Profit without fans

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CottonopolisClaret
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Profit without fans

Post by CottonopolisClaret » Tue Aug 14, 2018 8:47 am

What a wonderful time to be a Claret. It's an even more wonderful time to be an affluent Claret. Tangible success to be seen almost everywhere- on the playing field, the training ground and in the community. This then is no curmudgeonly post which has its genesis in grumbling and moaning for its own sake. Rather it is born of a desire to ensure that the young, deprived and less fortunate of our community have their tilt at the life that we have enjoyed as Clarets. There are few trips to the Turf let alone trips to Aberdeen, Istanbul or Piraeus for a very significant majority. For as many of you will know, Burnley was ranked as the 17th most deprived area out of 326 districts and unitary authorities in England in the 2015 index of multiple deprivation. Our fan base in all our nearby former mill towns suffer similar deprivation.

Our Club does not rely on us for matchday ticket income. It generates but a small proportion of revenue- just 4.8%. It does though does rely upon us in other ways, as Football Supporters' Federation chair Malcolm Clarke says, "Players and managers come and go, but we are always there. The reason that they can get lucrative TV deals is because the product shows the crowd, the noise, the away fans and the atmosphere - it is all part of it. On one level they don't need the fans because they have got so much money from broadcasters, but at another level they do need fans to keep an attractive product.How boring would it be to watch a Premier League game in an empty stadium?" https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44850888" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

On Thursday night, despite the low cost of admission the ground will still not be full. I suspect but have not checked, that on Sunday, the picture will be the same. Never has the time been better for the Board to commit to begin the process of reducing the cost of match tickets. We must ensure the longevity of support for our Club- reducing ticket prices and getting groups of youngsters, families and friends to the Turf will ensure our future.

We are without any doubt the success story of the Premier League- our Board should show leadership by reducing the cost of tickets in a dramatic way. No ticket should be more than £10 for any home game for next season. All outstanding season tickets this year should be reduced and offered to those who have a East Lancashire post codes. All fans who have bought tickets for this year should get next years for free.

Why not? Should we ever get relegated then the Board can review the situation. Meanwhile I urge you to join the FSF. http://www.fsf.org.uk/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Will you join me in agitating for change?
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Devils_Advocate
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Devils_Advocate » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:01 am

Maybe a lot of kids just arent interested in actually going on games and like the local pub culture no matter what you do and how wrong it feels to older generations its popularity will continue to wain and its just something we'll have to accept and get used to

RogerBest
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by RogerBest » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:03 am

I have always thought the purpose of a club is to provide entertainment for the community it serves at an affordable price and largely agree with your sentiments.

However, if we sell tickets now for £10 It becomes very difficult to ask fans to pay more for lower quality football if we are relegated and are more reliant on gate receipts.

I feel the board's caution in the transfer market should be applauded if the reason for it is to protect the club long term.

I think pricing is generally about right at the moment in terms of season tickets, merchandise and events ie player of the year awards. I do think walk on tickets are a bit too high.
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Burnley1989
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Burnley1989 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:04 am

If we cant fill our ground at £15 in the Europa league then we will always struggle to fill it at home to teams like Cardiff, Fulham etc no matter what the price.

Its an argument that some on here love to have, yes its an expensive hobby but with more access to watching it at home and in the pub I don't really blame folk for doing the latter. Personally I doubt I'll ever get out of the habit, but that's easy for me to say as I don't need to travel far for the game. During the warm summer months with no sport I long for the cold Tuesday nights on the Turf, under the lights, scoring a last minute winner against Stoke. :)

deanothedino
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by deanothedino » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:07 am

No

RogerBest
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by RogerBest » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:09 am

You also mentioned tickets should be offered to people with an East Lancashire post code. I don't see why that should be relevant, surely people living in West Yorkshire or committed Clarets who live further away should have equal access.
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by fatboy47 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:51 am

More or less sold out against watford on sunday...with 5 days to shift the last few hundred...if you can sell out against possibly the least attractive opponents in the division, why reduce prices, and simply encourage the expectation of cheap football in the future?..

The only drawback to higher prices is the new breed of supporter it's brought. Doctors, teachers, solicitors and the generally insipid chattering classes now fill the place with their goofy bespectacled kids, and the atmosphere reflects this.
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:57 am

I think the pricing is just about right, we have to ensure that there’s contingency for relegation, where ticket income would then be much more important.

