Englands chances this summer

4:20 · Post by **4:20** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:45 pm

For the first time in about 20 years I have this gut feeling, not bourne out of hype, that England will do the England fans proud this summer. I can't see us winning it, but after the wake up call that was Euro 2016 (and all the disappointments preceding it), the change in manager that seems to know what he wants, our forward line, good fullbacks, the hunger returning, proactive football, players on form etc, I can honestly see us doing a 1990 and having an exciting summer. Would love it to be the case. I hope we play without fear, don't faff around at a pedestrian pace and fight for the victory.
I'm getting the world cup buzz again, it's been a while, come on England.

COYC73 · Post by **COYC73** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:50 pm

England in the modern era are absolutely crap....! The sooner you just accept that....the less painful it will be for you

Expect nothing else but complete failure and embarrassment....!

Ps...he’s still got Joe Hart in the squad....

4:20 · Post by **4:20** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:57 pm

COYC73 wrote:England in the modern era are absolutely crap....! They sooner you just accept that....the less painful it will be for you
Expect nothing else but complete failure and embarrassment....!

I think failure and embarrassment are my default settings and have been for nigh on 2 decades...but my gut is rumbling and even though I admit it has the proverbial for brains, I can't help but imagine a summer of swashbuckling football from our lads. I suppose it's the anticipation and the potential of it all, I did it earlier in the season with us and the Champions league...dare to dream and all that.. If Southgate can finally get us playing as a team in a competition, we might do alright.

COYC73 · Post by **COYC73** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:05 pm

I used to really look forward to watching England in tournaments and we’d always have the family and friends round and get the bbq going etc and make a real party atmosphere...hanging England flags from the front of the house and in the back garden etc...but after Euro 96 it got worse and worse and worse....I carried on hoping for better and throwing the parties for far too long until I finally gave up and admitted defeat in around 2010....

4:20 · Post by **4:20** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:12 pm

COYC73 wrote:I used to really look forward to watching England in tournaments and we’d always have the family and friends round and get the bbq going etc and make a real party atmosphere...hanging England flags from the front of the house and in the back garden etc...but after Euro 96 it got worse and worse and worse....I carried on hoping for better and throwing the parties for far too long until I finally gave up and admitted defeat in around 2010....

Pretty much the same. I want those days back though, those pre millennial halcyon days where everybody got swept up in it all. I remember the first time I ever went downtown with mates, England v Tunisia 1998, bootleggers, it was absolutely mental, so much fun...then, as you say, it just got worse and worse with each passing year.

chekhov · Post by **chekhov** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:20 pm

4:20 wrote: I can honestly see us doing a 1990 and having an exciting summer.

I think this is possible, bearing in mind the England team in 1990 only played well in one match (against Germany). Otherwise we were pretty painful to watch but had some luck and the run of the ball.

chekhov · Post by **chekhov** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:24 pm

COYC73 wrote:I used to really look forward to watching England in tournaments and we’d always have the family and friends round and get the bbq going etc and make a real party atmosphere...hanging England flags from the front of the house and in the back garden etc...but after Euro 96 it got worse and worse and worse....I carried on hoping for better and throwing the parties for far too long until I finally gave up and admitted defeat in around 2010....

You must be too young or have forgotten. As I remember (as far back as the mid seventies) England have always been bang average.

BabylonClaret · Post by **BabylonClaret** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:25 pm

The key here is a manager that is trying to gwt a team rhat works and swlecring players to operate in that system. You dont need the best players to do well if you have an identity and togetherness that means the whole is greater than the sum of the parts.

We know all about this of course

As do Greece, Wales and Denmark (abd to an extent Portugal) - none of whom had the best players but won or did well at tournaments.

chekhov · Post by **chekhov** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:26 pm

BabylonClaret wrote:The key here is a manager that is trying to gwt a team rhat works and swlecring players to operate in that system. You dont need the best players to do well if you have an identity and togetherness that means the whole is greater than the sum of the parts.

We know all about this of course

As do Greece, Wales and Denmark (abd to an extent Portugal) - none of whom had the best players but won or did well at tournaments.

Would you care to re-type that?

