VOTE for a second Brexit vote...

Damo · Post by **Damo** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:56 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:It gave two choices but the reality is that there weren't two possibilities. As has been said ad nauseam, but i'll repeat it for you, no one knew what Leave meant. No one. Not even the Leave campaigns had a clue. So how can you possibly know that if Leaving meant leaving with no deal that that referendum result would still have been a win for Leave? I think there are a lot of Leave voters who if they knew that Leaving the EU meant leaving without a deal then they wouldn't have voted to Leave in the first place, and we should find that out. Why shouldn't we? The leave campaigns all campaigned on the idea that there'd be some kind fo deal that mitigates the disaster of leaving.

I've asked this a bunch of times and i still await a worthwhile answer (just "but mah will of the peepul"), but why shouldn't we double check with the public that the Leave deal/no deal is really what we want right before we do it? This is supposed to be about honouring the will of the people so what possible harm can it do to check with us that it's really what we want right before we cut off our own nuts?

If the public still want to leave then we'll say so, and the next day we withdraw, job done. And if we don't want to leave then i'm sure you'll agree that it's a good job we double checked, right? Because "will of the people".

I'm convinced that the only reason Leave voters are opposed to the referendum is that they're really worried that what they want is no longer what the public wants, and so they're trying to get it done against the will of the public. I can't think of many things more undemocratic than that.

I was fully aware we might leave with no deal.
The remain campaign told us time and time again.
I'm quite sure you did too.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 9:59 pm

Damo wrote:I was fully aware we might leave with no deal.
The remain campaign told us time and time again.
I'm quite sure you did too.

But that was ‘Project Fear’ surely?!

Damo · Post by **Damo** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:04 pm

martin_p wrote:But that was ‘Project Fear’ surely?!

I can imagine it instilled quite a bit of fear on the remain side

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:06 pm

LeadBelly wrote:"Like" doesnt mean "exactly same as".

Don't change the goalposts.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:12 pm

Damo wrote:I can imagine it instilled quite a bit of fear on the remain side

If you mean did the very likely conclusion that we’d be significantly worse off after Brexit influence remainers vote, then yes it probably did.

But of course the Brexiteers knew there’d be a deal and what’s more it’d be a deal that would put us in a better position than being in the EU. After all, they need us more than we need them.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:14 pm

Looks like a longer transition period while everyone works out how to bin this mess and save face.

Pstotto · Post by **Pstotto** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:22 pm

It's more stirring of a collective unconscious from folks with a vested interest in screwing England further, no doubt most of the million are Irish etc.

It's not a thought-out vote, it's saying if you don't like the agreement then the alternative is to stay in the EU. It's trying to force the Brexit voters to walk the plank of the Remainer's remit.

If there were a vote it would be for a Brexit deal and leave or a Brexit no deal and leave.

THAT IS WHAT THAT CAMPAIGN SHOULD BE. Nothing else.

The fact that it's not shows up that it's not democracy that is their mandate but a simulacrum of democracy to fudge the Brexit democratic vote for shady purposes of self-interest that are not necessarily in the Interests of a better Britain.

Dark Cloud · Post by **Dark Cloud** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:31 pm

No. We don't need one. (Because we already had one!)

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:35 pm

Pstotto wrote:It's more stirring of a collective unconscious from folks with a vested interest in screwing England further, no doubt most of the million are Irish etc.

It's not a thought-out vote, it's saying if you don't like the agreement then the alternative is to stay in the EU. It's trying to force the Brexit voters to walk the plank of the Remainer's remit.

If there were a vote it would be for a Brexit deal and leave or a Brexit no deal and leave.

THAT IS WHAT THAT CAMPAIGN SHOULD BE. Nothing else.

The fact that it's not shows up that it's not democracy that is their mandate but a simulacrum of democracy to fudge the Brexit democratic vote for shady purposes of self-interest that are not necessarily in the Interests of a better Britain.

Dominic Raab agrees with you Pstotto https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45893881

In a letter to MPs, he suggests they will have to choose between whatever deal is on the table and no deal - and no other options will be offered.

