I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

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Spijed
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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Spijed » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:25 pm

Rileybobs wrote:Just because you don't understand why playing 2 games per week doesn't have an effect on performance levels doesn't mean that sport scientists don't. Comparisons with days of old are ridiculous, players used to have a half time pint and fag. You only need to watch clips of football from the 60's and 70's to see that the intensity levels were far lower and players were far less fit. And I'm not sure what a person's salary has to do with their ability to recover from high intensity aerobic exercise.
Should league cup games have any bearing on the outcome of a Saturday match though?

That's what our game at home to Istanbul was the equivalent of. No travelling involved, with a home league game at the weekend.

Swansea won the league cup and still managed to stay in the Prem for a few seasons afterwards.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by ClaretAL » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:30 pm

It's quite simple for me. It's no different than the schedule in the Championsip which we were very successful in despite playing Tuesday Saturday.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Rileybobs » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:34 pm

Spijed wrote:Should league cup games have any bearing on the outcome of a Saturday match though?

That's what our game at home to Istanbul was the equivalent of. No travelling involved, with a home league game at the weekend.

Swansea won the league cup and still managed to stay in the Prem for a few seasons afterwards.
Yes, having just 2 days to recover between games will definitely leave a player in -less-recovered' state than had they had a week between games.

And the League Cup scenario you have given would give the players 11 hours more time to recover than the Europa League scenario.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by dsr » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:36 pm

Which is why when Roger Federer plays a five-setter at Wimbledon, six hours of running around, he is incapable of winning his next round. Oh, hang on ...

Maybe tennis players have different sports scientists.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Rileybobs » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:36 pm

ClaretAL wrote:It's quite simple for me. It's no different than the schedule in the Championsip which we were very successful in despite playing Tuesday Saturday.
As were our opponents.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Rileybobs » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:36 pm

dsr wrote:Which is why when Roger Federer plays a five-setter at Wimbledon, six hours of running around, he is incapable of winning his next round. Oh, hang on ...

Maybe tennis players have different sports scientists.
Maybe tennis is a different sport.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by dsr » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:40 pm

Rileybobs wrote:Maybe tennis is a different sport.
Does that make a difference? I though aerobic recovery was related to how hard you have worked, not whether or not you hit the ball with a foot or a racquet.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Rileybobs » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:46 pm

dsr wrote:Does that make a difference? I though aerobic recovery was related to how hard you have worked, not whether or not you hit the ball with a foot or a racquet.
I suspect it makes a difference seeing as tennis players are able to play on consecutive days and sometimes twice in one day, whereas footballers require rests in between matches. It's an entirely different sport played at an entirely different pace using different parts of the body. In the grand slam tournaments a lot is made of players being able to get through the early rounds at a low intensity in straight sets in order to conserve energy for future rounds. I expect the experts in this field know what they're doing.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Dyched » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:51 pm

Surely tennis is by far a more intense sport than football.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by clarets1978 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:55 pm

ecc wrote:Were people saying "I hope we don't qualify for Europe" last season?
I actually work in place where everyone was saying this and I spent most of the latter part of the season justifying why we should be there. None of them have taken up Sundays result with me yet though

I think any result we've had is bog all to with Europe. Only 3 of the start eleven on Sunday played the full 120 minutes against Istanbul and 2 of those got subbed in the end any way.

The most laughable thing I heard was a chap next me on Sunday saying we were so poor due to lack of game time!!! And he was being serious!

Just to throw one in there, the season Wigan were in the Europa league they had been relegated to the championship, yet they made the playoffs with no problems. That would be through playing a lot more games than we will do this season 46 league, 6 Europa, 6 FA cup, 1 League Cup and 1 Community Shield and that adds up to less than what we played the season we went up with Owen Coyle and I don't remember anyone complaining about too many games with the much smaller squad we had back then!
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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by dsr » Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:05 pm

Rileybobs wrote:I suspect it makes a difference seeing as tennis players are able to play on consecutive days and sometimes twice in one day, whereas footballers require rests in between matches. It's an entirely different sport played at an entirely different pace using different parts of the body. In the grand slam tournaments a lot is made of players being able to get through the early rounds at a low intensity in straight sets in order to conserve energy for future rounds. I expect the experts in this field know what they're doing.
Footballers could play again on consecutive days. Amateur footballers often do. The question is, how much is their play affected?

