More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

This Forum is the main messageboard to discuss all things Claret and Blue and beyond
Locked
UpTheBeehole
Posts: 5069
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:14 pm
Been Liked: 1157 times
Has Liked: 496 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by UpTheBeehole » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:27 am

Damo wrote:
IMG_20171215_001923.jpg
IMG_20171215_001948.jpg
IMG_20171215_002023.jpg
There you go.
I don't subscribe to FT
Neither does my 9 year old son and even he was capable of sourcing this info.
If you like I will forward you his email
Strange how you didn't quote the bottom of the article
Not everyone in the financial community views a Corbyn government in such grave terms. Dean Turner, an economist in the UK investment office at UBS Wealth Management, believes investors have exaggerated the threat posed by Mr Corbyn, saying a government led by the Labour leader would not turn Britain into “Venezuela overnight”.

“Taxation as a share of gross domestic product would be at 1985 levels, and spending as a share of GDP at 1984 levels,” Mr Turner said, adding that it would be a “dramatic shift from where we have been for the last 30 years”.

He said, any change would be “gradual”.

“There is a lot of talk about becoming Venezuela overnight,” said Mr Turner. “That’s extreme.”

Mr Turner said many of Mr Corbyn’s policy proposals, such as renationalisation of the railways, would be seen as mainstream in other EU countries. He also said that Mr Corbyn’s pledge to reverse cuts in corporation tax — raising the headline corporation tax rate from 19 to 26 per cent — was also relatively conventional. Even under Mr Corbyn’s plan, for example, the UK would still have the lowest corporate tax rate in the G7.

Mr Turner also dismissed speculation about a run on the pound and the imposition of capital controls, even after Mr McDonnell said that Labour would have to prepare for both possibilities.

“If we do see a weaker pound, the change would be gradual,” Mr Turner said. “I doubt we would see the kind of falls we saw post-Brexit vote.”

Mr Turner’s colleague, Karan Sejpal, head of UBS Wealth in the north-west and Yorkshire, said some private wealth management clients were concerned about the prospect of a Corbyn government. “Quite a few are getting apprehensive,” he said.

But Mr Sejpal added: “It has been relatively subdued. His rhetoric has softened as he has become more probable as a prime minister.”
This user liked this post: If it be your will

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:37 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:I repeat the devil is in the detail Ringo.

I know exactly what was agreed by the EU. Its not a European army.

Its the preparation work for a potential EU force at most, and a sensible funding deal for weapons specification and development

We'll be ok though, what is it? £20 billion less for our armed forces in the next defense review, barely enough frigates and destroyers to protect our new carriers, all three parts of the service about 90% of thier supposed strength.

But hey, at least we can rely on the Yanks.........oh

https://qz.com/1127984/eu-army-bloc-for ... ependence/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"It's a potential EU force"

Do you know what your hero, Nick "tuition fees" Clegg would say about what you've just admitted.

"A dangerous fantasy" that's what the lying hard core Remoaner claimed when Nigel Farage said it was going to happen.

You're a dangerous fantasist Lancs. Or as id prefer to think. You're not, but Mr tuition fees is an arch federalist europhile, who knows that the British people would throw the the while sorry EU experiment out of the window were the truth to be allowed out.

By the way if, as you claim, you know "exactly what was agreed by the EU. Its not a European army."

What do you think, Europhile, Made in means when he says the EU must have an "autonomous capacity for action" !???!!!!

If it looks, acts and behaves like an EU army. It's an EU army.

What is an "autonomous capacity for action" Lancs?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-41403394" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Last edited by RingoMcCartney on Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:44 am, edited 1 time in total.

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:44 am

Here is what he said last week Ringo about it.

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/columnists/ ... -350m-nhs/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I think I prefer to called someone who makes up his own mind based on looking at stuff to be honest.

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:46 am

Upanatem

Basically I don't think Greece or anyone else is going to default, and even if they did, its a euro zone issue so we won't have to contribute.

We have a good deal at the moment, and we are walking away from it based on promises that are not based on enough to make it worthwhile.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:50 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Here is what he said last week Ringo about it.

https://inews.co.uk/opinion/columnists/ ... -350m-nhs/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I think I prefer to called someone who makes up his own mind based on looking at stuff to be honest.
Using the above link a quote from Mogherinni

"European Union of Security and Defence” was ”not a dream anymore, it is reality coming true”

Sorry lancs. You've just shot yourself in the foot!


