Tax rises to pay for Brexit

[kindonesque]

So which taxes will Teresa pump up to pay for our exit from Europe? I reckon pensioners will take the biggest hit. Anyone agree?

[Rowls]

Hello hello?

What's all this then?

Looks like a Financial Times headline posing as an UTC thread title.

Let's dig out some of the old classics like "If UK Doesn't Join the Single Currency We Will Be Left Behind".

[Sidney1st]

Taxes would rise if we stayed in, it's one of life's guarantees.

[Imploding Turtle]

Taxes would rise if we stayed in, it's one of life's guarantees.

Only for us plebs.

[Imploding Turtle]

Hello hello?

What's all this then?

Looks like a Financial Times headline posing as an UTC thread title.

Let's dig out some of the old classics like "If UK Doesn't Join the Single Currency We Will Be Left Behind".

Ah yes, the classic tactic of disparaging a newspaper based on it either reporting on someone's opinion, or on one writer's opinion article.

[nil_desperandum]

So which taxes will Teresa pump up to pay for our exit from Europe? I reckon pensioners will take the biggest hit. Anyone agree?

I think it would be refreshing if TM were to actually be honest in the run up to the election and tell us which taxes will rise and what they will pay for.
She's got no leeway at present because of Cameron's disingenuous promise made before the 2015 election not to rise any taxes or NI in the next Parliament.
Like the pledge to hold a referendum, it was made because he assumed he would be leading a coalition and wouldn't need to keep his promises.
Obviously I don't want to see my taxes rise or my pension take a hit, but it's hard to see how both of these can be avoided in the short to mid-term, so let's have an election fought with honesty and integrity.

[kindonesque]

Tessie already using her hairpin to pick triple lock on pensions.

[taio]

Will Labour be saying which taxes they would increase in their manifesto?

Scrap that...it's a stupid question!

[Rowls]

Ah yes, the classic tactic of disparaging a newspaper based on it either reporting on someone's opinion, or on one writer's opinion article.

Turtle, I've genuinely given up trying to teach you. You're on your own, son.

[Rowls]

She's got no leeway at present because of Cameron's disingenuous promise made before the 2015 election not to rise any taxes or NI in the next Parliament.

Disingenuous is the wrong word.

Some may consider it ill-advised but there was certainly nothing disingenuous about it at all. In fact Cameron was scathing of Hammond for going back on his manifesto commitment on tax.

[kentonclaret]

Not only a hit on pensions but many of the "pensioner benefits" will go as well such as Freedom Passes and Winter Fuel Payments, cuts which have already been suggested during the course of this parliament.

Once Theresa gets her "mandate" she can really cut loose.

[USC]

I think it would be refreshing if TM were to actually be honest in the run up to the election and tell us which taxes will rise and what they will pay for.

I agree. At least she has been honest and confirmed taxes will rise, but a shame she is not going to outline which ones, by how much, etc.

[nil_desperandum]

Disingenuous is the wrong word.

Some may consider it ill-advised but there was certainly nothing disingenuous about it at all. In fact Cameron was scathing of Hammond for going back on his manifesto commitment on tax.

I disagree, and even many on the right of the political spectrum agree with me. The Tory manifesto of 2015 was far too long and contained far too many un-costed plans and promises.
Virtually no-one - including Cameron and his team, expected an overall majority, so basically they ill-advisedly (to use your words) put lots of populist words in there, never imagining that they would be stuck with them for 5 years.
Of course Cameron was scathing. He doesn't have to implement "his own" manifesto, so he can stick by it. He got out of the fire when it got too hot, so he doesn't have to make the sums add up.

[kindonesque]

Hammond's next budget will most likely include the national insurance rise he was forced to withdraw only a few weeks ago.

[Paul Waine]

So which taxes will Teresa pump up to pay for our exit from Europe? I reckon pensioners will take the biggest hit. Anyone agree?

Yes, kindonesque, taxes will rise as a result of the Brexit referendum result. We know this already, because Philip Hammond indicated as such, firstly in his Autumn Statement and then again in the budget in March.

In Autumn Statement he said that clearing the deficit would take longer than George Osborne had previously "forecast" or "promised."

In his first budget he proposed to increase NIC for self-employed people - but, then was forced to withdraw.

It was a "dumb" promise by Cameron to say there would be no increase in income tax, or national insurance (he only meant NIC on employees, but maybe he wasn't aware of the other types) or VAT. It was "dumb" because it gives the government no room to adjust and respond to changing circumstances.