The only thing I would change is to heavily discount cup tickets for season ticket holders for a short period only - that way the club would generate larger crowds for cup games.
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by LoveCurryPies » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:00 am

The Club has held the season ticket prices for several years so in effect reduced prices. But I don’t agree we should be cheaper. We need to invest in players and the future.
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:01 am

Our pricing is spot on, because we will need income in the future.

Just glance down the M65 and you can see what happens when you start selling S/Ts for next to nowt.
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Blackrod
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Blackrod » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:07 am

The pricing is right with many early bird deals. The pricing for Europa is good value. Deals for kids are a good idea but £10 a ticket for an adult is laughable.

burnleymik
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by burnleymik » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:08 am

I too think we have it about right, although I do like the sentiment of what you are pushing for.

I think the fact that the first two premier league home games of the season are close to selling out reflects that.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by JohnMac » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:09 am

fatboy47 wrote:
The only drawback to higher prices is the new breed of supporter it's brought. Doctors, teachers, solicitors and the generally insipid chattering classes now fill the place with their goofy bespectacled kids, and the atmosphere reflects this.
Had to appreciate the genius of this paragraph, made me chuckle, more than a bit!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by evensteadiereddie » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:15 am

Same here, has this guy ever been to the Turf ? I think for every one goofy, bespectacled kid there must be thirty gobshite, chav ones.
Bloody funny, though.

CottonopolisClaret
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by CottonopolisClaret » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:18 am

I confess to being a little surprised about how callous some of the replies so far have been. What about those who use foodbanks? Those whose kids never see a holiday? Those families on the breadline and for whom a game of football is a luxury? Those fathers who would dearly wish to be able to take their kids on the Turf bit who can't afford. The Club should have the foresight to think about these people because some will be the Doctors and lawyers and teachers of the future despite their current straightened circumstances.
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Rick_Muller » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:20 am

CottonopolisClaret wrote:I confess to being a little surprised about how callous some of the replies so far have been. What about those who use foodbanks? Those whose kids never see a holiday? Those families on the breadline and for whom a game of football is a luxury? Those fathers who would dearly wish to be able to take their kids on the Turf bit who can't afford. The Club should have the foresight to think about these people because some will be the Doctors and lawyers and teachers of the future despite their current straightened circumstances.
I may be generalising a little bit those who use food banks will likely have a top end mobile phone on a contract for £50/month - me, I choose to have a £10/month contract and a sh!t (well old) phone - there’s one saving that would easily pay for and adult and under 22 season ticket. And I haven’t had a holiday in years and neither have my kids.

CottonopolisClaret
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by CottonopolisClaret » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:26 am

You are generalising but you have a point. This is about a club that that receives a huge amount of money from broadcasting rights. It is distributed in a variety of ways to ensure the well-being of the Club but the Club can do more to share this bounty with the fans thus ensuring the future loyalty of the fanbase.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:50 am

Securing the future loyalty of the fans is to have very decent prices for kids.

Which we do.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Blackrod » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:51 am

Could the club afford to donate a few tickets to the needy ? Yes and as far as I am aware they do. Someone who is using a food bank has a top priority of being able to eat and not attending A PL game. Should all fans pay less ? No.

summitclaret
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by summitclaret » Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:01 am

" I feel the board's caution in the transfer market should be applauded if the reason for it is to protect the club long term."

I feel that to leave us a winger short is an unnecessary risk that is more likely to have a negative affect on the long term than that caution.

If it be your will
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by If it be your will » Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:05 am

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Last edited by If it be your will on Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

9thMay1987
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by 9thMay1987 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 11:17 am

Man U. fan told me he paid £720 for his ticket behind the goals but not the Stretford end.

Seems expensive to me but they need his money to pay the wages to keep them top 4.

At the other end Blackburn fans want prices reducing to virtually zero, to get more people in the ground, create a better atmosphere and success will follow.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by keith1879 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:06 pm

Burnley1989 wrote:If we cant fill our ground at £15 in the Europa league then we will always struggle to fill it at home to teams like Cardiff, Fulham etc no matter what the price.

