the flanks or overlapping the man on the ball or getting to the deadball line, or a midfielder running beyond the strikers.

We respected the point which is Sean Dyches MO.

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Mon Mar 20, 2017 4:31 pm

RocketLawnChair wrote:I don't think the centre half giving it back to Heaton and him smashing the tits out of it up the middle is pushing for a win, it's more I hope we might nick it.

I think smashing the tits out of it is my new favourite phrase.