Central Midfield

[jojomk1]

Whilst watching on tv, Sky came up with a fact that we have not won a game in 2018 when Defour and Cork have started together
Both very good last night at picking the ball up from the back four and making passes sideways, backwards or slightly forward a few yards (nothing penetrating) - no pressing, pace, strength in tackles or winning any balls in the air.
However, could Westwood or Hendrick offer anything much different - unfortunately I don't see much hope but would prefer to see changes for Sat

[SalisburyClaret]

Interesting stat - I think Defour is too light to play in a 2 so we need to add a Westwood/Hendrick/McNeil to the middle

[MarkGreen]

How many games have they started together in 2018? Can only be single digits cant it?

[Tall Paul]

Given that Defour has spent most of 2018 injured that's not exactly surprising.

[quoonbeatz]

needs to be a 3 of defour, cork and hendrick - that's our strongest midfield and means we get the best out of all 3.

[randomclaret2]

None of them currently have the strength or athleticism to compete in the Premier League.We are extremely weak in that department . Any 2 or 3 from the 4 ...it makes little difference at the moment.

[Top Claret]

Neither Cork or Defour have the strength or legs to play in a 2. Hendrick needs bringing in to form a 3.
Defour should have been pulled on 60 minutes last night he was shot at. He does not have the stamina, strength or pace anymore to play effectively at this level

[Stayingup]

Playing two big men up front the midfield need to deliver the ball into them quickly. And of course crosses might help!!! Just not happening. Must be disheartening though when the defence is conceding soft goals for fun.

[Mala591]

Whilst watching on tv, Sky came up with a fact that we have not won a game in 2018 when Defour and Cork have started together
Both very good last night at picking the ball up from the back four and making passes sideways, backwards or slightly forward a few yards (nothing penetrating) - no pressing, pace, strength in tackles or winning any balls in the air.
However, could Westwood or Hendrick offer anything much different - unfortunately I don't see much hope but would prefer to see changes for Sat

Give McNeil a try at left central midfield. Technically very strong and definitely an attacking threat

--------Cork
Defour--------McNeil

------Westwood
Defour--------McNeil

--------Defour
Hendrick------McNeil

[dsr]

Whilst watching on tv, Sky came up with a fact that we have not won a game in 2018 when Defour and Cork have started together
Both very good last night at picking the ball up from the back four and making passes sideways, backwards or slightly forward a few yards (nothing penetrating) - no pressing, pace, strength in tackles or winning any balls in the air.
However, could Westwood or Hendrick offer anything much different - unfortunately I don't see much hope but would prefer to see changes for Sat

That would be:

Liverpool home
Crystal Palace away
Man United home
Man City away
Leicester away.

How many would we have expected to win?

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

Defour never looks good in a 2 man midfield.

[Herts Clarets]

Another more alarming comment from the Sky commentator, which speaks volumes was when Diame and Brady went into a 50/50 challenge. Diame won it with ease. The comment was "Diame won that ball because he wanted it more". I can take losing to a better player/side. What I cannot accept is losing because the opposition has a greater desire to succeed.

[claretspice]

Little doubt that last night, the logic of playing Defour and Cork as a 2 in a genuine old-school 4-4-2 was exposed. They weren't suited to picking up the second balls and backing up the play as we really needed them to and whilst they moved the ball side to side well enough to set up the opportunities for us to cross/play long diagonals, they weren't able to compress the game once those diagonals had gone in. Hendrick and Westwood are both better at that (weirdly, they remain the best balanced-looking midfield duo we've put out when we play as a two, but its very much second choice).

If we're going to play with those two at the heart of midfield together, then we either need Hendrick playing as the third man in that area as he did successfully last season, or you need Vydra or someone similar willing to drop in and create an extra man. Or alternatively, you need to deploy someone like Hendrick narrow on one flank with a brief to supplement the midfield 2.

In times gone past under Dyche, we were quite good at picking off teams that played 3-5-2, because we invariably played with a narrow midfield 4, a roving striker who ran the sides behind the wing backs, and a focal striker who occupied a couple of the centre halves at any one time. Truth is that as we've evolved, we've ended up moving away from that template and last night we were outgunned tactically in that department.

[Belgianclaret]

Little doubt that last night, the logic of playing Defour and Cork as a 2 in a genuine old-school 4-4-2 was exposed. They weren't suited to picking up the second balls and backing up the play as we really needed them to and whilst they moved the ball side to side well enough to set up the opportunities for us to cross/play long diagonals, they weren't able to compress the game once those diagonals had gone in. Hendrick and Westwood are both better at that (weirdly, they remain the best balanced-looking midfield duo we've put out when we play as a two, but its very much second choice).

If we're going to play with those two at the heart of midfield together, then we either need Hendrick playing as the third man in that area as he did successfully last season, or you need Vydra or someone similar willing to drop in and create an extra man. Or alternatively, you need to deploy someone like Hendrick narrow on one flank with a brief to supplement the midfield 2.

In times gone past under Dyche, we were quite good at picking off teams that played 3-5-2, because we invariably played with a narrow midfield 4, a roving striker who ran the sides behind the wing backs, and a focal striker who occupied a couple of the centre halves at any one time. Truth is that as we've evolved, we've ended up moving away from that template and last night we were outgunned tactically in that department.

Agree, what worries me though is the amount of time it took the gaffer yesterday to realize it was not working. The positive result at Leicester probably did not help in that sense. With the players we've got now, we need to reserve the 4-4-2 for the occasions where it may reap dividend

[Burnley Ace]

Diame was always going to beat Brady in a 50:50. Nothing to do with desire more to do with self preservation

[Lancasterclaret]

We have to play three there.

Or only play one of Cork/Defour + Hendrick

[Dark Cloud]

I wonder if Scott Arfield is available on loan come January?