Will Brexit ever happen?

[ebby]

2 years ago i was in my hotel room in London wide awake at 5.30am with jet lag after arriving back fron Australia and watching the Brexit withdraw from Europe play out.
Now I am back again and nothing has hapened, other than lots of bickering, false news and
propoganda.
Does England have a leader like Churchill or Thatcher, who can actually make descisions & control a party?
From what we have seen so far from down under, I dont think so. Just more procrastinating.
If you ever descide to get real them I am sure more trade will come from the Commonwealth.
We have just signed up to buy 9 off - 26 type frigates at 20 Bill.

[Diesel]

'Travel Bragger'.

[BennyD]

Of course it will; it has to as the nation has decreed it.

[jurek]

It already has in some, if not many respects, and that's long before it actually will.
I can't be bothered to list the various related issues as a result of deciding to come out
of the EU.
I think we can all see what they are and might be.

[Spiral]

Of course it will; it has to as the nation has decreed it.

The nation has decreed its desire to disentangle, true, but there's no consensus even within the govt. on the extent to which we disentangle from the EU which makes forming a coherent negotiating strategy literally impossible and in some areas, paradoxical. I mean, I suppose complete and utter disentanglement is technically possible if we model ourselves on the DPRK but in the real world the government has a responsibility to its citizens not to turn us into a third world country overnight so in that regard there's the boring business of which treaties we're to withdraw from, how/what to replace them with, etc etc etc which requires some dialogue, concession, compromise with the EU, (it's sometimes called 'a deal'), which takes us back to the first sentence I typed out. You can't negotiate anything if you don't know what your negotiating positions are. A "stronger" leader might have been able to intimidate or compromise with their party rebels but as a political tactic it's virtually impossible for May to do it with without facing the collapse of her govt, so here we are.

[Stayingup]

The result of the referendum was such a shock to.the establishment. The City the CBI the BBC and generally London and the destable Blair (and the gruesome Cambell) that have been hell bent on stopping Brexit.

My wife is very ill. Can't get an appointment at the doctors for two months. Why? Because the loathsome Cameron decided we had to enshrine in law the ridiculous Foreign aid budget. The desirable t0sser Blair sanctions open immigration. What a set of w@nkers they are
So out of touch with reality and desires of normal people. Not lefty loony ideologues who are even more crazy.

[Spiral]

Considering we hire qualified doctors from other countries (that coincidentally also receive foreign aid) to make sure sick folk can get un-sick, that seems an odd stance to take.

[South West Claret.]

Of course it will; it has to as the nation has decreed it.

Of course it won’t; it had to be an”informed” referendum for it to be legitimate.

[BennyD]

So, only the remainers were “informed” enough to place their vote. Yes, ok, that’s right, jolly good, off you go. I hope you don’t get too depressed when we wave two fingers to the UXB that is Europe.

[Stayingup]

Considering we hire qualified doctors from other countries (that coincidentally also receive foreign aid) to make sure sick folk can get un-sick, that seems an odd stance to take.

Odd? Are you joking. Before you open the doors you should make sure you can cope wirh dictors nurses schiols and roads etc. We didnt and this patently was not considered. I wish we had more doctors foreign or British. I am sick of absolutely incompetent politicians who will sacrifice us for the sake of votes. Personally I think the country is bollocksed.

[Imploding Turtle]

Of course it will; it has to as the nation has decreed it.

The nation can change its mind

[joey13]

The result of the referendum was such a shock to.the establishment. The City the CBI the BBC and generally London and the destable Blair (and the gruesome Cambell) that have been hell bent on stopping Brexit.

My wife is very ill. Can't get an appointment at the doctors for two months. Why? Because the loathsome Cameron decided we had to enshrine in law the ridiculous Foreign aid budget. The desirable t0sser Blair sanctions open immigration. What a set of w@nkers they are
So out of touch with reality and desires of normal people. Not lefty loony ideologues who are even more crazy.

So your wife not getting an appointment is nothing to do with having a Tory Government since 2010

[Imploding Turtle]

The result of the referendum was such a shock to.the establishment. The City the CBI the BBC and generally London and the destable Blair (and the gruesome Cambell) that have been hell bent on stopping Brexit.

