Nick Pope

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:53 pm

Got to get in the world cup squad, even the pundits and commentators are saying it. Come on, Southgate!

mkmel · Post by **mkmel** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:57 pm

He was excellent today

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:57 pm

The problem is, he's not yet played for England. Which means he has to play vs Nigeria, if he's to go. I doubt Southgate will take an uncapped player to the World Cup.

Barry_Chuckle · Post by **Barry_Chuckle** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:58 pm

But he'll take a serial liability in Hart

Notsosuperstevedavis · Post by **Notsosuperstevedavis** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:59 pm

Its expected he'll name his squad before the next games. So he's no time left. If he goes and names his squad before the next games.

boatshed bill · Post by **boatshed bill** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:03 pm

Meteoric rise, I guess he'd have to get bought by a really big (even bigger than 7th placed Burnley) club to get a chance. Look at the other choices of keeper...letting in goals for fun!

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:04 pm

Barry_Chuckle wrote:But he'll take a serial liability in Hart

Yes.

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:05 pm

The saves were all pretty routine ones for him.

It's the command of the box and coming (and dealing with) crosses that was good again today.

WestMidsClaret · Post by **WestMidsClaret** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:07 pm

I will be a little disappointed if Nick doesn't go to the world Cup. I know I'm a tad biased but he is top of the stats of the English keepers. I understand he's inexperienced but so is everyone until they get a chance. I really don't trust any of the others. Not that we're going to win out but still.

He was really good today and came for everything when other keepers may have stood there and crumbled under the pressure.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:11 pm

Poo gash..on BT score questioned sarcastically if one save was for the TV cameras. The Burnley lass who played in goal for England put the bell end right.

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:07 pm

He did everything right and every decision he took was correct

Best English keeper currently playing.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:38 pm

Pope is currently in the best form but is that enough to start at a World Cup? Pickford has grown up playing in International tournaments and has that international experience at senior level now. It's a tough one because Pope will never get experience unless Southgate gives it to him, an international tournament too early for Pope is what i'd predict and you couldn't really argue against Southgate choosing Pickford as number 1 over him.

bartons baggage · Post by **bartons baggage** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:42 pm

KRBFC wrote:Pope is currently in the best form but is that enough to start at a World Cup? Pickford has grown up playing in International tournaments and has that international experience at senior level now. It's a tough one because Pope will never get experience unless Southgate gives it to him, an international tournament too early for Pope is what i'd predict and you couldn't really argue against Southgate choosing Pickford as number 1 over him.

The only thing Pickford does better than Pope is,pick the ball out of the net.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:44 pm

KRBFC wrote:Pope is currently in the best form but is that enough to start at a World Cup? Pickford has grown up playing in International tournaments and has that international experience at senior level now. It's a tough one because Pope will never get experience unless Southgate gives it to him, an international tournament too early for Pope is what i'd predict and you couldn't really argue against Southgate choosing Pickford as number 1 over him.

The Premier League is too early for Pope if Heaton got injured.

Think of it from that angle.

Duffer_ · Post by **Duffer_** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:46 pm

If Southgate wants a ball playing Ederson-lite then fair enough, Pickford gets it. If he wants a keeper to take pressure off his defence, it's Pope. If he doesn't know which style he prefers, it's Butland. If he's f@ckin stupid, it's Hart.

UTC!

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:54 pm

bartons baggage wrote:The only thing Pickford does better than Pope is,pick the ball out of the net.

Simply not true at all

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:56 pm

FactualFrank wrote:The Premier League is too early for Pope if Heaton got injured.

Think of it from that angle.

Yeah but can Southgate really afford to take risks and throw in a rookie goalkeeper which could do both of them more harm than good. There's no denying Pope deserves a shot at some point, personally I can see why Southgate wouldn't throw him in at the deep end in an international tournament.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:59 pm

KRBFC wrote:Yeah but can Southgate really afford to take risks and throw in a rookie goalkeeper which could do both of them more harm than good. There's no denying Pope deserves a shot at some point, personally I can see why Southgate wouldn't throw him in at the deep end in an international tournament.

