Will this government and May

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:38 am

Go down in history as the worst ever,can't think of a worse one.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:46 am

She’s doing her best to outdo Cameron that’s for sure.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:47 am

Certainly looking that way.

You cannot put internal divisions in your party ahead of what is best for the country.

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:59 am

Bordeauxclaret wrote:She’s doing her best to outdo Cameron that’s for sure.

And she's far from finished yet!

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:28 am

Although it would certainly be surpassed by Corbyn's if he wins the next election

Burnley Ace · Post by **Burnley Ace** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:04 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:
You cannot put internal divisions in your party ahead of what is best for the country.

Whose version of “what’s best for the country” are you using?

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:19 am

Everyones

She is more worried about the internal divisions in her party than she is about the country, as she's not prepared to entertain anyother idea other than her plan or a "No Deal". As she hasn't got a majority for either, and at least fifty Eurosceptic MPs won't vote for anything other than a "No Deal", she's effectively condemning us for a disastrous and (more importantly) unprepared "No Deal".

fatboy47 · Post by **fatboy47** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:26 am

Steve1956 wrote:Although it would be certainly be surpassed by Corbyn's if he wins the next election

Well, obviously, it says so in all the tabloid papers.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:30 am

Steve1956 wrote:Although it would be certainly be surpassed by Corbyn's if he wins the next election

How do you know - do you have some inside knowledge - do share. Or are you you just showing a touch of bias? Mmm!

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:30 am

And she is banking on Corbyn Eurosceptism carrying Labour with her.

Which as 80 odd percent of Lab members don't agree with him, is a tad risky BUT it all depends on whether Corbyn is red old Uncle Corbyn from the 70s or this visionary who will revolutionise politics with members at the forefront.

Very entertaining it does remain though!

mdd2 · Post by **mdd2** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:33 am

It is a dog’s breakfast and given Europe wants us in and ain’t going to make leaving easy why on earth have we made it clear we won’t leave without a deal. That puts us worse off than Nelson with only one arm and eye when he went into battle.
Should have got ASLEF to negotiate a deal not Civil Servants who likely are remainders and M Ps

kentonclaret · Post by **kentonclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:35 am

Having been outed as a proven liar last Friday regarding his comments over Turkey during the Referendum campaign, I noticed that the Daily Mail had a double page spread on Boris Johnson and his new lover in their Saturday edition. To devote 2 whole pages to this buffoon shows how indebted the Daily Mail are to Boris for helping to deliver Brexit and how they still view him as a future PM in waiting.

Lord Rothbury · Post by **Lord Rothbury** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:36 am

With the benefit of hindsight Blair and Brown have been a hard act to follow and to think I voted for them.

All should step aside and let one of the few politicians with any integrity left head up a government,Nigel Farage.

Steve-Harpers-perm · Post by **Steve-Harpers-perm** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:39 am

Lord Rothbury wrote:With the benefit of hindsight Blair and Brown have been a hard act to follow and to think I voted for them.

All should step aside and let one of the few politicians with any integrity left head up a government,Nigel Farage.

Good old Nige he’ll sort this country out. One of the lads!

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:39 am

You've cast far better than that.

Thats just Roy Schneider dropping chum off the back of the boat

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:40 am

Drivers perspective Dover-Calais

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... are_btn_tw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Test User · Post by **Test User** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:42 am

Happy Coup Day everyone. Because that's something that's happening today. Apparently

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:43 am

houseboy wrote:How do you know - do you have some inside knowledge - do share. Or are you you just showing a touch of bias? Mmm!

Corbyn running the country along with Abbot & Costello,we would be broke and at war in about 3 months

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:45 am

Steve1956 wrote:Corbyn running the country along with Abbot & Costello,we would be broke and at war in about 3 months

Now I know you are taking the Mick. Jeremy Corbyn leading ANY country into war? You really don't know anything about him do you?

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:45 am

Would he be worse than the current lot?

You could argue that they might be, but there is a fairly good chance that they might not be either.

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:47 am

houseboy wrote:Now I know you are taking the Mick. Jeremy Corbyn leading ANY country into war? You really don't know anything about him do you?

I was talking about our prospective loose cannon home secetary

Hendrickxz · Post by **Hendrickxz** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:48 am

File the lot of them in the same drawer as Martin Buchan!

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:00 am

houseboy wrote:Now I know you are taking the Mick. Jeremy Corbyn leading ANY country into war? You really don't know anything about him do you?

I know he's a scruffy prick,bit of a laughing stock and he probably smells, apart from that I don't know anything about him,but God help us if he's ever Prime Minister.

houseboy · Post by **houseboy** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:06 am

Steve1956 wrote:I know he's a scruffy prick,bit of a laughing stock and he probably smells, apart from that I don't know anything about him,but God help us if he's ever Prime Minister.

Love your humour. Nice bit of tongue-in-cheek comment there.

You ARE being funny there aren't you? Of course you are - no one could take that seriously.