What is an "autonomous capacity for action" Lancs?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-41403394" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

So far, in trying to prove that an EU army is not being formed, and clearly being of the view that it's simply fantasy. You've provided a link that pre-dates the EU agreement for an EU "defence force" by over a year!. And a further link that has a quote from a leading Eurocrat, who, when describing an EU army as, ”not a dream anymore, it is reality coming true”!!!!

It's not been a good start for you has it!?
Last edited by RingoMcCartney on Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:07 am, edited 2 times in total.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:59 am

Sidney1st wrote:Our countries defense is always the prime priority, however we should get involved in things like Bosnia or Rwanda when it's clear genocide is happening.

Getting dragged into 'wars' by the Yanks however needs to stop because as it's been shown it doesn't actually make things any better and is just costing us lives and money needlessly.
How do you feel the majority of the People would feel about getting dragged into wars as part of an "EU defence force" lead by the semi permanently p1ssed Drunker?

aggi
Posts: 8762
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 11:31 am
Been Liked: 2109 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by aggi » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:18 am

RingoMcCartney wrote:Don't need one. Now we're leaving.

Stop deflecting.

What would be the answer?

Fighting for Jean Claude Drunker. Or to defend these islands

Which one? No ifs no buts keep it nice n straight forward.

Which one would they say?

Come on. Let your "inner Ringo" loose! As you said when you made a total twit of yourself claiming Clarke wasn't elected !!!!

Drunker or these islands?
It's an irrelevant question (and obviously heavily loaded), you may well as well ask would you prefer the army to defend these islands or fight for Putin.

Nothing has been agreed, it wouldn't be agreed in the nature you claim. I would ask you to provide evidence that it has been agreed but we both know that isn't how you work. You far prefer to make something up (or believe something you've read, I don't know which) and base an argument on that rather than fact.

Come on. Let your "inner Ringo" loose! As you said when you made a total twit of yourself claiming Clarke wasn't elected !!!!
If you look back these were your exact words with just the names/locations changed ...

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:20 am

Details have never been your strong point Ringo, and that isn't going to change.

You keep believing what you want to believe, if it keeps you going I'm happy with that.

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:23 am

How do you feel the majority of the People would feel about getting dragged into wars as part of an "EU defence force" lead by the semi permanently p1ssed Drunker?
If I had to remember any posts of yours from this thread that show exactly why I'd be better off arguing with a stone, it would be this one.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:30 am

aggi wrote:It's an irrelevant question (and obviously heavily loaded), you may well as well ask would you prefer the army to defend these islands or fight for Putin.

Nothing has been agreed, it wouldn't be agreed in the nature you claim. I would ask you to provide evidence that it has been agreed but we both know that isn't how you work. You far prefer to make something up (or believe something you've read, I don't know which) and base an argument on that rather than fact.

Come on. Let your "inner Ringo" loose! As you said when you made a total twit of yourself claiming Clarke wasn't elected !!!!
If you look back these were your exact words with just the names/locations changed ...

Clarke was elected. You said he wasn't.

As for evidence. Look at the link that Lancaster claret has so kindly provided this morning. In it is a quote regarding the formation of an EU army. In it Mogherini says"European Union of Security and Defence” was ”not a dream anymore, it is reality coming true” is that good enough for you?

Also, why is my question "irrelevant"? Is it because you know what the answer is? And the answer is that the majority of british people would not want our army to be part of one lead by Drunker. Further more. The idea that only remain voters knew what they were voting for is garbage. How many who did were aware of this EU army being formed?

UpTheBeehole
Posts: 5069
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:14 pm
Been Liked: 1157 times
Has Liked: 496 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by UpTheBeehole » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:34 am

RingoMcCartney wrote: How many who did were aware of this EU army being formed?
What's your opinion of the United Nations peacekeeping forces?

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:36 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:If I had to remember any posts of yours from this thread that show exactly why I'd be better off arguing with a stone, it would be this one.
You've provided a link that pre-dates the EU agreement for an EU "defence force" by over a year!. And a further link that has a quote from a leading Eurocrat, who, when describing an EU army as, ”not a dream anymore, it is reality coming true”!!!!

You consistently not answered my question - "What is an "autonomous capacity for action", because you know the answer.

And it's clear to both of us that an EU army is on its way. But rather than back up your belief it's not. You've been reduced to simply trying to belittle me. I thought you were better than that. You're clearly not......