I'm absolutely fine with TM getting rid of this meaningless and damaging election promise: we all should be. If Jeremy Corbyn has any aspirations to forming a government he would also avoid making meaningless and damaging tax promises. We want and need governments that are competent to manage the economy - that's what will produce the greatest benefits for the "ordinary" people, like you and me.

[AndrewJB]

Considering the scale of tax cuts the government has handed out to well off people I suppose it was only a matter of time before they'd revisit what next they can take from ordinary people. Labour's position is to reverse the tax cuts to the rich.

[Sidney1st]

Would labour stop tax increases on the ordinary people?

Would that help pay for their proposals re education, nhs etc?

[Rowls]

I disagree, and even many on the right of the political spectrum agree with me. The Tory manifesto of 2015 was far too long and contained far too many un-costed plans and promises.
Virtually no-one - including Cameron and his team, expected an overall majority, so basically they ill-advisedly (to use your words) put lots of populist words in there, never imagining that they would be stuck with them for 5 years.
Of course Cameron was scathing. He doesn't have to implement "his own" manifesto, so he can stick by it. He got out of the fire when it got too hot, so he doesn't have to make the sums add up.

I don't think that "many on the right" would agree with you using that word. I agree a lot of promises were uncosted and put out in an air of panic but that doesn't make that word correct.

Disingenuous has an implication that they knew they could not keep the promise. Cameron's public anger at Hammond's planned (then dropped) tax rise for the self-employed shows that he had every intention of keeping his promises, even if they were foolishly made.

His words were to the effect of "How stupid could you be to go back on a manifesto promise?"

You're being cynical to the point it breaks logic. Cameron didn't say his words publicly, he was overheard saying them publicly (at a private function) and it was captured on film. The idea that he's simply playing that as a script is frankly laughable.

[AndrewJB]

Corbyn pointed out in a speech two years ago that an increase of half a percent in corporation tax would cover free tuition. All the Labour promises regarding spending will be coming from revenue. Only the promises about investment are coming from borrowing (from our own green investment banks).

[nil_desperandum]

[quote="Rowls"]I don't think that "many on the right" would agree with you using that word. I agree a lot of promises were uncosted and put out in an air of panic but that doesn't make that word correct.

Disingenuous has an implication that they knew they could not keep the promise.".[/quote}

No you misunderstand me. Disingenuous in the sense, that he assumed he would never have to try to keep the promise because they wouldn't have an overall majority.
Any party that has no chance of being elected can promise the earth. I don't believe that Cameron ever thought he would get a majority but was keen to ensure that they were the largest party and therefore at the head of any coalition.

[Rowls]

Half a percent, half a percent
Half a percent onwards
Into the valley of taxes
Rode the pledges five-hundred

[Rowls]

No you misunderstand me. Disingenuous in the sense, that he assumed he would never have to try to keep the promise because they wouldn't have an overall majority.

There was a bit of that, I'll accept. It's all semantics anyway at the end of the day. Either way...

Anyway - Birmingham are losing, my new deep fat fryer doesn't work, I have to watch the big game today with a load of plastic manyoo fans and I've got a very busy day ahead of me.

Come on Burnley!

[RingoMcCartney]

Hello hello?

What's all this then?

Looks like a Financial Times headline posing as an UTC thread title.

Let's dig out some of the old classics like "If UK Doesn't Join the Single Currency We Will Be Left Behind".

Or more recent ones from Alistair Darling "a vote for Brexit would see confidence evaporate in the economy OVERNIGHT!!!!!"

https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... uk-economy" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/67740 ... conomy/amp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Or the whopper from Cameron-"brexit would be like putting a bomb under the economy!!"

All rolled out recently. But let's not forget the lies told when the British people were being lied to about joining the single currency.

The classic europhile chestnut. - "we'll be cut adrift somewhere in the north atlantic"

Or the simple "we'll simply become an economic backwater!" Howler

All those who are still Remoaners prove one thing.

It's easier to lie to someone, than it is to convince them that they've actually been lied to in the first place.

Since the brexit vote-

Unemployment DOWN
Employment UP
No housing market crash.
Stock market at record levels.
Investment UP.
Siemens NOT relocating
Nissan STAYING
World War 3 has NOT broke out.

All Operation Fear Remoaner lies.

But, to be fair, what has remained true.

Eddie Izzard, Bob Geldof and Will Self are still c****

[kentonclaret]

Of course we just love to gloss over all of the blatant lies told by the LEAVE campaign.

