It gives me no pleasure to pick Michael Keane as our match winner

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:49 pm

For both of our goals, MK was at fault and had a torrid day against Ash today.

I did want to see him do well when he left us but it is now clear that MK isn't the player that he was without Ben Mee.

claretcarrot93 · Post by **claretcarrot93** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:51 pm

How on earth was he at fault for the second. Pickford or Williams take your pick

Wilsdenclaret · Post by **Wilsdenclaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:01 pm

Thought he was one of their best players, him and Walcott

beddie · Post by **beddie** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:01 pm

Thought he did well, won a lot in the air. Not sure he can be blamed for our goals. Great lad for us. I wish him well for the future.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:07 pm

claretcarrot93 wrote:How on earth was he at fault for the second. Pickford or Williams take your pick

For our first goal, Ashley Barnes got behind Michael Keane before lashing the ball in.

For the second, Chris Wood was marked by (guess who) Michael Keane. Yes, Pickford should have done better for both goals but, Ben Mee or Tarks would not have allowed those two chances.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:08 pm

RalphCoatesComb wrote:For the second, Chris Wood was marked by (guess who) Michael Keane.

No he wasn't - it was Williams who lost Wood completely.

Buxtonclaret · Post by **Buxtonclaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:14 pm

: Screenshot_2018-03-03-15-41-59-050.jpeg (468.32 KiB) Viewed 6455 times

Keane didn't have a bad game for them.
But Woody did him today!
He left us for a club in temporary disarray. He's class, and will come good again.

We've also two CBs just as good though, still playing for us.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:14 pm

Thought MK did ok, but Ashley Barnes did a real number on him.

Excellent work by Ash.

Holtyclaret · Post by **Holtyclaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:17 pm

Picture above is mk trying to retrieve the situation after Williams completely lost wood who he didn’t go goal side of. A lot of mks season has been trying to cover whichever hapless cb partner he has that game. Did well today.

Buxtonclaret · Post by **Buxtonclaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:17 pm

ElectroClaret wrote:Thought MK did ok, but Ashley Barnes did a real number on him.

Excellent work by Ash.

He did.
Goal apart, Ash had a cracking game today.
It's been said often, but he must be one of the most annoying forwards in the Prem to play against!

claretnproud · Post by **claretnproud** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:26 pm

first goal was a world class pass that would have been purred about if de bruyne had done and rightly so. 2nd goal he was covering for his pathetic team mates. he is wasted at everton right now and hope his confidence doesnt suffer because of his team mates short comings.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:31 pm

ClaretTony wrote:No he wasn't - it was Williams who lost Wood completely.

A few comments from a Toffees forum...

"Keane made Barnes look like usain bolt"

"Keane looks like, no is, a scared rabbit. Get him off"

"I find it interesting how Dyche has targetted Keane. It' like he has known how to expose him and done so easily"

"Keane needs an extended period out of this side"

Following our 2nd Goal

"I saw that coming. We're terrible at defending. Keane lost his man again... f**k him"

claretcarrot93 · Post by **claretcarrot93** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:34 pm

RalphCoatesComb wrote:A few comments from a Toffees forum...

"Keane made Barnes look like usain bolt"

"Keane looks like, no is, a scared rabbit. Get him off"

"I find it interesting how Dyche has targetted Keane. It' like he has known how to expose him and done so easily"

"Keane needs an extended period out of this side". He was poor today but not at fault for the second goal

Following our 2nd Goal. He did not play particularly well but he is in no way shape or form at fault for the second goal.

"I saw that coming. We're terrible at defending. Keane lost his man again... f**k him"

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:35 pm

No doubts that Keane has a vulnerability in the air at set pieces, he has improved since but I still wake up with palpitations dreaming of Smalling dominating him at Old Trafford to win after we were the better side. No doubts Dyche targeted him today, He is a Rolls Royce of course, but when you target a Rolls you think of the thing it can’t do, even a Rolls has some.

I felt his fault for the first goal was to do with the Allardyce way of leaving a huge gap between CB and FB - we targeted that relentlessly.

In many ways, Dyche came of age today.

Croydon Claret · Post by **Croydon Claret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:38 pm

CrosspoolClarets wrote:No doubts that Keane has a vulnerability in the air at set pieces, he has improved since but I still wake up with palpitations dreaming of Smalling dominating him at Old Trafford to win after we were the better side. No doubts Dyche targeted him today, He is a Rolls Royce of course, but when you target a Rolls you think of the thing it can’t do, even a Rolls has some.

I felt his fault for the first goal was to do with the Allardyce way of leaving a huge gap between CB and FB - we targeted that relentlessly.

In many ways, Dyche came of age today.

Quite true, a Rolls is terrible on corners

piston broke · Post by **piston broke** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:39 pm

How could Michael Keane go from the player we and England had to that shadow?
It's not just today, it's every time I see him at Everton.
Have to feel for him having to play alongside Williams, whose career is done, and there is zero midfield cover in front of him. Sign him up.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:42 pm

Hope MK does well and prospers in his career, but what a great
bit of business by the club.