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:39 am

Aggi, if you read the link I provided this morning, you'll never believe just how selective Ringo is being.

I know, Ringo being "selective". I don't believe that he'd do such a thing but by jove he has!

aggi
Posts: 8762
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 11:31 am
Been Liked: 2109 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by aggi » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:39 am

RingoMcCartney wrote:Clarke was elected. You said he wasn't.

As for evidence. Look at the link that Lancaster claret has so kindly provided this morning. In it is a quote regarding the formation of an EU army. In it Mogherini says"European Union of Security and Defence” was ”not a dream anymore, it is reality coming true” is that good enough for you?

Also, why is my question "irrelevant"? Is it because you know what the answer is? And the answer is that the majority of british people would not want our army to be part of one lead by Drunker. Further more. The idea that only remain voters knew what they were voting for is garbage. How many who did were aware of this EU army being formed?
Have a read of this post and compare the wording ... http://www.uptheclarets.com/messageboar ... 6r#p512146" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

No, that isn't evidence that it is agreed. I want something that shows it has been agreed unanimously (which it would have to be to come into force, and Lancaster's link explicitly says that not all countries have agreed) and the relevant legislation, not random quotes from a politician.

It's irrelevant because the "EU army" you are describing isn't going to happen so it has no bearing on the discussion. You could ask, would you prefer the EU give us £1bn a week to stay in or leave and most would prefer the £1bn a week option but that isn't going to happen so it is irrelevant to the discussion.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:40 am

UpTheBeehole wrote:What's your opinion of the United Nations peacekeeping forces?
What's more important is my opinion of you, uphisownhole, and that you're an irrational foul mouthed toddler, who had a maturity by-pass operation at a very early age.

Move on.

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:44 am

Okay Ringo, based on your vast experience of multi-national armed forces, with different doctrines, equipment, units and ammunition (and the rest), what do you think "autonomous capacity for action" means?

I know exactly what it means, because if I've got a thing (apart from football!) its military.

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:46 am

Ringo
You've been reduced to simply trying to belittle me.
followed by
What's more important is my opinion of you, uphisownhole, and that you're an irrational foul mouthed toddler, who had a maturity by-pass operation at a very early age.
I don't think you even know you are doing it. Thats the amazing thing.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:48 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Aggi, if you read the link I provided this morning, you'll never believe just how selective Ringo is being.

I know, Ringo being "selective". I don't believe that he'd do such a thing but by jove he has!
Your first link predated the new agreement for the formation of an EU "defence force" by 17 months. Which made it utterly irrelevant. Did it or did it not?

Your second link included a quote a quote saying a "European Union of Security and Defence” was ”not a dream anymore, it is reality coming true”. Did it or did it not?

And for the last time. What is an "autonomous capacity for action" Lancs?

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:55 am

aggi wrote:Have a read of this post and compare the wording ... http://www.uptheclarets.com/messageboar ... 6r#p512146" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

No, that isn't evidence that it is agreed. I want something that shows it has been agreed unanimously (which it would have to be to come into force, and Lancaster's link explicitly says that not all countries have agreed) and the relevant legislation, not random quotes from a politician.

It's irrelevant because the "EU army" you are describing isn't going to happen so it has no bearing on the discussion. You could ask, would you prefer the EU give us £1bn a week to stay in or leave and most would prefer the £1bn a week option but that isn't going to happen so it is irrelevant to the discussion.
In your opinion it's not going to happen. In mine it already is. And simply because you say it's an irrelevant question doesn't actually mean it is. I posed the question. You and I know the answer. But the answer is awkward for you. Therefore you declare it "irrelevant". It's not. It's just one that you don't like the answer to.

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:57 am

I know what it is Ringo, I'm asking you if you know what it means

UpTheBeehole
Posts: 5069
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:14 pm
Been Liked: 1157 times
Has Liked: 496 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by UpTheBeehole » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:59 am

Would you mind answering the question Ringo?

What's your opinion on the UN peacekeeping forces?

My 2nd question would be "please explain the differences between an 'EU army' and the UN peacekeepers"

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:01 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Okay Ringo, based on your vast experience of multi-national armed forces, with different doctrines, equipment, units and ammunition (and the rest), what do you think "autonomous capacity for action" means?

I know exactly what it means, because if I've got a thing (apart from football!) its military.
Stop the sneering and belittling lancs. I clearly have a lot less experience of multi-national armed forces, with different doctrines, equipment, units and ammunition, compared to you. The self declared UTC military expert eh?!

