Wages and employment up..

[Stayingup]

You don't see the breathtaking hypocrisy in this then?

I want Brexit cos it will be great for business says James Dyson and sixty odd days before we leave, he ups sticks to Singapore.

That leaves Tim "Nice but Dim" of Wetherspoons and the bloke from JCB who has enough spare cash to pay David Davis £3000 an hour.

With friends like these, Brexit doesn't really need enemies does it?

And its not shock to find that JCB also hand out large sums to Boris Johnson and Daniel Hannan.

Your ignorance is astounding. No idea about business. Its far better to keep quiet in your case

[Lancasterclaret]

The reason food bank use is massively up is because food banks are no longer seen as the last resort for the destitute, they are now seen as a way of getting food without having to cut back on other spending. Most people now, if they are short of money and can't afford both their mobile phone contract and food purchases, will pay their mobile phone contract and get the free food. Once of a day, food would have been the priority and other expenses would be cut first.

You are way better than that Dsr

[dsr]

He saw it on the massive telly that these people own. They were probably smoking as well.

Why else do you think food bank use is massively up? Either it's because people nowadays are poorer and have less income and fewer possessions than anytime in history; or else it's because free food is more readily available and no longer carries the stigma. And the clue is, it's not the former.

[Lancasterclaret]

Your ignorance is astounding. No idea about business. Its far better to keep quiet in your case

Yeah, that is so right. None of your posts on here show anything that total ignorance of reality if we are going down that route.

So you don't see any problem at all with Mr Brexit leaving the country to set up his HQ in another country?

Why is that?

BECAUSE HE SUPPORTS BREXIT. IF YOU SUPPORT BREXIT THEN YOU ARE IMMUNE FROM CRITICISM.

I'm perfectly happy to accept that this is a business decision but to pretend that there isn't a problem with someone telling us all that Brexit means the UK can be a global player and then moving his HQ sixty days before we leave doesn't suggest he's as confident of Brexit as you clearly are.

[aggi]

Why else do you think food bank use is massively up? Either it's because people nowadays are poorer and have less income and fewer possessions than anytime in history; or else it's because free food is more readily available and no longer carries the stigma. And the clue is, it's not the former.

And I assume you have the figures to back that up. I guess the dozens of people I now see sleeping rough are doing that because it has no stigma as well?

[aggi]

Finanacial press and quote - James Dyson. He happens to own this hufely successful company a d its university.

I think you're quoting me on the wrong thing here unless James Dyson's hugely successful company is running foodbanks.

[dsr]

And I assume you have the figures to back that up. I guess the dozens of people I now see sleeping rough are doing that because it has no stigma as well?

I'm just saying that the massive increase in use of food banks does not mean there is an equivalent massive rise in poverty. There are other reasons for the increase in use of food banks.

[KateR]

Yeah, that is so right. None of your posts on here show anything that total ignorance of reality if we are going down that route.

So you don't see any problem at all with Mr Brexit leaving the country to set up his HQ in another country?

Why is that?

BECAUSE HE SUPPORTS BREXIT. IF YOU SUPPORT BREXIT THEN YOU ARE IMMUNE FROM CRITICISM.

I'm perfectly happy to accept that this is a business decision but to pretend that there isn't a problem with someone telling us all that Brexit means the UK can be a global player and then moving his HQ sixty days before we leave doesn't suggest he's as confident of Brexit as you clearly are.

I see an irony in this for sure, however you don't know his real reason, perhaps it was all the arguing and leaning to second referendum and staying in the EU which caused the final decision. All very similar to R Branson (The little Tsar) and his continual support of staying in the EU, this from tax fraudster, a tax exile living on his Necker Island and giving up his British Citizenship. But then again I don't suppose we're supposed to discuss these things are we!

[Lancasterclaret]

Come on Kate, that sounds **** weak

I refer you to the point I made

"HE'S A BREXITEER. THEREFORE HE IS IMMUNE FROM CRITICISM"

[KateR]

no that is not so, anyone is open to criticism and I do mean anyone, he (Dyson) is just white noise as is Branson and in the long run count for nothing. Hopefully you realize this and when you criticize someone on one side there is always someone on the other side of this division that is equally guilty. Not weak to me but as always you're allowed your opinion, surely better if we had everyone working to the same goal but in this "debate" it's never going to happen.

