Clarets Foundation

Hoddesdon Claret · Post by **Hoddesdon Claret** » Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:24 pm

I have been a member of the Foundation for 3 seasons now and I never used the priority match day ticket service which comes with membership.
It states on the club website that Foundation Membership includes the following guaranteed benefits.
*Priority match day tickets ordering service *
I believe this to be around 100 tickets per away games.
It does not say anything about cup games and I believe this service has been available in past cup games.
I contacted the Foundation last week to use this service only to be told the club would not be supplying this service for Aberdeen Europa Cup away leg.
Can someone explain why this game is different to any other cup game and this service is not available.
It seems to me that the club are making good the rules up as they are going along .

Pearcey · Post by **Pearcey** » Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:41 pm

I’m in the same boat but I can understand why they’ve done it. 50 odd years is a long time to wait and some people have held season tickets since then. They should get priority for me.

Paul Waine · Post by **Paul Waine** » Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:43 pm

Hoddesdon Claret wrote:I have been a member of the Foundation for 3 seasons now and I never used the priority match day ticket service which comes with membership.
It states on the club website that Foundation Membership includes the following guaranteed benefits.
*Priority match day tickets ordering service *
I believe this to be around 100 tickets per away games.
It does not say anything about cup games and I believe this service has been available in past cup games.
I contacted the Foundation last week to use this service only to be told the club would not be supplying this service for Aberdeen Europa Cup away leg.
Can someone explain why this game is different to any other cup game and this service is not available.
It seems to me that the club are making good the rules up as they are going along .

Is it just Aberdeen? or will this apply to all Europa games? and both home and away?

Hoddesdon Claret · Post by **Hoddesdon Claret** » Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:45 pm

I was led to believe it would be for the Aberdeen game . Nothing was mentioned about any other games .

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Mon Jul 02, 2018 11:15 pm

I phoned the ticket office today with pretty much the same response.

I joined the foundation around twenty years ago when it started so that I could always get a ticket when required as I live 250 miles away and only get to 6 or so home games per season (hence pointless getting a season ticket).

What bugs most is that they have always advertised the ticket facility as the key benefit of membership and do not specify that cup games are excluded ( I was told today that they had stopped including cup games due to lack of interest from members). It does not specify types of games in the foundation member benefits…

In the past I have rarely used the foundation membership as route to tickets as they only supply one ticket which would be sat separately to other people I sit with. It has made more sense to go through supporters clubs or direct to the ticket office to be sat with people I know. In addition the disconnect between the lottery office and the ticket office has regularly appeared draconian and has not moved forward at the fast pace of the clubs movement in terms of recent successes.

It is also a shame that I was today advised that I could cancel my membership, thus, defying the point of the original sign up and making the 20 years of wanting to invest in my club from afar futile.

It is a shame that the infrastructure of the club is not keeping pace with the improvements on the pitch.

I fully understand why season ticket holders should be rewarded but at the same time an international business needs to get the marketing of products correct and accurately explain which tickets are part of the priority ordering service.

tybfc · Post by **tybfc** » Mon Jul 02, 2018 11:28 pm

Hoddesdon Claret wrote:I have been a member of the Foundation for 3 seasons now and I never used the priority match day ticket service which comes with membership.
It states on the club website that Foundation Membership includes the following guaranteed benefits.
*Priority match day tickets ordering service *
I believe this to be around 100 tickets per away games.
It does not say anything about cup games and I believe this service has been available in past cup games.
I contacted the Foundation last week to use this service only to be told the club would not be supplying this service for Aberdeen Europa Cup away leg.
Can someone explain why this game is different to any other cup game and this service is not available.
It seems to me that the club are making good the rules up as they are going along .

Waste of a phone call and the Foundation are a waste of time.

They live on the same car park as the ticket office but can't communicate.

I wonder why I bother donating?

NL Claret · Post by **NL Claret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 5:25 am

Getting tickets through the foundation for Derby away on a Monday night was straight forward.

