Katie Hopkins..

[_Soclaretes_]

Yes. The trouble is, Islam seems to want to do very little to solve it.

Before the Tories cut the budget there was a group called Building Bridges, in Nelson. They visited schools and community centers teaching about cohesion and peaceful co existence. The staff were a mix of Christian, Muslim and atheist.

Why are the Muslims involved in these types of outreach schemes (when they were funded and in full effect) not as symbolic of the whole religion of Islam as you choose these murderers to be?

I would hazard a guess that it's because of everything you've read and heard in the press. It's the big scary secret Muslim you're scared of, not Bashar from the top shop or Ishy from the library. Go out, talk to some people and ask questions.

[Lancasterclaret]

Don't forget to put the words "Arbeit Macht Frei" over the pub doorway CAJ

[Sidney1st]

If put in the words "Final Solution" into google it will lead you to the following wiki page:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Solution" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In modern history it's fairly obvious what it means and the connotations that go with it.

We all know what it means ffs.

What we're questioning is what her use of the phrase means, especially as there is limited amount of space to write a tweet.

If she's asking for a final solution to a terrorism problem is she asking for something to finally stop all this shite or asking for genocide to be commited?

Some people seem to think it's the 2nd option, some of us think it's the first option.

[Lancasterclaret]

Yes. The trouble is, Islam seems to want to do very little to solve it.

I wish I knew a lot more about it to be honest, but like all religous texts, you can read what you want into the Quran, and ISIS clearly do.

[Lancasterclaret]

Come off it Sidney.

Its Katie Hopkins, not some poor bloke who tweeted for the first time.

[Sidney1st]

I know who it is and I know she loves being controversial.

Even so, stating as fact she's suggesting genocide or sending coded messages is bizarre, even for this place.

[ClaretAndJew]

I think the fact she deleted it says enough for me.

I'm all for people making mistakes, but if she didn't mean exactly what we suggest it does, she would have stood by her convictions and told people where to go.

[Lancasterclaret]

She's deleted it because she can claim that she realised that it might be controversial and had a rethink about it.

All the screen grabs and sharing then spreads the same message and gets it out there.

And then she can't get sued, because its screengrabs rather than her tweet.

Quite clever really, but again, treating people like idiots as its really obvious.

[spadesclaret]

We all know what it means ffs.

What we're questioning is what her use of the phrase means, especially as there is limited amount of space to write a tweet.

If she's asking for a final solution to a terrorism problem is she asking for something to finally stop all this shite or asking for genocide to be commited?

Some people seem to think it's the 2nd option, some of us think it's the first option.

Yes, Sidney, we all know what it means. So does she. She's an intelligent woman. She's also a journalist who knows how to use words.

Think about it. She had a whole host of words and phrases she might use but she chose 'final solution'.

[nil_desperandum]

I think the fact she deleted it says enough for me.

I'm all for people making mistakes, but if she didn't mean exactly what we suggest it does, she would have stood by her convictions and told people where to go.

I have absolutely no doubt that her choice of words was calculated for maximum effect, and I think the point you made there is an extremely good one, and pretty much nails it.
Why did she delete it and then not seek to apologise for any unintended offence, or alternately why doesn't she just come out and say, "I stand by it - my comment clearly wasn't a reference to the Holocaust".
If anyone didn't interpret it as she intended then fair enough, but she knew exactly what she was posting.

[nil_desperandum]

She's deleted it because she can claim that she realised that it might be controversial and had a rethink about it.

All the screen grabs and sharing then spreads the same message and gets it out there.

And then she can't get sued, because its screengrabs rather than her tweet.

Quite clever really, but again, treating people like idiots as its really obvious.

Is that right, Lancaster? Surely you're not immune to being prosecuted just because you subsequently delete something??

[Damo]

Before the Tories cut the budget there was a group called Building Bridges, in Nelson. They visited schools and community centers teaching about cohesion and peaceful co existence. The staff were a mix of Christian, Muslim and atheist.