This saga is going down to the wire as many predicted, some are happy it is some are appalled, regardless of the feelings and gnashing of teeth of the little people and the likes of Dyson/Branson it won't really make a jot of difference to the outcome. However the feelings of the people in the immediate future and decisions will count when elections etc. come round again regardless of the outcome of Brexit.

I have said it before and stand by my opinion, the election of Corbyn and Abbot to power gives me far more to worry about than even a hard Brexit, but that's another discussion for the future.

[KateR]

will you, or anyone else be going to listen to Tim Martin, or for that matter has anyone heard him anywhere in the country live?

[Lancasterclaret]

No, why would I?

He's prepared to take a hit and get rid of EU wines and spirits. Thats not the act of a rational businessman, that is the act of someone who values his vision of Brexit more than anything.

(though to be fair, when he's talked to pro-remain campaigners he's been both happy to engage and happy to concede that he might not be right, which is a massive positive)

[Steddyman]

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2019/0 ... on-lowers/

Ahh Breitbart, the bastion of truth and integrity. Without which Bannon wouldn't have driven trump into power.

[quoonbeatz]

Source? The Institute of the Blindingly Obvious. You don't need a source for what can be clearly seen.

you've been helping out at food banks dsr?

good man.

[quoonbeatz]

But let the Tories brag about the employment rate and close their eyes to what is actually happening.

oh they aren't closing their eyes to it, make no mistake.

[Devils_Advocate]

The reason food bank use is massively up is because food banks are no longer seen as the last resort for the destitute, they are now seen as a way of getting food without having to cut back on other spending. Most people now, if they are short of money and can't afford both their mobile phone contract and food purchases, will pay their mobile phone contract and get the free food. Once of a day, food would have been the priority and other expenses would be cut first.

***PROCEED WITH CAUTION: THIS POSTER GENERALLY FAILS TO MAINTAIN BASIC STANDARDS OF ACCURACY AND ACCOUNTABILITY***

[KateR]

LC,
I thought it was a subject you're interested in and might want to get some insight in to what people don't agree with you have to say and maybe ask some pertinent questions, such as "are you just willing to take a hit for your beliefs"? He seems to believe in what he says which is more that a lot who just have rhetoric and quote other people, he's definitely putting his money where is mouth is which I can only applaud.

I would be tempted to go if he was anywhere near me and will continue to look at where he intends to appear just in case I can catch him. I do think a lot of what he says is for publicity and to drum up more business. I see he is beefing up on his other sales such as coffee and breakfasts, with statistics supporting young people driven more to spending there money on coffee/cafes rather than beer/pubs (for guys) which I found interesting, rarely go anywhere just for coffee but then again I'm old.

[Pimlico_Claret]

The reason food bank use is massively up is because food banks are no longer seen as the last resort for the destitute, they are now seen as a way of getting food without having to cut back on other spending. Most people now, if they are short of money and can't afford both their mobile phone contract and food purchases, will pay their mobile phone contract and get the free food. Once of a day, food would have been the priority and other expenses would be cut first.

You didn't used to need a mobile phone to be able to apply for welfare benefits.

[2 Bee Holed]

Why else do you think food bank use is massively up? Either it's because people nowadays are poorer and have less income and fewer possessions than anytime in history; or else it's because free food is more readily available and no longer carries the stigma. And the clue is, it's not the former.

I volunteer at a foodbank.

You are absolutely right dsr.
They all have the latest i phones, they all arrive in their BMW's smoking cigars and telling me which horses I should be betting on.
Yet they let their kids starve and rummage for food in the school bins.

There I have been honest, could you be honest too?
Who do you vote for?
Do you actually believe what you have written?
Is this most foodbank users or just a small minority?

Oh by the way in order to use the Trussel Group foodbanks, the one I volunteer for and the largest one in the country.
Users have to have been referred by a Social Worker, a Head Teacher or a GP or the like, (you get a red voucher).
The biggest referrer for the past 6 months has been the DWP!!!!!!!!
Would you f**king believe it?

[dsr]

I volunteer at a foodbank.

You are absolutely right dsr.
They all have the latest i phones, they all arrive in their BMW's smoking cigars and telling me which horses I should be betting on.
Yet they let their kids starve and rummage for food in the school bins.

There I have been honest, could you be honest too?
Who do you vote for?
Do you actually believe what you have written?
Is this most foodbank users or just a small minority?