Getting tickets for United away or Huddersfield away was impossible. Would doubt they get 100 tickets. More like 20 I would guess and the tickets for the big games are probably already reserved for the chosen few.

Stalbansclaret · Post by **Stalbansclaret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 6:53 am

I got my ticket for Reading away in the play-offs via my Foundation membership. For that alone I will donate forever !

Croydon Claret · Post by **Croydon Claret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 7:16 am

Hibsclaret wrote:I phoned the ticket office today with pretty much the same response.

I joined the foundation around twenty years ago when it started so that I could always get a ticket when required as I live 250 miles away and only get to 6 or so home games per season (hence pointless getting a season ticket).

What bugs most is that they have always advertised the ticket facility as the key benefit of membership and do not specify that cup games are excluded ( I was told today that they had stopped including cup games due to lack of interest from members). It does not specify types of games in the foundation member benefits…

In the past I have rarely used the foundation membership as route to tickets as they only supply one ticket which would be sat separately to other people I sit with. It has made more sense to go through supporters clubs or direct to the ticket office to be sat with people I know. In addition the disconnect between the lottery office and the ticket office has regularly appeared draconian and has not moved forward at the fast pace of the clubs movement in terms of recent successes.

It is also a shame that I was today advised that I could cancel my membership, thus, defying the point of the original sign up and making the 20 years of wanting to invest in my club from afar futile.

It is a shame that the infrastructure of the club is not keeping pace with the improvements on the pitch.

I fully understand why season ticket holders should be rewarded but at the same time an international business needs to get the marketing of products correct and accurately explain which tickets are part of the priority ordering service.

The club don't need the money from Foundation members the same as they did when it was first formed therefore it's probably more of an inconvenience to administer it these days

Not providing tickets does amount to a breach of contract though

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 7:43 am

Agree that they don’t need the money anymore. Very much akin to a small business growing and then forgetting the core customers that helped along the way. They should cancel the foundation and replace with something appropriate to the needs of the new business model.

What they shouldn’t do is continue to market something that is inaccurate and then fumble through a fudged explanation as to why they can’t provide tickets. Yesterday I heard UEFA blamed along with ‘we don’t do cup games due to lack of interest from members on previous occasions’ etc etc.

The infrastructure off the pitch should now match the quality on the pitch. They have had plenty of time to get this right as we first got promoted 9 years ago now.

Somethingfishy · Post by **Somethingfishy** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:08 am

Hibsclaret wrote:Agree that they don’t need the money anymore. Very much akin to a small business growing and then forgetting the core customers that helped along the way. They should cancel the foundation and replace with something appropriate to the needs of the new business model.

What they shouldn’t do is continue to market something that is inaccurate and then fumble through a fudged explanation as to why they can’t provide tickets. Yesterday I heard UEFA blamed along with ‘we don’t do cup games due to lack of interest from members on previous occasions’ etc etc.

The infrastructure off the pitch should now match the quality on the pitch. They have had plenty of time to get this right as we first got promoted 9 years ago now.

I'm not a Foundation member but i would hazard a guess that the Uefa excuse is probably the right one and the reason why the foundation has no tickets. They have strict rules in how the tickets are distributed. I am sure there will be people along to explain the ins and outs that are more in the know than me.

Steve-Harpers-perm · Post by **Steve-Harpers-perm** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:15 am

Has anyone on here ever won any of the cash draw prizes?

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:28 am

That's the shock of the day. I have been looking forward to the match and am in Inverness that morning, so great timing. I am a shareholder and have been successful getting tickets, most of the time. To exclude shareholders and paying Foundation members, amounts to a 'we don't need you any more' statement. They should think again.

As a shareholder, the directors will expect their tickets...

Croydon Claret · Post by **Croydon Claret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:44 am

Steve-Harpers-perm wrote:Has anyone on here ever won any of the cash draw prizes?

I won £25 a couple of years ago. I'm certainly not in it for the money

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 10:51 am

To exclude shareholders and paying Foundation members, amounts to a 'we don't need you any more' statement. They should think again.