Why are the Muslims involved in these types of outreach schemes (when they were funded and in full effect) not as symbolic of the whole religion of Islam as you choose these murderers to be?

I would hazard a guess that it's because of everything you've read and heard in the press. It's the big scary secret Muslim you're scared of, not Bashar from the top shop or Ishy from the library. Go out, talk to some people and ask questions.

You just posted a bizarre, political point scoring post that had no relevance to my comment.
Blaming Tory cuts, implying I'm afraid of Muslims or that I judge all Muslims on the action of a few is just the typical, pre written response from certain people lately and it doesn't answer or help anyone.

[Sidney1st]

Yes, Sidney, we all know what it means. So does she. She's an intelligent woman. She's also a journalist who knows how to use words.

Think about it. She had a whole host of words and phrases she might use but she chose 'final solution'.

It does need a final solution though, just not the Nazi one or anything similar.

[ClaretAndJew]

Sidney,

In that case, it just needs a solution.

[Lancasterclaret]

She can claim that she thought about it, and realised that it was too controversial and deleted it.

Good thread on twitter about it from Simon Pegg, because she's only started doing that since she got successfully sued. I think she's had some legal advice on it put it that way.

[boatshed bill]

spadesclaret wrote:
Yes, Sidney, we all know what it means. So does she. She's an intelligent woman. She's also a journalist who knows how to use words.

Think about it. She had a whole host of words and phrases she might use but she chose 'final solution'

Would the editor not get the final say in what gets printed?

[ClaretAndJew]

Not on her personal twitter account, no.

[Sidney1st]

Sidney,

In that case, it just needs a solution.

Yes, a permanent one.

One that ends it, for good.

Also known as a final one, but not THE Final one you're all thinking about.

Blair thought he'd had a solution for the Irish troubles and that hasn't resolved it fully.

[boatshed bill]

Not on her personal twitter account, no.

Sorry, so she's acting completely independently. I don't really understand Twitter, never been near it!

[ClaretAndJew]

But isn't a solution in and of itself supposed to be that, the solution, to a problem.

It doesn't need to be made any more clear with added words for effect.

[ClaretAndJew]

Sorry, so she's acting completely independently. I don't really understand Twitter, never been near it!

Aye mate, she's in control of her own account and can post what she sees fit.

[quoonbeatz]

its a shame for them but for the likes of hopkins, tommy robinson and that prison planet guy off twitter, their battle is already lost. the terrorists have defeated them because they've got exactly what they want from them.

they've got a rise out of them, they've got them to spread their own hate, they've made them seek to divide.

its sad for them but to use their own pathetic language, they're 3 of the biggest snowflakes around.

[Sidney1st]

If it had been someone not as controversial as Hopkins, or others like her, would there be this much hysteria about the use of words?

[ClaretAndJew]

I think so mate, yeah. It's such a significant choice of words that you can't accidentally say it.

People wouldn't call for a holocaust or a genocide, and in the same vein shouldn't call for a final solution.

[_Soclaretes_]

You just posted a bizarre, political point scoring post that had no relevance to my comment.
Blaming Tory cuts, implying I'm afraid of Muslims or that I judge all Muslims on the action of a few is just the typical, pre written response from certain people lately and it doesn't answer or help anyone.

I'll definitely admit to some political bias in my post but to say it had no relevance? Hmm, not sure about that one.

You said that Islam had no interest in doing anything about it, and don't see the link to what I was saying? Who or what is Islam if not the total embodiment of all who follow it? Why only choose the sick elements like that evil prick from the other night? Why ignore the much more common example of people acting positively?

That led me to guess, unfairly and not my place I suppose, that you maybe didn't see any positive examples in your daily life.

[Damo]

I'll definitely admit to some political bias in my post but to say it had no relevance? Hmm, not sure about that one.

You said that Islam had no interest in doing anything about it, and don't see the link to what I was saying? Who or what is Islam if not the total embodiment of all who follow it? Why only choose the sick elements like that evil prick from the other night? Why ignore the much more common example of people acting positively?

