The signs of positive change...

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ablueclaret
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:44 am

I'm less impressed by your knowledge of this club Sidney, time to step up your interest.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:45 am

ablueclaret wrote:No problem with Tarka being offered a long-term contract but don't pretend it means he's going to stay here just that we might get more for him come the season end.
We all know he's going to force a transfer in the summer so he can realise your dream of him playing in midfield.
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Dyched » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:46 am

Ok so ABC lets buy 5/6 young players say under 22/23.

Start them all.
Then we go down and we have to put up with threads from you like
"You can't trust in youth"
"Why didn't we buy experiance"

Investing in youth for us now is totally different to when we signed Mee/Trippier/Ings. We had nithing to lose then. Now just remaining 17th flr the next 5 years will earn us over £500m

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:46 am

ablueclaret wrote:I'm less impressed by your knowledge of this club Sidney, time to step up your interest.
I'll step up my interest when you get yourself a season ticket.

Fair deal?
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ablueclaret
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:46 am

So only one replacement bought this season Sidney, we happen to have 11 players on the field of play.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:48 am

You buy young players to fight for their places not to just ditch them in. We have plenty of experience at the club we need a radical injection of young blood to keep the seniors on their toes. We have forgotten our agenda.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:50 am

Pope was signed originally for the future.
Future has arrived and he's stepped up.

Tarks was signed for the future, it's here and he's top notch.

Joey B was signed for the future and bang, here it is.
Taylor was signed to be future first choice LB, Ward gets injured and Taylor steps in and does well enough.

It doesn't matter if a younger player is signed this season or next, it will happen because that's the natural evolution of football.

You want it all now, yet complain the club aren't looking at the future.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Dyched » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:50 am

Sidney1st wrote:We all know he's going to force a transfer in the summer so he can realise your dream of him playing in midfield.
I've always presumed he got mixed up between Edgar Davids and David Edgar
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:51 am

ablueclaret wrote:You buy young players to fight for their places not to just ditch them in. We have plenty of experience at the club we need a radical injection of young blood to keep the seniors on their toes. We have forgotten our agenda.
The club just changes it's agenda to suit themselves, bit like you.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by bob-the-scutter » Wed Jan 24, 2018 11:51 am

ablueclaret wrote:I'm looking at the future of the club as the Board should be doing and the highest of our priorities should have been to bring in two young defenders, a young keeper, a young winger and striker. Tarka may have signed a long-term contract but both he and Mee will become targets at the end of the season whether we like it or not, In too many areas of the pitch our cover is old men in footballing terms when football wisdom always dictates that it should be young blood.
That whole statement sums you up for what you are!
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by bfcmik » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:05 pm

ablueclaret wrote:I've no problem with buying players up to the age of 28, and obviously every side has its sprinkling of squad players over 30 but to purchase 5 over 30's is quite honestly ridiculous.
There are a couple of good reasons for signed experienced older players.

Firstly, we needed to round out the squad. Last season we had a first 11 and a couple of decent subs with, to be honest, several makeweights such as abc's beloved Darikwa, Kightly etc. Now we are looking at a subs bench where each of them is able to compete for a starting spot. Unfortunately, we still only have 18 or 19 realistic 1st teamers at the club with the rest being very much in the 'possible' category.

Secondly, you need the older, more experienced players to ground your team. We had Joey doing it for a couple of seasons, Graham Alexander did the same when he was here. Just using a calm head to combat adversity or give support to younger players.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:09 pm

Look I'm not hiding the fact I'm a bit of a romantic, I'd as soon watch Ings playing for us in the Championship with that expectation of something spell binding as the more cerebral chess board stuff we get nowadays, but for me its watching young players develop, seeing Mee with that defenders appetite for battle progress into the fine player he is now, see Tarka with his abundance of skills settle into a water-tight defence, watch Trippier develop his bombastic attacking potential.
It is young players who excite most, who also of course frustrate most but it is their potential for development which allows a team to progress.
Older players bring their skill set but they rarely bring development, progression, unless like Dobson when he played for us at a lower level when he brought style and arrogance to a workmanlike side, but then he had Trevor Steven to light things up and provide that magic which most of us want football to offer.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by NCClaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:09 pm

ablueclaret wrote:It's always been fun being a Burnley supporter and although this might be the best we have achieved in terms of league position it is certainly not the most entertaining.
Your comment really depends on what you mean by 'entertaining'.
I have this discussion frequently with supporters of the allegedly more entertaining football clubs. Personally, as I point out to them, I am hugely entertained by the level of defending we are able to achieve against these clubs. I see many examples - certainly second half against Utd. of us also playing some excellent creative and attacking football.
We are what we are at the moment and as Mr. Dyche says; we are learning and improving all the time. I enjoy that. I enjoy us taking it to the bigger clubs;"... they don't like it up 'em you know"!! Personally I think we are playing some of the best football (in the round) I have seen us play in the modern era.
In addition we are moving forward as a Club off the field too - the training ground and perhaps as importantly our work in the community which is exceptional - it's all part of 'entertainment' to me.
Long may it last and develop - UTC