UTC

Belgianclaret · Post by **Belgianclaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:43 pm

[quote="piston broke"]How could Michael Keane go from the player we and England had to that shadow?
It's not just today, it's every time I see him at Everton.

Two words: Ashley Williams, one of the worst ever PL defenders

Buxtonclaret · Post by **Buxtonclaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 5:08 pm

[quote="Belgianclaret"][/quote] (plus not being alongside Ben Mee)

quoonbeatz · Post by **quoonbeatz** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 5:22 pm

piston broke wrote:How could Michael Keane go from the player we and England had to that shadow?

two reasons:
he gets no cover from midfield and everton are playing him on the left to accomodate ashley williams, just as we did with duff.

keane is a right sided centre half and he's half the player when he's on the left.

that said, he was one of everton's better players today, first half especially, and he can't be blamed for either goal; first one is just a fantastic ball and second one, williams leaves wood to get the run on the ball.

he's still an excellent centre half but he's playing slightly out of position in a poor team.

Jeffbfc · Post by **Jeffbfc** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 5:33 pm

Yes was great for us, he could have stayed, he didn't and was sad to see him go.
If for the money or to better his career or both, now not looking good enough for England and confidence must be down if the Everton fans are on his back.
Ah well never mind.
UTC

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 5:58 pm

The still picture on this thread doesn't show what happened - Williams is the player who lost Wood.

The Enclosure · Post by **The Enclosure** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:04 pm

Everton fans hate him with a passion sadly.

Flat Stanley · Post by **Flat Stanley** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:07 pm

Keane somewhat at fault for first goal. Thought Pickford Was more at fault though. Though it was a good ball Barnes picked the ball up deep in their box. I would have been disappointed if pope stayed on his line in that situation. Pickford could have come and got that if he had been more aware and in a better starting position. Pope is very good at positioning himself well. Not Keanes fault for the second goal. Keane is stugging due to lack of midfield protection and poor defensive partner. Williams was a good player but his legs have gone. Overall didn't think Keane had a bad game.

FCBurnley · Post by **FCBurnley** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:20 pm

Thought he was their best player in first half but struggled in second once we had 2 up front. Having said that I could probably mark Hendrick !

Caernarfon_Claret · Post by **Caernarfon_Claret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:35 pm

RalphCoatesComb wrote:For both of our goals, MK was at fault and had a torrid day against Ash today.

I did want to see him do well when he left us but it is now clear that MK isn't the player that he was without Ben Mee.

Maybe you could argue he was partially responsible for both, but for the first there was abysmal positioning by Pickford and for the second Pickford and Williams made schoolboy errors in marking (Pickford got distracted by Ward and Williams pointed at Wood but then completely lost sight of him.)

Sky Pundits both thought Pickford was at fault in both and Williams with the second.

I know Big Sam blamed Williams and Keane rather than Pickford.

Caernarfon_Claret · Post by **Caernarfon_Claret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:41 pm

RalphCoatesComb wrote:A few comments from a Toffees forum...

"Keane made Barnes look like usain bolt"

"Keane looks like, no is, a scared rabbit. Get him off"

"I find it interesting how Dyche has targetted Keane. It' like he has known how to expose him and done so easily"

"Keane needs an extended period out of this side"

Following our 2nd Goal

"I saw that coming. We're terrible at defending. Keane lost his man again... f**k him"

Depends if you listen to fans or former footballers who you blame.

But Ederson showed Pickford how to do it in a similar situation against Arsenal - you don't retreat. He was on the edge of the area seconds before Lowton's pass and decided to retreat leaving a huge space for Barnes that wouldn't have been there if he was doing what he should have done.

Sproggy · Post by **Sproggy** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:46 pm

I thought Keane looked ok today too. Ashley Williams on the other hand looked awful. And overweight. I also breathed a big sigh of relief when they took off the young midfielder with the ladies hair style and replaced him with Rooney.

JarrowClaret · Post by **JarrowClaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:48 pm

What surprised me was not reading how poor they think he’s playing but how slow he is. I was shocked as the Keane I remember has pace to burn. Not seen today game was he slow?

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:50 pm

Pickford and Williams the culprits for youemr goals. However, I prefer to say Barnes and Wood were our heroes for the goals.

turfytopper · Post by **turfytopper** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:01 pm

As much as I loved having MK as a Claret..... I have to say his overall performance today was I think pretty poor. His distribution was really bad, and Barnes made life very difficult for him. OK he may not have been helped with his defensive partner but I think the problem was more than that.

The confident MK that graced Turf Moor didn't turn up today.
This afternoon the 2 centre backs that would have impressed the watching Southgate, were wearing Claret shirts

scouseclaret · Post by **scouseclaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:38 pm

I don’t know what Everton we’re trying to do for the second goal. They were all lined up on the six-yard line seemingly unconcerned that Wood was goal side. Williams was nearest, but neither he nor Keane had any chance of recovering when the ball came in.

