Brexit: Uniting the Country Since 31/01/2020

[tiger76]

The only 'democratic' way out of this INTRACTABLE parliamentary situation is for the public to choose between:

1. Leave the EU with the negotiated withdrawal agreement
2. Leave the EU without an agreement on WTO terms

I suspect that the withdrawal agreement 'deal' option would win and we could then move forward to negotiate a tariff free trade deal.

If the public decided to leave without a deal then WE will have made that decision and WE would have to make it work.

A confirmatory referendum with those options would be valid,as the public have already decided to leave,the question is how we leave,such a vote would decide that,i can't see the spineless politicians in Westminster countenancing any such choice however,although if Boris takes the reins who knows.

[summitclaret]

Not a good way to decide it as we need to test what I think most leavers want. Which is not May's deal. I believe leaving with a canada type free trade deal would be the first choice of most leavers. Hopefully the emergence of TBP will make the above option look like a good compromise.

[Colburn_Claret]

I was replying to your post where you were championing a no deal scenario, and I'm referring to the days immediately after we've left the EU with no deal.

That will be the dire situation that will get worse by the day. That's when we will be absolutely desperate and in need of support, and that's when the EU will hold our feet to the fire over the Irish border, the financial settlement and citizens rights.

These issues don't disappear in a no deal scenario.

Whats the dire situation though. What is going to happen to us that allows the eu to hold us to the fire. I'm not being obtuse, but you obviously fear something. What is it? I still don't know.

[Lancasterclaret]

Even in a "No Deal" scenario, the WA will still have to be signed before we can do anything else, which makes the arguing over the WA even more pointless, and the Conservative leadership candidates various pledges to gain support amongst the terminally ill-informed even more pointless again.

[JohnMcGreal]

Whats the dire situation though. What is going to happen to us that allows the eu to hold us to the fire. I'm not being obtuse, but you obviously fear something. What is it? I still don't know.

1. A tumbling currency
2. Checks at the border, causing delays, turning the M20 into a lorry park in a matter of hours
3. Shortage of goods we import such as food, medicines, nuclear material etc
4. Price increases due to the shortage of goods and the weakness of the pound

They're just the immediate concerns. On top of that we'll no longer part of any legal or regulatory framework, which will have far reaching consequences. We will have no trade agreements with any other country other than the couple that Liam Fox has managed to cobble together. We will be the only country in the world in that position. Well, us and Mauritania.

The government's own impact assessments show that a no deal situation would be catastrophic for us. No sane person would even consider it, let alone do it.

The EU have also done their own impact assessments and have come to the same conclusion as our government. That the UK will be a complete basket case within a fortnight, and we'll be back at the table, desperate. And the things we didn't like about the WA will be the first thing on the agenda. There's no getting away from those issues.

But hey. What do all those experts know. Nigel and Boris said everything will be fine, so why worry about it.

[tiger76]

Not a good way to decide it as we need to test what I think most leavers want. Which is not May's deal. I believe leaving with a canada type free trade deal would be the first choice of most leavers. Hopefully the emergence of TBP will make the above option look like a good compromise.

But a Canada type free trade deal isn't on the table,at least not yet,and the EU 27 have been clear they won't discuss the future relationship until the WA is confirmed by the HOC,whether you think this is a good strategy by the UK is arguable,but that's where we are at this point in time,unless yet another extension is offered,i wouldn't totally discount that either.

[Colburn_Claret]

1. A tumbling currency
2. Checks at the border, causing delays, turning the M20 into a lorry park in a matter of hours
3. Shortage of goods we import such as food, medicines, nuclear material etc
4. Price increases due to the shortage of goods and the weakness of the pound

They're just the immediate concerns. On top of that we'll no longer part of any legal or regulatory framework, which will have far reaching consequences. We will have no trade agreements with any other country other than the couple that Liam Fox has managed to cobble together. We will be the only country in the world in that position. Well, us and Mauritania.

The government's own impact assessments show that a no deal situation would be catastrophic for us. No sane person would even consider it, let alone do it.

The EU have also done their own impact assessments and have come to the same conclusion as our government. That the UK will be a complete basket case within a fortnight, and we'll be back at the table, desperate. And the things we didn't like about the WA will be the first thing on the agenda. There's no getting away from those issues.

But hey. What do all those experts know. Nigel and Boris said everything will be fine, so why worry about it.

Immediate concerns.... there is no proof that this will happen, just a fear, spread by people who want us to remain.