Tennis players run around less, but their running is virtually all sprints. I would have thought they balance out. And very few players can coast the early rounds of grand slam events - only the top players can ever do that. When Isner beat Mahut over 10 hours, he was shattered for his game next day and was easily beaten - that's to be expected. But that doesn't automatically mean a normally-long game has the same effect. The difference to my mind appears to be that tennis players know they have to play consecutive days, even in grand slam events if there is rain, or else they wouldn't have a sport; so they just get on with it; footballers are so frequently told that they can't do what tennis players can do, that they come to believe it.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Dyched » Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:26 pm

Id think tennis players are far more prepared mentally than that of footballers. They know recovery times, schedules. They’ll be prepared mentally to go on court at any time. If theres a match before them on court at 2 sets to 0, they could be on court within the hour. If it end up 2-3 they’ll be on in 4/5 hours. Same physically when they get on court. It could be 3 hours or a 6 hour slog. They’ll need recovery afterwards/food etc and finally go to bed late at night.

Footballers typically have it easy. Their “protected”. It’s not that they cant play 2 games in 4 days, it’s more the manager doesn’t want to risk injury. There’s more chance over 180mins than that of 90mins. It’s funny when it come to the end of the season and a team chasing the PL and CL the only players/teams that are tired are the ones that get beat. It’s an excuse.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by houseboy » Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:34 pm

Rileybobs wrote:Just because you don't understand why playing 2 games per week doesn't have an effect on performance levels doesn't mean that sport scientists don't. Comparisons with days of old are ridiculous, players used to have a half time pint and fag. You only need to watch clips of football from the 60's and 70's to see that the intensity levels were far lower and players were far less fit. And I'm not sure what a person's salary has to do with their ability to recover from high intensity aerobic exercise.
High intensity aerobic exercise? So what do sports scientists have to say about tennis players? They play, sometimes, for hours and then have to play again a couple of days later or even the day after (or in extreme cases the same day). What about Olympic performers? They don't get a week off after an event. What about cyclists on the Tour de France (or any other long haul race)? They will cycle at high speed, often climbing mountain roads, for over 150km and then do it all again the following day (and will finish with a sprint quite often). I love football but footballers are pampered in the extreme and, despite what sports scientists say, should be capable of two games of footie per week.
With regard to what money has to do with it that is simple - if you are getting paid more per week than most people get paid in a year (or more) you should be able to go that extra mile. Don't forget that football is not a constant sport like some others, players can (and often do - we've all seen it) get 'lost' for some of the game. I have zero sympathy for pro footballers at the highest level.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Rileybobs » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:19 pm

houseboy wrote:High intensity aerobic exercise? So what do sports scientists have to say about tennis players? They play, sometimes, for hours and then have to play again a couple of days later or even the day after (or in extreme cases the same day). What about Olympic performers? They don't get a week off after an event. What about cyclists on the Tour de France (or any other long haul race)? They will cycle at high speed, often climbing mountain roads, for over 150km and then do it all again the following day (and will finish with a sprint quite often). I love football but footballers are pampered in the extreme and, despite what sports scientists say, should be capable of two games of footie per week.
With regard to what money has to do with it that is simple - if you are getting paid more per week than most people get paid in a year (or more) you should be able to go that extra mile. Don't forget that football is not a constant sport like some others, players can (and often do - we've all seen it) get 'lost' for some of the game. I have zero sympathy for pro footballers at the highest level.
But we're not talking about tennis players or Olympic athletes, we're talking about footballers. It's a completely different sport and due to the contact nature a more physical one.

Nobody is saying that footballers aren't capable of playing two games per week, absolutely nobody. But I expect that it's a certainty that playing Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday is detrimental to a player's performance levels and will increase the likelihood of sustaining an injury. If that isn't the case then why are managers not playing their best players for every game, they have nothing else to gain by resting them?

A number of our players have been selected to play Thursday/Sunday already this season but considering that qualification to the group stage will lead to further consecutive weeks of Thursday/Sunday games it is totally reasonable for the squad to be rotated to ensure that our best 11 players aren’t burnt out or injured before Christmas.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Tall Paul » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:30 pm

It's not just fitness, it's all the other match preparation they'll do during the week as well. Fulham will have had all week to concentrate on this weekend's game while we'll have had to split our preparation between them and Olympiacos.
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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Burnley87 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:51 pm

The difference between a fans view and a player/managers view is completly different and for that reason is Money. If burnley get relegated from the premier league, I would presume everyone would get paid less.