Which is why I'd take him as 3rd choice. Little chance of being thrown in the deep end, but being one of the form keepers of the season would be there just in case.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:00 am

KRBFC wrote:Yeah but can Southgate really afford to take risks and throw in a rookie goalkeeper which could do both of them more harm than good. There's no denying Pope deserves a shot at some point, personally I can see why Southgate wouldn't throw him in at the deep end in an international tournament.

Yes of course he can afford to take risks, because he has no choice but to take risks. It's not a case of risking Pope or taking the safe option of Hart; it's a matter of the risk of an untried goalkeeper who might not be up to it, or a goalkeeeper who has proved beyond doubt that he is liable to make mistakes but has more experience to try and cover that up. There isn't a no-risk solution.

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:30 am

dsr wrote:Yes of course he can afford to take risks, because he has no choice but to take risks. It's not a case of risking Pope or taking the safe option of Hart; it's a matter of the risk of an untried goalkeeper who might not be up to it, or a goalkeeeper who has proved beyond doubt that he is liable to make mistakes but has more experience to try and cover that up. There isn't a no-risk solution.

I thought we were talking about the number 1 keeper role, Hart has no chance of being number 1.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:33 am

KRBFC wrote:I thought we were talking about the number 1 keeper role

No, the thread is about being taken to the World Cup and being included in the World Cup Squad.

RingoMcCartney · Post by **RingoMcCartney** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:36 am

Not been home long from today. Just watched the highlights.

Seeing him on Tele he looked even better.

When it comes to keepers, we've an embaressment of riches

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 12:37 am

FactualFrank wrote:No, the thread is about being taken to the World Cup and being included in the World Cup Squad.

Well I'd say Hart as 3rd choice then 2 from the other 3. The squad is young and inexperienced, Hart wouldn't play a single minute but he's been there and done it.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:02 am

I think Butland is a very good keeper and if he’s fit and confident he’s number one.
For two and three it’s between Pope and Pickford. How Joe Hart is still in the picture is amazing.

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:11 am

Pope, Heaton, Butland - one position sorted.

Wile E Coyote · Post by **Wile E Coyote** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:30 am

DCWat wrote:Pope, Heaton, Butland - one position sorted.

pope is without doubt THE in form keeper, watford match was just one example of his class, his abilities are obvious.
No earthly reason why he shouldn't be englands number one choice.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:07 am

KRBFC wrote:Well I'd say Hart as 3rd choice then 2 from the other 3. The squad is young and inexperienced, Hart wouldn't play a single minute but he's been there and done it.

If you want him there for coaching and experience, then by all means take him, but there's no need to waste a squad place. Southgate is there for the same reason - coaching and experience - but he won't be in the 23.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:52 am

superb coming out for crosses, took so much pressure off our defence today. I'd take him to the WC but I wouldn't expect him to start

superdimitri · Post by **superdimitri** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 4:46 am

I really hope he gets better at kicking. He's definitely improving but it's still pretty poor and I like that he both rolls the ball short and throws more now too. It's about his only weakness really.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:07 am

boatshed bill wrote:Meteoric rise, I guess he'd have to get bought by a really big (even bigger than 7th placed Burnley) club to get a chance. Look at the other choices of keeper...letting in goals for fun!

Yep but he is playing for the club sitting in the highest position of all the 4 keepers in contention.
The top 6 all have foreign keepers. So take these away and Pope is playing for the best team in the league !!

As for Hart - all this “been there and done it” is nonsense. Been there and done what ? Failed in every tournament he has played in. Has everyone forgotten how bad he was in the Euros ? And since then he has actually got a lot worse !

starting_11 · Post by **starting_11** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:46 am

KRBFC wrote:Pope is currently in the best form but is that enough to start at a World Cup? Pickford has grown up playing in International tournaments and has that international experience at senior level now. It's a tough one because Pope will never get experience unless Southgate gives it to him, an international tournament too early for Pope is what i'd predict and you couldn't really argue against Southgate choosing Pickford as number 1 over him.

So have most of the England team... How are THEY doing?

kaptin1 · Post by **kaptin1** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:49 am

At the end of the day, Pickford, Butland and Hart all have much more experience than Pope at picking the ball out of the back of their own net, something that will no doubt be required as England's number 1.

andyh · Post by **andyh** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:57 am

Pope would not have let the cross beat him from 30 yards like Butland did. I know Kane says he touched it but not enough that if he’d covered it he would not have saved it. If. The cross is going in you’ve got to assume no one gets much on it. Really poor keeping for me.

