REPORT: Wolves give us a Molineux mauling

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:36 am

Thought we played quite well really when I look back - well, here are my real thoughts on yesterday's performance

See link
http://www.uptheclarets.com/wolves-give ... ux-mauling" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

bodge · Post by **bodge** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:48 am

Just plucked up the courage to come on here after yesterday's display.

You are right in that it should have been a heavier defeat, our full back/wide man partnerships were all over the place yesterday and we are crying out for Defour's return next to Cork. His return will be a positive but make no mistake several other players need to up their game as well if we are to get points on the board.

If Lowton and Ward are fit they have to play for me.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:52 am

bodge wrote:Just plucked up the courage to come on here after yesterday's display.

You are right in that it should have been a heavier defeat, our full back/wide man partnerships were all over the place yesterday and we are crying out for Defour's return next to Cork. His return will be a positive but make no mistake several other players need to up their game as well if we are to get points on the board.

If Lowton and Ward are fit they have to play for me.

I've kept away totally, left the moderating to others and only posted my player ratings and rate the ref.

In my ratings I posted that I thought Taylor and Lennon were our two worst players. I bravely (or stupidly) watched it again last night and stand by that. But other players, Barnes notably, were totally anonymous. I felt sorry for Vokes yesterday, not sure what else he could have done. Some credit to the two central defenders too and, of course, the goalkeeper.

I'd play Lowton if fit, and I would very definitely play Ward.

taio · Post by **taio** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:56 am

I'm not normally one to criticise Dyche but I'm stunned he hasn't selected Lowton or Ward.

bodge · Post by **bodge** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:01 pm

Agreed on the front two, we didn't get any kind of platform to provide them with anything as we didn't get hold of the ball high enough up the pitch to create a chance of note.

9thMay1987 · Post by **9thMay1987** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:17 pm

I thought the ex Welsh player on Sky summed it up nicely at half time - Wolves got round the sides of Burnley, that didn't happen last season.

ashtonlongsider · Post by **ashtonlongsider** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:31 pm

Very fair assessment CT. I'd like ask SD what's happened to his mantra- minimum requirement is maximum effort, honesty, pride and passion. I'll be frank I've not seen a lot of that around for a while now bar the odd game.

claretblue · Post by **claretblue** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:36 pm

'...The chairman always boasts when a window closes as to how we’ve come out of it stronger than we went in. Has he said anything this time?...'

he was quoted (during the summer) that we were likely to break our transfer record when making a purchase!

Jeremy_Bentham · Post by **Jeremy_Bentham** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:43 pm

. agrees with most of the report - except the part about Vokes being a positive. He thinks Vokes was absolute garbage and way off the pace.

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:47 pm

taio wrote:I'm not normally one to criticise Dyche but I'm stunned he hasn't selected Lowton or Ward.

Spot on. Lowton AND Ward.

Play your best team....

Devils_Advocate · Post by **Devils_Advocate** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:52 pm

Hibsclaret wrote:Spot on. Lowton AND Ward.

Play your best team....

Do you think Ward is a better option than Taylor?

scouseclaret · Post by **scouseclaret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:53 pm

ashtonlongsider wrote:Very fair assessment CT. I'd like ask SD what's happened to his mantra- minimum requirement is maximum effort, honesty, pride and passion. I'll be frank I've not seen a lot of that around for a while now bar the odd game.

I’m not sure it’s down to lack of effort - some of the last ditch defending was genuinely impressive - but the fact that we had to do so much of it is the real worry.
We are totally devoid of creativity or any attacking threat. When we try to go forward we merely give the ball away.

This has been the case all year - ever since Brady and Defour got injured. Our hopes this season rest wholly on getting them fit as soon as possible. Our failure to address the situation during the summer - when we were able to dangle the addition carrot of European football - is inexcusable and, I fear, will cost us dear.

scouseclaret · Post by **scouseclaret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:53 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:Do you think Ward is a better option than Taylor?

100%

Nonayforever · Post by **Nonayforever** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:54 pm

Excellent report CT considering the cloud we are under.

A very fair and accurate assessment.

The next game will be extremely interesting to say the least. The selection, the tactics, the application.

All will be under close scrutiny.

