Wood for 15 million or Gray for 18 million ?

happyclaret17 · Post by **happyclaret17** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:11 pm

well I think I know which clubs got the best value there....said it before and will say it again....even if Wood hadnt scored yesterday he was in the right position time and time again....very encouraging for the future and Brady found him twice with defence splitting passes....utc.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:15 pm

I don't think I need to say anything really, as people should know my stance on this.

Wilsdenclaret · Post by **Wilsdenclaret** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:17 pm

Gray for 18m

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:19 pm

Let's wait and see.

Chester Perry · Post by **Chester Perry** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:20 pm

The player that wants to play for us

need to get over the euphoria and see what wood can do over the whole season to make a fair comparison - I am sure that if it goes well for him and he gets offers from up the food chain in the next 2 seasons he will want to go

happyclaret17 · Post by **happyclaret17** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:24 pm

the thing is though, you know what level Gray is at and even under Dyche his improvement hasnt been great....Wood is still a raw talent and improving...personally I think he is already a fair bit better than gray and sure to improve.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:28 pm

I think Wood can get us 12-15 goals this season if he's given enough time. He'll slowly overtake Vokes in a 4-5-1.

halfmanhalfbiscuit · Post by **halfmanhalfbiscuit** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:31 pm

I was impressed with Wood yesterday.
He looks to have a really good attitude. He kept on showing for the ball, made the right runs, found himself in the right place.
He did get caught offside a few time but he kept on going and got the goal.
He's a powerful player and he'll let centre backs know they've been in a game.
And he's quick.

Chester Perry · Post by **Chester Perry** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:34 pm

halfmanhalfbiscuit wrote:I was impressed with Wood yesterday.
He looks to have a really good attitude. He kept on showing for the ball, made the right runs, found himself in the right place.
He did get caught offside a few time but he kept on going and got the goal.
He's a powerful player and he'll let centre backs know they've been in a game.
And he's quick.

loved Sean's answer to the question of Woods offsides - don't mind it - it put's doubt in the mind of the defence

only manager I have ever heard take it as a positive - most go nut's at their player

Funkydrummer · Post by **Funkydrummer** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:35 pm

No contest for me - we picked Watford's pocket with that deal IMO.

Gray is never going to improve beyond what he is now imo.

halfmanhalfbiscuit · Post by **halfmanhalfbiscuit** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:38 pm

Chester Perry wrote:loved Sean's answer to the question of Woods offsides - don't mind it - it put's doubt in the mind of the defence

only manager I have ever heard take it as a positive - most go nut's at their player

I hadn't seen that. It's a good response.

halfmanhalfbiscuit · Post by **halfmanhalfbiscuit** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:43 pm

I suppose the question is are we a better team with Wood or Gray.
I like Gray and still think he's a good player. But I honestly don't think he'd have started so far this season.

claretjohn33505 · Post by **claretjohn33505** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:47 pm

both gray and wood seem to enjoy being caught offside, no difference there then.

i thought that generaly,wood's first touch was better than gray's but it is still early days.

we will wait and see.

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:56 pm

His ClaretPlayer interview is very good. Talks of 'we' even going back to previous seasons.
Well spoken too.

IndigoLake · Post by **IndigoLake** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:59 pm

IanMcL wrote:His ClaretPlayer interview is very good. Talks of 'we' even going back to previous seasons.
Well spoken too.

Agreed. He has very much bought into the team/group mentality Dyche has instilled!

IndigoLake · Post by **IndigoLake** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:02 pm

I think Wood can really score goals at this level. He's strong, deceptively quick for his size and gets in good positions. He'll prove to be a better player than Gray for us.

elwaclaret · Post by **elwaclaret** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:02 pm

Very early days obviously to make comparisons. However on first flush only I've been very impressed by Woods movement and presence - once he settles I'm pretty sure he's going to be a breath of fresh air for our squad. Seems to have a lot more about him than Gray.

billyhamilton82 · Post by **billyhamilton82** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:03 pm

happyclaret17 wrote:well I think I know which clubs got the best value there....said it before and will say it again....even if Wood hadnt scored yesterday he was in the right position time and time again....very encouraging for the future and Brady found him twice with defence splitting passes....utc.