To be fair, they have a right to expect their keeper to deal with it 3 yards out, but he was too busy wrestling with Ward.

holdyourfire · Post by **holdyourfire** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:41 pm

Jeffbfc wrote:Yes was great for us, he could have stayed, he didn't and was sad to see him go.
If for the money or to better his career or both, now not looking good enough for England and confidence must be down if the Everton fans are on his back.
Ah well never mind.
UTC

Ye but like we said,mee nursed him like he is nursing tarks,but both could go to the world cup.Keanes chances are nil though now no longer a claret.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:20 pm

turfytopper wrote:The confident MK that graced Turf Moor didn't turn up today.

My point exactly !

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:25 pm

RalphCoatesComb wrote:My point exactly !

Probably should have said that in the first place then.

Instead you've blamed him for a goal where his left back had gone AWOL and his goalie didn't get out of his 6 yard box.

Clarinetclaret · Post by **Clarinetclaret** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:28 pm

RalphCoatesComb wrote:A few comments from a Toffees forum...

"Keane made Barnes look like usain bolt"

"Keane looks like, no is, a scared rabbit. Get him off"

"I find it interesting how Dyche has targetted Keane. It' like he has known how to expose him and done so easily"

"Keane needs an extended period out of this side"

Following our 2nd Goal

"I saw that coming. We're terrible at defending. Keane lost his man again... f**k him"

It was Williams who lost his man for the second goal as CT said.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:33 pm

Bin Ont Turf wrote:Probably should have said that in the first place then.

Instead you've blamed him for a goal where his left back had gone AWOL and his goalie didn't get out of his 6 yard box.

I'll get my hair shirt and start self-flagellation immediately

I was reporting as I saw it and the photo above does show my memory isn't all that bad

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:41 pm

RalphCoatesComb wrote:
I was reporting as I saw it and the photo above does show my memory isn't all that bad

I was actually referring to the first goal.

I have heard on good authority that Williams was marking Wood and completely lost him for the second goal (someone trustworthy watching in the pub).

You can barely see Williams in the photo and Pickford should be making a claim for it anyway.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:47 pm

Bin Ont Turf wrote:Pickford should be making a claim for it anyway.

I was in line with Pickford and thought why the flock didn't he claim that?

Good work Stephen Ward !

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:53 pm

He's a decent goalie Ralph but you could put partial blame on him for our two goals today.

He could do with a few weeks working with Billy Mercer.

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Sat Mar 03, 2018 9:55 pm

At one point in the second half MK thought he still played for us he keep passing the ball to our midfield players.

RalphCoatesComb · Post by **RalphCoatesComb** » Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:08 am

Bin Ont Turf wrote:He could do with a few weeks working with Billy Mercer.

He made a few decent saves yesterday but BFS wouldn't have been impressed with the two goals.

timshorts · Post by **timshorts** » Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:18 am

Just thought that I'd add that evertons left back was as bad, if not worse, than Williams yesterday. there's a big difference in playing between mee and lowton on your better side than playing between worn out Williams and a consistent''ly out of position left back who gives the ball away in daft places on the pitch.
Keane didn't play well yesterday but hes on a hiding to nothing until Baines is back.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:38 am

claretcarrot93 wrote:How on earth was he at fault for the second. Pickford or Williams take your pick

or the first.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:44 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:or the first.

Haven't seen it back yet but at the time I thought his positioning wasn't great getting the wrong side of Barnes. But to be fair the pass by Lowton was superb.

agreenwood · Post by **agreenwood** » Sun Mar 04, 2018 7:49 am

I thought Barnes gave him a really uncomfortable afternoon.

Real shame to see him like that. Everton has proven a poor move in the end. Reputations take time to build and Keane is going to have put in a year or two of good performances to get back to where he was when he left us.

Chances are he might have gone to the World Cup if he’d still been at Burnley. That dream is over for him this time around.

warksclaret · Post by **warksclaret** » Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:11 am

He was good enough to command a £25/£30m fee
If he was still with us in the current team and current position in the table he would be an even better centre half and probably a cert for the World Cup. Put it down to confidence and bad management since his move

HatfieldClaret · Post by **HatfieldClaret** » Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:14 am

If I remember rightly, MK was in the Man Utd side that got stuffed in the cup at Milton Keynes.

Judging by yesterdays game he obviously just needs to be in a team with a decent defensive coach and someone to manage them. Where would he find that though ?

Papabendi · Post by **Papabendi** » Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:42 am

Alladyche has blamed both Keane and Williams for the first goal. And no doubt Keane and Pickford to blame for second.

Keane looked like the player who joined Burnley and not the player who left.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Mar 04, 2018 8:44 am

Papabendi wrote:Alladyche has blamed both Keane and Williams for the first goal. And no doubt Keane and Pickford to blame for second.

Keane looked like the player who joined Burnley and not the player who left.

Don't see how Keane can be blamed for the second. Williams clearly at fault - terrible positioning and marking.