Leisure · Post by **Leisure** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:58 am

Sorry but I don't get this importance being put on him not having international experience being a major negative. He's playing in possibly the best league in the world, how can playing against international teams be any difference? What would he be unable to do in an international game that he isn't/can't do now? Get him on the plane!

Woodleyclaret · Post by **Woodleyclaret** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:04 am

Joe Hart " been there and done it' too right picked a totally unwarranted number of caps and screwed up on countless ocassions for club and country.
Nick Pope is the best English goalkeeper as he proved again yesterday.But class doesnt get you picked for England.

tim_noone · Post by **tim_noone** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:11 am

KRBFC wrote:Well I'd say Hart as 3rd choice then 2 from the other 3. The squad is young and inexperienced, Hart wouldn't play a single minute but he's been there and done it.

Billy Mercer turns silver into gold.get him on the plane he would be "head n shoulders" above JH and his experience.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:16 am

Duffer has nailed it, but there is a good argument for Pope to go as 3rd choice as experience.

But I agree that they will probably take Hart because of his experience.

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:21 am

The more Pickford is shown, the more erratic his behaviour.

Pope came onto the pitch mid match, in the Prem and has owned it ever since. His mindset is - I tell myself I am just playing with my mates - England and World Cup would not phase this lad.

Ps. If Southgate wants Hart to be there for his experience, take him in a non playing role. He is certainly not up to playing.

watsonsclarets · Post by **watsonsclarets** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 11:16 am

When people talk about experience surely your talking about losing experience because England have never done nothing in my lifetime.

I understand experience but surely thats if it a positive one then fine but Hart hardly has many positive tournmount experiance does he...

starting_11 · Post by **starting_11** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 11:22 am

I've said it before and I'll say it again

If he can go from barely any experience to the joint best keeper in the Premier League overnight, he needs to be given a chance at doing the same internationally. Fterall, he's not in some Mickey mouse league, he's playing against half the players he'd face in the world cup already

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 1:30 pm

I notice the last action on MotD last night was a cross coming into the area which Pope punched away followed by another cross which he caught. I couldn't see the point of that clip except to show that Pope can do crosses as well - maybe there's a MotD editor pushing the Pope bandwagon?

Stalbansclaret · Post by **Stalbansclaret** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:18 pm

That is EXACTLY what I thought dsr !!
I never thought I could possibly prefer any keeper to Tom Heaton as I love the bloke but Nick Pope is so tall and commanding he inspires confidence just looking at him.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 2:21 pm

Just had this discussion while watching my kid play football.

Its been said before, but the way Southgate wants to play, I'm not sure that Pope is the keeper he wants.

Its not an argument in terms of form as he's clearly No 1 but its the same argument that stops Mee getting into the England squad, is his distribution good enough?

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 8:11 pm

TVC15 wrote:Yep but he is playing for the club sitting in the highest position of all the 4 keepers in contention.
The top 6 all have foreign keepers. So take these away and Pope is playing for the best team in the league !!

As for Hart - all this “been there and done it” is nonsense. Been there and done what ? Failed in every tournament he has played in. Has everyone forgotten how bad he was in the Euros ? And since then he has actually got a lot worse !

He's played for England countless times, been to quite a few international tournaments, won PL titles and played Champions League football. People will remember Hart for being p*ss poor in the Euros but that's an unfair reflection on Hart because he was a very good goalkeeper prior to that. Hart may not be the same keeper but I'm sure he has a lot to offer off the field to the younger keepers like Pope, Pickford and Butland. It's a similar situation to when Robinson joined, he was absolutely useless on the field and 3 stone overweight but Heaton definitely improved when he was here.

beddie · Post by **beddie** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:19 pm

Hart was outstanding today against Chelsea. Fantastic save on 87 mins from the head of Giroud.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:34 pm

KRBFC wrote:He's played for England countless times, been to quite a few international tournaments, won PL titles and played Champions League football. People will remember Hart for being p*ss poor in the Euros but that's an unfair reflection on Hart because he was a very good goalkeeper prior to that. Hart may not be the same keeper but I'm sure he has a lot to offer off the field to the younger keepers like Pope, Pickford and Butland. It's a similar situation to when Robinson joined, he was absolutely useless on the field and 3 stone overweight but Heaton definitely improved when he was here.