Needless to say Labour are up in arms.

Meanwhile the transition period may be extended,quelle surprise.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45897253

Some people might think stalling tactics are being deployed.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:39 pm

tiger76 wrote:Dominic Raab agrees with you Pstotto https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45893881

In a letter to MPs, he suggests they will have to choose between whatever deal is on the table and no deal - and no other options will be offered.

Needless to say Labour are up in arms.

So essentially it’s a vote about whether to take a punch to the face or a kick in the balls. But democracy is always right!

Pstotto · Post by **Pstotto** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:14 pm

That's your lack of English MOJO, not everyone else's.

BennyD · Post by **BennyD** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:16 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote:Looks like a longer transition period while everyone works out how to bin this mess and save face.

It’s not going to be binned, however much you, the remainers and the EU want it to be. Get used to it, we’re going in March.

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:34 pm

The people have voted. Dress it up all you want. Democracy rules. We voted out, and whether you believe in it or not, every man, woman and child should now get behind it and support the govt in getting the best deal we can. To do otherwise is just stupidity.

We are out. The rest of he EU (Germany and France for sure) want to make it as difficult as they can for us, because they want us in.
Why?
Is it because they are really concerned that being out isnt good for us? Are they really that concerned about us? Or is it because they think us being out means the vast sums of money we pump into the ‘club’ will have to be made up by them? They are making it difficult for a very good reason. Concern for OUR future and our welfare isn’t that reason. If we take out more than we put in, they’d be delighted we are off.

When we make a go of it, and we absolutely can make a go of it, watch the rest bin it off.

Audi (VAG), Mercedes, BMW, Siemens Renault, Citroen et al have kept a dignified silence so far. They are hoping we crumble and opt for a **** deal. They want to sell to us, and their respective govts making threats about what we can sell and what we can’t, and what tariffs will be applied etc worries them because they KNOW we will reciprocate. They don’t want that, we are a big part of their market.

Rumours of flights being turned back and drivers needing x amount of licences and courses and paperwork is just scaremongering. If we need all that, then the hundreds of thousands of EU nationals who want to work here and drive here and travel/holiday here will have to do the same, but no one tells you this. If we need visas for two weeks in torremolinos, then so do they for a wet weekend in Blackpool or a weeks surfing in Cornwall.

It’s all bad news for us and great for them, so let’s stay in the club eh? ********. I’m out. And I’m not being scared into thinking otherwise.

We voted. We are out. If you didn’t understand what “in” or “out” meant, tough ****. You should’ve worked harder at school.

kritichris · Post by **kritichris** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:38 pm

I've lived on Crete for several years and then in France since 2007 but due to the Brexit vote reducing my income by a third (pound doing crap) and the uncertainty of my rights to live in europe I'm moving back to the UK where I will now as an aged person be another drain on the NHS and will make a point of going into banks and the post office at lunchtime to **** the workers off as the majority voted for me to come back.

Bin Ont Turf · Post by **Bin Ont Turf** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:46 pm

kritichris wrote:I've lived on Crete for several years and then in France since 2007 but due to the Brexit vote reducing my income by a third (pound doing crap) and the uncertainty of my rights to live in europe I'm moving back to the UK where I will now as an aged person be another drain on the NHS and will make a point of going into banks and the post office at lunchtime to **** the workers off as the majority voted for me to come back.

Did they not send a ballot paper to France for you?

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:53 pm

bobinho wrote:The people have voted. Dress it up all you want. Democracy rules. We voted out, and whether you believe in it or not, every man, woman and child should now get behind it and support the govt in getting the best deal we can. To do otherwise is just stupidity.

You want to tell that to your Brexit mates in the Tory party! The biggest threat to us getting any sort of deal are the ‘hard Brexiteers’ sitting on the Tory back benches.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Wed Oct 17, 2018 11:54 pm

No.