EXTRA £350M A WEEK FOR THE NHS.

WE CAN STILL REMAIN A MEMBER OF THE EU SINGLE MARKET WHILST RESTRICTING FREE MOVEMENT.

TURKEY ARE ON THE VERGE OF JOINING THE EU (EMBLAZONED HEADLINES ACROSS THE DAILY SNAIL AND EXPRESS)

THE BIGGEST LIE OF ALL "THEY NEED US MORE THAN WE NEED THEM"

Meanwhile the Tories will hike up taxes once elected to "cover the costs of Brexit"

[gawthorpe_view]

Freedom has a value as well as a cost.

[Cirrus_Minor]

If Toies win then expect VAT to go up. They have history on this.

[Acting Claret]

Both sides lied.

[Imploding Turtle]

Both sides lied.

And as the saying goes two wrongs make a right.

[Pstotto]

Raisng taxes to pay for the homes and hospital care and education of 10 million folk from somewhere else, brought into the country to build the extra roads and the schools and the prisons and to look after and house and educate theextra folk from somewhere else, brought into the country to build the...

As my Nan used to relate: Once upon a time there were three brigands sat round a camp fire and one of them said to the other "Hey Joe, tell us a tale."
And so the tale began. Once upon a time there were three brigands sat round a camp fire and one of them said to the other (and so on.)

[brexit]

all taxes are theft

[RingoMcCartney]

Of course we just love to gloss over all of the blatant lies told by the LEAVE campaign.

EXTRA £350M A WEEK FOR THE NHS.

WE CAN STILL REMAIN A MEMBER OF THE EU SINGLE MARKET WHILST RESTRICTING FREE MOVEMENT.

TURKEY ARE ON THE VERGE OF JOINING THE EU (EMBLAZONED HEADLINES ACROSS THE DAILY SNAIL AND EXPRESS)

THE BIGGEST LIE OF ALL "THEY NEED US MORE THAN WE NEED THEM"

Meanwhile the Tories will hike up taxes once elected to "cover the costs of Brexit"

1 Divide our contribution to the EU by the number of weeks in a year. That gives £350 million. That COULD be spent on the NHS. So despite Remoaners best efforts. Not a lie.

2 Recently Turkeys President Erdogan has threatened "to flood the EU with migrants" If talks for Turkey joining the EU are not resumed. It's not the EU not wanting turkey to join. It's more the fact that the president locking up journalists and becoming more dictatorial by the day, is slowing progress.

3. Given that the EU sells more to us than we do them. Just because you don't agree with the notion , they DO need us more. Just because you say it's not true doesn't mean it's a lie.

Time has shown the europhlie doom and gloom merchants for exactly what they are. Peddlers of self-loathing, anglophobic scaremongering.

Most of them are no more than anti democratic, traitorous rats.

[Imploding Turtle]

1 Divide our contribution to the EU by the number of weeks in a year. That gives £350 million. That COULD be spent on the NHS. So despite Remoaners best efforts. Not a lie.

2 Recently Turkeys President Erdogan has threatened "to flood the EU with migrants" If talks for Turkey joining the EU are not resumed. It's not the EU not wanting turkey to join. It's more the fact that the president locking up journalists and becoming more dictatorial by the day, is slowing progress.

3. Given that the EU sells more to us than we do them. Just because you don't agree with the notion , they DO need us more. Just because you say it's not true doesn't mean it's a lie.

Time has shown the europhlie doom and gloom merchants for exactly what they are. Peddlers of self-loathing, anglophobic scaremongering.

Most of them are no more than anti democratic, traitorous rats.

If you oppose Brexit you're an "anti democratic, traitorous rat"



Also, someone should educate Ringo about rebates.

[nil_desperandum]

1 Divide our contribution to the EU by the number of weeks in a year. That gives £350 million. That COULD be spent on the NHS. So despite Remoaners best efforts. Not a lie.

.