That led me to guess, unfairly and not my place I suppose, that you maybe didn't see any positive examples in your daily life.

I see plenty of positive examples of Islam in my life.
I see how close they are as a community for starters, and I think that gives them a real opportunity to stop things like this from happening.
Hence my comment

[Lancasterclaret]

Bit O/T, but I made the mistake of clicking on one of Tommy Robinson tweets and the replies to it.

Crikey, it makes Right Winger seem like a er, libtard

[Rick_Muller]

....Hatey Cockpins....

had to laugh at this

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

Ok mate,

So there's one of two things at play, either Hopkins is a complete, uneducated moron, and doesn't know history and just spouts any old crap to her similarly minded followers, or, she's quite a clever racist, using terminology she understands to rile people up on purpose.

Or she is just paid a lot of money and told to write something that will be controversial.

[_Soclaretes_]

I see plenty of positive examples of Islam in my life.
I see how close they are as a community for starters, and I think that gives them a real opportunity to stop things like this from happening.
Hence my comment

But you refer to Islam as a singular unit. Like a government or singular society.

It's the same as every other community. Even as low end as football support, would you class all Burnley fans as X, Y or Z? Would you say that we, as a community, could stop all racism within football grounds? The FA has tried. Supporters groups have tried. Can you, as a singular supporter, stop any and all racist remarks and ideas at the Turf?

It a too simple man, it sounds easy. It isn't.

[joey13]

Is this the same woman who defended Adam Johnson, child abuser

[FactualFrank]

Is this the same woman who defended Adam Johnson, child abuser

Yes, but only because the majority of people were against him. Had the majority been on his side, she'd have lambasted him.
She's not intelligent, she's just extremely predictable, yet whilst it's working for her, she won't need to change her false stance on things as it's getting her the attention she craves.

[Damo]

But you refer to Islam as a singular unit. Like a government or singular society.

It's the same as every other community. Even as low end as football support, would you class all Burnley fans as X, Y or Z? Would you say that we, as a community, could stop all racism within football grounds? The FA has tried. Supporters groups have tried. Can you, as a singular supporter, stop any and all racist remarks and ideas at the Turf?

It a too simple man, it sounds easy. It isn't.

This isn't a case of someone being a c**t at a football match though is it?
It's someone who has made and implemented a complex plan to murder as many little girls as possible in the most barbaric way.
Your use of that analogy, which I have seen used multiple times in ways much more relivent than the way you are using it now, doesn't quite work here.
Also implying I'm generalizing Muslims because I used the word Islam is lazy. Your either not understanding my point or you are deliberately ignoring it, and using rhetoric and other people's sound bites to try and take some kind of moral highground

[Dom]

Come on Sidney, you don't come across as thick but you're playing the part now. Katie Hopkins knew exactly what she was doing. Final solution isn't even a term that you'd use unless it was in reference to the Holocaust. Final solution isn't a common phrase outside that connotation. You're giving her more credit than she's ever been due.

[Sidney1st]

Come on Sidney, you don't come across as thick but you're playing the part now. Katie Hopkins knew exactly what she was doing. Final solution isn't even a term that you'd use unless it was in reference to the Holocaust. Final solution isn't a common phrase outside that connotation. You're giving her more credit than she's ever been due.

Not being thick, but as I've stated it wouldn't be the first thought in my head upon reading the tweet.

Nor has anyone else in my office thought of the holocaust when I've asked their opinion.
Some of us just view the world different to those who instantly thought genocide/holocaust/secret codes

[Right_winger]

The vast majority of people won't instantly think of the holocuast. Just a few over sensitive souls trying to make a big deal of it.

To be fair you have to be a little creative in your thinking to come To that conclusion.

Iv not seen a great deal of what she has said and I don't really take an interest on anything twitter related unless it's brought to my attention through other means.
I have however seen fb posts from a vile creature praising the attacks because he hates he English ( one of sturgeons love child's ) yet no big fuss about it or being reported to the authorities?

IMG_1174.PNG (378.03 KiB) Viewed 2626 times

Big difference between Kate Hopkins tweet and the likes of the above don't you think.