And for a simple reason. Leading Remainers were queuing up in the immediate aftermath of the vote (by 'The People' as I recall - I certainly don't remember cars or toasters voting) to underline how they accepted the will of the people and would enact it. It was my surmise at the time, now pretty much confirmed, that this was because they thought they could derail it or water it down to the point where it was effectively not a departure from the EU. If a second referendum was held, I don't trust our politicians not to come back again. Countries have form for this in EU matters.

Some of the points raised are valid. With a 52:48 it's impossible to be sure that Leave would win again but we'd only have the same lack of clarity going in to the vote as last time as to what Leave meant and what future EU we'd stay in (and yes I know the vetoes but I think the wounded animal we'd be would find ourselves backed into a corner on the future direction and even if we got exemptions the changing EU while we're still in it would constrain us).

So, no. Decision made. On we go.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:23 am

SmudgetheClaret wrote:The only vote that's needed at present is the one to get rid of the absolutely useless TM...

And which demagogue would you like to replace her?

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:24 am

Damo wrote:I was fully aware we might leave with no deal.
The remain campaign told us time and time again.
I'm quite sure you did too.

The Leave campaign said it would be absolutely ridiculous to suggest we'd leave with no deal. And it was them you listened to when you cast your ballot.

jackmiggins · Post by **jackmiggins** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:42 am

I’m now pretty sure that remoaners consist of lily livered self wetters, who believe all that they are told & have no faith in their own abilities.
This European ‘Union’ benefits one nation. Remember Greece? - one winner- German banks (& the Union nations just watched on!!). I don’t want to be governed in Berlin & Frankfurt & I have faith that Brexit will bring this country out of its malaise, building up our own manufacturing capabilities, instead of freewheeling to oblivion.

box_of_frogs · Post by **box_of_frogs** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 7:12 am

gawthorpe_view wrote:Best of three?

Ok! But I reserve the right to make it best of 5.

ClaretMoffitt · Post by **ClaretMoffitt** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:35 am

So what you are telling us OP, that 2 years down the line from when the last petition was done by these angry and hysterical remainers, they have dropped about 3 million? Because i'm pretty sure the last petition they had like this got about 4 million votes, right?

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:05 am

ClaretMoffitt wrote:So what you are telling us OP, that 2 years down the line from when the last petition was done by these angry and hysterical remainers, they have dropped about 3 million? Because i'm pretty sure the last petition they had like this got about 4 million votes, right?

"angry and hysterical"

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:24 am

jackmiggins wrote:who believe all that they are told

And it didn’t even need to be on the side of a bus!

ClaretMoffitt · Post by **ClaretMoffitt** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:33 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:"angry and hysterical"

Seriously though, do you honestly think after a drop in 3 million signatures that this is now undeniable proof that the nation has indeed changed its mind and is now desperate to remain in the EU? Do you really think you are going to win this? I remember how angry the left were during the referendum about how "divisive" it was; are you willing to go through all that again on this slim hope of staying in?

burnleymik · Post by **burnleymik** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:43 am

The main arguments for the second vote are totally flawed.

1. Informed - We cannot really be informed until we have tried Brexit and know how it actually pans out. Claiming this would be an informed referendum is clearly not true. It would simply be based on predictions and guess work, same as the first time around.

2. If you don't want a second vote then you don't believe in democracy. - If that is true then why wouldn't you want a 3rd or 4th vote etc? Why would this vote suddenly become the only one that really counts? How can it be democratic to NOT implement a choice made by the public, via a referendum where the government promised it was "once in a generation" and "the government will implement what you decide".

3. "people's vote" - What was the first vote if it was not the vote of the people? Over 31 million people exercised their democratic choice. I would say that is an incredibly substantial vote of the people.

4. Foreign interference. The Organisation behind this "peoples vote" movement, Best For Britain, is directly funded by George Soros. The remain camp have had a real bee in their bonnet about so-called Russian interference in the brexit vote and have had numerous investigations into this outside interference, yet have no problem with the outside interference of Soros.