I don't know why I bother replying to some of your posts, or how many times it needs to be repeated, but I'll have one last go.
Our contribution should be 17 billion, (which you correctly say equates to around £350 million / week).
Historically we negotiated a rebate - (currently about 4 billion). Now, just to be clear - this isn't a rebate, in the sense that we never actually pay it. (i.e. it's deducted from the 17), and we actually get a bill for about £13 billion. So our GROSS contribution is £13 billion.
Then as part of our membership we get about 4.5 billion back to spend on (e.g. farming, the north-east, Burnley etc).
Our NET contribution is therefore currently £8.6 billion, which is around £150 million / week.
Now - You could argue that all of that 8.6 billion could go to the NHS, (whose cost, to give it some context, is over £120 billion / year), but in reality that 8.6 will be more than spoken for to cover all the areas that we currently get as part of our EU membership. (Free trade being one of them. Why are Nissan staying in Sunderland?, because, (for the moment at least), they have been promised Govt funding.
With a crisis in social care, and a looming crisis in the NHS, Brexit exit fees, and many unknown costs, the pragmatists in the Conservative party know that they cannot rule out tax rises in the next 5 years.
Of course things might turn out really well after Brexit, ( I hope they do), but few people think that there won't be a cost in the short to mid-term.

[RingoMcCartney]

`Above all, the European Economic Community takes away Britain's freedom to follow the sort of economic policies we need.' : Tony Blair, writing in his personal manifesto when standing for Parliament in Beaconsfield in 1982.



`We'll negotiate a withdrawal from the EEC which has drained our natural resources and destroyed jobs.': Tony Blair, pledging his opposition to the EEC when standing for Parliament in Sedgefield in 1983.



`On the day we remember the legend that St George slayed a dragon to protect England, some would argue that there is another dragon to be slayed: Europe.' : Tony Blair, in patriotic and vote winning mood on St George's Day 1997 in an interview with 'The Sun' newspaper - exactly 20 years ago.



`I am a passionate pro-European. I always have been.': Tony Blair, speaking to the EU Parliament in 2005.



Was the lure of loads of money and power just too great?

A liar never to be trusted? Never.

Tony Bliar- Remoaner -in chief.

Tony Bliar - a very dark, sinister man

Tony Bliar - has the blood of 250,000 innocent Iraqi children on his treasonous and traitorous, hands

[Lancasterclaret]

Someone should just educate Ringo full stop.

Tax rises are coming, and if they aren't, then they should be.

We have to stop pretending that we can somehow have all that we are used to on the current tax revenue, because we can't.

[RingoMcCartney]

I don't know why I bother replying to some of your posts, or how many times it needs to be repeated, but I'll have one last go.
Our contribution should be 17 billion, (which you correctly say equates to around £350 million / week).
Historically we negotiated a rebate - (currently about 4 billion). Now, just to be clear - this isn't a rebate, in the sense that we never actually pay it. (i.e. it's deducted from the 17), and we actually get a bill for about £13 billion. So our GROSS contribution is £13 billion.
Then as part of our membership we get about 4.5 billion back to spend on (e.g. farming, the north-east, Burnley etc).
Our NET contribution is therefore currently £8.6 billion, which is around £150 million / week.
Now - You could argue that all of that 8.6 billion could go to the NHS, (whose cost, to give it some context, is over £120 billion / year), but in reality that 8.6 will be more than spoken for to cover all the areas that we currently get as part of our EU membership. (Free trade being one of them. Why are Nissan staying in Sunderland?, because, (for the moment at least), they have been promised Govt funding.
With a crisis in social care, and a looming crisis in the NHS, Brexit exit fees, and many unknown costs, the pragmatists in the Conservative party know that they cannot rule out tax rises in the next 5 years.
Of course things might turn out really well after Brexit, ( I hope they do), but few people think that there won't be a cost in the short to mid-term.

"Our contribution to the EU is £17 million"

Should've just stopped there mate......

[nil_desperandum]

"Our contribution to the EU is £17 million"

Should've just stopped there mate......

You might at least quote me correctly.
I think you'll find that I wrote "should be" - not "is".

Our NET contribution is 8.6 billion - as I demonstrated.

[Pstotto]

Never in the history of taxation has there ever been any wealth re-distribution.

At least with the Tories they tell it like it is.

[Acting Claret]

And as the saying goes two wrongs make a right.

No pal, just saying. Whoever is arguing, they seem to forget untruths were spoken by both sides, namely the side they are defending.
In truth nobody knew what would happen either way.
I also don't think many people listened to the lies anyway.
I certainly knew which way I would vote regardless of any spin.

[Paul Waine]

Considering the scale of tax cuts the government has handed out to well off people I suppose it was only a matter of time before they'd revisit what next they can take from ordinary people. Labour's position is to reverse the tax cuts to the rich.

Hi Andrew, what tax cuts have the gov't handed to the well off?

