Your team vs Southampton

Squarepusher · Post by **Squarepusher** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:50 pm

Pope
Lowton - Tarks/Long - Mee - Taylor
Lennon - Cork - Hendrick - JBG
Vokes - Barnes

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:14 pm

HiroshimaClaret wrote:I too thought he was excellent against Man Utd away for a good 40-40 minute spell and also for a period, I believe it was against Man City. Referencing your point regards my not being able to follow his every footstep and being a slave to the cameras, then you have a valid point. Several co-commentators though, who I presume are at the game (?????) have pointed out how little Hendrick is `in the game`, especially in recent away games.

Excellent against Man Utd away you say. Well at least you gave him a six which was lower than any other player and your comments at the time suggest anything but excellent.

HiroshimaClaret wrote:As a 44-year old Burnley fan, we were 5 minutes away from possibly the best result I`ve ever seen watching the mighty Clarets. Simply incredible stuff. My disappointment faded very quickly with the realisation of were we now are as a football club.

Pope 9 - I don`t think Heaton`s getting the gloves back. His command of the area is second to none. If De Gea had pulled off THAT save in the 2nd half the pundits would have been declaring it the save of the season.

Bardsley 10 MOM- an incredible defensive display. The tenacity he shows is off the chart.
Long 8 - he was as sound as a pound with one superb block to deny Ibrahomovic to boot.
Mee 10 - incredible stuff. If he doesn`t get a call-up to the Englans squad soon then there`s something very, VERY wrong.
Taylor 7 - may seen a smidgeon low but although he was solid, it terrified me every time Young (should also be in the England squad) was up against him.

Gudmundsson 9 - the heart of a Viking. SUCH a willing runner with final delivery to boot.
Cork 8 - did what he does with very little fuss.
Defour 9 - WHAT A FREE KICK! WHAT A PLAYER. He`ll be off to the World Cup but hopefully nowhere else.
Arfield 7 - ummm...stuck to his guns and helped out defensively.

Hendrick 6 - honestly didn`t see anything from him. Some suggest (co-commentator included) he marshalled Matic so if true happy to be wrong. I JUST am not seeing any physicality in his game at the moment.

Barnes 8 - thought he was a 10 in the first half (barring stupid yellow card) as he bullied and harried and held the ball so well. 2nd half more isolated as we defended deep but a fantastic player and another big goal.

PROUD TIMES TO SUPPORT OUR CLUB!

piston broke · Post by **piston broke** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:31 pm

FAO CT.
What is it with you and Hendrick?
You are digging up scores from 2 months ago to make an argument out of nothing. The guy is entitled to his opinion.
You had a pop at me last week and I like Hendrick but not as a number 10.
Now he's back in midfield he'll be back to his best.

PS By the end of that thread the majority sided with me. He is not a No.10.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:06 pm

piston broke wrote:FAO CT.
What is it with you and Hendrick?
You are digging up scores from 2 months ago to make an argument out of nothing. The guy is entitled to his opinion.
You had a pop at me last week and I like Hendrick but not as a number 10.
Now he's back in midfield he'll be back to his best.

PS By the end of that thread the majority sided with me. He is not a No.10.

Not digging up anything at all if you had bothered to look at why I’d quoted it. And maybe you should read what the manager has to say about him too.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:12 pm

The manager, like all humans is not always right. In this case hes wrong. Hendrick never has been or likely will be a so called number 10.

It is not his best position, doesnt paint him in a good light and weakens the team.

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:27 pm

he hasn't been playing as a number 10 though, not in the way most people would think of a 'number 10' anyway.

that's not his role.

piston broke · Post by **piston broke** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:31 pm

quoonbeatz wrote:he hasn't been playing as a number 10 though, not in the way most people would think of a 'number 10' anyway.

that's not his role.

This is the problem. Why not just play 4-5-1 and allow Cork, Defour(before his injury) or Hendrick to get forward as required. Hendrick and Defour are excellent ball carriers and can put teams on the back foot.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:59 pm

Pope,
Lowton Long Mee Taylor
JBG Cork Westwood Hendrick GKN
Barnes

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:24 pm

piston broke wrote:This is the problem. Why not just play 4-5-1 and allow Cork, Defour(before his injury) or Hendrick to get forward as required. Hendrick and Defour are excellent ball carriers and can put teams on the back foot.