My wife is very ill. Can't get an appointment at the doctors for two months. Why? Because the loathsome Cameron decided we had to enshrine in law the ridiculous Foreign aid budget. The desirable t0sser Blair sanctions open immigration. What a set of w@nkers they are
So out of touch with reality and desires of normal people. Not lefty loony ideologues who are even more crazy.

Notice how it's the foreigners getting in your way? Not austerity. That's because you're playing right into the arms of their xenophobia by spreading their scapegoating bullshit.
You're easy pickings for them.

[Imploding Turtle]

Considering we hire qualified doctors from other countries (that coincidentally also receive foreign aid) to make sure sick folk can get un-sick, that seems an odd stance to take.

They aren't even being trained over here so it's not like we're spending money on them. They're massive net contributors.

[bfcjg]

Considering we hire qualified doctors from other countries (that coincidentally also receive foreign aid) to make sure sick folk can get un-sick, that seems an odd stance to take.

Ok. Just short of four million Europeans living in the UK and you want our already overstretched GP'S to look after them as well. The incoming doctors are looking after immigrants as well.
Reservoirs very low should we blame Brexit for that or the four million not bringing water for fifty years with them ?

[Tall Paul]

Ok. Just short of four million Europeans living in the UK and you want our already overstretched GP'S to look after them as well. The incoming doctors are looking after immigrants as well.
Reservoirs very low should we blame Brexit for that or the four million not bringing water for fifty years with them ?

I'm sure there are a few more Europeans than that living here.

About 60 million more.

[Imploding Turtle]

Ok. Just short of four million Europeans living in the UK and you want our already overstretched GP'S to look after them as well. The incoming doctors are looking after immigrants as well.
Reservoirs very low should we blame Brexit for that or the four million not bringing water for fifty years with them ?

I've seen some dumb **** in my time...


You're talking about people who collectively are net contributors to our country. They put more in than they take out because they didn't need 18 years of healthcare and education and government support before entering our workforce and paying taxes and national insurance.

[Spiral]

Ok. Just short of four million Europeans living in the UK and you want our already overstretched GP'S to look after them as well. The incoming doctors are looking after immigrants as well.
Reservoirs very low should we blame Brexit for that or the four million not bringing water for fifty years with them ?

Demonise them all you like but short of a spike in fertility or the UK population somehow becoming more productive more or less overnight, working, tax paying migrants play a significant part in producing the growth that affords us a health service used mostly by elderly retirees.

[Top Claret]

Fukin hope so

[South West Claret.]

Of course it won’t; it had to be an”informed” referendum for it to be legitimate.

To just explain an “informed “ referendum is on the final outcome of the negotiation by our government.

[Terrier]

If not democracy is dead.

[If it be your will]

.

[tiger76]

Depends on your definition of Brexit,and this is the problem how the hell can we agree with 27 other countries,when the cabinet can't find a common voice on the issue,i suspect there will be some clarity when the white paper emerges.

That will be the point when Brexitters have to put up or shut up(yes you Boris) and mayhem will have to stick or twist,the EU are running out of patience hence Branier and Tusk's straight talking today.

If i had to guess the UK will end up in some form of customs union one way or another,partly due to the Irish border issue as there has been no viable alternatives proposed,and businesses won't tolerate a no deal.

How the negotiations proceed on other matters pass

[If it be your will]

.

[Imploding Turtle]

Of course you're totally and indisputably correct, and I wonder how that isn't obvious to everyone. We always forget, though, these healthy, highly-educated, net-contributing citizens often arrive from countries that can least afford to train them. We tell developing nations to spend more on educating their citizens and, when they do, we hire them. Morally speaking, the flow of highly-educated, healthy citizens should be in the other direction.

Quite why bfcjg is morally outraged about them coming here, though, I've yet to fathom.

Maybe he's genuinely concerned about the economic prosperity of the countries from which they come.

[Lancasterclaret]

Yes, and it will be a disaster.

Unless of course you are very well off

[If it be your will]

.

[TheFamilyCat]

Odd? Are you joking. Before you open the doors you should make sure you can cope wirh dictors nurses schiols and roads etc. We didnt and this patently was not considered. I wish we had more doctors foreign or British. I am sick of absolutely incompetent politicians who will sacrifice us for the sake of votes. Personally I think the country is bollocksed.

You're certainly presenting a good case for the standard of education suffering.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Of course we will leave.