If you're so well informed. Please. Enlighten me. I've given you more than enough opportunity.

aggi
Posts: 8762
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 11:31 am
Been Liked: 2109 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by aggi » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:04 am

RingoMcCartney wrote:In your opinion it's not going to happen. In mine it already is. And simply because you say it's an irrelevant question doesn't actually mean it is. I posed the question. You and I know the answer. But the answer is awkward for you. Therefore you declare it "irrelevant". It's not. It's just one that you don't like the answer to.
We both know the answer would be defending our island, my point is that it is irrelevant to the debate. I assume you want us out of Nato too, and UN preacekeeping, etc.

Anyway, I'm still waiting for that evidence. You very explicitly stated:
Do you feel that our armed forces should exist to defend these islands. Or, to form part if an EU army, presumably lead by Jean Claude Drunker?

Because, if we stayed in the EU, despite being described by hard core europhile, Nick Clegg, as a "dangerous fantasy", the latter, is what has just been agreed to in Brussels.


I assume you didn't just make it up.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:04 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:I know what it is Ringo, I'm asking you if you know what it means
:lol: :lol:

Time to stop claiming you know what an "autonomous capacity for action" is

And time to start proving it.........

Over to you Field Marshall!!!!!!!!

Cryssys
Posts: 468
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 1:47 pm
Been Liked: 141 times
Has Liked: 28 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Cryssys » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:13 am

RingoMcCartney wrote::lol: :lol:

Time to stop claiming you know what an "autonomous capacity for action" is

And time to start proving it.........

Over to you Field Marshall!!!!!!!!
Typical wriggling Ringo.

Asks lots of questions of others and frequently demands they provide facts/evidence to back up their statements. However whenever he is asked a question all he does is duck and dive, change the subject or resort to exclamation marks and emojis in the hope that it will somehow hide his ignorance.

Lancaster asked you first Ringo, so why don't you answer it? The balls in your court so why not play that instead of the man?
This user liked this post: UpTheBeehole

UpTheBeehole
Posts: 5069
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:14 pm
Been Liked: 1157 times
Has Liked: 496 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by UpTheBeehole » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:15 am

Another one wanting proof of the EU confirmation that the EU army has been voted on and given the green light.

Come on Ringo

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:15 am

aggi wrote:We both know the answer would be defending our island, my point is that it is irrelevant to the debate. I assume you want us out of Nato too, and UN preacekeeping, etc.

Anyway, I'm still waiting for that evidence. You very explicitly stated:
Do you feel that our armed forces should exist to defend these islands. Or, to form part if an EU army, presumably lead by Jean Claude Drunker?

Because, if we stayed in the EU, despite being described by hard core europhile, Nick Clegg, as a "dangerous fantasy", the latter, is what has just been agreed to in Brussels.


I assume you didn't just make it up.
Well done you've actually agreed with me that the majority wouldn't want it!

As for evidence. I don't need to provide evidence to you or any body else. I simply hold an opinion. You hold an opinion too.

My opinion is that an EU army is being formed. And I'm tempted to believe that's the case when top europhiles calling for an "autonomous capacity for action". And the claim that an EU wide "defence force" ( An army in anything other name ) " is not a dream anymore, it is reality coming true”

I have no evidence just an opinion. A view.

The EU is displaying blatent mission creep. A "trading bloc". With its own f****** army? Really?

Do you have evidence that an EU army IS NOT actually being formed?. If you have, post it. Otherwise, your just like me. Somebody with an opinion.
Last edited by RingoMcCartney on Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

Sidney1st
Posts: 15478
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:40 pm
Been Liked: 3547 times
Has Liked: 5594 times
Location: Oxfordshire

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Sidney1st » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:16 am

UpTheBeehole wrote:What's your opinion of the United Nations peacekeeping forces?
The UN Peace Keeping Force is and always would be a completely different entity to an EU Army.

I think there have been several times when a UN Peace keeping force hasn't been able to step in due to it's parameters, whereas an Army could and probably would be much more aggressive.

Is there a need for an EU Army?
Hard to know really, because if Russia and USA stopped antagonizing each other this side of the world would be a calmer place.

You'd only really need an EU Army to fight Russia if it came to it, it wouldn't be needed for anything else because there isn't another threat militarily to the EU.
Nato and the UN cover everything else and the US likes to invade countries when it suits them.