Well firstly, I'm not sure Defour is a particularly good ball carrier. He's OK, but he's not especially quick. The reason that Hendrick gets nominated to be the "running 10" (to use Dyche's term) is that he covers the ground faster than Defour or Cork both in and out of possession. So he gets up to support the front man quicker.

Secondly, any 4-5-1 involves one man either in front of the two or behind them. The pitch isn't wide enough to make it sensible to play a flat 5 across midfield. We play with two holding players, so that means one in front.

taio · Post by **taio** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:38 pm

claretspice wrote:Well firstly, I'm not sure Defour is a particularly good ball carrier. He's OK, but he's not especially quick. The reason that Hendrick gets nominated to be the "running 10" (to use Dyche's term) is that he covers the ground faster than Defour or Cork both in and out of possession. So he gets up to support the front man quicker.

I don't see a great deal of difference in pace with or without the ball between Hendrick and Defour or Cork. The reason he gets up to support the front man quicker is because of the postion he's most often played this season i.e. in the number 10 or AMC role.

claretspice · Post by **claretspice** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:46 pm

taio wrote:I don't see a great deal of difference in pace with or without the ball between Hendrick and Defour or Cork. The reason he gets up to support the front man quicker is because of the postion he's most often played this season i.e. in the number 10 or AMC role.

Disagree. Hendrick is a good athlete and deceptively quick (like many rangy midfielders) - my guess is that before Lennon signed, he was probably the quickest player in our regular starting eleven, certainly over 30 yards if not 5.

He play in that more advanced role partly because he's better able to get up and down the park, not the other way round.

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:20 pm

Hendrick has been playing out of position all season in this so- called number 10 position. A waste of a good player and a position. He is a good midfielder.

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:30 pm

Hendrick would be the first name on my team sheet every week and I bet he is also Dyche's first name on the team sheet certain posters on here really need to get of the lads back !

Carport · Post by **Carport** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:49 pm

UpTheClaretsFCBK wrote:Re: the Hendrick bashing.

Simply the ramblings of Supporters who don’t really understand football and have jumped on the scapegoat band wagon.

He’s looked miles better since he reverted to his natural position.

Seriously? We’re you at Swansea as I was? He was rubbish.

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:14 pm

I thought this thread was called 'your ' team for Southampton not 'Dyche's' team. If we are playing 4-5-1 mine would not include Hendrick in the more advance role. Why ? Because he has been poor for weeks in that role and the stand out worst performer. In a 442 I would include him.

UpTheClaretsFCBK · Post by **UpTheClaretsFCBK** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:13 pm

Carport wrote:Seriously? We’re you at Swansea as I was? He was rubbish.

So he deserves to be black listed as a player for a bad game.

Who did play well at Swansea? Bar the back four.

Cubanclaret · Post by **Cubanclaret** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:50 pm

HiroshimaClaret wrote:Got me thinking (you can tell the kids have gone to bed) if whether during our other `successful` periods (I can only comment from `91/`92 onwards) there has been a player SO polarising (for use of a better word) a player as Hendrick currently is?

I can recall having some real barndingers with people regards Super Johnny Francis (some unenlightened ones thought he wasn`t so super!!!!). Andy Farrell was another favourite of mine who some did not have down as `a good `un.

Eagles, I suppose, split opinion.

I love the idea of a champion for Andy Farrell thinking Jeff Hendrick isn’t good enough:). Nowt against Faz but shows how far we’ve come.

claretcarrot93 · Post by **claretcarrot93** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:41 pm

claretspice wrote:Disagree. Hendrick is a good athlete and deceptively quick (like many rangy midfielders) - my guess is that before Lennon signed, he was probably the quickest player in our regular starting eleven, certainly over 30 yards if not 5.

He play in that more advanced role partly because he's better able to get up and down the park, not the other way round.

The white yaya

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:07 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Excellent against Man Utd away you say. Well at least you gave him a six which was lower than any other player and your comments at the time suggest anything but excellent.

A shame I can`t dredge up your Arfield ratings from a few seasons ago in the Championship season.

Burnleyareback2 · Post by **Burnleyareback2** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:13 pm

Hendrick is one of those players that does more off the ball than on it. I can see both opinions, and personally I don’t think the position he has played this season is his best.
However, what you have to respect is that he is doing exactly what the manager asks and showing flexibility for the team.
A team with our budget doesn’t get to 7th in this league by carrying luxury players, he is working for the team.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:17 pm

HiroshimaClaret wrote:A shame I can`t dredge up your Arfield ratings from a few seasons ago in the Championship season.