Gordon Brown stopped pensions receiving dividends tax free, then he introduced limits on annual contributions and life time allowances. When David Cameron and Lib-Dem coalition was in power both the annual contributions and the life time allowances were cut and then the life time allowance was cut again.

And, Gordon Brown introduced the idea of no personal allowance if taxable income was above £100,000 (on a £1 for £2 scale).

Somewhere along the line, National Insurance was introduced at 1% for all earnings above the NIC upper earnings limit (yes, I know it was previously £nil. And, then this was doubled to 2%.

And, yes, just before the 2010 general election Gordon Brown increased the top rate of tax for income above £150,000 from 40% to 50% for the year after the election. David Cameron/George Osborne reduced this to 45%.

And, property stamp duty was revised - lower for lower priced properties, but for the "well off" who buy houses roughly above £1 million the stamp duty has increased - and increased again if it is a second home (or for buy-to-let) - again, activities that the "well off" might do more of than the "less well off."

What've I missed? Another one on the tax increase side - tighter rules on all "avoidance" schemes (I don't disagree with these, though I do wish the MPs would write the tax laws in the way they intend them to be operated).

So, what cuts for the "well off" have I missed?

[RingoMcCartney]

You might at least quote me correctly.
I think you'll find that I wrote "should be" - not "is".

Our NET contribution is 8.6 billion - as I demonstrated.

Same old tired arguments. Going round and round and round.

Just like the history books will show that Utd beat us this afternoon. Sadly.

You lost.....

[nil_desperandum]

Same old tired arguments. Going round and round and round.

Just like the history books will show that Utd beat us this afternoon. Sadly.

You lost.....

I really don't mind people having a different opinion to mine, and I'll happily debate facts and opinions all day, but you really are impossible.
You deliberately (or maybe accidentally) misquoted me, and now you claim to have won the argument!
I proved with figures that can be checked that the actual net amount is 8.6 billion, and yet you still say that you won.
There was misleading information put out by both sides prior to the referendum. I fully accept that. Some of it was just opinion, but some of it was distortion of facts or downright lies. The £350 million per week NEVER existed and Farage admitted this the day after the referendum. I've backed this up with the actual figures and yet you come still come back with a childish "You lost", which clearly I haven't.
You'll gain a lot more respect if you learn to debate properly.

[Imploding Turtle]

No pal, just saying. Whoever is arguing, they seem to forget untruths were spoken by both sides,...

No one forgets that.

[RingoMcCartney]

I really don't mind people having a different opinion to mine, and I'll happily debate facts and opinions all day, but you really are impossible.
You deliberately (or maybe accidentally) misquoted me, and now you claim to have won the argument!
I proved with figures that can be checked that the actual net amount is 8.6 billion, and yet you still say that you won.
There was misleading information put out by both sides prior to the referendum. I fully accept that. Some of it was just opinion, but some of it was distortion of facts or downright lies. The £350 million per week NEVER existed and Farage admitted this the day after the referendum. I've backed this up with the actual figures and yet you come still come back with a childish "You lost", which clearly I haven't.
You'll gain a lot more respect if you learn to debate properly.

I was referring to the result of the referendum.

Remoaners like you simply won't let go.

So its not childish to point out the fact that you lost!


And isn't it funny I pointed out all the lies told by the Remain campaign.

You made no attempt to deny any of them.

But like I say.

You like OUR team yesterday, you lot lost the referendum. Why not try and do what the rest of the country are attempting to do and get behind the PM. Instead of being like a poor man's Tiny Tim Farron?

I couldn't care less about gaining respect. Especially if it means a never ending rerun of LAST YEAR'S debate!!

[Lancasterclaret]

Yeah come on, democracy is one vote and then thats it, for eternity.

We all need to get behind Gruppenfuhrer May and make sure we kick Johnny Foreigner into touch. Spitfires! Dunkirk! Flags! Blue Passports!

[nil_desperandum]

I was referring to the result of the referendum.

Remoaners like you simply won't let go.

So its not childish to point out the fact that you lost!


And isn't it funny I pointed out all the lies told by the Remain campaign.

You made no attempt to deny any of them.


I couldn't care less about gaining respect. Especially if it means a never ending rerun of LAST YEAR'S debate!!

