Guardian PL Season Preview: Burnley

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:10 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/football/bl ... 18-burnley

The Guardian panel predicts we'll finish 18th, and go down

“I still think we need that extra bit of experience within the group,” the manager said after the signings of Jack Cork and Jon Walters. “I thought we needed that all along, even though this will be my third Premier League season.”

That seems fair enough. Cork and Walters have played more than 400 games between them and are unlikely to let anyone down, even if they are not quite the type of captures to set pulses racing or shift many more season tickets. Phil Bardsley has so similar a profile it is tempting to wonder how many able but unadventurous signings Burnley may end up with.

Burnley have also lost Michael Keane, most significantly, from the heart of their defence, banking £25m from Everton without so far rushing out to spend much of it. That reluctance to spend may catch up with them one day.

Burnley have yet to bring anyone in to beef up their attacking options, and if anyone makes an unrefusable offer for Andre Gray it is hard to imagine Sam Vokes and Ashley Barnes scoring enough goals to keep the company afloat.

Burnley can expect a certain amount of second-season syndrome. Turf Moor is not an intimidating venue, just an old-fashioned and noisily atmospheric one, and fewer opponents are likely to be caught out by complacency now they know what to expect. Dyche would probably bite your hand off right now if you were to hold out the promise of another 10 home wins.

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:12 pm

The Guardian that had us finishing 19th last season ? They must think we are a better side this season.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:13 pm

Don't think anyone could reasonably disagree with any of that to be honest.

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:13 pm

SkiptonClaret wrote:Don't think anyone could reasonably disagree with any of that to be honest.

Well it would have suited some on here better had they put us down for finishing 20th

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:15 pm

claretdom wrote:Well it would have suited some on here better had they put us down for finishing 20th

Regardless, is any of it woefully unfair ? I'd suggest not.

Claret-On-A-T-Rex · Post by **Claret-On-A-T-Rex** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:18 pm

The article is mostly positive and then predicts us finishing in the bottom three, very strange.

Neither does it give Dyche any credit, or should I say belief, that we are going to be stronger due to his longevity at the club and now decent Prem League experience.

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:19 pm

SkiptonClaret wrote:Regardless, is any of it woefully unfair ? I'd suggest not.

Nothing is "woefully unfair" but from their own collection of esteemed football writers they are predicting us to do better this season than they thought we would last season. They didn't mention last seasons preview and how we would be relegated.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:24 pm

I fully expect a lottery below 10th again. I'm confident we will have enough to avoid the drop though. Nothing spectacular happened yet but I think we've strengthened sensibly so far and hopefully with another couple at least still expected to arrive think we'll have enough to keep our heads above it.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:28 pm

elwaclaret wrote:I fully expect a lottery below 10th again. I'm confident we will have enough to avoid the drop though. Nothing spectacular happened yet but I think we've strengthened sensibly so far and hopefully with another couple at least still expected to arrive think we'll have enough to keep our heads above it.

Maybe, I'd suggest that the centre back aside we really could do with being a little more adventurous / "braver" in further outfield signings. Just don't see where the "spark" is coming from at the minute, all looks a little pedestrian and straight lined.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:29 pm

With Keane gone, we will concede more.

We didn't score many last season; this year we really need to have a go at teams and score some goals, because we can't rely on a superstar at the back any more.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:30 pm

UpTheBeehole wrote:With Keane gone, we will concede more.

We didn't score many last season; this year we really need to have a go at teams and score some goals, because we can't rely on a superstar at the back any more.

Agreed, I fully expect us to concede more without Keane but really unsure where the counter threat is going to come from at the minute.

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:31 pm

That's a very fair assessment tbh. They might see us as a little weaker but the other teams around the bottom weaker.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:34 pm

It's going to be another big achievement to stay up. Not sure why people are getting their knickers in a twist over a paper thinking we won't do it.

hampsteadclaret · Post by **hampsteadclaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:35 pm

If we get three good players in [we know what we want] then we will finish somewhere in 13th - 16th position.

JohnMcGreal · Post by **JohnMcGreal** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:35 pm

I'd say that's a very fair assessment by Paul Wilson. Hard to disagree with any of that.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:37 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote:It's going to be another big achievement to stay up. Not sure why people are getting their knickers in a twist over a paper thinking we won't do it.

To be fair it's only ClaretDong that has.

CleggHall · Post by **CleggHall** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:37 pm

A fair and balanced report from MY paper, predicted 18th place apart. Keane will be a miss but other signings have improved us, we are in a much better place than August 2016. However the Guardian's predictions on all things (Election, Corbyn, Referendum ) are generally incorrect so here's looking forward to another successful season.

