Two steps​ forward, one step back

[Croydon Claret]

It's been a long 30 year recovery since the Orient game, with the overall direction being an upward one.

But which managers left us in a worse place after their tenure; either because of league position or a worse group of players. Or any other reason

Chris Waddle would be the outstanding candidate for me

[alicante claret]

Laws was difficult to defend.

[Sidney1st]

Laws was difficult to defend.

Probably didn't help that the players were still pining for Coyle.

[TheFamilyCat]

Miller and Casper both took us as far as they could before Mullen led us out of the division. Sad how that ended but he definitely left is in a better place.

Heath showed some promise and flirted with the play offs but we were on a downward curve from the moment John Ward left him.

It was always going to be difficult for Waddle taking over from that, although he showed very little evidence of managerial ability.

Stan left us in a higher division than he joined is, but again, we were heading in the wrong direction and Cotterill had to pick up a real mess.

Cotterill, despite some awful football and a real malaise when he left, at least handed over a decent squad.

Coyle, like Stan left having taken us a division higher left a mess, due to the timing and decimating the back room staff.

Laws, like Waddle was a poor choice and had little chance of succeeding.

Howe, like Cotterill, despite not really taking us anywhere, at least brought some good players to the come who his successor would benefit from.

[Colburn_Claret]

Laws was difficult to defend.

It split opinion at the time, as Laws was passed the shitty end of the stick.
But the stories that have come out since, about the lack of discipline in the dressing room, engendered by Coyle, it's amazing he did as well as he did. He tried to sort them out, and some of the pros were happy with the cushy life. He really didn't have a chance.

[edlass]

the waddle season was one of my earliest so I didn't pay as much attention to anything other than the actual team sheet and matches (I wish I could still do the same). But I remembered him having a decent second half to the season. I was only a kid but am I right about that? I remember beating champions watford 2-0 at the turf and my dad saying. Why can't we play like that every week?

as for how he left us at the end. I guess expensive crap players, so I get that one.

I have been lucky to be a fan during the upturn, mullen I only remember people chanting for him to go. heath I remember leaving for Everton. Then waddle was he near miss but onwards and upwards thereafter! lucky me.

[Right_winger]

Eddie Howe took us from the brink of the play offs to bottom half and even worse football than played under Laws and destroyed the youth set up.

[Croydon Claret]

Laws was on a hiding to nothing before a ball had been kicked. I give him a "Get out of jail free" card

[ClaretTony]

Miller - took over a complete mess in 1986 with no money and, after that first season, did improve us and left us better than he found us.
Casper - play offs in his last season and left a squad that won us promotion out of the fourth division.
Mullen - ups and then downs and thankfully went before we went back to where he found us, but forever will be remembered as the manager who got us out of the fourth division.
Heath - fell out with all and sundry, his record without John Ward was 24 points in 24 games. Didn't move us forward at all.
Waddle - disastrous season that was saved in the end. Whether things would have improved with him we'll never go, but certainly not a success.
Ternent - after a difficult start he moved us up to the next level although that last two and a half years were poor. Definitely left us better than he found us.
Cotterill - I know many didn't like the football but he slowly built the squad and left us with one all but ready to win promotion.
Coyle - no matter what he did, he got us into the Premier League and left us better than he found us without a doubt.
Laws - never had a chance although he wasn't right for the job. The players treated him appallingly.
Howe - same players tried the same stunts with Howe as they had with Laws but he got rid of them. Not a success for me, was allowed to dismantle the youth department, we were lower down the league when he left and I thought the football was turgid. Was thankful when he left. Having said that, you can't underestimate the job he's done at Bournemouth, it's outstanding.
Dyche - close to being on a par with Harry Potts for me as the best manager I've seen at Burnley. Those who know me and know what I thought of Harry will realise how high a praise that is for our current manager.

[Paul Waine]

Miller and Casper both took us as far as they could before Mullen led us out of the division. Sad how that ended but he definitely left is in a better place.

Heath showed some promise and flirted with the play offs but we were on a downward curve from the moment John Ward left him.

It was always going to be difficult for Waddle taking over from that, although he showed very little evidence of managerial ability.

Stan left us in a higher division than he joined is, but again, we were heading in the wrong direction and Cotterill had to pick up a real mess.

Cotterill, despite some awful football and a real malaise when he left, at least handed over a decent squad.

Coyle, like Stan left having taken us a division higher left a mess, due to the timing and decimating the back room staff.

Laws, like Waddle was a poor choice and had little chance of succeeding.

Howe, like Cotterill, despite not really taking us anywhere, at least brought some good players to the come who his successor would benefit from.

I know John Bond came before Orient game - but shouldn't he be at the top of the list of managers that left us worse off?

[ClaretTony]

I know John Bond came before Orient game - but shouldn't he be at the top of the list of managers that left us worse off?

Absolutely not, he left us where he found us in the third division with arguably a better squad. Benson was the one who took us to the fourth division. He's the worst of the lot alongside Tommy Cavanagh.

[RocketLawnChair]

Absolutely not, he left us where he found us in the third division with arguably a better squad. Benson was the one who took us to the fourth division. He's the worst of the lot alongside Tommy Cavanagh.

And Martin Buchan left us before he found us CT !

[ClaretTony]

And Martin Buchan left us before he found us CT !

Hardly worth mentioning him to be honest - 11 league games and he was gone. Strange appointment in that Teasdale had already told Tommy Hutchison he'd got the job. Buchan offered Hutch the number two role, I don't know which words he used but he declined the offer.

[Selby Claret]

Laws signed Marney. That, for me, is his 'get out of jail free' card

[Steve1956]

Bond! End of.

[Hipper]

I would like to more about 'The players treated Laws appallingly' and the 'same players tried the same stunts with Howe as they had with Laws but he got rid of them.

[Sidney1st]

I would like to more about 'The players treated Laws appallingly' and the 'same players tried the same stunts with Howe as they had with Laws but he got rid of them.

Remember ABC banging on about Howe being unable to manage senior players?

Those same senior players are the ones who gave Laws the most aggro from what I remember seeing on CM

Howe turning up and clearing them out was a good thing for the club.

[Steve1956]

Remember ABC banging on about Howe being unable to manage senior players?

Those same senior players are the ones who gave Laws the most aggro from what I remember seeing on CM

Howe turning up and clearing them out was a good thing for the club.

Who where these players Sidney.

[Sidney1st]

Who where these players Sidney.

I haven't got names just bits I remember reading on CM.

CT will know more then me, but its generally accepted now that the players didn't put in the same shift for Laws as they did for Coyle.

[Hipper]

Was this addressed in Carlisle's book?