[ClaretAndJew]

Praising the attacks? Really?

Why don't you report it then, Right Winger, or are you also massively liberal really and don't deem it a problem?

If you think it's a problem, then complain about it, make a fuss, report it to the police.

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

Praising the attacks? Really?

Why don't you report it then, Right Winger, or are you also massively liberal really and don't deem it a problem?

If you think it's a problem, then complain about it, make a fuss, report it to the police.

Wouldn't say any difference between that and Hopkins tweet just two sad small minded individuals posting shite from behind the safety of their keyboards.

Reminds me of a few posters on here.

[Imploding Turtle]

The vast majority of people won't instantly think of the holocuast. Just a few over sensitive souls trying to make a big deal of it.

To be fair you have to be a little creative in your thinking to come To that conclusion.

Iv not seen a great deal of what she has said and I don't really take an interest on anything twitter related unless it's brought to my attention through other means.
I have however seen fb posts from a vile creature praising the attacks because he hates he English ( one of sturgeons love child's ) yet no big fuss about it or being reported to the authorities?

IMG_1174.PNG

Big difference between Kate Hopkins tweet and the likes of the above don't you think.

You really like whatabouitism, but this time it's backfired on you because no one here is happy about what that **** said either. And if his comments got got more publicity then more people would know about them and be appalled by them. But then he isn't a mouthpiece of Scottish nationalism like Hopkins is when it comes to the far-right in England which is why Hopkins has the audience she has and why more people are aware of the bile she spouts. It's also handy for her that she'll have willfully naive apologists like yourself fighting her corner.

[nil_desperandum]

Wouldn't say any difference between that and Hopkins tweet just two sad small minded individuals posting shite from behind the safety of their keyboards.

Reminds me of a few posters on here.

Sorry - no similarity IMO. He's not a well-know public mouthpiece, or maybe I should say gobshite, like Hopkins. No one other than a small number of his associates will read it, and, although it's absolutely no excuse, he is most likely of low intelligence, has an anti-English agenda and gave little thought to what he posted or its consequences. (All assuming of course that it's not a fake account.)
She on the other hand knew her comments would be read by millions, and worded it in such a way that she actually gets apologists supporting her.

[Greenmile]

If it had been someone not as controversial as Hopkins, or others like her, would there be this much hysteria about the use of words?

Although I don't always agree with you, you're usually one of the more balanced and reasonable posters on here imo, Sidney, but you seem to have something of a blind spot where Katie Hopkins is concerned. Does she have some compromising photos of you or something?

http://www.uptheclarets.com/messageboar ... ns#p338661" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Sidney1st]

She does say things people agree with though, she spots an opportunity and says something to get attention.

No she doesn't have any pictures of me, not even my missus wants any of me!

[Imploding Turtle]

If it had been someone not as controversial as Hopkins, or others like her, would there be this much hysteria about the use of words?

Yes. All else being equal of course. In fact if this was Carole Malone or another less controversial columnist there'd probably be even more outrage at the suggestion as people don't expect it from them. Although at the same time that might be counter-acted by the higher likelihood of if being a stupid mistake.

If this was the first time Hopkins had ever said anything this provocative then there'd be some credibility in the notion that she didn't mean it the way it is being perceived, but it's not. She knew what she was posting and she's chosen to be the public face of this form of extremism. And the reason people are outraged by it is because this is a further example of how Nazism is creeping into our society, and its proponents are being given platforms in our national press.

[lovebeingaclaret]

Yes. All else being equal of course. In fact if this was Carole Malone or another less controversial columnist there'd probably be even more outrage at the suggestion as people don't expect it from them. Although at the same time that might be counter-acted by the higher likelihood of if being a stupid mistake.

If this was the first time Hopkins had ever said anything this provocative then there'd be some credibility in the notion that she didn't mean it the way it is being perceived, but it's not. She knew what she was posting and she's chosen to be the public face of this form of extremism. And the reason people are outraged by it is because this is a further example of how Nazism is creeping into our society, and its proponents are being given platforms in our national press.

