Matic will not wear poppy

CleggHall · Post by **CleggHall** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:04 pm

Man Utd's Matic will not wear a poppy either, the Serbian midfielder says it reminds him of his village being bombed ( by British planes?) during the Kosovo conflict. Matic was only 12 at the time, I have some sympathy.

basil6345789 · Post by **basil6345789** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:10 pm

But he'll earn a fortune in our country and evade tax. Pillock! We we there to save people being masacred.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:31 pm

I couldn't care less it's his business

conyoviejo · Post by **conyoviejo** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:37 pm

He's wore one before ,but on reflection he's decided not to wear one now..

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:41 pm

basil6345789 wrote:But he'll earn a fortune in our country and evade tax. Pillock! We we there to save people being masacred.

That worked out well.

mdd2 · Post by **mdd2** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:27 pm

basil6345789 wrote:But he'll earn a fortune in our country and evade tax. Pillock! We we there to save people being masacred.

Except we were a bit late getting there.
Although if one is looking at WW1 his native Serbia was I think against the Austro-Hungarian Empire and lost a large slice of its male population in the War.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:29 pm

There's a very strong anti-UK, anti-US, anti-NATO, anti-EU sentiment in Serbia. I'm not surprised.

Lord Rothbury · Post by **Lord Rothbury** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:29 pm

mdd2 wrote:Except we were a bit late getting there.

Better late than never.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:38 pm

Lord Rothbury wrote:Better late than never.

Not in the opinion of the Serbs.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:42 pm

He’s just another Ian Huntley.

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 6:48 pm

We're not the good guys in war all the time.

Cirrus_Minor · Post by **Cirrus_Minor** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:23 pm

Arch Duke Ferdinand was also Serbian, look at what he caused. ☺

evensteadiereddie · Post by **evensteadiereddie** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:35 pm

Just because you live and work here doesn't mean you have to auto matic ally wear a poppy..

AndrewJB · Post by **AndrewJB** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:37 pm

Cirrus_Minor wrote:Arch Duke Ferdinand was also Serbian, look at what he caused. ☺

Ferdinand was Austrian.

evensteadiereddie · Post by **evensteadiereddie** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:39 pm

He played for England, though...

ŽižkovClaret · Post by **ŽižkovClaret** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:41 pm

thatdberight wrote:There's a very strong anti-UK, anti-US, anti-NATO, anti-EU sentiment in Serbia. I'm not surprised.

Lot of kids called Tony Blair / Tonibler in Kosovo, though....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tonibler

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:47 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:Lot of kids called Tony Blair / Tonibler in Kosovo, though....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tonibler

If it wasn't for Iraq, Blair would be remembered fondly in this country as a great Prime Minister largely for his work during the Kosovo conflict. He ****** his legacy completely.

Cirrus_Minor · Post by **Cirrus_Minor** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:48 pm

AndrewJB wrote:Ferdinand was Austrian.

Your right, I'm thinking of the chap that shot him.

ŽižkovClaret · Post by **ŽižkovClaret** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:55 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:If it wasn't for Iraq, Blair would be remembered fondly in this country as a great Prime Minister largely for his work during the Kosovo conflict. He ****** his legacy completely.

Tuition fees were a bit of a hump in the road too.... but aye

ŽižkovClaret · Post by **ŽižkovClaret** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:56 pm

Cirrus_Minor wrote:Your right, I'm thinking of the chap that shot him.

At Terezin, most famous for being a concentration camp in WW2, there is a plaque for the assassin of Archduke Franz Ferdinand commemorating the "Great Serbian fighting Spirit"..... That tells you all you need to know about Serbs

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:57 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:Tuition fees were a bit of a hump in the road too.... but aye

True, but that's not career defining in the way that Kosovo would have been, and that Iraq was.

ClaretMoffitt · Post by **ClaretMoffitt** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 8:07 pm

I personally like it when our traditions and deepest felt cultural sensitivities are mocked and smeared.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 8:07 pm

ClaretMoffitt wrote:I personally like it when our traditions and deepest felt cultural sensitivities are sh!t on.

Snowflake.

ClaretMoffitt · Post by **ClaretMoffitt** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 8:10 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:Snowflake.

why? I enjoy it.

You forget, I want a chaotic world.

Billy Balfour · Post by **Billy Balfour** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 8:14 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:I couldn't care less it's his business

I wholeheartedly agree.

I always buy and wear a poppy, but I wouldn't dream of having a go at anyone who doesn't. After all, they died so that we and future generations can be free - and free choice is part of this.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 9:26 pm

If people HAVE to wear a poppy then surely that devalues the whole thing anyway?

There are still major parts of serbia that havent been repaired from the bombings which killed and injured way too many people back in the 90s. Ultimately we were in cahoots with americans who ordered them. Whether America, Britain or Milosevic is to blame for that depends on your view interpretation. That said all Serbs I have met have loved Brits although admittedly they dont seem to like Americans.

On the other hand, kosovo who they still dont get on with (understatement) and still occupies the land serbs to be their own (like a european palestine) love americans and british believe it or not.