Hence everyone’s motivation at the club is to stay there. Nobody is telling me that finishing 17th wets the appetite of any professional or fan if Money wasn’t in the equation rightly or wrongly.

People remember winners, moments and success. I for one will remember my three trips into Europe and nobody will take that away however much money you have or want to accumulate. It’s a sad state of affairs that fans talk about money, we don’t get paid and for that reason we enjoy OUR moments

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by dsr » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:53 pm

Rileybobs wrote:But we're not talking about tennis players or Olympic athletes, we're talking about footballers. It's a completely different sport and due to the contact nature a more physical one.

Nobody is saying that footballers aren't capable of playing two games per week, absolutely nobody. But I expect that it's a certainty that playing Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday is detrimental to a player's performance levels and will increase the likelihood of sustaining an injury. If that isn't the case then why are managers not playing their best players for every game, they have nothing else to gain by resting them?

A number of our players have been selected to play Thursday/Sunday already this season but considering that qualification to the group stage will lead to further consecutive weeks of Thursday/Sunday games it is totally reasonable for the squad to be rotated to ensure that our best 11 players aren’t burnt out or injured before Christmas.
If we beat Olympiakos, we have 23 games in 17 weeks until New Year. I don't believe that any individual player, or our squad as a whole, can't manage that fixture list.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Mala591 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:54 pm

ClaretAL wrote:It's quite simple for me. It's no different than the schedule in the Championsip which we were very successful in despite playing Tuesday Saturday.
There is a very important difference. Play Thursday evening (EL) and then Sunday lunchtime (PL) = only 2.5 days to recover for the more important PL match.

Sunday lunch to Thursday evening = 4 days to recover.

PL should stay on Saturday afternoon, EL should be played on Tuesday evening.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Rileybobs » Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:10 pm

dsr wrote:If we beat Olympiakos, we have 23 games in 17 weeks until New Year. I don't believe that any individual player, or our squad as a whole, can't manage that fixture list.
Again, nobody has said that any individual player couldn't play 23 games in 17 weeks. The argument is that there is a deterioration in performance level and increase in the likelihood of injury. If you don't believe this to be the case then of course that's fine but I'd rather trust the evidence-backed opinions of the sports professionals working at the very top of their field than some bloke on a messageboard.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by deanothedino » Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:14 pm

Rileybobs wrote:But we're not talking about tennis players or Olympic athletes, we're talking about footballers. It's a completely different sport and due to the contact nature a more physical one.

Nobody is saying that footballers aren't capable of playing two games per week, absolutely nobody. But I expect that it's a certainty that playing Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday is detrimental to a player's performance levels and will increase the likelihood of sustaining an injury. If that isn't the case then why are managers not playing their best players for every game, they have nothing else to gain by resting them?

A number of our players have been selected to play Thursday/Sunday already this season but considering that qualification to the group stage will lead to further consecutive weeks of Thursday/Sunday games it is totally reasonable for the squad to be rotated to ensure that our best 11 players aren’t burnt out or injured before Christmas.
NHL players play three times a week normally. Pretty intense, physical, sport with a lot of travel as well.

I do think footballers are more than a bit pampered.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Dyched » Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:21 pm

deanothedino wrote:NHL players play three times a week normally. Pretty intense, physical, sport with a lot of travel as well.

I do think footballers are more than a bit pampered.
Their assets. £££££££. That’s why their pampered. We’re told so much shite about footballers. One week they need minutes to get match fit the next they need rest.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by dsr » Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:35 pm

Rileybobs wrote:Again, nobody has said that any individual player couldn't play 23 games in 17 weeks. The argument is that there is a deterioration in performance level and increase in the likelihood of injury. If you don't believe this to be the case then of course that's fine but I'd rather trust the evidence-backed opinions of the sports professionals working at the very top of their field than some bloke on a messageboard.
What do these professionals say is the ideal number? If 23 matches in 17 weeks significantly affects performance compared with 17, then how about 13, or 10, or 5? How many matches can a professional footballer play in 17 weeks before he he is over the hill and his form noticeably dips?