It doesn't mean that at all. It means that the club are sticking to UEFA requirements from what I can gather.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:19 am

The UEFA rules don't seem that strict when you read them. The only possible thing that could apply would be:

tickets must not be used for any commercial purposes such as for promotion, advertising, use as a prize in a competition/sweepstake, or as part of a hospitality or travel package, without the prior written approval of UEFA;

which I wouldn't say applies to the Foundation given you are still buying tickets (and they're still not banned, just permission needs to be sought).

I very much suspect the club is using "UEFA regulations" as a catch-all when they don't have an explanation. Much in the same way as "health and safety" is blamed.

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:30 am

I don’t buy the UEFA line.

The key issue is KYC which is why ID et all is required. If they don’t have enough info for adequate customer knowledge of a foundation member of 20 years then something is wrong.

The foundation had its day when it was relevant but the more successful we have become should mean a rework of the lottery and ticketing set up so that it remains relevant and aligned with our peers in the premier league.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:35 am

Ok, then If I had to hazard a guess (and this purely guesswork) but the club may well have has a lot of communication from fans about other fans getting tickets for games it should be very hard to get tickets for.

They may have decided that they wanted to maximise the allocation for what they see (what they see, not what I think btw!) as the fans who have the most reward points. I haven't used the word "loyalty" btw as that is unfair.

But we have to remember that this is our first European game for 40 odd years, and an 2,000 allocation was always going to be problematic and people will miss out, and probably not be happy about it.

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:47 am

I understand why I’m missing out and accept it.

I was at all the midlands to southern based away games last season including Arsenal (where there was lots of issues about the 1500 approx tickets and many people with more points than me missing out). The club are continuing (as I understand) with the approach to prem games next season which will mean that there will continue to be discrepancies in terms of who can and should get tickets.

The system needs a full overhaul and the foundation benefits should be clearer and not as ambiguous as they are. There is an argument that they are in breach of contract as mentioned by Croydon on this thread.

Foshiznik · Post by **Foshiznik** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:49 am

I managed to get Reading away, Arsenal away, Tottenham away and Wembley tickets via the Foundation during Judas reign. It was well worth the money.

bfcmik · Post by **bfcmik** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 12:16 pm

aggi wrote:The UEFA rules don't seem that strict when you read them. The only possible thing that could apply would be:

tickets must not be used for any commercial purposes such as for promotion, advertising, use as a prize in a competition/sweepstake, or as part of a hospitality or travel package, without the prior written approval of UEFA;

which I wouldn't say applies to the Foundation given you are still buying tickets (and they're still not banned, just permission needs to be sought).

I very much suspect the club is using "UEFA regulations" as a catch-all when they don't have an explanation. Much in the same way as "health and safety" is blamed.

The Foundation calls itself a lottery. The main problem as I see it is that the club's supporter facing admin departments, whether it be the shop, ticketing, Foundation, marketing has still got quite 'small club' feel to them though there does appear to be tiny steps towards a more up to date approach.

I am not pointing a finger at any member of staff at the club, in every 1 to 1 contact I have had with them they have proved themselves to be helpful and friendly.

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 12:31 pm

You have hit the nail on the head very subtly here.

This is an organisation which used to be a corner shop that is now the size of Tesco but still being run like a corner shop (in some areas)

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 1:00 pm

I was a member of the foundation from the start when BK launched it in the James Hargreaves. First time I enquired about a ticket was for BBurn away this year in the cup for a family member. They were ignorant to the point of rude and unhelpful. I wrote and complained didn't get and answer so cancelled my DD and decided to give it to cancer research instead. Never even contacted me to ask why I had left !

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 1:24 pm

Foshiznik wrote:I managed to get Reading away, Arsenal away, Tottenham away and Wembley tickets via the Foundation during Judas reign. It was well worth the money.