Silkyskills1 · Post by **Silkyskills1** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:38 pm

Have to agree with much of what has been written. I expect us once more to be tough and resilient but our inability to score enough goals has not been addressed. Sam Vokes and Ashley Barnes will not correct it.

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:39 pm

Fair assessment.

There is nothing in the article that stands out as unfair or unreasonable.

I suspect that in part, their average finishing position (note that the author may have had us finishing higher) could be to do with those around the bottom being stronger this year than last.

Newcastle will be better than Sunderland were, Brighton may we'll be better than Middlesbrough were. Huddersfield may be the only exception, who barring a big surprise, I can't see getting more points than Hull achieved.

We need at least two quality signings, perhaps three or four, and that excludes a keeper.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:42 pm

We need more that two. Four or five, I'd suggest, there would then be room to ship the odd one out.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:43 pm

They see Keane as a big miss, recognise that we've signed experienced prem players and have highlighted that we'd be very lucky to maintain our amazing home form.

Based on what we have done so far, its a fair assessment.

Think its possible to call anywhere between 14th-20th though for where we finish though.

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:44 pm

'Burnley have yet to bring anyone in to beef up their attacking options, and if anyone makes an unrefusable offer for Andre Gray it is hard to imagine Sam Vokes and Ashley Barnes scoring enough goals to keep the company afloat.'

What's Jon Walters then?

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:45 pm

First choice striker (with pace or skill)
Winger better than Gudmundsson and Arfield
Centre Back better than Mee or Tarkowski
Experienced goalkeeper who'd be more use to the first team than Paul Robinson was

At the bare minimum.

Selby Claret · Post by **Selby Claret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:47 pm

SkiptonClaret wrote:Agreed, I fully expect us to concede more without Keane but really unsure where the counter threat is going to come from at the minute.

My hope is that we see (A LOT!) more of Defour, Gudmundsson and Brady.

Plus a first full season in the PL will have done Hendrick/Gray/Vokes the world of good for experience.

A Dyche pre-season for ball playing Westwood plus the addition of ball playing Cork and attacking option Walters will hopefully all come together in a glorious new forward thinking unit...............(fingers crossed!)

And thats before the two or three signings yet to arrive.........(toes crossed!)

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:48 pm

its as fair an assessment as you'd expect to be written by an outsider. there's plenty more to take into account than who we have or haven't signed.

its also the easiest thing in the world to predict that one of the clubs with the smallest resources will be one of those relegated.

up to us to prove them all wrong again.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:48 pm

With the exception of Keane, we've replaced what we've lost and certainly upgraded.

We do need more though, but there actually is quite a bit to be positive about.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:48 pm

UpTheBeehole wrote:First choice striker (with pace or skill)
Winger better than Gudmundsson and Arfield
Centre Back better than Mee or Tarkowski
Experienced goalkeeper who'd be more use to the first team than Paul Robinson was

At the bare minimum.

Steady ! Paul Robinson was absolutely immense in the stands and dressing room as was Stephen Reid.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:51 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:With the exception of Keane, we've replaced what we've lost and certainly upgraded.

We do need more though, but there actually is quite a bit to be positive about.

That implies you think Walters will be as fundamental to the working of the framework that Boyd was. Do you think, at 34, he's got the legs ? Assuming, of course, you see Walters as Boyd's replacement. Reminds me more of a Matt Taylor type signing and he certainly was never going to meet the demands of the framework on a regular basis.

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:52 pm

Jon Walters isn't 34.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:53 pm

I think it depends if you think Boyd was essential to the way we play or not.

I liked him, but with Brady, Arfield, Gudmundsson, Defour and Walters he's what known as "surplus to requirements".

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:55 pm

Tall Paul wrote:Jon Walters isn't 34.

Ok, 34 next month if you really want to be that pedantic.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 2:55 pm

Tall Paul wrote:Jon Walters isn't 34.

Walters is 34 for all but the first 5 games this season

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:01 pm

claretdom wrote:Least the cry arse has moved on and is now using his name,there is hope he might start to enjoy being a top flight club yet.

Ha, ClaretDong has turned up - didn't think it would take too long, do you have some sort of alert set or something ?
Anyway you must try harder, young man. How can I be be expected to take someone seriously who features some relic of a Brit Pop quote as their "location" ?

claretdom · Post by **claretdom** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:03 pm

SkiptonClaret wrote:Ha, ClaretDong has turned up - didn't think it would take too long, do you have some sort of alert set or something ?
Anyway you must try harder, young man. How can I be be expected to take someone seriously who features some relic of a Brit Pop quote as their "location" ?