Protest and march by all means, but there should clearly not be a second referendum on an issue that has already been decided.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:46 am

ClaretMoffitt wrote:Seriously though, do you honestly think after a drop in 3 million signatures that this is now undeniable proof that the nation has indeed changed its mind and is now desperate to remain in the EU? Do you really think you are going to win this? I remember how angry the left were during the referendum about how "divisive" it was; are you willing to go through all that again on this slim hope of staying in?

Then you've nothing to worry about with a second referendum. In fact if you are sincere about only wanting the will of the people to be enacted then you should welcome the chance to make sure that what the government is about to do really is the will of the people.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:51 am

Devils_Advocate wrote:Totally agree we should just scrap Brexit all together but as that is unlikely with this gutless treacherous government ive signed this petition 12 times with different aliases

So you've lied then? Just like the continued lies of the remainers.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:53 am

burnleymik wrote:The main arguments for the second vote are totally flawed.

1. Informed - We cannot really be informed until we have tried Brexit and know how it actually pans out.

There clearly should have been a trial period, say five years.

That would be the same length of time as a general election, thus if you don't like what's happening you can vote to change things.

As it stands we are going to be in the same situation for years, if not decades, for good or bad.

ClaretMoffitt · Post by **ClaretMoffitt** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:57 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:Then you've nothing to worry about with a second referendum. In fact if you are sincere about only wanting the will of the people to be enacted then you should welcome the chance to make sure that what the government is about to do really is the will of the people.

I always have and still am happy top have one.

You really think that people in this country will let the politicians and elite squirm their way out of this, it will be a lot bigger this time than it was before.

It will be painted by the leavers as a big guy against the little guy argument, they will say the elite are trying to overturn you and the very fabric of democracy itself rests on you sticking to your guns.

And you know what, they will not be able to lose on that manta.

What do the remain side have to threaten with that is worse than what they tried last time?

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 9:57 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:Why not? Leave voters keep telling us how good referendums are. Or they were when they wanted one, but now that we want one suddenly they're undemocratic and treasonous, or something.

Ah, so what you want is democracy ad infinitum. Let's keep voting until the losers eventually win, but then the new losers will want another vote until they win etc etc etc.

Don't talk utter balls.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:00 am

burnleymik wrote:The main arguments for the second vote are totally flawed.

1. Informed - We cannot really be informed until we have tried Brexit and know how it actually pans out. Claiming this would be an informed referendum is clearly not true. It would simply be based on predictions and guess work, same as the first time around.

2. If you don't want a second vote then you don't believe in democracy. - If that is true then why wouldn't you want a 3rd or 4th vote etc? Why would this vote suddenly become the only one that really counts? How can it be democratic to NOT implement a choice made by the public, via a referendum where the government promised it was "once in a generation" and "the government will implement what you decide".

3. "people's vote" - What was the first vote if it was not the vote of the people? 31 million people exercised their democratic choice. I would say that is an incredibly substantial vote of the people.

4. Foreign interference. The Organisation behind this "peoples vote" movement, Best For Britain, is directly funded by George Soros. The remain camp have had a real bee in their bonnet about so-called Russian interference in the brexit vote and have had numerous investigations into this outside interference, yet have no problem with the outside interference of Soros.

Protest and march by all means, but there should clearly not be a second referendum on an issue that has already been decided.

1. it would be a decision on as informed as we could possibly be before we take a decision that can't be reversed And you know how difficult it would be to reverse which is why you're desperate for it to go through without checking to make sure it's what the public want.

2. This is now and always has been a retarded argument. First of all I've got no problem with the government checking with the public every 5 or 10 years regarding our EU membership. Secondly, any second referendum would be immediately prior to the deal being struck so there simply wouldn't be enough time for more referendums and again, you know this. You're just spreading false fears. Some would say you were going all Project Fear on us. And thirdly, there's nothing stopping the second referendum being legally binding. So that's two ways that you can be put at ease that constant referendums aren't going to happen. But that won't stop the false fear being spread.