It would take a lot of money to standardize everything across 27 nations in regards to equipment and training too, plus all the language barriers etc.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:17 am

Cryssys wrote:Typical wriggling Ringo.

Asks lots of questions of others and frequently demands they provide facts/evidence to back up their statements. However whenever he is asked a question all he does is duck and dive, change the subject or resort to exclamation marks and emojis in the hope that it will somehow hide his ignorance.

Lancaster asked you first Ringo, so why don't you answer it? The balls in your court so why not play that instead of the man?
It's an army. Calm down.

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:24 am

I reckon BennyD knows more than me to be fair Ringo.

I'll let you do some research on it. Its a fascinating subject, one that I've been keen on since I was about eight. I'm now 44!
I have no evidence just an opinion. A view.
Glad we agree on that at least

UpTheBeehole
Posts: 5069
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:14 pm
Been Liked: 1157 times
Has Liked: 496 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by UpTheBeehole » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:26 am

You do struggle with evidence don't you Ringo.

You'd make a crap copper.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:27 am

Sidney1st wrote:The UN Peace Keeping Force is and always would be a completely different entity to an EU Army.

I think there have been several times when a UN Peace keeping force hasn't been able to step in due to it's parameters, whereas an Army could and probably would be much more aggressive.

Is there a need for an EU Army?
Hard to know really, because if Russia and USA stopped antagonizing each other this side of the world would be a calmer place.

You'd only really need an EU Army to fight Russia if it came to it, it wouldn't be needed for anything else because there isn't another threat militarily to the EU.
Nato and the UN cover everything else and the US likes to invade countries when it suits them.

It would take a lot of money to standardize everything across 27 nations in regards to equipment and training too, plus all the language barriers etc.
I've heard top British defence men (usually retired top brass) saying an EU army would be very troublesome when it comes to NATO. It would lead to split commitments and competing demands both financial and logistical. Too many cooks.

Tall Paul
Posts: 7171
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:07 am
Been Liked: 2560 times
Has Liked: 690 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Tall Paul » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:29 am

lol Ringo

He can't be a real person.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:30 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Okay Ringo, based on your vast experience of multi-national armed forces, with different doctrines, equipment, units and ammunition (and the rest), what do you think "autonomous capacity for action" means?

I know exactly what it means, because if I've got a thing (apart from football!) its military.
Last chance saloon Lancaster claret!!!!!!!

If you "know exactly what it is" tell me.

UpTheBeehole
Posts: 5069
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:14 pm
Been Liked: 1157 times
Has Liked: 496 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by UpTheBeehole » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:30 am

RingoMcCartney wrote:I've heard top British defence men (usually retired top brass) saying an EU army would be very troublesome when it comes to NATO. It would lead to split commitments and competing demands both financial and logistical. Too many cooks.
No, you heard Michael Fallon say that. Michael Fallon has zero military experience
British defence chiefs have previously vowed to veto any creation of an EU Army, with Defence Secretary Sir Michael Fallon saying in 2016 such a force would serve as a “rival to NATO”.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:33 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:I reckon BennyD knows more than me to be fair Ringo.

I'll let you do some research on it. Its a fascinating subject, one that I've been keen on since I was about eight. I'm now 44!



Glad we agree on that at least
I know exactly what it means, because if I've got a thing (apart from football!) its military.

Come on Lancaster prove you've got "a thing for the military!"

What is an "autonomous capacity for action" Lancs?

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:35 am

Balls in your court Ringo

Enlighten me what you think it means.

HINT - it does not involve the formation of an EU army, which is what you are claiming.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:35 am

UpTheBeehole wrote:No, you heard Michael Fallon say that. Michael Fallon has zero military experience

You're telling me what I've heard, when I heard it and who was sayimg it!!!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Some body put uphisownholes dummy back In!!


:lol: :lol:

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:36 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Balls in your court Ringo

Enlighten me what you think it means.

HINT - it does not involve the formation of an EU army, which is what you are claiming.
It's an army.

Over to you.

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:37 am

In other news, Phase two talks can begin in the EU.

Good!

aggi
Posts: 8762
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 11:31 am
Been Liked: 2109 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by aggi » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:42 am

RingoMcCartney wrote:As for evidence. I don't need to provide evidence to you or any body else. I simply hold an opinion. You hold an opinion too.
So this the latter, is what has just been agreed to in Brussels was just a lie. You do understand that just making stuff up to prove your point invalidates it somewhat?
This user liked this post: Greenmile

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:43 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:In other news, Phase two talks can begin in the EU.