MrClaretandBlue · Post by **MrClaretandBlue** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:26 pm

Quarter finals at the very most.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:29 pm

I think we'll reach at least the semis and I normally have no interest in England, this squad has me more interested than ever, I really fancy a Portugal v England final. Ronaldo to score a hattrick then parade the trophy around the Argentina team hotel.

Mala591 · Post by **Mala591** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:41 pm

We have lots of good players in the squad but no 'world class' players. Harry Kane is getting close but not there yet. Last 8 will be a success. Prepare yourself to be bored, frustrated, angry and very occasionally ecstatic.

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:42 pm

KRBFC wrote:I think we'll reach at least the semis and I normally have no interest in England, this squad has me more interested than ever, I really fancy a Portugal v England final. Ronaldo to score a hattrick then parade the trophy around the Argentina team hotel.

Just that last bit would be amazing

Sidney1st · Post by **Sidney1st** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:43 pm

Mala591 wrote:We have lots of good players in the squad but no 'world class' players. Harry Kane is getting close but not there yet. Last 8 will be a success. Prepare yourself to be bored, frustrated, angry and very occasionally ecstatic.

Greece didn't have world class when they won the Euros.

Squarepusher · Post by **Squarepusher** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:45 pm

MrClaretandBlue wrote:Quarter finals at the very most.

I think if they get to the quarters, they'll have done fine.

MrClaretandBlue · Post by **MrClaretandBlue** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 2:52 pm

Squarepusher wrote:I think if they get to the quarters, they'll have done fine.

Absolutely. As long as we go out with a fight too. That awful lacklustre exit against Iceland is still fresh in the memory.

Rick_Muller · Post by **Rick_Muller** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:00 pm

Ok, here’s my prediction.

As long as Southgate picks the squad - and doesn’t have interference suggesting such and such players have to go, I think we’ll win it.

We showed real spells of great football last night, and the squad are beginning to gel a little. I feel good about this...

Of course, politics may come into it and ruin it all then we’ll never know

chekhov · Post by **chekhov** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:04 pm

I think we'll get to the group stages.

clarethomer · Post by **clarethomer** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:08 pm

I have been pretty surprised by the last couple of games so can understand why there may be a chance of performing well.

We have pace, we seem to have some creativity and the players seem to be playing well together.

Not saying that we will win it either but I am looking forward to seeing how they do. Never expect them to do anything and I can see what Southgate is trying to do.

hampsteadclaret · Post by **hampsteadclaret** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:10 pm

I feel quite positive about our prospects at this point...though amongst everything else we will need some of that essential commodity, luck.

We won't start as a favourite, therefore under less pressure [most of our fans won't expect that much].

We have a pretty good draw in the groups..and if we get to the next round, the potential draw doesn't look too bad.

Southgate and his staff look like they're doing a decent job...well organised and thorough.

The players...

Of the four keepers, three pretty good ones will be taken to Russia.

Defensively we could have a few problems, and I am not convinced yet that Southgate knows his best three, nor that they all can play 'defending with three' as well as they should'...we have decent players vying for the three positions....a work in progress though..more work to do..

I guess 352 can convert quickly to 442 when it needs to.

I think we have sufficient depth in midfield, with good wing backs - the flair will have to come from Dele Alli, Lallana, Wilshere [if included]and Lingard

I thought last night [and previously] that Oxlade-Chamberlain, Rashford, Vardy, and Sterling are all potentially match winners...crucially they all provide real pace as does Walker, Young, Rose and a couple of others. Real pace scares defenders to death, and to some extent will dissuade some teams from closing us down too ambitiously...Bertrand and Gomez also.

- and we have Kane to come back, coveted all over Europe, and a genuine goalscorer in all sorts of matches....there is also versatility here with several players easily able to play in more than one position - Dier, Young, Walker for example.

- Stones Henderson and Trippier can all be added - this is not meant to be a 23 man squad, more a list of players who might give us a decent shot this summer.

Quarter Finals should be a real possibility, and a decent draw and an above par performance might see us reach the semi-finals...who knows?

chekhov · Post by **chekhov** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:20 pm

clarethomer wrote:I have been pretty surprised by the last couple of games so can understand why there may be a chance of performing well.

We have pace, we seem to have some creativity and the players seem to be playing well together.