It is a shame because you would find them good, not sure why on earth you would think I had something against Arfield. I seem to recall giving him a 10 though for his performance at Doncaster in that season. He was outstanding for us.

It's amazing though how, when a few posters disagree with you, your view on Hendrick at Old Trafford changes dramatically.

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:26 pm

ClaretTony wrote:It is a shame because you would find them good, not sure why on earth you would think I had something against Arfield. I seem to recall giving him a 10 though for his performance at Doncaster in that season. He was outstanding for us.

It's amazing though how, when a few posters disagree with you, your view on Hendrick at Old Trafford changes dramatically.

Don`t think you had anything against Arfield. Ratings aren`t a personal attack simply one person`s `take` on a player`s performance. Glad you could be bothered to find my Man Utd ratings. I was very well mistaken which game it was but certainly one of the top teams, where I thought he had a very good spell. Having 2 young kids the mind is getting fuzzy. I can recall commenting on it during a match day thread something along the lines of `very quiet in the first 15 minutes or so but from then on really grew into the game and really showed what he could do until near or around the 50th minute mark. Anyway, each to their own and let`s just let this lie and agree to have extremely differing views on one particular player. Goodnight to you and Up the Clarets!

Murger · Post by **Murger** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:26 pm

I go to matches and have seen enough football to recognise when someone is playing pap, and atm, you can see why he wasn't a regular in Derbys team. He been poor for some time now.

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:31 pm

Cubanclaret wrote:I love the idea of a champion for Andy Farrell thinking Jeff Hendrick isn’t good enough:). Nowt against Faz but shows how far we’ve come.

Agree that indeed it does show the incredible journey we have been on but that for me really was the time, early to mid 90s, to use a better phrase, I was in love with Burnley football club, it ran through my veins and it was an incredible time (as of course it is now but my distance from it all takes off some of the sheen/connection).

"John Deary!" one could go all gooey legged!!!!!!

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:32 pm

Burnleyareback2 wrote:Hendrick is one of those players that does more off the ball than on it. I can see both opinions, and personally I don’t think the position he has played this season is his best.
However, what you have to respect is that he is doing exactly what the manager asks and showing flexibility for the team.
A team with our budget doesn’t get to 7th in this league by carrying luxury players, he is working for the team.

Agree with you wholeheartedly that he will be doing exactly what Dyche is asking of him. A valid point without doubt.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:46 pm

So a thread about who anyone might pick for the game vs Saints turns into an argument about the merits of Jeff Hendrick as a number 10 (if such a thing still exists).
Some of you really need to let go.

BleedingClaret · Post by **BleedingClaret** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:32 am

Pope
Lowton - Tarks/Long - Mee - Taylor
Lennon - Cork - Westwood - JBG
Vokes - Barnes

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:44 am

Postby HiroshimaClaret » Sat Feb 03, 2018 10:22 pm Manchester City (h)

Well, that got better as the half went on. I was not impressed with particularly Hendrick or Vokes in the first 25 minutes but Hendrick in particular has been excellent in the last 20mins. THERE IS HOPE!!!!

by HiroshimaClaret » Sun Dec 31, 2017 10:46 am Huddersfield Town (a) -I knew it was one of the big boys!!!!!!

Hendrick 8 - I`m not his biggest fan at all but thought he was bright and involved.

I will give him credit when in my opinion it is due.

maidenover · Post by **maidenover** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:26 am

It is difficult though, Hiroshima, to have a full perspective of whats going on if your main view is on TV. I'm assuming, perhaps incorrectly, through your user name is that's what you do. Watching on TV is almost like "ball watching" - a common criticism of a player. Even the commentators view a good part of the game from the TV so their opinion is formed from this. On the other hand I went to Huddersfield away live with a view from behind the pitch side wall, out towards the wing behind the goals and ended up with little perception of who was playing well and who wasn't. In other regards, TV is very good especially slow motion if you need to decide for instance if that was a penalty etc.

I live in the USA so most of my games are on TV. I still give my ratings based on the screen view but accept to myself that roles like Hendricks's from his positional and tactical sense don't always get fully realized.

Now tell me you live on Brunshaw Road or somewhere and make my post moot!