Dy1geo · Post by **Dy1geo** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:54 pm

The club has improved by “adding layers” as Dyche calls it, the team has gradually improved year on year but I don’t think the addition on Gibson and Hart combined with the release of Marney, Arfield and Nkoudou has led to an improvement. The Board went along with the we finished seventh so we will be ok this year mantra when in reality we overperformed. Last year we thought that whatever the ultimate result would be, we could give everyone a game and that confidence and expectation fed its way throughout the club from the fans to the players. Now it seems we are just trying to nick nil nils. In patches this season against Southampton, Watford and especially Olympiakos we have been on the front foot and looked good, we have to play like that on Saturday not the safety first approach and get the confidence boosting win.

occ-claret · Post by **occ-claret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:55 pm

Lowton and ward have to start

mdd2 · Post by **mdd2** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:57 pm

CT as you point out in your report our problems have been brewing throughout 2018 and the big big errors occurred in the transfer window when in reality we signed a good keeper we may not have needed given the points gained from those 5 games,and the fitness of Heaton, a defender who will not play unless we have injuries and we already have one good cover but we have lost two midfielders (Marney and Arfield) plus two out injured and replaced none of them, lost 2 attackers and got one in.
We look so pedestrian that without someone who can go past defenders we are unlikely to create anything. This is a real test now for Sean and his support staff; but please please please can we leave the doom on here and not when the lads are playing.

Devils_Advocate · Post by **Devils_Advocate** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:58 pm

scouseclaret wrote:100%

I'm more interested in what Hibsclaret thinks about Ward and Taylor as he tends to be a bit of a fence sitter when it comes to who should play left back for us this season

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:04 pm

You know we were bad when the report is focused on 'what if the fireworks went the wrong way!'

scouseclaret · Post by **scouseclaret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:06 pm

Anyone know why McNeil didn’t play?

He’s been one of the (maybe the only!) bright spots this season, but was apparently dropped at the first opportunity, while the consistently disappointing Lennon seems to play regardless.

Silkyskills1 · Post by **Silkyskills1** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:06 pm

For myself, it's the 'siege mentality' that has disappeared. Very much part of what the manager has developed in his time here. Nearly every game we've played in this division the opposition have always had better players, high profile names from all over the world but we've competed with them, run the extra yard and ground out results. Not at all pretty to watch at times but leaving supporters with that satisfaction that comes from not being rolled over easily much to the dismay of many in the media.
As a child going to the match I always seemed to hear the phrase 'get stuck in' and as I grew older I always felt there was a little bit more to the game than that. Maybe it's time to revert to my childhood come Saturday and start to 'get stuck in'.

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:07 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:I'm more interested in what Hibsclaret thinks about Ward and Taylor as he tends to be a bit of a fence sitter when it comes to who should play left back for us this season

I’m surprised you haven’t ventured into a career in comedy

jedi_master · Post by **jedi_master** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:25 pm

scouseclaret wrote:Anyone know why McNeil didn’t play?

He’s been one of the (maybe the only!) bright spots this season, but was apparently dropped at the first opportunity, while the consistently disappointing Lennon seems to play regardless.

This frustrated me as well, particularly odd that McNeil wasn't even on the bench when he was our best player against Olympiakos and absolutely fine against United given the type of game that was.

He offers far more than Lennon, and even than Gudmundsson on current form who is seriously struggling himself.

Papabendi · Post by **Papabendi** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:29 pm

The most worrying element is that it doesn't look like a Dyche team: we are yards slower to the ball and losing most 50/50 physical battles. Is something amiss internally?

One can only speculate, but perhaps there are some clues in what one or two of the players released said this close season. Plus the introduction of Hart who (performances taken out of the equation) after a handful of games is now the club's spokesperson.

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:37 pm

Very fair report, Tony.

Burt · Post by **Burt** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:48 pm

DCWat wrote:Very fair report, Tony.

Totally agree and can't for the life of me understand why Lowton & Ward are on the bench unless it is a fitness thing

ashtonlongsider · Post by **ashtonlongsider** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:49 pm

Papabendi wrote:Plus the introduction of Hart who (performances taken out of the equation) after a handful of games is now the club's spokesperson.

I've no problem with Hart. Think we need a few more leaders. Since Joey Barton we've been sadly lacking in that area.

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 2:21 pm

But were you not one of the people of here defending our summer transfer buisness ?