3. So what? If the decision was so certain then a second referendum will only affirm that decision right before we enact it. But if the public have changed their mind then it's important to find that out too. But I'm pretty sure it's not about enacting the will of the people. If it was then you'd be welcoming the opportunity to more accurately measure what the will of the people actually is as close as possible to "Brexit Day". No, Brexiteers are only interested in enacting the will of the people if the will is in their favour. If the will of the people has changed then as far as they're concerned everything possible must be done to make sure that isn't measured.

4. **** off.

The Leave campaigns were riddled with foreign interference and you don't care because the interference was pro-Leave.

Devils_Advocate · Post by **Devils_Advocate** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:04 am

houseboy wrote:So you've lied then? Just like the continued lies of the remainers.

Ok you've caught me out I did lie. I got bored after creating my 4th alias and so only signed the petition 5 times and not 12. Are you a detective cos if youre not you really should be?

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:17 am

houseboy wrote:Ah, so what you want is democracy ad infinitum.

I sincerely hope that you do as well. Undemocratic totalitarian states tend not to turn out well.

burnleymik · Post by **burnleymik** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:38 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:1. it would be a decision on as informed as we could possibly be before we take a decision that can't be reversed And you know how difficult it would be to reverse which is why you're desperate for it to go through without checking to make sure it's what the public want.

So it's not informed then, you agree. So it's pointless having another uninformed referendum.

2. This is now and always has been a retarded argument. First of all I've got no problem with the government checking with the public every 5 or 10 years regarding our EU membership. Secondly, any second referendum would be immediately prior to the deal being struck so there simply wouldn't be enough time for more referendums and again, you know this. You're just spreading false fears. Some would say you were going all Project Fear on us. And thirdly, there's nothing stopping the second referendum being legally binding. So that's two ways that you can be put at ease that constant referendums aren't going to happen. But that won't stop the false fear being spread.

Nonesense. Utter garbage. If the first vote doesn't count because things have changed, then as soon as the second vote is held and things change agin surely it has to already become redundant and a thrid vote needed. All this second vote does is undermine the first one. It is utterly frivolous.

3. So what? If the decision was so certain then a second referendum will only affirm that decision right before we enact it. But if the public have changed their mind then it's important to find that out too. But I'm pretty sure it's not about enacting the will of the people. If it was then you'd be welcoming the opportunity to more accurately measure what the will of the people actually is as close as possible to "Brexit Day". No, Brexiteers are only interested in enacting the will of the people if the will is in their favour. If the will of the people has changed then as far as they're concerned everything possible must be done to make sure that isn't measured.

The decision has already been made, it doesn't need making again.

4. **** off. The Leave campaigns were riddled with foreign interference and you don't care because the interference was pro-Leave.

So you say and all remain did was complain and call Leavers Russian shills, but now it's okay because the outside interference supports your side? The difference is there was no conclusive proof of outside interference for leave, but there clearly is with this second vote, yet remainers have no problem with this now. Double standards once again. Do you really believe Soros is in this because he cares about the working class Brits? Not a chance.

HatfieldClaret · Post by **HatfieldClaret** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:25 am

I just want out. That's all.

No different to a bad marriage; when I walked out 30 years ago with no or little planning it was pretty crap to begin with but now I've never been happier. The ex still thinks that I'm Satan though.....

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:29 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:Ok you've caught me out I did lie. I got bored after creating my 4th alias and so only signed the petition 5 times and not 12. Are you a detective cos if youre not you really should be?

Luvya man - you rascal you.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:44 pm

nil_desperandum wrote:I sincerely hope that you do as well. Undemocratic totalitarian states tend not to turn out well.

I think you missed the point bud. When I said democracy ad infinitum i was referring if you like to the infinite regression of countless votes on the same subject till we get it 'right'. Right, that is, in the eyes of the 'losers'. If we did this at elections we'd never have a government. The whole basis of the second vote (I won't call it the people's vote because we've had that one) is that the remainers claim that we were 'lied to', which is quite a claim when you consider if we'd voted to remain it would have been on the basis of the outrageous 'project fear' of the remain campaign, you know, the one where it was claimed amongst other stupidity (I still laugh at this one) we were in danger of a war if we left. Apparently it was going to rain frogs, the rivers would turn to blood and the first born would all die.
I am a passionate believer in democracy and have been all my adult life, but I am also aware that you cannot keep voting on the same subject until enough people say 'okay, we seem to have got it right now, we'll stick with that one'.