Oh by the way in order to use the Trussel Group foodbanks, the one I volunteer for and the largest one in the country.
Users have to have been referred by a Social Worker, a Head Teacher or a GP or the like, (you get a red voucher).
The biggest referrer for the past 6 months has been the DWP!!!!!!!!
Would you f**king believe it?

Read what I wrote and answer that. Don't quote me and go off on a rant about something that is nothing to do with me - by all means post your details about food banks and why they are necessary and why it's the government's fault, but not attached to my post that isn't about that.

But if there are ten times as many people who use food banks now as there were 5 years ago, or 25 years ago, or 55 years ago, then it's not because we're so grindingly poor compared with those times. It's because of lifestyle changes, one of them being that the amount of possessions deemed essential for living is so much higher than it used to be, and one being that there is no longer any stigma (or at least, much less stigma) attached to begging for food. It is not because we are living in a uniquely impoverished time.

Or to say again, the vast increase in food provided by food banks does not prove a vast increase in poverty.

[Lancasterclaret]

So, not for the first time, when presented with evidence that what you believe is actually not true, you just ignore it.

[2 Bee Holed]

Read what I wrote and answer that.

I did!

[Stayingup]

Yeah, that is so right. None of your posts on here show anything that total ignorance of reality if we are going down that route.

So you don't see any problem at all with Mr Brexit leaving the country to set up his HQ in another country?

Why is that?

BECAUSE HE SUPPORTS BREXIT. IF YOU SUPPORT BREXIT THEN YOU ARE IMMUNE FROM CRITICISM.

I'm perfectly happy to accept that this is a business decision but to pretend that there isn't a problem with someone telling us all that Brexit means the UK can be a global player and then moving his HQ sixty days before we leave doesn't suggest he's as confident of Brexit as you clearly are.

Look Lancaster I respect that you are entitled to your viewpoint. Naive and hugely informed as it may be.

What I find preposterous is you calling self made buisnessmen, who are hugely successful dim, thick and stupid as you have done here and in the past, simply because they dont agree with your politics. I must ask are you a student? Why I ask is because you dont seem to have a grasp of how successfull businesses work on a global scale.

Dyson is sending two men to Singapore. I dont blame him. I wouldnt if he if he moved his whole business. There he will not be shackled by EU regulations and the likelyhood of a Corbyn government. He is moving his HQ to a low tax highly competitive pro business State.
We here have lost that oportunity now thanks to our Europhiles. Ruined on the altar of protectionism, and the money sucking sclerotic establishment that is the EU.

[Spijed]

Ruined on the altar of protectionism

And yet weren't many pro leavers saying how great it was that we could do a deal with the USA once we leave, with a President that wants protectionism for American jobs?

[2 Bee Holed]

Read what I wrote and answer that. Don't quote me and go off on a rant about something that is nothing to do with me - by all means post your details about food banks and why they are necessary and why it's the government's fault, but not attached to my post that isn't about that.

But if there are ten times as many people who use food banks now as there were 5 years ago, or 25 years ago, or 55 years ago, then it's not because we're so grindingly poor compared with those times. It's because of lifestyle changes, one of them being that the amount of possessions deemed essential for living is so much higher than it used to be, and one being that there is no longer any stigma (or at least, much less stigma) attached to begging for food. It is not because we are living in a uniquely impoverished time.

Or to say again, the vast increase in food provided by food banks does not prove a vast increase in poverty.

I notice you didn't answer my two earlier questions.
' a uniquely impoverished time', again you are correct, we are in many cases back to Dickensian times.
I assume your lifestyle/amount of possession theory is from right wing newspapers or from politicians who cannot accept how human beings are being treated so they have come up with this theory?
In reality, and I suggest you go down to a foodbank and volunteer for a day, it is the Government's benefit system and the rise in zero hours contracts.
In the past, if you became unemployed or were 'sick' you went down to the DSS and claimed Unemployment Benefit or 'Sick Pay'.
Either way you tended to get some money within 7 to 10 days. Now it can take 13 weeks.
Nobody can do without money for 13 weeks.
Please don't mention emergency loans, the Government's own figures show that only 40% of people entitled to these loans actually get them.
We at the foodbank tend to see most of the other 60%. The DWP are giving them vouchers to come to the foodbank!
Does that not prove to you that Government Policy is failing?