Not saying that we will win it either but I am looking forward to seeing how they do. Never expect them to do anything and I can see what Southgate is trying to do.

I'm looking forward as well, and hope we do well (performance-wise, I'm not bothered if we don't win), but I'm not getting my hopes up.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Mar 28, 2018 3:41 pm

Should get out of the group

After that it really always comes down to who we get.

Always like watching the World Cups, and looking forward to this one

Rachel13 · Post by **Rachel13** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:01 am

I also like to watch the world Championships

jlup1980 · Post by **jlup1980** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:08 am

I was talking to a colleague in the office about this yesterday. We both agreed it would just be nice to go out in glorious failure this time rather than abject failure!! I feel like we've gone with the tried and tested team for too many years and the way Southgate is shaking up his squad and formation can only be a positive. We have the basis of a decent side but our frailty in the midfield will ultimately be our undoing. If only we had a Gerrard / Scholes type to dictate the play. Anyway I think we'll get out of the group and possibly reach the last 8 before going out. Even that would be an improvement on the past 20 years!!

Tribesmen · Post by **Tribesmen** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 12:53 pm

Yer I would say Quarters at best , it's this 3 at the back that will undo them when they play better sides it will be taken apart .
Germany or Spain to win it for me .

Inchy · Post by **Inchy** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 1:05 pm

The last two games England have shown some real promise.

We dominated possession but failed to create enough chances. Hopefully with Kane fit we will have more of a chance because he creates chances for himself.

I can see us reaching the semi final.

I am usually very negetive about England but I have a feeling this summer we could do something. We are going to get booed every game because of what’s gone on with Russia. Hopefully the siege mentality will go along way

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 1:11 pm

He’s helped by not having many star players. Managers in the past have had loads. It must be an incredibly hard decision not to pick certain players eg, Gerrard/Lampard. But I wouldnt say that we failed.

I reckon quarters would be an achievement but a semi would be fantastic and if we go that far who knows.

Im not sure when or if we’ll play them but what about Germany. Southgate missed that penslty many years ago and his England sides knock them out on penalties this time. Football just works like that sometimes.

LeadBelly · Post by **LeadBelly** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 1:41 pm

Blimey, misplaced optimism seems to be alive and well.
Not enough good players and not even (anything like) a settled team at this late stage.

There is more attacking potential in this team than a lot of previous occasions but no settled defence (and no "organiser"/leader as far as I can see), no really good defensive midfielder (and I'm not a Henderson detractor- he plays a very important role with Liverpool).
Anything beyond getting out of the group would be a bonus.

UpTheBeehole · Post by **UpTheBeehole** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 2:42 pm

I think we'll pose some threat through players comfortable carrying the ball, like Sterling and Alli.
Kane is a lethal finisher, and our defence isn't all that bad.

The downside is central midfield, where we miss anyone with any real quality.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 2:50 pm

I think we can do fairly well (and I'm normally a cynic with regard to England). Southgate has had his knockers (no pun intended) but to be fair he has had a good look around at new talent and seems to have more idea than some of the recent incumbents.

The one thing I will say is we stand more chance without Dele Alli because we have a tough enough task without being reduced to 10 men due to his diving.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 2:50 pm

In chance a not hells cat.

Inchy · Post by **Inchy** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 3:47 pm

I don’t think England fans are delusional. At least not by expecting semis.

Our squad is made up of players who are all performing in the best/second best league in the world.

Look at Italy or Holland. Not many players from their squads that would compete at the top end of the prem.

Other than Spain, Belgium, and maybe France, I can’t think of a better squad of players.

Teams like Argentina and Brazil are made up of bang average player with one or two amazing players. Portugal won the euros with arguably only 2 or 3 really good players. The rest are average.

The difference is they play as a team. Now we don’t have the big names of the last 20 years I think we may have more chance because we might play more like a team.

If Kane shows up, and with Lingard in amazing form, I think there’s a chance of reaching the knockout stages

karatekid · Post by **karatekid** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:39 pm

I think we will do well until the whole competition gets cancelled due to violent disorder from Putins youth. Sadly.

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 8:35 pm

It'll be all down to how we hold our nerve............

agents.