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:39 am

maidenover wrote:It is difficult though, Hiroshima, to have a full perspective of whats going on if your main view is on TV. I'm assuming, perhaps incorrectly, through your user name is that's what you do. Watching on TV is almost like "ball watching" - a common criticism of a player. Even the commentators view a good part of the game from the TV so their opinion is formed from this. On the other hand I went to Huddersfield away live with a view from behind the pitch side wall, out towards the wing behind the goals and ended up with little perception of who was playing well and who wasn't. In other regards, TV is very good especially slow motion if you need to decide for instance if that was a penalty etc.

I live in the USA so most of my games are on TV. I still give my ratings based on the screen view but accept to myself that roles like Hendricks's from his positional and tactical sense don't always get fully realized.

Now tell me you live on Brunshaw Road or somewhere and make my post moot!

I don`t disagree with you. Of course you can`t get a true perspective by simply watching on TV, but you can understand a game after watching it for over 30 years. I think we can have a feeling for games and use other knowledge to gauge a team/individual performance. Your point though is still a true one. There is nothing like being in the ground to assess more fully a player`s contribution. It is all subjective though so that also has to be taken into account.

I don`t live next to Park View Chippy, no. I do indeed live in Japan and have done for almost 10 years now.
Thanks for your post and take care in the good ole US of A (in my childhood that was the uther side of Accrington

maidenover · Post by **maidenover** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:44 am

Anyway, my team for Saturday, (even though only about 6 posts out of 80 on this thread have posted one) is:

Pope
Lowton Long(or Tarkowski) Mee Taylor
Lennon Cork Hendrick Gudmundsson
Barnes Vokes

Subs
Wood
Wells
Ward
Lindegaard
Arfield
Westwood
GKN

maidenover · Post by **maidenover** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:53 am

"I don`t live next to Park View Chippy, no. I do indeed live in Japan and have done for almost 10 years now.
Thanks for your post and take care in the good ole US of A (in my childhood that was the uther side of Accrington

"

Thanks for your reply, I left Whalley 38 years ago! You must have some weird times watching games there,(if you do watch them live). I was in Brisbane on holiday for the United game and watched in a pub at 2:30 in the morning!

RVclaret · Post by **RVclaret** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:08 am

Pope
Lowton
Tarks
Mee
Taylor
JBG
Cork
Hendrick
Lennon
Arfield
Vokes

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 3:13 am

maidenover wrote:"I don`t live next to Park View Chippy, no. I do indeed live in Japan and have done for almost 10 years now.
Thanks for your post and take care in the good ole US of A (in my childhood that was the uther side of Accrington "

Thanks for your reply, I left Whalley 38 years ago! You must have some weird times watching games there,(if you do watch them live). I was in Brisbane on holiday for the United game and watched in a pub at 2:30 in the morning!

12:30 kick-offs are either 8:30pm or 9:30pm starts (too early as my kids aren`t in bed yet)
3pm kick-offs are actually fine in the summer as it`s 11pm here so PERFECT. In the winter that`s a midnight start and that hour makes a BIG difference but I watch them but have to delay the ole beer-drinking which pleases not one jot the wife.
Midweek games and games after 5pm on a Saturday or Sunday are write-offs with nerve-wrangling checks on this website in the morning. I usually gauge from post headlines the result and go from there!!!!!

If I do watch a game and the stream is awful I don`t usually put player ratings on here...that`s not on. The best possession we had at Swansea was whenever my stream froze

What do you do in the US? Good `chatting` to you! Hope all is well and UP THE CLARETS!!!!!!

JohnMac · Post by **JohnMac** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 7:16 am

Right then, this is MY team v Southampton, not yours and not SD's. It's MINE!

Pope
Lowton
Tarkowski
Mee
Taylor
Lennon
Hendrick
Cork
JBG
Vokes
Barnes

Burnleyareback2 · Post by **Burnleyareback2** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 8:30 am

Vino blanco wrote:Hendrick has been playing out of position all season in this so- called number 10 position. A waste of a good player and a position. He is a good midfielder.

So who would you of dropped to allow him in the team? Cork or Defour?

Vino blanco · Post by **Vino blanco** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:38 pm

Bab2, if Defour and Cork, Brady etc were all fit, then Hendrick would not get into my first eleven, he would be on the bench. With the current squad my number 10 would be Barnes playing off Wood, though I don't think he is good enough for the role in the PL.