Could you point me in the direction of examples of Nazism creeping into our society I would be much obliged.

The only isms I see lately are blowing children up isms, running people (many) over isms, knifing policeman isms, beheading soldiers in high street isms, grooming children and raping said children and introducing them to prostitution isms.

Street marches suggesting British police go to hell isms, gatherings telling us how sharia will be ruling our country isms.

Other areas we are being taught are

FGM isms
Removing females from society by covering them from head to toe in cloth which makes for great integration isms

Load more but I'll stop now and wait for the NatzI isms creeping into our society to be presented.

Also I keep on asking for examples of where Tommy Robinson has been making racist overtures. No one has yet given an example.

[Sidney1st]

Yes. All else being equal of course. In fact if this was Carole Malone or another less controversial columnist there'd probably be even more outrage at the suggestion as people don't expect it from them. Although at the same time that might be counter-acted by the higher likelihood of if being a stupid mistake.

If this was the first time Hopkins had ever said anything this provocative then there'd be some credibility in the notion that she didn't mean it the way it is being perceived, but it's not. She knew what she was posting and she's chosen to be the public face of this form of extremism. And the reason people are outraged by it is because this is a further example of how Nazism is creeping into our society, and its proponents are being given platforms in our national press.

So because its Hopkins it can't be a stupid mistake, which she's deleted I read further up the thread.
Ok, makes perfect sense now.

Now Nazism is creeping more and more into society?
Remember recently when I told you that I thought some of your posts were stupid?
Here's an example of what I think is stupid.

Someone has been sat watching her twitter account waiting for the first thing they can get outraged about and screenshot it to share around.
Now to me that's quite bloody stupid that people are so desperate to get outraged that they will follow her on twitter.
Same with people who follow Barton or Frankie Boyle, but don't actually like them, they're just seeking to get offended by them and other people like them.

As I've stated, I read the tweet and didn't think Nazis or Holocaust or genocide.
It's not because I'm stupid, or naive etc, nor am I a Nazi or nazi sympathizer and I don't support the EDL, BNP or any organization like that.

I'm simply not out looking to get offended by something she's written and I'm not looking for a secret code either.
Most of you have chosen to interpret her words to suit your own agenda against her is how I've viewed this thread.

Now unless you can show she's called for genocidal acts to be committed before then that's how I'll continue to view this thread.

I've read her article today and there's nothing genocidal in that either, I even managed to finish it without getting offended.
You should try the same, you might like it although going off your past form you'll struggle to do that.
Maybe Trump will distract you with something else you can get upset about, he seems to be your flavour of the year so far.

[Imploding Turtle]

So because its Hopkins it can't be a stupid mistake, which she's deleted I read further up the thread.

...

I'm getting a little bit tired of correcting you after you've twisted what i've said into something I didn't so that you can criticise it.

[cloughyclaret]

You keep saying there's some kind of secret code. All she did was miss off the capital letters. Hardly secret. Its you who hasn't read her intention - you have admitted yourself that you neither follow her and don't take much notice of her. It's you who is basically arguing on behalf of someone that you don't even care about her views enough to know her history.

Well others do, and yes. Her intention was clear - not a 'secret code'.

[Sidney1st]

Read the whole thread Cloughy, its turtle who's mentioned the code originally, he even gave it a name.

[Sidney1st]

I'm getting a little bit tired of correcting you after you've twisted what i've said into something I didn't so that you can criticise it.

Hmm now lets have a look at that shall we...

You're tired of me twisting something you've said into something you didn't...
Can I direct you to the original tweet and ask why its been twisted into a what it has been on here?

Or doesn't the same apply?

[cloughyclaret]

And you have pounced on it Sid. There is no secret code. She meant what she said, stop being a stubborn **** and and accept that she meant it. She really did. Educate yourself about her before jumping to her defense. She has form in hatred - kids ,fat people, disabled - the list goes on.

Someone earlier up posted you are better than this. You are.