Did you come up with claretdong all on your own ?

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:04 pm

claretdom wrote:Least the cry arse has moved on and is now using his name,there is hope he might start to enjoy being a top flight club yet.

Christ, you're having a pop at someone else now, all your posts are the exact same just aimed at different people. You must be seriously unhappy in your own skin, at least that's how it comes across.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:05 pm

claretdom wrote:Did you come up with claretdong all on your own ?

Oh do run along little chap and pick an argument with someone who gives a s*it.

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:06 pm

KRBFC wrote:Christ, you're having a pop at someone else now, all your posts are the exact same just aimed at different people. You must be seriously unhappy in your own skin, at least that's how it comes across.

Glad someone else has noticed -appears a wretched little creature who simply can't abide any view different to his own.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:08 pm

Back on topic, I think they wont be far off with their prediction, a failed transfer window where we just haven't done enough to boost the quality of the team. Ultimately will put us in danger, 2 wins in 15 at the end of last season, we needed serious upgrades to the team and we haven't seen it at all yet. Serious work to do in the market yet I fancy the funds just aren't there to spend for whatever reason.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:10 pm

Garlick said the funds were there even before we signed Keane. So far we've signed one first team player, having lost 2. We need so much more.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:11 pm

SkiptonClaret wrote:Glad someone else has noticed -appears a wretched little creature who simply can't abide any view different to his own.

Yeah he does the same to all sorts of posters, Its like he needs a self esteem boost and tries to put others down on here to get it. Apparently I ruin threads yet this Muppet posts sh**e like this on every thread to start arguments. So fkn weird

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:13 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:I think it depends if you think Boyd was essential to the way we play or not.

I liked him, but with Brady, Arfield, Gudmundsson, Defour and Walters he's what known as "surplus to requirements".

I didn't rate him as a footballer but then I don't think playing football was fundamental to his purpose. I think he had attributes that suited the physical demands of the framework, I would question that 3 or 4 of the names you've listed possess the same 'qualities".

SkiptonClaret · Post by **SkiptonClaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:14 pm

KRBFC wrote:Yeah he does the same to all sorts of posters, Its like he needs a self esteem boost and tries to put others down on here to get it. Apparently I ruin threads yet this Muppet posts sh**e like this on every thread to start arguments. So fkn weird

Yes, exactly that.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:15 pm

UpTheBeehole wrote:Garlick said the funds were there even before we signed Keane. So far we've signed one first team player, having lost 2. We need so much more.

Talk is cheap, we have been linked with how many players worth over £10M? We aren't prepared to do what we did last and spend the cash. We are trying to do what we did in Dyches first PL season and survive on the cheap. The cash should be there but it isn't and even if it is, they're unwilling to spend it which is a shame because I thought the last 2 years they've backed Dyche tremendously. 2 steps forward then 3 steps backwards.

ksrclaret · Post by **ksrclaret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:18 pm

It's a decent assessment of where we are right now. We've done some good business bringing in shed loads of PL experience, and in Jack Cork I think we've massively upgraded on the Barton we saw in the second half of last season.

We're two good players away I think. One is obviously a centre half to replace Keane because I don fancy Long and Anderson as our only back ups, and the other is a pacey, dynamic forward. We're going to need to spend to acquire those players though, which is just as well given we've still got all of this seasons prem money available.

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:21 pm

The signings will come. As dyche has stated before, buying players is like buying a house. There's a chain. The window will get going properly over the next couple of weeks.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:25 pm

We've got a week and a half before the season starts. We need to be at full strength for every game this season, not give everyone else a head start because we haven't got our targets in until the last day of the deadline.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:25 pm

Dyched wrote:The signings will come. As dyche has stated before, buying players is like buying a house. There's a chain. The window will get going properly over the next couple of weeks.

Possibly, there's only one way to find out. I have a bad feeling though, based on the window so far.

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:29 pm

UpTheBeehole wrote:We've got a week and a half before the season starts. We need to be at full strength for every game this season, not give everyone else a head start because we haven't got our targets in until the last day of the deadline.

I could've sworn many said the same last season, which didn't turn out too badly.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:31 pm

We lost pathetically to a relegation rival on the opening day

Top Claret · Post by **Top Claret** » Tue Aug 01, 2017 3:32 pm

Hard to disagree with any of that. We are definitely weaker without Keane and the writing would definitely be on the wall if Gray went this window. On the other hand we still have another 30 days before the window closes and I fully expect additional signings that will strengthen the starting 11.
I still think that the clubs togetherness will shine through and we will stay in this division by the skin of our teeth