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:09 am

Definitely, but it isn't just the government.
The whole of the HOC is a self interested mess. They've become so wrapped up in party politics, the public are completely ignored. Highlighted by the attempts to overturn the referendum.
It won't be solved until we stop voting for party funded mouth pieces, who've been through the party system to get to stand for election.
We need a new party to fight for the centre ground, that seeks to represent the majority of this country.
Until then I would suggest you put party politics aside and instead vote for the candidate who looks least likely to be under the party thumb. A candidate who will put his constituents before his party, whatever bloody colour their rosette is.

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:28 am

Corbyn prime minister? God no. He will negotiate with anyone except the sitting government. The guy is an opportunistic leech.

Granted Theresa and her pals are making a pigs ear of it, but at least she hasn’t started negotiating after giving away her biggest bargaining chip, which is what the lunatic jezza wants her to do.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:32 am

That "biggest bargaining chip" hasn't worked so far it as to be said.

Somehow I suspect its about as valid as "they need us more than we need them"

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:38 am

bobinho wrote: but at least she hasn’t started negotiating after giving away her biggest bargaining chip, which is what the lunatic jezza wants her to do.

How can you give away something that you've never had?
The EU have known from the outset that "no deal" isn't an option, it's just posturing.
Presumably most of our MPs and most of the population are also lunatics since they agree with his position, indeed Parliament might agree this pretty soon. (I'm not entirely certain, by the way, that Corbyn would rule out "no deal" if he wasn't bound by his party's rules and policies, so you might have something in common).).

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:40 am

Steve1956 wrote:Corbyn running the country along with Abbot & Costello,we would be broke and at war in about 3 months

So you must be very grateful then that the Speaker has recently reasserted the authority of MPs in Parliament, so Jezza and his executive can't do anything without the approval of the house.

Chobulous · Post by **Chobulous** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:43 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:And she is banking on Corbyn Eurosceptism carrying Labour with her.

Which as 80 odd percent of Lab members don't agree with him, is a tad risky BUT it all depends on whether Corbyn is red old Uncle Corbyn from the 70s or this visionary who will revolutionise politics with members at the forefront.

Very entertaining it does remain though!

And therein lies Corbyn's ultimate downfall I think. 80%+ Labour members may well support a remain point of view but I believe that number is dwarfed by the number of voters in what used to be traditional Labour heartlands in the midlands, South Wales and the north of England. Those are the areas the voted resoundingly to leave the EU. Whatever happens when Corbyn finally is dragged kicking and struggling into the daylight he is in for a rough ride.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:50 am

bobinho wrote:Corbyn prime minister? God no. He will negotiate with anyone except the sitting government. The guy is an opportunistic leech.

Granted Theresa and her pals are making a pigs ear of it, but at least she hasn’t started negotiating after giving away her biggest bargaining chip, which is what the lunatic jezza wants her to do.

‘Give me what I want or I’ll jump’ only works as a negotiating tactic if anyone believes you’ll actually jump (or even cares whether you do or don’t). No one with even an ounce of sense thinks she’ll do it. Now if we were led by Donald Trump.....

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:53 am

Chobulous wrote:And therein lies Corbyn's ultimate downfall I think. 80%+ Labour members may well support a remain point of view but I believe that number is dwarfed by the number of voters in what used to be traditional Labour heartlands in the midlands, South Wales and the north of England. Those are the areas the voted resoundingly to leave the EU. Whatever happens when Corbyn finally is dragged kicking and struggling into the daylight he is in for a rough ride.

That's a tricky circle for Jezza to square hence why he's getting splinters from all that fence sitting.

AndrewJB · Post by **AndrewJB** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:19 am

This government, and Cameron’s have been abysmal - unless you’re wealthy. All the pain of austerity, only to see the money that was saved be given away in tax breaks, while the national debt grew by more than under every Labour government in history. And of course the playing politics with the country’s future, by calling this referendum, and dividing the people, all to heal Tory rifts. No magic money tree, except to bung the DUP. No plans to raise VAT, weeks before it was done. No major changes to the NHS, followed by just that. Windrush, and vans telling people to go home. Biggest sell off of state assets since Thatcher.

And some people think a Corbyn government would be worse?

Chobulous · Post by **Chobulous** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:24 am

Even TM has her limits

https://youtu.be/o5LOXKxuVJw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:32 am

bobinho wrote:Corbyn prime minister? God no. He will negotiate with anyone except the sitting government. The guy is an opportunistic leech.

Granted Theresa and her pals are making a pigs ear of it, but at least she hasn’t started negotiating after giving away her biggest bargaining chip, which is what the lunatic jezza wants her to do.

Let's be honest, if we wanted to play no deal as a bargaining chip we had to start preparations for it a couple of years ago. It's not going to be taken seriously at this late stage as the lack of preparation shows that the UK had never considered it a serious option.

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:36 am

fatboy47 wrote:Well, obviously, it says so in all the tabloid papers.

Wouldn't know,I never read them.

Billy Balfour · Post by **Billy Balfour** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:47 am

bobinho wrote:Corbyn prime minister? God no. He will negotiate with anyone except the sitting government.