So why bring the result of the referendum into it?
I was clarifying why the £350 million per week was demonstrably incorrect, and acknowledged as such. You then misquoted me in an attempt to discredit my argument. When I pointed this out you came out with the "you lost" line.
If you want to go back to the referendum result, I would says that I came to terms with it within days, and am already a long way down the road to preparing for it. Are you?
With regards to who lost. It strikes me that if Brexit goes well then we are all winners, so if you believe that you won then I'm onto a winner too.
Why are you so angry about "winning" to use your term? If it all turns out as well as you clearly expect it to, then I will be winner like you. Once we have left the EU it won't suddenly be better for the 52% who voted to leave and worse for the 48% who voted to remain, will it?
If things don't turn out so well as you expect, then I suspect you will be a greater loser than me, but obviously I don't know your personal circumstances.
With regards to the "lies" told by the remain side, many of these were expressed "opinions" not outright lies, and as has been continually pointed out we haven't left the EU yet, and no one has a clue what the final deal will be, so some of the views should not be dismissed as yet.
Macron's election in France is hardly going to hasten the break up of the EU that so many Brexiteers have predicted. (That was a prediction by the Brexiteers, by the way, - not a lie. Life is often about predictions. It doesn't make them lies).

Serious question: If you don't care about being respected, then how can you expect people to take your views seriously?

[RingoMcCartney]

So why bring the result of the referendum into it?
I was clarifying why the £350 million per week was demonstrably incorrect, and acknowledged as such. You then misquoted me in an attempt to discredit my argument. When I pointed this out you came out with the "you lost" line.
If you want to go back the referendum result, I would says that I came to terms with it, within days, and am already a long way down the road to preparing for it. Are you?
With regards to who lost. It strikes me that if Brexit goes well then we are all winners, so if you believe that you won then I'm onto a winner too.
Why are you so angry about "winning" to use your term? If it all turns out as well as you clearly expect it to, then I will be winner like you. Once we have left the EU it won't suddenly be better for the 52% who voted to leave and worse for the 48% who voted to remain, will it?
If things don't turn out so well as you expect, then I suspect you will be a greater loser than me, but obviously I don't know your personal circumstances.
With regards to the "lies" told by the remain side, many of these were expressed "opinions" not outright lies, and as has been continually pointed out we haven't left the EU yet, and no one has a clue what the final deal will be, so some of the views should not be dismissed as yet.
Macron's election in France is hardly going to hasten the break up of the EU that so many Brexiteers have predicted. (That was a prediction by the Brexiteers, by the way, - not a lie. Life is often about predictions. It doesn't make them lies).

Serious question: If you don't care about being respected, then how can you expect people to take your views seriously?

So when people expressed an "opinion" that the money we send to the EU could be spent on the NHS. That was a lie!?

And when operation fear, the IMF, The Treasury, the OECD, George Osborne, Gordon Brown, Nick Clegg, lied, they were expressing "opinions" and making predictions and forecasts!!!

Hahaha.

Again you prove the point that it's easier to lie to someone than it is to convince them they've actually been lied to!!

And the biggest lie of all, was to the British people in 1975 when we were told the Common Market was just that. A trading block of 7 (i think) equal countries. No plans to a borderless superstate. And when eurosceptics said it was all about constructing a united States of Europe, they were belittled and shouted down and called "little englanders"

History shows that they were bang on the money. And the europhile lies had already began.

So when asked if there were plans for an EU army, Nick "tuition fees " Clegg said it was "pure fantasy". Was it a Suprise that a matter of days later it was announced that in fact that now Britain was leaving the EU, they could carry on full steam ahead with the plans for an defense force?

That's called lying mate. Or in Remoaner land an "opinion!"

Europhiles - lying through their teeth since 1975

[quoonbeatz]

So when people expressed an "opinion" that the money we send to the EU could be spent on the NHS. That was a lie!?

no, the lie was the £350m figure that was given, not that we could spend it on the nhs.

i thought you were good at spotting all these lies?

[Lancasterclaret]

But its ok, cos leave won, and that its. For ever.

wave a flag someone, and shoot down some Messerschmitts!

[android]

Fascinating how the myth of Tory tax cuts for the rich is perpetuated. Certainly some truth in historical terms but not since 2010, as Paul Waine has pointed out to Andrew JB. The Tories since 2010 have hammered the wealthiest and highest earners. The main cases being:

Top rate of income tax increased from 40% under Blair/Brown to 45% under Cameron/May
Stamp duty top rate increased from 4% to 12%

They were even going to increase probate fees from £215 to £20,000 for the wealthiest (20 grand - a 9,300% increase) but that seems to have been scuppered by the timing of the election.