Would Gray have scored that Wood goal yesterday?

Quite possibly (although personally I doubt it.)

Would Gray have got into that position in the first place?

Absolutely no chance.

Its alright having pace but when you don't have the football brain to go with it is nowhere near as effective.

You can get away with it at Championship level not at Premier.

On the other hand Wood's movement is exceptional.

A Leeds friend of mine likened him to Andy Payton, I coudn't see it at the time but I can understand his comparison now.

Just as a further comparison yesterday Brady played the same ball twice as Wood got in behind the Spurs defence creating one on ones with the keeper scoring one.

Rewind and compare that to Gray in the home match in April.

Gray was static and unable to create anything as his thought process wasn't quick enough as the Spurs defence was totally impregnable.

In fact he was so poor and ineffective he was taken off after just 50 minutes.

In Chris Wood we have a real striker on our hands who is at the top of his game and a fully rounded player.

Don't get me wrong Gray has big potential but he still has a lot to learn. Whether he does learn under the Watford regime only time will tell.

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:08 pm

Some Watford fan's posts about Gray :

"Oh poor Gray. He was **** yesterday and every game I've seen him in, still *\\: insert excuse://

\\He was isolated
\\It's his first game
\\The wind was coming from the wrong direction
\\ he put the wrong socks on
\\ He saw a gay in the crowd and it put him off all game

Bang average championship level player at best.
Not fast.
No first touch
Not big enough to play off the second ball and bully the defence

How many more useless performances without goals until the apologists realise we have bought a diamond encrusted dud"

"Gray - I thought he was **** yesterday, think he had 18 touches all match?"

"Thought Gray was very poor. 1st touch was terrible. I hope we have not messed up with this signing"

"Even before the sending off Gray was poor. First 10 minutes in particular he was shocking, everything he could do wrong he did. "

dibraidio · Post by **dibraidio** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:08 pm

Wood is so much better than Gray it's embarrassing to make the comparison.

Andre scored less than one goal for every three games he played. Chris is already on a tally of 2.65 goals per 90 minutes. If he plays 32 times like Andre did (presumably he won't get a ban for homophobic bigotry, but hey, let's be fair on this one) he'll finish the season with 84.8 goals compared to Andre's 9!

J50 · Post by **J50** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:10 pm

What's the total cost though, over say 4 years? Transfer fees, agents fees, salary etc. I would guess a much greater gap in cost than the difference in transfer fees alone.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:15 pm

dibraidio wrote:he'll finish the season with 84.8 goals compared to Andre's 9!

I don't think he'll pass the 80 goal barrier this season.

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:21 pm

J50 wrote:What's the total cost though, over say 4 years? Transfer fees, agents fees, salary etc. I would guess a much greater gap in cost than the difference in transfer fees alone.

Not when you factor in what it would have cost us in wages to keep Andre, (if we are to believe what we were told his demands were).

Quicknick · Post by **Quicknick** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:24 pm

I don't suppose for a second we got 18 million for Gray.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:25 pm

Quicknick wrote:I don't suppose for a second we got 18 million for Gray.

We inserted a clever clause into the deal. £15 million rising to £18 million if he scores a goal.

Goalposts · Post by **Goalposts** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:28 pm

wood all day long only area gray is better is pace

gandhisflipflop · Post by **gandhisflipflop** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:34 pm

Wood easily. Gray just isn't a premier league striker at all. You need to be converting chances more frequently than Gray does at this level. I still can't understand what he will offer Watford but he isn't our problem anymore.

billyhamilton82 · Post by **billyhamilton82** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:40 pm

Gray

According to reports Gray's wages are £95k per week.