Guich · Post by **Guich** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:49 pm

kritichris wrote:I've lived on Crete for several years and then in France since 2007 but due to the Brexit vote reducing my income by a third (pound doing crap) and the uncertainty of my rights to live in europe I'm moving back to the UK where I will now as an aged person be another drain on the NHS and will make a point of going into banks and the post office at lunchtime to **** the workers off as the majority voted for me to come back.

The biggest reason for ex-pats of a certain age returning to the UK has always been to use the NHS, to be fair.

But if you're genuinely worried about being able to stay put, I'd stop worrying and enjoy the sun.

And I'd get a new accountant

Claret-On-A-T-Rex · Post by **Claret-On-A-T-Rex** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:15 pm

By the time the transition period ends we'll have a new government, the clamour for a second referendum will be too loud to ignore and we'll vote to stay.
It's like I've ALWAYS said, the intelligent will fix the mistakes of the stupid, just like they have throughout history.

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:17 pm

Claret-On-A-T-Rex wrote:By the time the transition period ends we'll have a new government, the clamour for a second referendum will be too loud to ignore and we'll vote to stay.
It's like I've ALWAYS said, the intelligent will fix the mistakes of the stupid, just like they have throughout history.

I'll have a wee dram of that.

BennyD · Post by **BennyD** » Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:54 pm

Claret-On-A-T-Rex wrote:By the time the transition period ends we'll have a new government, the clamour for a second referendum will be too loud to ignore and we'll vote to stay.
It's like I've ALWAYS said, the intelligent will fix the mistakes of the stupid, just like they have throughout history.

Still a bit sore are we? However, I agree with you. That’s why we voted to leave; to fix the mistake of getting sucked into the USE vortex.

Wile E Coyote · Post by **Wile E Coyote** » Fri Oct 19, 2018 12:15 am

portillo just put alastair campbell in his place by telling him when the people vote against the elite, they are required to vote again.
Campbell was useless by comparison.

mdd2 · Post by **mdd2** » Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:11 am

Our Alistair certainly got his come uppance against both Portillo and Caroline Flint and his blustering, interruptions and finger pointing made him look ridiculous.
Andrew Neil asked him why should the Government take notice of 100,00 marching for a peoples referendum when we still invaded Iraq despite millions marching against the war under him and Blair?

Pstotto · Post by **Pstotto** » Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:12 am

LoveCurryPies has got some answering to do.

mdd2 · Post by **mdd2** » Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:15 am

Guich wrote:The biggest reason for ex-pats of a certain age returning to the UK has always been to use the NHS, to be fair.

But if you're genuinely worried about being able to stay put, I'd stop worrying and enjoy the sun.

And I'd get a new accountant

Within the EEC I think health care is free for all up to a point with UK paying for its Nationals in Europe and vice versa -or it maybe that it is just us who lets the European Citizens have free care here.
Any UK citizen living abroad (I think for 2 or more years) should lose entitlement to free NHS care (I think)

PaintYorkClaretnBlue · Post by **PaintYorkClaretnBlue** » Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:00 am

Would remainers prefer to stay even if we lose our rebate as has been suggested?

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:18 am

PaintYorkClaretnBlue wrote:Would remainers prefer to stay even if we lose our rebate as has been suggested?

I don't give a **** about the rebate.

PaintYorkClaretnBlue · Post by **PaintYorkClaretnBlue** » Fri Oct 19, 2018 6:40 am

Haha, so you’re willing to give the eu even more of our money just to be part of the ‘club’?

Roosterbooster · Post by **Roosterbooster** » Fri Oct 19, 2018 8:24 am

Goobs wrote:With our current system your vote is rendered pointless in certain areas anyway

Unless a vote share wins by less than 2 votes, you could argue your vote was pointless in any voting system. Not just ours...