Thing is, she won't negotiate with anyone and he knows this. Last week's offer of cross-party talks was duplicitous in the extreme. She's hasn't listened to anyone and is now back trying to sell her sorry-arsed deal to the hard Brexiteers on her backbenchers. JC got it right for once.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:49 am

Just to reiterate what is obvious to everybody else, the EU have no intention of renegotiating the backstop so we are going to head out with "No Deal" unless either May or Corbyn shifts on something.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:50 am

aggi wrote:Let's be honest, if we wanted to play no deal as a bargaining chip we had to start preparations for it a couple of years ago. It's not going to be taken seriously at this late stage as the lack of preparation shows that the UK had never considered it a serious option.

And let’s not forget the part the hard Brexiteers played in undermining this option when preparations finally did start. Talk of stockpiling medicines and emergency measures at ports were labelled ‘more project fear’ designed to scare the public off no deal Brexit. Not only did they want the EU to believe we’d jump off the cliff, they also expected everyone to believe we could gently flex our knees, land on our feet and skip off into the luscious no deal pasture without so much as a sprained ankle!

The Enclosure · Post by **The Enclosure** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:53 am

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alwaysaclaret · Post by **alwaysaclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:02 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Would he be worse than the current lot?

You could argue that they might be, but there is a fairly good chance that they might not be either.

Couldn't have put it better myself, maybe we'll be a bit financially worse off, but c'mon this government have taken austerity a tad past the limit.

IanMcL · Post by **IanMcL** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:03 pm

Cameron appalling decision making. Short straw for May, who has risen to the occasion and managed to lose the straw entirely.

Incompetence in the extreme.

That, above all reasons, is why we should remain in the EU. Our country is run by imbeciles.

SGr · Post by **SGr** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:06 pm

Not even a Corbyn fan but there’s a mad amount of whataboutery at play. This government has literally been found to be in contempt of parliament, and uses bribery to try and bypass the process.

alwaysaclaret · Post by **alwaysaclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:15 pm

AndrewJB wrote:This government, and Cameron’s have been abysmal - unless you’re wealthy. All the pain of austerity, only to see the money that was saved be given away in tax breaks, while the national debt grew by more than under every Labour government in history. And of course the playing politics with the country’s future, by calling this referendum, and dividing the people, all to heal Tory rifts. No magic money tree, except to bung the DUP. No plans to raise VAT, weeks before it was done. No major changes to the NHS, followed by just that. Windrush, and vans telling people to go home. Biggest sell off of state assets since Thatcher.

And some people think a Corbyn government would be worse?

Not to mention all the people with serious illnesses their "forcing" not helping as she persists in preaching in the hoc at every opportunity " back to work " nothing short of ridiculous. Just my opinion of course.

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:32 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:That "biggest bargaining chip" hasn't worked so far it as to be said.

Somehow I suspect its about as valid as "they need us more than we need them"

The biggest bargaining chip didn't work because they simply didn't believe her, they still don't. The reason they didn't believe her is because of all the remoaners in the HOC and in the media complaining about the result of the referendum.

Now it's time to show you and them, that she wasn't lying, and walk away with the no deal. In the weeks that follow the deals will be done, because no deal suits nobody, them or us.

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:42 pm

SGr wrote:Not even a Corbyn fan but there’s a mad amount of whataboutery at play. This government has literally been found to be in contempt of parliament, and uses bribery to try and bypass the process.

The government should be in contempt of parliament, considering Parliament is in contempt of the country.
TM is guilty of trying to sit on a fence that doesn't exist. She needs to have the courage to implement the referendum, and then prove that it isn't the end of the world as we know it.

If she does that, and calls an election in 12 months time, the Tories will walk it.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:44 pm

The reason they don't is because its economic suicide.

I do wish you'd check all the stuff that backs my view up and stop reading posts/speeches by people who are tad vague on details about this.

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:50 pm

Country divided down the middle, the Tories are and labour are. It is an impossible ask for any politician or party.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:55 pm

The position now appears to be "WTO but only for a short time till the EU caves in"

1) That means everyone who counts knows that WTO is worst case scenario. So can we please stop this "WTO is fine" ********

2) Relying on an EU collapse of position is far too risky an option to seriously consider

Honestly, if we were all being our usual UK selves, we'd be laughing these charlatans out of office.

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Mon Jan 21, 2019 12:56 pm

Colburn_Claret wrote:The government should be in contempt of parliament, considering Parliament is in contempt of the country.
TM is guilty of trying to sit on a fence that doesn't exist. She needs to have the courage to implement the referendum, and then prove that it isn't the end of the world as we know it.

If she does that, and calls an election in 12 months time, the Tories will walk it.

Even hardline ERG type brexiteers admit that a "no deal" brexit will result in short-term damage, (Rees-Mogg for example says we might not feel the benefits for 50 years), so the chances of a Tory victory, (let alone landslide) just 12 months after a "no deal" must be virtually nil.
[This is one of May's major problems since she is following Cameron in putting party before country].