[Lancasterclaret]

Sorry, Stayingup, not a student. No idea why you'd think that.

If you'd like to explain why Mr Brexit is so confident of our role in the world economy after Brexit he's moved his HQ to Singapore (continuing his trend for moving one by one, all his businesses out of the country). This despite him saying we can be a world leader in the new global Britain?

He doesn't believe what he's been telling people like you. And you still believe those who tell you Brexit will be in your best interests.

You call me naive!

[wickdkewlclaret]

Violent crime up 19% in England & Wales.

But don’t worry, 0 hour employment is up.

[dsr]

...
Does that not prove to you that Government Policy is failing?

What I said was that the food banks being ten times busier does not prove that poverty is ten times worse. That is not the same thing as saying everyone at a food bank is a scrounger and the government is doing a wonderful job. I can well believe that the government policy is failing, but that doesn't mean that the conditions of A Christmas Carol are being repeated today.

[dsr]

' a uniquely impoverished time', again you are correct, we are in many cases back to Dickensian times.

The Unitarian School accounts book from the 1850's (late Dickensian times) recorded frequently, in winter, that children were absent from school because there was snow on the ground and they had no boots.

[AndrewJB]

The Unitarian School accounts book from the 1850's (late Dickensian times) recorded frequently, in winter, that children were absent from school because there was snow on the ground and they had no boots.

Poverty is a huge problem in the UK. We are wealthy enough as a nation that nobody should have to make decisions between heating their home or feeding their children, yet this is happening to a growing number of people.

https://www.jrf.org.uk/report/uk-povert ... gLUY_D_BwE" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It's not merely those out of work, but many people in work are struggling to make ends meet, or relying on benefits and foodbanks (which you can't visit unless signed off by a doctor or other professional).

[2 Bee Holed]

Just back from the food bank. 9 vouchers today....helping 25 people. Of the 9, 4 were issued by the DWP.
Of the 9.....7 were in work.
All 9 were experiencing benefit problems.

[dsr]

Poverty is a huge problem in the UK. We are wealthy enough as a nation that nobody should have to make decisions between heating their home or feeding their children, yet this is happening to a growing number of people.

And yet in the days of say 60 years ago, when poverty was allegedly the less, most people didn't have that choice to make because heating their home wasn't an option. Heating the downstairs rooms, yes; only the rich had any heat upstairs. Even I remember the fern patterns on the inside of the windows in winter, and I'm not that old.

[Bosscat]

And yet in the days of say 60 years ago, when poverty was allegedly the less, most people didn't have that choice to make because heating their home wasn't an option. Heating the downstairs rooms, yes; only the rich had any heat upstairs. Even I remember the fern patterns on the inside of the windows in winter, and I'm not that old.

We were talking about that only last week in the pub...

Ah the good old days before central heating

[Lancasterclaret]

Amazing that all these old gimmers going on about the good old days don't ever mention outside bogs it has to be said.

[dsr]

We were talking about that only last week in the pub...

Ah the good old days before central heating

I'm not saying "the good old days". I'm just refusing to accept that people who can't afford heating now, are by definition poorer than those who couldn't afford heating sixty years ago.

[aggi]

I'm not saying "the good old days". I'm just refusing to accept that people who can't afford heating now, are by definition poorer than those who couldn't afford heating sixty years ago.

They may not be poorer absolutely but surely we should be judging poverty relatively. Just because families aren't sending their children out to sweep chimneys doesn't mean they're not in poverty.

[Bosscat]

I'm not saying "the good old days". I'm just refusing to accept that people who can't afford heating now, are by definition poorer than those who couldn't afford heating sixty years ago.

Irony is wasted on some innit

[Bosscat]

Aye it were geand when we were young.

Reminds me if that Python sketch....

http://www.montypython.net/scripts/4york.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[SingaporeClarets]

You don't see the breathtaking hypocrisy in this then?

I want Brexit cos it will be great for business says James Dyson and sixty odd days before we leave, he ups sticks to Singapore.

That leaves Tim "Nice but Dim" of Wetherspoons and the bloke from JCB who has enough spare cash to pay David Davis £3000 an hour.

With friends like these, Brexit doesn't really need enemies does it?

And its not shock to find that JCB also hand out large sums to Boris Johnson and Daniel Hannan.

https://youtu.be/SqQVfaYjEFc?t=142" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Tim visits T'Boot.