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:10 pm

But 5 over 30's, sorry I don't buy that.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:14 pm

ablueclaret wrote:But 5 over 30's, sorry I don't buy that.
You didn't and neither did the club (buy all 5) and for those they paid a fee, they were mainly low ones.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Hipper » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:16 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:Year 1 stability championship
Year 2 promotion championship
Year 3 relegation premier league
Year 4 promotion championship. Unbeaten for half a season and champions.
Year 5 stability premier league
Year 6 stability premier league AT LEAST.
Nicely summarised except I would say our intentions were:

Year 5 survival - premier league
year 6 survival plus - premier league

The fact that, so far, we are exceeding year 6 expectations is what is fabulous. To me anything outside the bottom three this year, considering 'second year syndrome', is acceptable. The fact that from day one of this season we have not even looked like being in the relegation places is extraordinary.

As someone who mostly read about the sixties but saw the seventies and eighties before losing interest after the Orient game, what's going on now, particularly considering the finances of modern football, is almost beyond superlatives.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by quoonbeatz » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:23 pm

abc is an absolute master at this, he's dragged you all in again.
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by lovebeingaclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:29 pm

ablueclaret wrote:But 5 over 30's, sorry I don't buy that.
At last something I can agree with abc.

But we already knew he doesn't buy a season ticket or even a match ticket.

He does give us a laugh though when he suggests he would rather watch ings in the championship when clearly he hasn't watched Burnley for decades hence not contributing to the funds available to the club.

Mind you he did once go to Bristol to watch Burnley in a friendly.

This guy has the cheek to question Sidney. Wow.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:31 pm

Question me about what?

My interest in the club?
I choose not to fret that much about the age of our signings, that's his issue I think.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by JTClaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:38 pm

Let's say you're right, and the club have got things horribly wrong.
Who should they have signed? Ideally 5 players, but if you could mention just 2.

Bear in mind;
They have to be capable of playing at this level, otherwise they are just a waste of money that could have gone on an experienced player that offered something.
They have to have the mentality to understand the game along with it's ups and downs, and if we only have young players they are going to need this naturally.
Also, we signed Alexander who was too old to be a good signing. If some one like Lennon looks after himself, he could have at least 4 good years left. But a 4 year contract would be too long right?

The way the board and Dyche have slowly built, essentially saving up, buying well and not taking big risks is the way I feel it should be done.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by martin_p » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:48 pm

ablueclaret wrote:No problem with Tarka being offered a long-term contract but don't pretend it means he's going to stay here just that we might get more for him come the season end.
So why is Dyche signing a long term contract worrying you then?

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by lovebeingaclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:50 pm

ablueclaret wrote:I'm less impressed by your knowledge of this club Sidney, time to step up your interest.
This is what I was challenging abc about.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Falcon » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:12 pm

Come on lads and lasses, we all should be experienced enough by now to know the golden rule, DO NOT FEED THE TROLL!

Just ignore the post and move on. Starves them of the attention they so desperately want.

Or do what I do, add them to the 'foe' list.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:23 pm

I think you misunderstand the word Troll Falcon, I just say on here what I think much as I do in a Labour Party meeting, few agree with me and that is fine but if you have followed the Board over toide and Clarets Mad before you will see I have been more consistent than most.
Indeed Casper Claret sees me as as a prehistoric bore, spouting the same agenda year in year out and in many ways he is right.
As to SD's contract yes I do think it too long, a year in football is a long time and this club may need an injection of new thinking at any point. SD may have progressed to some extent but his failure to become adaptable still counts against him. When the framework falters, SD doesn't have the back up plan.
Twelve months from now will be interesting, 24 months from now if he is still here I will be amazed.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:26 pm

Jt wingers are very different creatures from holding midfielders or defenders, their abilities are very much more age dependent.
I hope Lennon is successful, he has a decent pedigree but I fear his best days are behind him.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Bin Ont Turf » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:30 pm

If this board was a pub setting and the very same discussion was taking place, then someone would have chinned Ablue by now.
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by dsr » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:30 pm

Here's an idea, blue. This thread is about POSITIVE change. Fair enough mentioning once that you aren't happy, but it's a bit off trying to take over the whole thread and bang on and on about your single point. It's called hijacking the thread, and it's not polite.