Its an argument that some on here love to have, yes its an expensive hobby but with more access to watching it at home and in the pub I don't really blame folk for doing the latter. Personally I doubt I'll ever get out of the habit, but that's easy for me to say as I don't need to travel far for the game. During the warm summer months with no sport I long for the cold Tuesday nights on the Turf, under the lights, scoring a last minute winner against Stoke. :)
Spot on. This match to me finally nails the old argument that reducing prices will help the club. It's our first competitive match against overseas opposition in 50 years, the tie is on a knife-edge after the first leg, the tickets are effectively half price. The ground should be sold out and it won't be ......I'm very disappointed but I suppose school holidays are partially to blame. What more can we do .......even at £5 a ticket would any more seats be sold?

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by NRC » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:07 pm

I think the OP would benefit from reading up on Maslow
Last edited by NRC on Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.

dougcollins
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by dougcollins » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:13 pm

I suppose we could always buy some players. Just a thought.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:15 pm

keith1879 wrote:Spot on. This match to me finally nails the old argument that reducing prices will help the club. It's our first competitive match against overseas opposition in 50 years, the tie is on a knife-edge after the first leg, the tickets are effectively half price. The ground should be sold out and it won't be ......I'm very disappointed but I suppose school holidays are partially to blame. What more can we do .......even at £5 a ticket would any more seats be sold?

The last round we had the "reasons" of it being school holidays, on TV, on a Thursday and it was £25. The only thing that remains the same is Thursday. Had it been Man Utd on a Thursday none of these reasons would come into play.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by ecc » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:21 pm

"No ticket should be more than £10 for any home game for next season. "

And what happens if we go down?

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by sox8595 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:21 pm

how many have we sold for thursday?
There have been comments elsewhere on the board about folk having to wait until general sale to get extras even though they are season ticket holders, maybe if they sold extras to season ticket holders in the restricted spell more would be sold?
I had to wait until general sale and ended up nowhere near my season ticket spot :-(

edlass
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by edlass » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:27 pm

in terms of younger people attending, or not being as interested, I worry sometimes that football is now just a list of statistics to bet against as a lot of young people just seem to care about both teams to score or how many corners. The actual bit where the football happens comes second. Watching the scores come in not to see who won but just to see if their bet wins. Hoping that their team would win but also hoping their rivals elsewhere scored more than 2.5 goals or 10+ shots or a penalty.

But the grounds are still full aren't they so maybe not?

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Leisure » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:40 pm

sox8595 wrote:how many have we sold for thursday?
There have been comments elsewhere on the board about folk having to wait until general sale to get extras even though they are season ticket holders, maybe if they sold extras to season ticket holders in the restricted spell more would be sold?
I had to wait until general sale and ended up nowhere near my season ticket spot :-(
That wasn't the case.

Priority Periods

Saturday 4th August, 12:30pm: On sale online, with season ticket holders able to purchase their reserved season ticket seats (seats not taken by season ticket holders will also be on sale)

Leisure
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Leisure » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:41 pm

dougcollins wrote:I suppose we could always buy some players. Just a thought.
Strange, I thought that we'd already done this!

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Granny WeatherWax » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:47 pm

Prices are fine, less than £25 to watch a premier league match in the most expensive part of the ground (excluding corporate) is a bargain.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by dsr » Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:00 pm

CottonopolisClaret wrote:I confess to being a little surprised about how callous some of the replies so far have been. What about those who use foodbanks? Those whose kids never see a holiday? Those families on the breadline and for whom a game of football is a luxury? Those fathers who would dearly wish to be able to take their kids on the Turf bit who can't afford. The Club should have the foresight to think about these people because some will be the Doctors and lawyers and teachers of the future despite their current straightened circumstances.
People who can't afford food wouldn't come on the Turf even at £10 a ticket. They'd have other priorities like clothes, toiletries, other necessities, long before football.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Sproggy » Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:05 pm

CottonopolisClaret wrote:I confess to being a little surprised about how callous some of the replies so far have been. What about those who use foodbanks? Those whose kids never see a holiday? Those families on the breadline and for whom a game of football is a luxury? Those fathers who would dearly wish to be able to take their kids on the Turf bit who can't afford. The Club should have the foresight to think about these people because some will be the Doctors and lawyers and teachers of the future despite their current straightened circumstances.
They can watch it on Sky.

I think what you should be arguing for is a fairer distribution of income down through the pyramid.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by sox8595 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:20 pm

Leisure wrote:That wasn't the case.