BFC88 · Post by **BFC88** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 10:58 pm

We'll probably scrape out of the group but as soon as we come up against anyone half decent we're screwed.

We do have some good players however only Kane can be considered world class.

GK, Defence & Midfield is too weak, as someone mentioned above we also don't have a settled team.

Compare our squad to someone like Spain and it's just laughable. They have players who won't make it to Russia who would walk into our team.

QF's at the very best- and even then we'd have to be lucky.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 11:09 pm

Inchy wrote:I don’t think England fans are delusional. At least not by expecting semis.

Our squad is made up of players who are all performing in the best/second best league in the world.

Look at Italy or Holland. Not many players from their squads that would compete at the top end of the prem.

Other than Spain, Belgium, and maybe France, I can’t think of a better squad of players.

Teams like Argentina and Brazil are made up of bang average player with one or two amazing players. Portugal won the euros with arguably only 2 or 3 really good players. The rest are average.

The difference is they play as a team. Now we don’t have the big names of the last 20 years I think we may have more chance because we might play more like a team.

If Kane shows up, and with Lingard in amazing form, I think there’s a chance of reaching the knockout stages

You lost me at “teams like Argentina and Brazil are made up of bang average players”

Argentina have 4 strikers worth about half a billion !
Brazil are better than Argentina

England have half of the team who struggle to make their club first teams most weeks (Rose, Stones, Dier, Lalana, Rashford, Henderson)

All that said plenty of examples down the years of the tournament favourites not winning the World Cup or Euros and England are one of the 10 or so teams who could go very far if everything clicks and the likes of Kane are on fire.

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 11:21 pm

Sidney1st wrote:Greece didn't have world class when they won the Euros.

They had Dimi Papadoupolous

Braindead · Post by **Braindead** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 11:27 pm

We have a system to take that finally isn't the rigid 4-4-2, we have young players, most of whom are rapid and crucially have Champions league experience, and have one of the best strikers in the world.
Yes we have some problems in finding the right players for key positions, but i have been pleasantly surprised by how well Southgate has done in changing our style and introducing a lot of young players into the squad.
Personally i think if we get out of the group we will stand a chance of going deep into the tournament.

KeighleyClaret · Post by **KeighleyClaret** » Thu Mar 29, 2018 11:50 pm

I always hope for success but it never happens. I wouldn't mind if we went down fighting but we usually show no fight, no passison and precious little skill.

We have players of sufficient quality to show well, sadly they always return home having under achieved.

I don't ming losing but I hate inept performances. Who knows if it will be any different?

Cirrus_Minor · Post by **Cirrus_Minor** » Fri Mar 30, 2018 12:26 am

I think we might do a bit better than expected but, as said on a previous thread, I can’t see us worrying the likes of France, Germany, Spain or Brazil. But we may have a ‘punchers’ chance if we can keep our defence together.

UpTheClaretsFCBK · Post by **UpTheClaretsFCBK** » Fri Mar 30, 2018 12:58 am

I’d say about a 5% chance of winning it.

We need to avoid playing a decent team until the final or semi final at least.

Difficult, but has happened before.

Germany got to the final in 2002 by playing Ireland, Cameroon, Saudi Arabia, Paraguay, USA and South Korea.

I’d fancy even we could beat teams of that standard.

Then hope for a miracle in the final / Semi Final. Germany played Brazil and lost 2-0.

Wile E Coyote · Post by **Wile E Coyote** » Fri Mar 30, 2018 1:13 am

4:20 wrote:For the first time in about 20 years I have this gut feeling, not bourne out of hype, that England will do the England fans proud this summer. I can't see us winning it, but after the wake up call that was Euro 2016 (and all the disappointments preceding it), the change in manager that seems to know what he wants, our forward line, good fullbacks, the hunger returning, proactive football, players on form etc, I can honestly see us doing a 1990 and having an exciting summer. Would love it to be the case. I hope we play without fear, don't faff around at a pedestrian pace and fight for the victory.
I'm getting the world cup buzz again, it's been a while, come on England.

Inevitable career bursting adventure for southgate courtesy of our insane press, players already primed for scapegoat status.
Thick fans from lower leagues with inane banners on the big screens in Russia. No, sadly, we are as inept as usual.