What you should do is start a thread about NEGATIVE change, and then you can bang on about how it's all going wrong on your own thread without having to hijack this one. Then we can keep this one on topic, about positive change.
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:41 pm

Not allowed to start threads dsr they get removed, hence have to respond on others threads.
thanks for your interest though.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by BurnleyPaul » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:41 pm

ablueclaret wrote:I've no problem with buying players up to the age of 28, and obviously every side has its sprinkling of squad players over 30 but to purchase 5 over 30's is quite honestly ridiculous.
So in a 25 man squad it’s ridiculous to have 1/5 of the players 30 or over? Especially when 2 of them are goalkeepers- a position where players are coming into their prime at this age these days?

It’s ridiculous to buy players over 30 who have spent almost their entire careers in this division and who have the experience our players are lacking/currently developing?

It’s ridiculous when these players have been bought to act as cover and as “mentors” to our younger players? I don’t know about you but when I started in my chosen career I absolutely loved having somebody there that could help guide me and show me pitfalls/better ways of doing this from their experience.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:44 pm

It's ridiculous to buy 5 players over 30 when you have the drawing power we now have, and none of them are mentor figures. Do Heaton and Pope need mentors? or Arfield or Vokes ?

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:45 pm

Sad reflection on pubs BOT.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by turfytopper » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:14 pm

ablueclaret wrote:I just see an opportunity missed and some decisions that might have far reaching consequences for us.
If I saw it as positive I'd be saying so, I don't.
Forgive me for asking, are you a Burnley supporter?

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:17 pm

ablueclaret wrote:It's ridiculous to buy 5 players over 30 when you have the drawing power we now have, and none of them are mentor figures. Do Heaton and Pope need mentors? or Arfield or Vokes ?
We didn't buy 5 players, try again.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:18 pm

I've followed the club since 1955 so I think I might call myself a Supporter but of course in many people's eyes time counts for nothing, fervour is all.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:19 pm

and my father before me, and my grandfather before him, fairly longstanding.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:19 pm

lovebeingaclaret wrote:This is what I was challenging abc about.
Ah, I still don't know what he was banging on about tbh, but I've made a fair offer.

I'll step up my interest when he gets a season ticket, fair deal afterall.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:20 pm

Since 1955?

No wonder you drone on like some senile old fart...

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:20 pm

Getting on the ball at last Sidney, at least I've woken your interest in our peripheral players

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:21 pm

Not sure you have a season ticket Sidney.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:21 pm

BurnleyPaul wrote: I don’t know about you but when I started in my chosen career I absolutely loved having somebody there that could help guide me and show me pitfalls/better ways of doing this from their experience.
My mentors used to set fire to my overalls whilst I was still in them, put grease in my ears and other things people do to apprentices...

All useful stuff to pass on to the next apprentice that entered the workshop :lol:

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:22 pm

Senile old fart maybe but I've seen many more hours of the Clarets than you young green horn.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:23 pm

But we're not talking apprentices we are talking players of considerable experience, we don't do young players that is the huge irony of signing mentors!

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:24 pm

ablueclaret wrote:Not sure you have a season ticket Sidney.
season ticket.JPG
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Vegas Claret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:24 pm

I don't think there is a single one of us that would have thought we would be where we are now, OP has it spot on

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:25 pm

That looks like a railcard between Didcot and Slough.
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by duncandisorderly » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:26 pm

I think abc and those who respond to him are engaged in some sort of mutual boredom release; the young ones doing anything they can to avoid doing a bit of work and the old ones passing the time until their next nap.

I'm not sure he realises it, but abc is actually providing a service. I reckon he should start charging.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by Sidney1st » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:26 pm

Definitely not abc.

I've actually never been into Slough, never felt the need too, looks bad enough passing it on the train.
Last edited by Sidney1st on Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ablueclaret
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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:26 pm

So you're the Great Orme they speak of.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by duncandisorderly » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:27 pm

ablueclaret wrote:That looks like a railcard between Didcot and Slough.

For years I thought the signs on railway station platforms warning you about passing trains sucking you off if you stand too close were a **** take until I got to Didcot.

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Re: The signs of positive change...

Post by ablueclaret » Wed Jan 24, 2018 3:28 pm

It is a service I provide Duncan and like the NHS free at the point of source, a true socialist outpouring.

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