Priority Periods

Saturday 4th August, 12:30pm: On sale online, with season ticket holders able to purchase their reserved season ticket seats (seats not taken by season ticket holders will also be on sale)
The seats next ours were free last season they must have been taken up for this season. Obviously won't know until first hone match
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Re: Profit without fans

Post by fatboy47 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:57 pm

A quick glance at the club site will tell you that the JMU is two thirds empty as it stands for Thursday's game....proof if any were needed that you can fill the ground easily enough with freebie ST's for kids....but the minute the same people have to pay then it's a totally different story.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by yorkyclaret » Tue Aug 14, 2018 6:43 pm

I think carers who work long hours for 64 quid a week should get a discount.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by bfcjg » Tue Aug 14, 2018 6:48 pm

Bullsh1t. The Twix sales last season paid for Gibson.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Goody1975 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:01 pm

fatboy47 wrote:A quick glance at the club site will tell you that the JMU is two thirds empty as it stands for Thursday's game....proof if any were needed that you can fill the ground easily enough with freebie ST's for kids....but the minute the same people have to pay then it's a totally different story.
Generally what it shows at this time of year, is that with a fairly large percentage of the stand being occupied by children of school age and their parents, there is a very strong possibility that a very high number of said people will choose the six weeks of the school holidays to go away for a break in the sun.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by fatboy47 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 8:06 pm

Goody1975 wrote:Generally what it shows at this time of year, is that with a fairly large percentage of the stand being occupied by children of school age and their parents, there is a very strong possibility that a very high number of said people will choose the six weeks of the school holidays to go away for a break in the sun.

:lol: :lol: .......so Jmu gonna be half empty on Sunday?????.....I somehow doubt it Goody.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Goody1975 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 8:36 pm

fatboy47 wrote::lol: :lol: .......so Jmu gonna be half empty on Sunday?????.....I somehow doubt it Goody.
I reckon they'll be a fair few empty seats yes, they'll be counted as attending though as they have purchased a ticket.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:41 pm

summitclaret wrote:" I feel the board's caution in the transfer market should be applauded if the reason for it is to protect the club long term."

I feel that to leave us a winger short is an unnecessary risk that is more likely to have a negative affect on the long term than that caution.
Are we a winger short?

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Espia » Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:34 am

Granny WeatherWax wrote:Prices are fine, less than £25 to watch a premier league match in the most expensive part of the ground (excluding corporate) is a bargain.
Eh? Burnley v Watford, JHU, £35.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by brexit » Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:47 am

evensteadiereddie wrote:Same here, has this guy ever been to the Turf ? I think for every one goofy, bespectacled kid there must be thirty gobshite, chav ones.
Bloody funny, though.
Would be interesting to see the age profile of burnley season ticket holders. I would guess that it was skewed towards the "older generation" Who can guarantee to attend most the of the matches in a season.
Maybe Tony can ask for that data.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by Espia » Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:50 am

After reading this thread it seems the conclusion is that the price of a ticket is not a determining factor in selling more tickets and filling the ground. All I can say is that it is for me. Not because I can't afford it but because of reasons like ... Why should I fork out as much as £35 when it's proven that match day ticket revenue is actually less than 5% of the club's income, to watch players on such obscene levels of income that they wouldn't even bother to bend down to pick up£35 if it was lying in the street.
I still do stump it up though now and again, because BFC is in my blood and there's nothing I can do about it. But it's very rare these days and the last time I did it (v Southampton last season) the game was so mind numbingly dire that I haven't dare risk it since.

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by JTClaret » Wed Aug 15, 2018 1:32 pm

I'd love this to be the case, but I simply don't think it is just a case of money.

Perhaps I'm wrong. My season ticket costs around £400 for me and my son, roughly £20 a game for the 2 of us. That's good value for money in my eyes.
As for walk ons, I'm not sure what the answer is, people have to want to go in the first place, whatever the cost. The big games will always sell out because people want to see the best players. Is somebody who can take or leave football going to be interested in (for example) Bournemouth?

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Re: Profit without fans

Post by KateR » Wed Aug 15, 2018 6:43 pm

I enjoyed reading the article and showing that we are in a good place and it's one of if not the best time to be a Clarets supporter in the last 50 years + :)

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