I reckon it's quite a lot above 23, myself. But the evidence-backed opinions will by definition have the evidence. Presumably they will take into account match fitness as well as physical fitness.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Spijed » Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:38 pm

Rileybobs wrote:Again, nobody has said that any individual player couldn't play 23 games in 17 weeks. The argument is that there is a deterioration in performance level and increase in the likelihood of injury. If you don't believe this to be the case then of course that's fine but I'd rather trust the evidence-backed opinions of the sports professionals working at the very top of their field than some bloke on a messageboard.
Interestingly, we looked far sharper than Southampton and that was probably due to the fact that we'd already had competitive matches and they hadn't.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Rileybobs » Wed Aug 22, 2018 5:08 pm

Spijed wrote:Interestingly, we looked far sharper than Southampton and that was probably due to the fact that we'd already had competitive matches and they hadn't.
Agreed, and then we looked far weaker than Watford in the second half on Sunday. I'm not sure whether either performance had anything to do with the preceding European game as we played a much-changed side. Southampton was our first league game so we hadn't played consecutive Thursday/Sunday games until then. I doubt that the odd Thursday/Sunday combo will affect a player noticeably but we're about to play our 5th and 6th consecutive Thursday game. That's going to take it's toll, particularly if we reach the group stages.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:14 pm

deanothedino wrote:NHL players play three times a week normally. Pretty intense, physical, sport with a lot of travel as well.

I do think footballers are more than a bit pampered.
They don't play a full 90 mins a game, they have 3 different squads, Offense, Defence and Special play from memory.

60 mins of actual game time, with intermissions and stops etc.

Probably not that difficult to play 3 games a week if you're playing half an hour or so...

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Lord Beamish » Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:17 pm

I can’t be arsed reading the whole thread, so I’ll just say this to the OP; I really hope Olympiacos is not our last tie in Europe this year.
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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by deanothedino » Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:10 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:They don't play a full 90 mins a game, they have 3 different squads, Offense, Defence and Special play from memory.

60 mins of actual game time, with intermissions and stops etc.

Probably not that difficult to play 3 games a week if you're playing half an hour or so...
3 different squads :lol:

They have 20 players. Two goalies (only one will play) 6 defenders and 12 attackers.

They’ll be 2 defenders and 3 attackers playing at any one time and while they’re on the ice it’ll all be the equivalent of sprinting. Special teams are made up of those same players. Just they’ll either be less opponents or less of their team on the ice.

Then add in the physicality. You won’t find many players under 200lbs. 200+lbs crashing into you at over 20mph is quite an impact.

It’s a hard physical sport that’s played at a very high intensity.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by KRBFC » Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:22 pm

FactualFrank wrote:Neither would I.
You wouldn't take a European trophy if it meant relegation? Is this what football has become? less about the winning and more about simply surviving?

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by dsr » Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:41 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:They don't play a full 90 mins a game, they have 3 different squads, Offense, Defence and Special play from memory.

60 mins of actual game time, with intermissions and stops etc.

Probably not that difficult to play 3 games a week if you're playing half an hour or so...
NHL is ice hockey. You're thinking of American Football, where they only play 16 games a season, not because of tiredness but because the game is so violent and so rough on the joints that they would all get injured if they played more.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Spijed » Wed Aug 22, 2018 11:08 pm

For those who would rather survive in the Prem - a question.

What have West Brom actually achieved in the last few years that they can look back on with pride?
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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by dsr » Thu Aug 23, 2018 12:52 am

One thing strikes me about the title - why does the OP want this to be the last Euro tie this season? Wouldn't he be hoping that we never qualify again and this could be our last Euro tie ever?

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by bartons baggage » Thu Aug 23, 2018 7:17 am

The club are evolving,it's just a shame some of our fans still have a 4th division mentality.
Embrace and enjoy these times they don't come round to often.
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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by claretnproud » Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:52 am

still not sure why people cannot understand that I am not really too fussed about a game or 2 in europe. This season is a huge season for us and I think if we stay in the prem this year then we will be here for a while providing mr dyche stays. Now we have had the euro experience I am happy to concentrate on continuation of our progress. The euro event has come a bit too early for us to do ourselves justice and it would be great to have a proper go at it further down the line when we can field a team thats a good reflection of our club instead of having several fringe players involved. Hoping for the best tonight. Its a win win game for me. Happy if we progress and not gutted if the results not a good one.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Wile E Coyote » Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:04 am

at least we're not stoke.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by houseboy » Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:21 am

Rileybobs wrote:But we're not talking about tennis players or Olympic athletes, we're talking about footballers. It's a completely different sport and due to the contact nature a more physical one.