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 2:32 pm

Papabendi wrote:The most worrying element is that it doesn't look like a Dyche team: we are yards slower to the ball and losing most 50/50 physical battles. Is something amiss internally?

One can only speculate, but perhaps there are some clues in what one or two of the players released said this close season. Plus the introduction of Hart who (performances taken out of the equation) after a handful of games is now the club's spokesperson.

Who has been saying what regarding those released?

Be interesting to know.

ashtonlongsider · Post by **ashtonlongsider** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 3:29 pm

BOYSIE31 wrote:But were you not one of the people of here defending our summer transfer buisness ?

If your referring to my post Boysie31, yes I was defending our summer transfer business based on the players we were rumoured to be after. On the balance of 'Risk and Reward' I didn't feel the figures being quoted for Rodriguez and Dawson and the factored in wages were worth the gamble and wouldn't represent good business. That said I am concerned by our overall transfer strategy.

CleggHall · Post by **CleggHall** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 3:37 pm

"Dyche has spoken far too often about the (failures of) the last transfer window"- yes we've heard more than enough of this over the past 3 months, time to put another record on Sean.

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 4:51 pm

I would go as far as saying that this Wolves side yesterday was everything i wanted Burnley to be either this season or next -
pace - flair - movement - options

We have gone back 2 years

BOYSIE31 · Post by **BOYSIE31** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 4:53 pm

ashtonlongsider wrote:If your referring to my post Boysie31, yes I was defending our summer transfer business based on the players we were rumoured to be after. On the balance of 'Risk and Reward' I didn't feel the figures being quoted for Rodriguez and Dawson and the factored in wages were worth the gamble and wouldn't represent good business. That said I am concerned by our overall transfer strategy.

No was not referring to you at all and agree the figures for both of them were obscene and correct to walk away - but they are many other players available.

Stayingup · Post by **Stayingup** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:37 pm

ashtonlongsider wrote:I've no problem with Hart. Think we need a few more leaders. Since Joey Barton we've been sadly lacking in that area.

Oh how we've missed Joey. And Tripps and Ings and Marney and Arfield and Gray and .... those signings to replace them

BobSykes · Post by **BobSykes** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:38 pm

Why isn't Lowton playing? That baffles me.

And whilst Hart has done very little wrong, why isn't our club captain playing in goal now he's fit again? Whilst he's doing very well, he does seem to get targeted (Calamity Hart...) in a way Heaton wouldn't. If we are going to get back to basics, then surely Heaton/Ward/Mee/Tark/Lowton has to be a given as a starter?

Stayingup · Post by **Stayingup** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:38 pm

BOYSIE31 wrote:I would go as far as saying that this Wolves side yesterday was everything i wanted Burnley to be either this season or next -
pace - flair - movement - options

We have gone back 2 years

Further.

DCWat · Post by **DCWat** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:39 pm

Has Hart done anything to justify being dropped? It’s his place to lose now and that’s surely how it should be.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:40 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:You know we were bad when the report is focused on 'what if the fireworks went the wrong way!'

Oh no, that would have been included had we won 10-0 and played them off the park. I thought it was ridiculous and at Molineux, given what happened previously, dreadful.

ClaretTony · Post by **ClaretTony** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:42 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:Do you think Ward is a better option than Taylor?

Can't believe anyone has to ask that question

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:51 pm

BobSykes wrote:Why isn't Lowton playing? That baffles me.

And whilst Hart has done very little wrong, why isn't our club captain playing in goal now he's fit again? Whilst he's doing very well, he does seem to get targeted (Calamity Hart...) in a way Heaton wouldn't. If we are going to get back to basics, then surely Heaton/Ward/Mee/Tark/Lowton has to be a given as a starter?

I think the dilemma we have as a close knit group of players is when someone with over 70 caps for England comes into the club. I think we can all agree that Hart has been very good in his games. The issue for me is behind the scenes and the psychological effect on some players in the squad.

Take Heaton, great pro, been in England squads and barely kicked a ball in 12 months. He has been fit for some months now and played in Athens. The boss is showing effectively that he is the number 2 which could be 3 in a couple of months. He is also club captain.

What do the likes of Lowton, Ward, Mee, Tarky etc think of this. A couple of bad games for Lowton and he gets an inferior player replacing him etc.