Over 4 years is £20 million plus transfer fee of £18.5 million.

Total deal nearly £40 million.

Wood

According to reports our wage ceiling is around £40k per week.

Over 4 years is £8.3 million plus transfer fee £15 million rising to a possible £18.5 million.

Total deal just over £23 million to a maximum of just over £26 million.

If you also take into consideration that Gray is represented by a so called "super agent" then I would suggest the total deal for Gray will be nearly double that of the Wood deal.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:41 pm

Early days, but Wood looked really good. Took up some good positions. I would say, on the little evidence here, that he reads the game better than Gray.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:42 pm

And on top of that, I think I'd have Wood even if they were for the same money.

happyclaret17 · Post by **happyclaret17** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:42 pm

when I saw gray play the other week he was just running the channels and crossing.....not sure you would want to pay 18 million for that....he isnt premiership class and proved that last season when Vokesy outperformed him consistently....brilliant business selling him for that sort of money.

mohamed69 · Post by **mohamed69** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:42 pm

Everyone hates gray now...a year ago I was ridiculed for pointing out his awful touch

If this isn't evidence of the ridiculous claret goggles most on here wear then I don't know what is...

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:43 pm

boatshed bill wrote:Early days, but Wood looked really good. Took up some good positions. I would say, on the little evidence here, that he reads the game better than Gray.

One thing I've not seen mentioned yet, which relates to what you say about reading the game. When Brady got the ball yesterday, if you see the replay, watch Wood's running and notice that he points - he's telling Brady where he wants the ball.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:48 pm

FactualFrank wrote:One thing I've not seen mentioned yet, which relates to what you say about reading the game. When Brady got the ball yesterday, if you see the replay, watch Wood's running and notice that he points - he's telling Brady where he wants the ball.

I didn't notice that, but it was a very smart piece of play from both of them.

billyhamilton82 · Post by **billyhamilton82** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:51 pm

mohamed69 wrote:Everyone hates gray now...a year ago I was ridiculed for pointing out his awful touch

If this isn't evidence of the ridiculous claret goggles most on here wear then I don't know what is...

That doesn't hold any significance when you ridicule everything to do with Burnley Football Club.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:54 pm

I don't hate Gray.
And this thread is a topic about comparison between two strikers. It's little wonder that fans tend to prefer our new striker.

mohamed69 · Post by **mohamed69** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:58 pm

billyhamilton82 wrote:That doesn't hold any significance when you ridicule everything to do with Burnley Football Club.

That just isn't true

But is consistent with the cognitive biases people on here seem to demonstrate in spades

mohamed69 · Post by **mohamed69** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:59 pm

boatshed bill wrote:I don't hate Gray.
And this thread is a topic about comparison between two strikers. It's little wonder that fans tend to prefer our new striker.

Just because he is ours? And then ridicule people who don't share the same opinion. How boring is that.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:07 pm

mohamed69 wrote:Just because he is ours? And then ridicule people who don't share the same opinion. How boring is that.

i think the goal yesterday may have had some bearing, TBF
I don't really pay much attention to what may be deemed "ridicule" myself.

mohamed69 · Post by **mohamed69** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:09 pm

boatshed bill wrote:i think the goal yesterday may have had some bearing, TBF
I don't really pay much attention to what may be deemed "ridicule" myself.

Not talking about gray vs wood, just in general. I much prefer wood, it should be no surprise to hear!

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:13 pm

mohamed69 wrote:Not talking about gray vs wood, just in general. I much prefer wood, it should be no surprise to hear!