Nobody is saying that footballers aren't capable of playing two games per week, absolutely nobody. But I expect that it's a certainty that playing Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday/Thursday/Sunday is detrimental to a player's performance levels and will increase the likelihood of sustaining an injury. If that isn't the case then why are managers not playing their best players for every game, they have nothing else to gain by resting them?

A number of our players have been selected to play Thursday/Sunday already this season but considering that qualification to the group stage will lead to further consecutive weeks of Thursday/Sunday games it is totally reasonable for the squad to be rotated to ensure that our best 11 players aren’t burnt out or injured before Christmas.
I addressed the injury situation - they can happen in ANY game, they game happen if a player only plays once a year. As for squad rotation, one of the reasons (although perhaps not so much at Burnley) is because some clubs have so many players (they buy them so that others can't have them in my opinion) that they have to keep them happy. The old adage that you don't change a winning team still holds true but squad rotation has come about because of many clubs simply having too many players to keep happy.
But we aren't talking about squad rotation here per se we are talking about the diminishing of the value of a competition because the god of money now says that you have to stay in the PL even if it means murdering your wife. It is made worse when managers don't announce their teams until late, by which time fans have bought tickets only to find they have paid hard earned cash to watch their reserves, it's a pity clubs cannot be fined under the trades descriptions act.
The analogy to other sports I made was simply to highlight the fact the many sports men and women don't have the luxury of a week off after every game/event and yet actually work very much harder than the average footballer.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Stayingup » Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:47 am

COBBLE wrote:I don't. So far at least. Our problem is that the three most skilful players we have, Brady, Defour and Vidra are not match fit, and that we didn't add a fourth.
What makes you think Vydra is one of our miost skilful players?

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by ecc » Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:06 am

I don't overly like Martin Samuel but he's called it right in that article, in my humble opinion.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Silkyskills1 » Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:10 am

Wile E Coyote wrote:at least we're not stoke.
Can't be that long ago that the likes of Stoke and mentioned earlier,West Brom, were the type of clubs we wanted to emulate. Perhaps we will.
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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Tall Paul » Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:14 am

Silkyskills1 wrote:Can't be that long ago that the likes of Stoke and mentioned earlier,West Brom, were the type of clubs we wanted to emulate. Perhaps we will.
Wouldn't you be happy with that? They did stay in the PL for ten and eight seasons, respectively.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Silkyskills1 » Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:20 am

Think I would be very happy with that.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Spijed » Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:50 am

dsr wrote:One thing strikes me about the title - why does the OP want this to be the last Euro tie this season? Wouldn't he be hoping that we never qualify again and this could be our last Euro tie ever?
You'd think that some don't want us to finish 7th or higher this season.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Spijed » Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:52 am

Silkyskills1 wrote:Think I would be very happy with that.
I suspect playing against Chelsea, Arsenal, Man City etc. would start to get less exciting in 3-4 years time.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by LoveCurryPies » Thu Aug 23, 2018 12:08 pm

It must be incredibly exciting for the players and taking on teams from Europe must help boost the idea that Burnley are a Club of substance. Let's all get behind the team tonight and next thursday!

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Rileybobs » Thu Aug 23, 2018 1:49 pm

houseboy wrote:I addressed the injury situation - they can happen in ANY game, they game happen if a player only plays once a year.
Of course they can happen, in any game, but the risk of injury increases substantially if a player is fatigued. I don't know how you can even argue against this point.

houseboy wrote:It is made worse when managers don't announce their teams until late, by which time fans have bought tickets only to find they have paid hard earned cash to watch their reserves, it's a pity clubs cannot be fined under the trades descriptions act.
What a load of rubbish. It's a squad game and we have players capable of stepping into the side and getting results at this level. Dyche has played a strong side in all of our European games.
houseboy wrote:The analogy to other sports I made was simply to highlight the fact the many sports men and women don't have the luxury of a week off after every game/event and yet actually work very much harder than the average footballer.
So it's the footballers you have the problem with? I guarantee every single member of our squad will want to start tonight. They're not having the luxury of a week off, they're being rotated strategically to give us the best chance of winning as many games as possible this season.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Thu Aug 23, 2018 3:36 pm

dsr wrote:NHL is ice hockey. You're thinking of American Football, where they only play 16 games a season, not because of tiredness but because the game is so violent and so rough on the joints that they would all get injured if they played more.
Yeah I misread it, but NHL still has different squads within a team, don't play full games etc.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by houseboy » Thu Aug 23, 2018 3:44 pm