Hart used to be a very good keeper I agree.
But the last 4 years he has been poor.

I just don’t see what he can add to the team by taking him as a 3rd keeper personally. In this World Cup I think Southgate is better off taking those in form and without any previous baggage. At least then there may not be unreasonable expectations put on them to do well.

Paul Waine · Post by **Paul Waine** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:39 pm

KRBFC wrote:He's played for England countless times, been to quite a few international tournaments, won PL titles and played Champions League football. People will remember Hart for being p*ss poor in the Euros but that's an unfair reflection on Hart because he was a very good goalkeeper prior to that. Hart may not be the same keeper but I'm sure he has a lot to offer off the field to the younger keepers like Pope, Pickford and Butland. It's a similar situation to when Robinson joined, he was absolutely useless on the field and 3 stone overweight but Heaton definitely improved when he was here.

Hi KRBFC, I'm not sure it's Joe Hart's goalkeeping experience that Southgate is looking for, I think it's simply his experience in being in the England squad in a "player" - because so few of the rest of the squad, whoever goes, has only a limited number of caps. So, agree, it's the "off the field" stuff that he's got to offer, but not just to the younger keepers but to all the squad.

So, question, for Hart to fulfill "experienced player role" does he need to be one of the squad of 23 or can he go in a non-playing support staff role?

We've all watched Pope and Hart play recently - and know who is the better keeper. We've also all watched Pickford v Pope - and know who won that contest. In a couple of weeks we should have the same opportunity to compare Pope and Butland.

PS: Great to see Tom Heaton on the bench yesterday. If Tom was getting some game time would that make Southgate's decisions easier?

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:41 pm

TVC15 wrote:Hart used to be a very good keeper I agree.
But the last 4 years he has been poor.

I just don’t see what he can add to the team by taking him as a 3rd keeper personally. In this World Cup I think Southgate is better off taking those in form and without any previous baggage. At least then there may not be unreasonable expectations put on them to do well.

You don't think he'd help the other 2/3? if we were in the semi final and Pickford went off injured, who would you look to bring on?

KRBFC · Post by **KRBFC** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:47 pm

Paul Waine wrote:Hi KRBFC, I'm not sure it's Joe Hart's goalkeeping experience that Southgate is looking for, I think it's simply his experience in being in the England squad in a "player" - because so few of the rest of the squad, whoever goes, has only a limited number of caps. So, agree, it's the "off the field" stuff that he's got to offer, but not just to the younger keepers but to all the squad.

So, question, for Hart to fulfill "experienced player role" does he need to be one of the squad of 23 or can he go in a non-playing support staff role?

We've all watched Pope and Hart play recently - and know who is the better keeper. We've also all watched Pickford v Pope - and know who won that contest. In a couple of weeks we should have the same opportunity to compare Pope and Butland.

PS: Great to see Tom Heaton on the bench yesterday. If Tom was getting some game time would that make Southgate's decisions easier?

Hart will be there for experience solely and based on his performance today Hart isn't finished just yet. Pickford v Pope? who won the contest? I personally don't judge a goalkeeper off what happens in 1 game. Southgate obviously wants a goalkeeper with good distribution which is the only area where Pope isn't great. A goalkeeper is as good as the defence infront of him, Stoke are terrible which makes the whole Pope v Butland comparison on Burnley v Stoke a little stupid.

TVC15 · Post by **TVC15** » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:52 pm

KRBFC wrote:You don't think he'd help the other 2/3? if we were in the semi final and Pickford went off injured, who would you look to bring on?

Errrr...Jack Butland ?

Help them with what ? Choice of shampoo ?

In all seriousness why bring any player who is as out of form as Hart has been just for his “experience” ?
Would you do that with a right back or midfielder ?

Jermaine Defoe is probably a similar example. Loads of experience but very little form in last 2 years. He could give the likes of Rashford and Kane the benefit of his experience - but what’s the point of using up a squad place just for that ?

Bring them as coaches by all means but not as players