But this thread is about Gray vs Wood

mohamed69 · Post by **mohamed69** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:15 pm

boatshed bill wrote:But this thread is about Gray vs Wood

Again, you are being mentally lazy. This is the same small mindedness that gives our fans a bad name

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:18 pm

mohamed69 wrote:Again, you are being mentally lazy. This is the same small mindedness that gives our fans a bad name

Yep, that's me, mentally lazy, constantly giving Burnley and its football club and the club's supporters a bad name.
Can't even read and respond to a thread title properly.
Never mind, thick in the arm, thick in the head...as they say

Rumbletonk · Post by **Rumbletonk** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:19 pm

dibraidio wrote:Wood is so much better than Gray it's embarrassing to make the comparison.

Andre scored less than one goal for every three games he played. Chris is already on a tally of 2.65 goals per 90 minutes. If he plays 32 times like Andre did (presumably he won't get a ban for homophobic bigotry, but hey, let's be fair on this one) he'll finish the season with 84.8 goals compared to Andre's 9!

Stats don't lie. That said, I think it would be unfair to expect more than 65 goals in his 1st season in the top flight

Bigvince · Post by **Bigvince** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:44 pm

Wow! They say a week is a long time in politics. It must be the same in football.
Gone are many of the doubters, of which I was one. Many of us thought Wood and Vokesy were to much alike,
But after the wovers game and yesterday's performance we've seen glimpses of what Chris Wood can bring to
Our team.and I for one can't wait to see more.
Not forgetting the role Andre Gray has had in our recent success,I think if we're asked the same question at
the end of the season, Chris or Andre, the answer might be Andre who?

UTC

3putt · Post by **3putt** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:46 pm

This board is great for any keen Burnley fan to keep up to date with all things Clarets and share and appreciate others views.

It's even better for comedy value. Leading up to the signing of Wood this board was in meltdown with the majority of fans in despair at the thoughts of of us signing Wood. "A poor man's Vokes" was one of the regular quotes, "one good season is all he's had" being another. Now all of a sudden he's brilliant after half a game in the Prem, miles better Gray and doing all sorts of things Gray could never do.

I was actually pleased with the Wood signing and he's made a good start. Let's hope it continues but perspective is in short supply on here sometimes.

Right_winger · Post by **Right_winger** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:30 pm

Totally different players. Gray is superb at playing just off the shoulder. He isn't remotely anything close to a target man. if Gray got the correct service he'd outscore Wood, mainly because of his pace and instinctive
Finishing.

Wood although looks quick off the mark doesn't have the same electric pace as Gray and doesn't have the same instinct. He may well be a better allround player but that doesn't really matter for a striker so much.

Gray has proven he can score goals at this level, Wood has yet to prove this. If/when he does then I'll happily re-evaluate my opinion.

happyclaret17 · Post by **happyclaret17** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:39 pm

Right_winger wrote:Totally different players. Gray is superb at playing just off the shoulder. He isn't remotely anything close to a target man. if Gray got the correct service he'd outscore Wood, mainly because of his pace and instinctive
Finishing.

Wood although looks quick off the mark doesn't have the same electric pace as Gray and doesn't have the same instinct. He may well be a better allround player but that doesn't really matter for a striker so much.

Gray has proven he can score goals at this level, Wood has yet to prove this. If/when he does then I'll happily re-evaluate my opinion.

..........

could hardly disagree more on virtually all of that....including being proven goal scorer at prem level....virtually anyone would score now and again if playing striker for us in the prem for 2 or 3 seasons....his stats were consistently poorer than Vokes and Vokes could be our 2nd choice striker now.
Grays strong point was striking the ball early if running on to a through ball....not particularly good in the air and not particularly good at working well in a partnership.
I would expect you will be re evaluating your opinion.....but this game is all about opinions....utc.

StuffyClaret · Post by **StuffyClaret** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:43 pm

FactualFrank wrote:And on top of that, I think I'd have Wood even if they were for the same money.

I'm sure you aren't the only one Frank. I must admit to having been slightly aroused too.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:02 pm

StuffyClaret wrote:I'm sure you aren't the only one Frank. I must admit to having been slightly aroused too.