Maybe not under this PM, or even under this Parliament, but we will leave. About 60% of the UK want to (52% plus a chunk who Project Fear made wobble and who would leave in different economic circumstances, such as a Euro crisis).

The Remainers as a group (to stereotype most of our MPs and about 15m people ) are too daft to realise that the best thing for them is to leave fully and use the economic blip to then creep back into various associate arrangements that actually would suit them quite well. Instead, they lobby for an associate arrangement (or worse) from the start which will just keep Leavers inflamed and keep pushing for even more distance from the EU for years or decades to come.

I actually think there will be a reasonable deal, though the PM is so incompetent she is fighting hard to make sure they offer us nothing. We are after all, a Germanic peoples, and our cousins the Germans will eventually offer us something because of their need for like minds. Let’s be honest, most of the EU detest the Germans for their fiscal toughness and saver culture - a culture which generally we share but have slipped away from recently. Tall Paul takes the Mick up above for a poster not calling us European, but in reality we are dozens of different types of ethnic groups, massively different, and we have so little in common with many of them. We may find more of an ally in the Germans than we realise.

I think we will end up in the EEA / EFTA, which we were after all a founder member of, alongside the other Germanic nations of Iceland and Norway. The Brexiteers will demand a compromise on free movement, and it will come. I don’t think it would be the correct exit, but it is the fudge they will go for. We will then spend years pushing for more distance rather than more closeness.

[Vino blanco]

Will signing Jayrod ever happen? Damn site more interesting than all the biased political drivel on here. This forum is going to the dogs from the you know who crowd. Same sh.te every day from the same people, I give up now, I am losing the will to live with it all.

[Damo]

Yes it will.
It's already in motion.
Some guy on here (infuriatingly) had to sign a piece of paper to say his kids could go on a school trip once.
Get used to it folks

[Lancasterclaret]

RIP Vino Blanco

You'll be missed.

Your life could have continued, a life that would have possibly enriched humanity beyond anything we have seen before, but he couldn't stop himself opening a thread that he knew would contain no football chat.

Its a loss, but we will survive.

[Tribesmen]

Yes, and it will be a disaster.

Unless of course you are very well off

Yes it will be , hey you voted for this

[jackmiggins]

Referendum was quite clear & I voted for absolutely no other reason than to keep the sovereignty of this country safe. Exit from the imploding EU is an escape from disaster & to not carry this out would actually put any ministers who were implicit in such a course of action in jeopardy of trial to high treason.

[Inchy]

Referendum was quite clear & I voted for absolutely no other reason than to keep the sovereignty of this country safe. Exit from the imploding EU is an escape from disaster & to not carry this out would actually put any ministers who were implicit in such a course of action in jeopardy of trial to high treason.

High treason! Haha brilliant

[jackmiggins]

Can’t actually get any higher (in European law) suck that.

[Inchy]

Whenever I hear anyone say high treason it reminds me of ridiculous Facebook posts, usually posted by a bloke with a medieval knight as his profile picture

[Imploding Turtle]

Referendum was quite clear & I voted for absolutely no other reason than to keep the sovereignty of this country safe. Exit from the imploding EU is an escape from disaster & to not carry this out would actually put any ministers who were implicit in such a course of action in jeopardy of trial to high treason.

"high treason"

lol.

[JohnMcGreal]

Referendum was quite clear & I voted for absolutely no other reason than to keep the sovereignty of this country safe. Exit from the imploding EU is an escape from disaster & to not carry this out would actually put any ministers who were implicit in such a course of action in jeopardy of trial to high treason.

[northernpowerhouse]

At some point in the next few months the Brexiteers will have to accept that we're getting Brexit in name only for now. Then we'll have all the time in the world to figure out how to distance ourselves from the EU. It will probably involve waiting for the Tories to get a majority, ditching the DUP and having a border in the Irish Sea.

[nil_desperandum]

Referendum was quite clear & I voted for absolutely no other reason than to keep the sovereignty of this country safe.

Not clear in statistical terms - less than 2% swing would overturn it, and definitely not clear as to what leavers voted for, as you demonstrate in the second half of the sentence. There were a number of reasons why people voted "leave", not just the one.
If you ask 100 leave voters what they were voting for, you'll get a wide range of answers. Not just "for absolutely no other reason" then Sovereignty.
It was this lack of clarity with different factions of the leave camp arguing for different things prior to (and since) June 16, that has caused our government to virtually grind to a halt.