Similar to me. I even turned down a free ticket to Reading as it was via a John Lewis contact and in the home end. It meant I would have had to keep a lid on it if we scored. Imagine being sat with home fans when Pato lamped home that opener. And then Thommo sending us even more wild and en route to Wembley. I would have ended up getting into trouble and/or thrown out as I couldn't have sat on my hands.

I have won the odd few prizes via the Foundation, but of late the ticket side of it has been hit and miss. I got 2 for West Ham but no joy for Arsenal, probably reflective of the allocation we took for respective games. I am tempted to cancel as for me the ticket side is the only real benefit. The club no longer needs my £100 a year or what ever it costs, I don't use any of the match day benefits like use of the bar, if that is still part of the deal so little point in me continuing.

Barry_Chuckle · Post by **Barry_Chuckle** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 3:19 pm

Just seen this thread after calling the Foundation to see when tickets are available for Foundation members.

Uefa rules is what I've just been told, yet having read what aggi put which is off Uefa, I'm of the opinion it stinks!

No tickets to shareholders either, so the directors box will surely be empty will it not !?!

Really disappointed with decision but hey ho, try my luck in Aberdeen!

Croydon Claret · Post by **Croydon Claret** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:37 pm

Mrs Croydon assures me that I'll get a ticket on general sale as there won't be that much interest!

Therefore a handicapped wager has been laid. If I get a ticket I will be taking her for afternoon tea at Claridges in London, and if I don't she will take me down the local cafe.

No risk for me, looking forward to my full English

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Tue Jul 03, 2018 11:40 pm

I made a complaint, as a shareholder.

The response related only to a check having been made of shareholders use of the service and deciding there was not enough use!!!!!

I have responded that a shareholder would not need to use the service ordinarily and would order online it is the exceptional times, like this one, that the service comes into play. Therefore, the decision had been made on false information.

I assume that all shareholders are included in the exclusion!

mybloodisclaret · Post by **mybloodisclaret** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:19 am

I am cancelling my dd. Balls to em, they needed my money, they needed me. Now they aint ar5ed about either. 96 quid pay rise for me then. Wanted to help by donating, but it really is one way traffic.

Eyres_11 · Post by **Eyres_11** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:53 am

Its a popular game.

If you don't have the points and miss out then you miss out.

Doesnt matter if youre a foundation member or shareholder.Fair enough I say.

Loyalclaret · Post by **Loyalclaret** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 10:19 am

Hibsclaret wrote:You have hit the nail on the head very subtly here.

This is an organisation which used to be a corner shop that is now the size of Tesco but still being run like a corner shop (in some areas)

They should get in people who have run other progress clubs or big business, maybe an American like Lee Hoos

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 11:15 am

Well, only if you are daft enough to take them seriously.

And complaining because you haven't got a ticket?

How many points you got Ian?

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 2:12 pm

Just under 4000, mostly achieved 10 points at a time.
Only 3rd year as ST holder, following Mrs McL's death.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 2:29 pm

Think that is a case to what I was alluding to further up the thread.

Someone has decided that the points system is to be used so it would minimise the hassale and complaints, and they would only do that if lots of people has either mentioned it or complained about it.

Christ, you just have to look on here when people can't get tickets to figure out that some are going to complain. As you have done.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 2:34 pm

Which would be fine if the website didn't say:

Your Clarets Foundation membership includes the following guaranteed benefits:

Priority match ticket ordering service

If they're not doing it, it probably shouldn't be on the website as a guaranteed benefit.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 2:45 pm

Not arguing with that aggi, just trying to work out why the club have decided that its not the usual service for this one.

Only explanation I can think is that people who have missed out with loads of points have complained, but at a high enough level and enough leverage to actually do something.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 2:53 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Not arguing with that aggi, just trying to work out why the club have decided that its not the usual service for this one.

Only explanation I can think is that people who have missed out with loads of points have complained, but at a high enough level and enough leverage to actually do something.