It is one thing being a close knit group and a small fish in a big pond but when you become a slightly bigger fish the close family ties can become strained. Add in all the organisational difficulties of Europe, Thursday, Sunday games etc and our situation is somewhat understandable at the minute.

I think and hope that the great man can sort it. However, it is now our biggest challenge given we have bigger fish with bigger egos playing for our team than we had last year

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:52 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Can't believe anyone has to ask that question

Not to worry Tony. He is just taking the you know what out of my comments about it over the last few weeks.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:21 pm

I thought Taylor did ok last season when he filled in. Ward has been very poor so far this season so I can see why he was selected. I think he’ll be back out after yesterday’s horror show though.
I just can’t understand Bardsley in front of Lowton though.

jojomk1 · Post by **jojomk1** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:26 pm

claretblue wrote:'...The chairman always boasts when a window closes as to how we’ve come out of it stronger than we went in. Has he said anything this time?...'

he was quoted (during the summer) that we were likely to break our transfer record when making a purchase!

I'll stand corrected if need be, but I don't think the Chairman said we would likely break our transfer record on a single purchase - that was Dyche who was clearly referring to Jay Rod (and with that comment, signalling to the Chairman to get the deal done)

The Chairman did state we would break our previous transfer window spends - but that was not going to be difficult to attain

As for Dyche constantly on about wanting more players in, I only remember Clucas being strongly linked (ok we don't know everything that goes on behind closed doors). Gibson and Vydra are good enough options to Jay Rod and Dawson

For me, our transfer window failure (if that's what it is) lies as much with the manager as the Chairman in just having a blinkered approach to his stereotyped player (did we go for any strong, dominant CM's or pace out wide - saw no evidence of it)

Add to that, some ridiculous selections and team formation yesterday got us what we deserved - nothing (and the Chairman can't be blamed for that)

Finally, a big thumbs up to CT - even he hasn't tried to defend our clear shortcomings (and that must hurt

)

ClaretLoup · Post by **ClaretLoup** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:18 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote:I thought Taylor did ok last season when he filled in. Ward has been very poor so far this season so I can see why he was selected. I think he’ll be back out after yesterday’s horror show though.
I just can’t understand Bardsley in front of Lowton though.

I agree with your comments re Ward and Taylor but the same logic should have applied to Lowton as well. Let's not forget his only assist so far this season in PL has been to tee up Hughes and along with the rest of the back four at Fulham he was absolutely gash. It could have been half a dozen on Sunday but at Fulham it could have been double figures. So Taylor and Bardsley had to be given a chance.

On their day Ward and Lowton are better but this season they have rarely turned up, so Dyche has a real problem this season as none of them on current form are good enough. Plus he has the same problem with the other pairings.

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:46 pm

Fair report very worrying. Shocking bargain basement window. Why can't we just for once behave like a top half premier league team ?

burnleymik · Post by **burnleymik** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:08 pm

Fair assessment, but I think our midfield also need to carry quite a lot of the blame, they were completely absent in both supporting the defence and the attacking moves.

Not sure how Dyche pulls us out of this because there are very few players who look upto the job at this moment in time. This was Wolves for crying out loud.

EarbyClaret · Post by **EarbyClaret** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:46 pm

Hindsight is a wonderful thing but we were already one short in CM with a fit Defour.

Cork has been an excellent player for us but to expect him to play effectively every minute of every game, be the defensive shield and provide the attacking drive seems beyond reasonable - he desperately needs someone to share the workload. It's no coincidence that playing alongside Defour he forced his way into the England reckoning.

You'd hope that after Sunday Lowton and Ward will start v Bournemouth - get McNeil back in and around the first team and maybe a place on the bench for Defour and already the look and feel is a lot more positive.

jojomk1 · Post by **jojomk1** » Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:01 pm

burnleymik wrote:Fair assessment, but I think our midfield also need to carry quite a lot of the blame, they were completely absent in both supporting the defence and the attacking moves.

Not sure how Dyche pulls us out of this because there are very few players who look upto the job at this moment in time. This was Wolves for crying out loud.

The current midfield is very poor, but all of them were brought in by the current manager

As for Wolves - wake up to reality

They have a manager and board structure that are singing from the same hymn sheet and going for success by buying in pace and skills