Good!
Swerve alert!......swerve alert!.......

Lancs, you've already claimed you "Have a thing for the military". So surely a man with your self proclaimed wealth of knowledge of all things military. Will be able to explain, when I ask the very straight forward question-

What is an "autonomous capacity for action" Lancs?

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-41403394" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

What does president Macron actually mean when he says, ""autonomous capacity for action" through a joint military force."?

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:45 am

You saying its an army makes you look a bit silly.

Tell me why that makes it an army.

Detail Ringo, its the detail where you always fall down.

This isn't chat in a pub with your Eurosceptic mates about how bad the EU is. Its a chat with people who want you to prove to them that what you are saying will result in the formation of an EU army.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:47 am

aggi wrote:So this the latter, is what has just been agreed to in Brussels was just a lie. You do understand that just making stuff up to prove your point invalidates it somewhat?
No lie whatsoever!!!!!!

"Remaining EU countries agree to plan to integrate their military forces after Brexit"

"http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 11311.html

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 11311.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Even the Remaoner bible, The Independent, agrees with my opinion that national armys are being integrated to form an EU army!!!!

http://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press ... -on-pesco/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It's called PESCO. It's the EU army!!!! Hey Presto!!
Last edited by RingoMcCartney on Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:59 am, edited 2 times in total.

Lancasterclaret
Posts: 23343
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 2:09 pm
Been Liked: 8058 times
Has Liked: 4714 times
Location: Riding the galactic winds in my X-wing

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:48 am

You think it means an EU army.

You can't tell me why that is, but you want me to tell why it isn't.

And I'm swerving?

The whole thread is about Brexit and the EU Ringo!

Ladies and Gentlemen, welcome (again) to Brexit debates in Britain.

I genuinely like you mate, but you do yourself no favours.

Tall Paul
Posts: 7171
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:07 am
Been Liked: 2560 times
Has Liked: 690 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Tall Paul » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:49 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:You saying its an army makes you look a bit silly.

Tell me why that makes it an army.

Detail Ringo, its the detail where you always fall down.

This isn't chat in a pub with your Eurosceptic mates about how bad the EU is. Its a chat with people who want you to prove to them that what you are saying will result in the formation of an EU army.
It's his opinion, he doesn't need to provide any details.

Cryssys
Posts: 468
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 1:47 pm
Been Liked: 141 times
Has Liked: 28 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by Cryssys » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:53 am

RingoMcCartney wrote:Swerve alert!......swerve alert!.......

Lancs, you've already claimed you "Have a thing for the military". So surely a man with your self proclaimed wealth of knowledge of all things military. Will be able to explain, when I ask the very straight forward question-

What is an "autonomous capacity for action" Lancs?
It's a simple concept Ringo. Someone asks you a question and you're supposed to answer it, not ask the questioner to tell you what the answer is.

RingoMcCartney
Posts: 10318
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2016 4:45 pm
Been Liked: 2636 times
Has Liked: 2798 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by RingoMcCartney » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:53 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:You saying its an army makes you look a bit silly.

Tell me why that makes it an army.

Detail Ringo, its the detail where you always fall down.

This isn't chat in a pub with your Eurosceptic mates about how bad the EU is. Its a chat with people who want you to prove to them that what you are saying will result in the formation of an EU army.
Field Marshall! You appear to try and claim what it's NOT. But despite repeated attempts, you seem totally unable to say what it IS. Have you taken leave of your senses man!? Its a dereliction of duty soldier!!
This user liked this post: Lancasterclaret

If it be your will
Posts: 2103
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2016 10:12 am
Been Liked: 500 times
Has Liked: 509 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by If it be your will » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:55 am

UpTheBeehole wrote:Strange how you didn't quote the bottom of the article
I'm embarrassed I couldn't be bothered to read the whole article myself, now. (Always balanced, the FT.)

UpTheBeehole
Posts: 5069
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 3:14 pm
Been Liked: 1157 times
Has Liked: 496 times

Re: More post brexit referendum good news!!!!

Post by UpTheBeehole » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:56 am

Ringo has more deflections than a disallowed Ashley Barnes goal
Last edited by UpTheBeehole on Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
This user liked this post: Tall Paul

Locked