To be honest at the end of the day the poppy should be optional. And as a political thing shouldnt even be on football shirts imo. Coming from someone who is very proud of the british army. Many friends and plenty of family have all served.

Some pictures below from my last visit to serbia and kosovo. 20 years after the troubles. Easy to guess which is which and easy to guess why on reflection matic wouldnt want to wear one.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 9:27 pm

Also an excellent (probably the wrong word) documentary about the whole thing is called the death of yugoslavia. Very interesting and eye opening. Also a bit brutal though.

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 9:36 pm

Serbia started the 'cleansing' Matic should be reminded of that fact.

I really don't care if he wears a poppy.

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:05 pm

Another disrespectful tw@t!

evensteadiereddie · Post by **evensteadiereddie** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:09 pm

Steve1956 wrote:Another disrespectful tw@t!

Who and why ?

BennyD · Post by **BennyD** » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:50 pm

Cirrus_Minor wrote:Your right, I'm thinking of the chap that shot him.

That’d be Gavrilo Princip.

AfloatinClaret · Post by **AfloatinClaret** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:43 am

Yugoslavia - unlike Paraguay - actually wasn't a 'real' country, just a hodge-podge of adjacent states/territories/regions that'd been fighting each other along ethnic & religious lines for better than a thousand years, cobbled together by the Allies at the end of WW1; the area only ever achieved any sort of stability during the period when Marshal Tito, backed by the Soviet Union was running things - now he was a hard man! The population were still butchering each other of course, but Tito ensured that they were doing it a little more discretely. Once Tito died and the Soviet Union collapsed, all that historic enmity resurfaced and with a few individuals fanning the flames because there was some profit to me made in so doing, it quickly went to rat-**** once again.

Of course this is purely a personal opinion: there's also a school of thought that no doubt reckons it was all Joe Hart's fault and that Arkan's Tigers were in actuality a group of primary school kids from Shrewsbury.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 4:37 am

Lol. "Yugoslavia". Aye, alright. As if i'd believe that one.

deanothedino · Post by **deanothedino** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 5:56 am

Steve1956 wrote:Another disrespectful tw@t!

You’re right, the people trying to take away Matic’s right to freedom of choice are being disrespectful to the millions of British’s servicemen and women who have died to keep us free.

Garnerssoap · Post by **Garnerssoap** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:01 am

No one actually knows why World War One started

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:05 am

deanothedino wrote:You’re right, the people trying to take away Matic’s right to freedom of choice are being disrespectful to the millions of British’s servicemen and women who have died to keep us free.

I think "millions" might be over doing it, but i get your point.

deanothedino · Post by **deanothedino** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:55 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:I think "millions" might be over doing it, but i get your point.

Okay pedant, greater than 1, less than 2, million dead servicemen and women.

Tribesmen · Post by **Tribesmen** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:11 am

Can't blame the lad not to wear .

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:41 am

Tribesmen wrote:Can't blame the lad not to wear .

Exactly. More respect for a man of principle who sticks by it.

claret wizard · Post by **claret wizard** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:35 am

cricketfieldclarets wrote:Exactly. More respect for a man of principle who sticks by it.

Hmmm I'm not sure if you're being deliberately ironic here CFC. I'm ex services and completely respect anyone's decision to not wear a poppy, especially if they have a good reason. This attempt by Matic looks a bit half pathetic though. Poppies reminds him of bombing? How, we were firing Tomahawks at Serbia not an occasional garden weed. The American's don't use the Poppy symbol, it's predominately a Commonwealth symbol, so it must be the UK he's ****** off with. His "principles" run so deep he'll quite happily move to the country that bombed him, take the cash and then slag us off in this mealy mouthed way.

Again, with all of this "Poppy Objectors" they fail to understand that the Poppies are there as an act of Remembrance, of all sides in a conflict. I regularly laid wreaths with the local German Officials at War Memorials in Germany. By coming out with statements like this one it only serves to politicise the poppy, create division and generally cause deterioration between former conflicting parties. He needs to wear his poppy, and remember the people who died in conflict, not set off trying to cause issues where none should exist.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:55 am

claret wizard wrote:Hmmm I'm not sure if you're being deliberately ironic here CFC. I'm ex services and completely respect anyone's decision to not wear a poppy, especially if they have a good reason. This attempt by Matic looks a bit half pathetic though. Poppies reminds him of bombing? How, we were firing Tomahawks at Serbia not an occasional garden weed. The American's don't use the Poppy symbol, it's predominately a Commonwealth symbol, so it must be the UK he's ****** off with. His "principles" run so deep he'll quite happily move to the country that bombed him, take the cash and then slag us off in this mealy mouthed way.

Again, with all of this "Poppy Objectors" they fail to understand that the Poppies are there as an act of Remembrance, of all sides in a conflict. I regularly laid wreaths with the local German Officials at War Memorials in Germany. By coming out with statements like this one it only serves to politicise the poppy, create division and generally cause deterioration between former conflicting parties. He needs to wear his poppy, and remember the people who died in conflict, not set off trying to cause issues where none should exist.

No. and i understand exactly where youre coming from. But personally I would rather someone wear and respect it who wants to, than wear it because they are told they have to and couldnt give two shits.