Rileybobs wrote:Of course they can happen, in any game, but the risk of injury increases substantially if a player is fatigued. I don't know how you can even argue against this point.




What a load of rubbish. It's a squad game and we have players capable of stepping into the side and getting results at this level. Dyche has played a strong side in all of our European games.



So it's the footballers you have the problem with? I guarantee every single member of our squad will want to start tonight. They're not having the luxury of a week off, they're being rotated strategically to give us the best chance of winning as many games as possible this season.
Fatigue? Give me a break. You have swallowed this whole 'finely tuned athlete' thing haven't you. Joints might take a little longer but muscles, under normal stress conditions, repair themselves in 48 hours unless torn or severely damaged. Joints suffer the worst damage from repetitive strain and the range of movement in a footballer is greater and less repetitive than in many other sports.
Rubbish? No it isn't. People are hard pressed financially these days and to try to say, for example, that playing Bardsley and Long (among others) is playing our best team (or close to it as you seem to suggest) is actually the rubbish. Football is not a cheap sport to watch these days and no-one really wants to pay current prices to watch what amounts to the reserves. This squad rotation is bad enough even in a massive squad (Chelsea come to mind) but at a club like ours it's just not acceptable. Not long ago many on here were moaning that our squad is threadbare and not a great deal has happened since to change that a lot. Question for you: if we were playing Man Utd on Sunday and all our players were fit what would you think if Dyche left out Tarks and Mee? Admit it, you'd go nuts and rightly so, so why is it okay to leave them out in Europe? I'll tell you why because you don't value that competition enough. And THAT is the whole problem! I actually tend toward Europe because I think it is not impossible that we could win it, the odds are not good I'll admit but it is far more likely than winning the damn PL. So I would invest the biggest effort in that which is more realistic in terms of success.
Your last paragraph is a bit pointless really because I have never said they don't WANT to play, I'm sure they do, it's the powers behind the team that look at where the money is and decide which is more important. I just think we are a sports club and as such we should be looking to actually win things.
There is an obsession now in football that clubs should be run as a business and I can get with that to a degree, but we have now reached a point where clubs seem to put business first and football second, which begs the question what is the point. Football is, or was, about passion and pride and trying to win things, not about who has the biggest bank balance.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Vegas Claret » Thu Aug 23, 2018 3:50 pm

it takes 72 hours for a player to fully recover after a game

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by Silkyskills1 » Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:18 pm

houseboy wrote:I . It is made worse when managers don't announce their teams until late, by which time fans have bought tickets only to find they have paid hard earned cash to watch their reserves, it's a pity clubs cannot be fined under the trades descriptions
Nothing new in that. As a youngster I think I only ever saw Stanley Matthews once at Turf Moor playing for Blackpool. Team changes were announced over the tannoy about 15 minutes before kick-off and all I can recall was 'instead of Matthews at No7 for Blackpool is 'Mandy' (Stephen) Hill. And an instant groan from the crowd. Mind you, I wouldn't have been disappointed to find out that Jimmy Greaves wasn't in the Spurs line-up. He always was, though.

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by dsr » Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:23 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:it takes 72 hours for a player to fully recover after a game
Is that from the full time whistle? So with our game being at 7 pm tonight, the players would all be fully fit at 9 pm on Sunday, but 4 pm will be five hours too soon?

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Re: I hope olympiacos is our last euro tie this season

Post by RocketLawnChair » Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:54 pm

I don't care one jot if we get relegated and it is actually proven that it was because we are in the Europa League which I think is actually impossible to prove. Play every game to win, minimum requirement is maximum effort, remember that ? We will either be good enough or we wont be between August and May no matter what competitions we are in.

I will support Burnley FC no matter what Division we are in or how much ******* money we have. In fact I have already bloody done it !!

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