BurnleyPaul · Post by **BurnleyPaul** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:55 pm

.......... Pope ..........
Lowton Long Mee Ward
... Cork ... Hendrick ...
Lennon .. JBG .. N’Koudou
.......... Wood ..........

Subs: Lindegard, Taylor, Westwood, Arfield, Barnes, Vokes, O’Neill

Personally I’d give Lennon, JBG and GKN complete free rein and let them interchange positions as they see fit- drag the opposition around the pitch to their heart’s content.

maidenover · Post by **maidenover** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 4:06 pm

"What do you do in the US? Good `chatting` to you! Hope all is well and UP THE CLARETS!!!!!!

Hi Hiroshima,nice chatting with you too. Retired to Oregon so little as possible these days except traveling, watching football and cricket and wine and beer! Worked entire career in the Aircraft industry, either BAE in the UK or Northrop Grumman in California.

Wilsdenclaret · Post by **Wilsdenclaret** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 5:04 pm

Pope
Lowton
Long/ Tarks
Mee
Taylor
Lennon
Westwood
Cork
JBG
Wood
Barnes

No Ney Never · Post by **No Ney Never** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 7:48 pm

Pope
Lowton, Tarkowski, Mee, Taylor
Lennon, Cork, Westwood, Marney, JBG
Vokes

BFC88 · Post by **BFC88** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:39 pm

If Wood is available i'd have him straight in the team as we are absolutely clueless up front at present.

Regards Hendrick he's literally been a passenger the last 2 months - offered absolutely nothing ; but to his defence he is not a no.10 either and shouldn't be playing there. He should start at CM, especially with Defour out.

As much as I've been impressed by Taylor and think he will be an excellent successor in coming years, i'd bring Ward back in for his experience. Think we've missed him and it's no coincidence we haven't won since he's been out of the side.

I also think a half fit Tarks is better than Long (no dig aimed at him) :

Pope

Lowton Tarks Mee Ward

Lennon Cork Hendrick JBG

Arfield

Wood

SGr · Post by **SGr** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:51 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Why? Why would you not want a player in the side who the manager deems good enough to have started every game for the last 17-18 months?

He had his good spell, but that’s long gone. Been a passenger virtually all season - replacement needed in summer. Dyche has stuck with him, simply because we don’t have another player who could conceivably play in that “number 10” role

SGr · Post by **SGr** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:55 pm

..........Pope..........
Lowton Long Mee Taylor
...Cork...Westwood..
Lennon..JBG..Nkoudou
..........Wood.........

HiroshimaClaret · Post by **HiroshimaClaret** » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:06 pm

maidenover wrote:"What do you do in the US? Good `chatting` to you! Hope all is well and UP THE CLARETS!!!!!!

Hi Hiroshima,nice chatting with you too. Retired to Oregon so little as possible these days except traveling, watching football and cricket and wine and beer! Worked entire career in the Aircraft industry, either BAE in the UK or Northrop Grumman in California.

What a life!!!! Enjoy it!!!!!!!! Oregon must be an incredible place to live - surrounded by nature.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:06 am

SGr wrote:Been a passenger virtually all season

Dyche must be a very incompetent manager then to have selected him for every game he's been fit. Imagine where we'd be in the league if Dyche could see what you can see.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Fri Feb 23, 2018 1:57 am

ClaretTony wrote:Dyche must be a very incompetent manager then to have selected him for every game he's been fit. Imagine where we'd be in the league if Dyche could see what you can see.

4th

warksclaret · Post by **warksclaret** » Fri Feb 23, 2018 7:32 am

Pope
Lowton/Mee/Long/Taylor
JBG/Hendrick/Cork/Westwood/Lennon
Wood

SGr · Post by **SGr** » Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:26 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Dyche must be a very incompetent manager then to have selected him for every game he's been fit. Imagine where we'd be in the league if Dyche could see what you can see.

So you’re saying I’m labelling Dyche “incompetent” on the basis of one player?? Jesus.

Another inspired performance by Jeff today by the way...

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:44 pm

SGr wrote:So you’re saying I’m labelling Dyche “incompetent” on the basis of one player?? Jesus.

Another inspired performance by Jeff today by the way...

He's regularly picking a player you consider to have been a passenger ALL season so yes, you are clearly considering him incompetent.