[Greenmile]

Of course we will leave.

Maybe not under this PM, or even under this Parliament, but we will leave. About 60% of the UK want to (52% plus a chunk who Project Fear made wobble and who would leave in different economic circumstances, such as a Euro crisis).

The Remainers as a group (to stereotype most of our MPs and about 15m people ) are too daft to realise that the best thing for them is to leave fully and use the economic blip to then creep back into various associate arrangements that actually would suit them quite well. Instead, they lobby for an associate arrangement (or worse) from the start which will just keep Leavers inflamed and keep pushing for even more distance from the EU for years or decades to come.

I actually think there will be a reasonable deal, though the PM is so incompetent she is fighting hard to make sure they offer us nothing. We are after all, a Germanic peoples, and our cousins the Germans will eventually offer us something because of their need for like minds. Let’s be honest, most of the EU detest the Germans for their fiscal toughness and saver culture - a culture which generally we share but have slipped away from recently. Tall Paul takes the Mick up above for a poster not calling us European, but in reality we are dozens of different types of ethnic groups, massively different, and we have so little in common with many of them. We may find more of an ally in the Germans than we realise.

I think we will end up in the EEA / EFTA, which we were after all a founder member of, alongside the other Germanic nations of Iceland and Norway. The Brexiteers will demand a compromise on free movement, and it will come. I don’t think it would be the correct exit, but it is the fudge they will go for. We will then spend years pushing for more distance rather than more closeness.

I’m guessing you’d be happy with a second referendum then, given the weight of numbers behind your side.

[Rick_Muller]

Not a big fan of Danny Dyer but #TheSecondTwat is something to admire...

https://twitter.com/thejeremyvine/statu ... 05600?s=21" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[bfcjg]

Im not convinced it will. I have posted before that i think there will be an election with the liberals getting the remain vote and holding the balance of power doing a deal with labour and there will be another referendum

[Strela_999]

I think that the EU is seen the same way from Great Britain and from Serbia. The people wants to get (or stay) out, while the political and economical ruling classes want in. And since it's the latter who are running the country, well...

Because in the eyes of your average Brit, the EU is mostly a source of taxes and random regulations taken by technocrats in an ivory tower, but for the government and big companies, it means this : https://tranio.com/articles/londons-pos ... tors_5263/. It means that British companies will struggle while foreign ones can take advantage of the weak pound to buy British real estate, companies... Now if you take into account the fact that some regions of Wales and Scotland are actually receiving money from EU development/crisis recovery program, you'll understand why if Brexit ever happens, it will happen very slowly.

[piston broke]

Gove tearing up Mays proposals now. That’s what we need at this time. A minister throwing his dummy out of the pram because he doesn’t get his own way.
The worst decision she made was putting the loony right in charge of this idiocy. Gove,Bojo,Fox,Davies all political lightweights with not an idea between them but pulling the Ian Paisley card......”na,na,na,na,na..we won”.

[boatshed bill]

Gove tearing up Mays proposals now. That’s what we need at this time. A minister throwing his dummy out of the pram because he doesn’t get his own way.
The worst decision she made was putting the loony right in charge of this idiocy. Gove,Bojo,Fox,Davies all political lightweights with not an idea between them but pulling the Ian Paisley card......”na,na,na,na,na..we won”.

She's not fit for purpose

[Lancasterclaret]

None of them are, that is the problem.

We need a Churchill, and we've got a collection of politicians that have the vision of Neville Chamberlain and the strategic vision of Anthony Eden.

[tiger76]

Not a big fan of Danny Dyer but #TheSecondTwat is something to admire...

https://twitter.com/thejeremyvine/statu ... 05600?s=21" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He is spot on no-one can explain what Brexit means,and he is also correct the rats left the sinking ship Cameron especially,yeah he might have shot the UKIP fox but at what cost to his own party and more importantly the country.

[Quickenthetempo]

Immigration is a problem because for every million that come in to the country we need to build a certain number of schools,hospitals,doctors surgeries,houses,drainage systems etc.. and we fall well short on it all.

The elite love low paid immigration as they can exploit it through jobs for them.

But let's pretend they have free movement because they're nice people.