I understand quite a lot about all of the balkans wars. But its easy to see why Matic would think we and america are one and the same.

As for him living and working here. Thats completely different to supporting our or any military. There are plenty of people in this country who are against war.

If the poppy was just about the ww's and or if there was no war since then, im sure Matic, McClean and plenty of others would have no problem.

2 things are for sure. With immigration, especially from people from places like the middle east its going to be moee common. The other is that football and politics (and religion) shouldnt mix. Or at least not be forced to the extent that this is.

There are currently several english players playing in germany. Should they be forced to support and remember dead nazi soldiers?

claret wizard · Post by **claret wizard** » Tue Nov 06, 2018 12:13 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:
There are currently several english players playing in germany. Should they be forced to support and remember dead nazi soldiers?

No they shouldn't, but I'd expect they would say I don't want to remember your War Dead because they were "Insert reasons here, holocaust, Nazi, war crimes etc etc". However, as I mentioned joint Remembrance services will take place all over Germany and during my time serving there the fact that probably half the names on the memorials were Nazi's wasn't made an issue of. Remembrance is about the useless loss of life that takes place in wars, it's a time to forget the causes that were behind it all. Seems Poppy Objectors can't seem to understand that the Remembrance act doesn't have "sides".

Falcon · Post by **Falcon** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 9:03 am

claret wizard wrote:No they shouldn't, but I'd expect they would say I don't want to remember your War Dead because they were "Insert reasons here, holocaust, Nazi, war crimes etc etc". However, as I mentioned joint Remembrance services will take place all over Germany and during my time serving there the fact that probably half the names on the memorials were Nazi's wasn't made an issue of. Remembrance is about the useless loss of life that takes place in wars, it's a time to forget the causes that were behind it all. Seems Poppy Objectors can't seem to understand that the Remembrance act doesn't have "sides".

As a 'poppy objector' I do understand that the act doesn't have sides. However, it isn't us that are politicising it. It's us that have been turned off by the politicisation of it by the 'poppy fascists'. I get your point but I won't be wearing one. I've still made a donation.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 9:36 am

Cirrus_Minor wrote:Your right, I'm thinking of the chap that shot him.

Now HE was the one to blame.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 9:39 am

Steve1956 wrote:Another disrespectful tw@t!

Why, are you a remembrance bully? I haven't worn one in years.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:04 am

Garnerssoap wrote:No one actually knows why World War One started

Do you know I was thinking exactly the same thing yesterday. I know the catalyst was the shooting of Archduke Ferdinand but other than that what was it all about? Other than being one of the finest examples of a human cull the world has ever seen why the hell were they even fighting.

And while we are on the subject why were none of our leaders ever broght to justice for war crimes? Our lads were conscripted or shamed into taking part, told to go 'over the top' to walk into enemy machine gun fire and shot by their own side if they didn't. In fact it is hard to even say they were heroes because they actually didn't have any choice, they were bloody slaughtered. Add to that the disgusting conditions they lived in in the trenches, the poor food, the poor training and the poor equipment. These men were put to the proverbial sword and for what? Young lives utterly wasted because a few politicians somewhere decided they disagreed with another bunch of politicains. This is how war works, a tiny bunch of people decide that we are at war then tell its people they have to go and kill or be killed and then they demand respect.
The one thing that makes me think is are they actually culls? A stupid idea I know but think about it. If millions of people hadn't died in the two world wars and they had all lived to produce children whose children would have produced more children etc. we may now be living in a major crisis of over-population, even worse, far worse than we have now. The estimates (because that's all it can ever be) are that around 100 million people died in the two wars, now if most of them had lived to produce even just one child (or one more if they already had kids) and those kids had all had the proverbial 2.4 children and there kids in turn likewise it doesn't take much to imagine another half billion more people alive today than there are now, at least. Now that is a scary and sobering thought. Makes you wonder if there is more to war than meets the eye.

Please note this is not some strange conspiracy theory but just a kind of mind excercise I torture myself with occasionally.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:36 am

Can't believe these bleeding immigrants are disrespecting us. After all, the flag waving, poppy loving, populace of this country has done nothing but be very welcoming to anyone and everyone from Europe over the last few years.

Maybe if these immigrants had been made to feel unwelcome and unloved you could understand why they'd be less than keen to engage with 'great British traditions'........

Oh hang on......

Sproggy · Post by **Sproggy** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:41 am

>Maybe if these immigrants had been made to feel unwelcome and unloved

I'm sure his million quid a month salary goes some way to offset his feelings of rejection?

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 10:51 am

Sproggy wrote:>Maybe if these immigrants had been made to feel unwelcome and unloved

I'm sure his million quid a month salary goes some way to offset his feelings of rejection?

It'll certainly be the reason he puts up with it. But as others have said, he's worn a poopy in the past, so something has obviously changed his feelings.

duncandisorderly · Post by **duncandisorderly** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:04 am

martin_p wrote:It'll certainly be the reason he puts up with it. But as others have said, he's worn a poopy in the past, so something has obviously changed his feelings.

*childish giggling*