Old-fashioned, low value, high maintenance initiatives like this and Golden Gamble have had their day. They must bring in peanuts in the scheme of things and, like passing round a bucket for David Reeves, are now something that seem out of place for Burnley FC in 2018.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 2:56 pm

Again, hard to argue with that but why has it changed for this game?

edison · Post by **edison** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 3:23 pm

I got cup tickets through the foundation years ago. Haven't been a member in about a decade though. Could it be as simple as it is a UEFA match, so normal foundation rules don't/can't apply?

MarbellaClaret · Post by **MarbellaClaret** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:11 pm

Ian Mcl........I got the same answer on tickets for shareholders but will be interesting to see how many directors get for family and friends.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:09 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Again, hard to argue with that but why has it changed for this game?

Very high demand for player and director complimentaries, chuck in 400 tickets going to the supporters travel package scheme and it leaves around 12/1300 to go on to loyalty scheme based fans.

It doesn't exactly leave enough for supporters clubs or foundation/single figure shareholders now.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:11 pm

MarbellaClaret wrote:Ian Mcl........I got the same answer on tickets for shareholders but will be interesting to see how many directors get for family and friends.

No offence but directors working for free and sometimes at grave expense to them deserve a bit more than someone who bought one share in 1989.

JohnMac · Post by **JohnMac** » Wed Jul 04, 2018 11:37 pm

Everyone cancel their Membership then I may, just may have a chance of my number coming up in one of the draws. Must be nearly 10 years and not a sniff

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Thu Jul 05, 2018 12:33 am

Quickenthetempo wrote:No offence but directors working for free and sometimes at grave expense to them deserve a bit more than someone who bought one share in 1989.

Not when it is stated that this will give priority.

The shares were not twuppence.

deanothedino · Post by **deanothedino** » Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:19 am

Hibsclaret wrote: The system needs a full overhaul and the foundation benefits should be clearer and not as ambiguous as they are. There is an argument that they are in breach of contract as mentioned by Croydon on this thread.

But then there's also an argument that they never said what games.

It only says a priority ticket service, doesn't promise that they'll always be tickets available.

Croydon Claret · Post by **Croydon Claret** » Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:26 am

deanothedino wrote:But then there's also an argument that they never said what games.

It only says a priority ticket service, doesn't promise that they'll always be tickets available.

It does state that this is a "Guaranteed benefit" No need to have a list of exclusions if it's guaranteed.

As we now know, it isn't guaranteed despite their claims.

deanothedino · Post by **deanothedino** » Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:41 am

Croydon Claret wrote:It does state that this is a "Guaranteed benefit" No need to have a list of exclusions if it's guaranteed.

As we now know, it isn't guaranteed despite their claims.

Maybe you did have priority but it was a lower priority than those with x number of loyalty points.

If tickets are offered to Foundation members for other games ahead of other fans then your guaranteed benefit has been provided. It didn't state 'Guaranteed benefits for every game ever'.

Just making the point that I think it's very unlikely you'd get them for breach of contract.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:44 am

Quickenthetempo wrote:... 400 tickets going to the supporters travel package scheme...

What is this? Is it advertised on the club website?

Murger · Post by **Murger** » Thu Jul 05, 2018 7:49 am

thatdberight wrote:What is this? Is it advertised on the club website?

Probably that what I posted last Friday, which was quickly removed. The act of a guilty party imo.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Thu Jul 05, 2018 8:17 am

thatdberight wrote:What is this? Is it advertised on the club website?

It was posted there would be one on the site but no details have been released.

I rang around a few to try and get a head start with one provider admitting they were the company chosen. They had offered the club multiple choices of plane, train, hotel etc.. but the club hadn't got back to them. This was 8 or 9 days ago though.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Thu Jul 05, 2018 8:58 am

Quickenthetempo wrote:It was posted there would be one on the site but no details have been released.

I rang around a few to try and get a head start with one provider admitting they were the company chosen. They had offered the club multiple choices of plane, train, hotel etc.. but the club hadn't got back to them. This was 8 or 9 days ago though.

Wasn't it the corporate trip the commercial department were organising for sponsors? If so, that has been scrapped because there can't be any away fans in hospitality at Pittodrie.