I've said why I think the fears are unfounded, or greatly exaggerated.
The person in charge of the Port of Calais has said that it wont make any difference. If an extra piece of paperwork is required I'm sure it can be sorted by October.
Queues on the M20, would be mirrored on the roads to Calais.
Our currency and economy is stronger than the Euro or any of the other European economies.
Britain might only be 1/28th of the bloc's but we account for more than 1/6th of the trade between Europe.
Claiming the we will have food shortages medicine shortages nuclear shortages poses a problem for Europe. What are they going to do with all these products they no longer sell to us. They dont have anyone else to sell it to, they are already trading to the full to the rest of the world. You seem to presume that they are going to he happy to lose all that trade, all that money, why?

The impact statement that the EU and our government base their statements on are biased in order to twist the arm of Britain to remain. The same as the 500,000 jobs we would lose on voting to leave. Didn't happen.
The £1,200 it was going to cost every household. Didn't happen.
The emergency budget the day after the vote. Didn't happen.

I can understand the fear, but it's only because you take at face value all the bullshit they spout at you.
Time will tell who is right, but I'm confident your great catastrophes are no more than a speed bump on the road to a new future.

[Lancasterclaret]

Three years and it's all still Project Fear?

It would be funny if it wasn't so serious

[martin_p]

There are simply dozens of Tory MPs who would put country before party if it came down to a choice of "no deal" under Boris or any other alternative.

Yep!

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... SApp_Other

[CombatClaret]

Going to be fun watching all those who say the EU is undemocratic enjoy their success at the polls as we race toward around 100,000 Tory members with an average age at between 65 and 75 choose an unelected Prime Minister.

[Right_winger]

Rock and a hard place for the Tories, a soft Brexit or remain candidate will alienate the voters who will mostly not return from the Brexit party and a hard brexiteer will cause the anti-democrats to collapse the government.

They may be careful what they wish for as a GE right now might just return a hard Brexit majority seeing as all the other parties are now in favour of remain. The more remain parties the better, get that vote split.

[Lancasterclaret]

Point of Order here

Leaving with a "No Deal" is just as undemocratic as cancelling the referendum result.

[Right_winger]

Point of Order here

Leaving with a "No Deal" is just as undemocratic as cancelling the referendum result.

No it’s not. It perfectly delivers on the referendum result which is to leave the EU.

This soft and hard Brexit were invented after the referendum as a means to coerce people against leaving, by those who refused to accept the result.

[AndrewJB]

Immediate concerns.... there is no proof that this will happen, just a fear, spread by people who want us to remain.

I've said why I think the fears are unfounded, or greatly exaggerated.
The person in charge of the Port of Calais has said that it wont make any difference. If an extra piece of paperwork is required I'm sure it can be sorted by October.
Queues on the M20, would be mirrored on the roads to Calais.
Our currency and economy is stronger than the Euro or any of the other European economies.
Britain might only be 1/28th of the bloc's but we account for more than 1/6th of the trade between Europe.
Claiming the we will have food shortages medicine shortages nuclear shortages poses a problem for Europe. What are they going to do with all these products they no longer sell to us. They dont have anyone else to sell it to, they are already trading to the full to the rest of the world. You seem to presume that they are going to he happy to lose all that trade, all that money, why?

The impact statement that the EU and our government base their statements on are biased in order to twist the arm of Britain to remain. The same as the 500,000 jobs we would lose on voting to leave. Didn't happen.
The £1,200 it was going to cost every household. Didn't happen.
The emergency budget the day after the vote. Didn't happen.

I can understand the fear, but it's only because you take at face value all the bullshit they spout at you.
Time will tell who is right, but I'm confident your great catastrophes are no more than a speed bump on the road to a new future.

I’m not confident that, if things do go badly, leave supporters won’t still just blame the EU.

[AndrewJB]

No it’s not. It perfectly delivers on the referendum result which is to leave the EU.

This soft and hard Brexit were invented after the referendum as a means to coerce people against leaving, by those who refused to accept the result.

The ballot I saw in 2016 just said yes or no - not hard or soft. It’s perfectly possible to leave the EU and remain in the customs union and single market. As agreed by these people: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0xGt3QmRSZY" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Lancasterclaret]

No it’s not. It perfectly delivers on the referendum result which is to leave the EU.

This soft and hard Brexit were invented after the referendum as a means to coerce people against leaving, by those who refused to accept the result.

No

Because some of us still remember what was promised before the referendum, as opposed to what we were told afterwards.

[RingoMcCartney]

I did go out. I have a life to live, an elderly father to look after, and grandchildren to pick up from school etc. etc. - and I also still work a couple of days a week despite being retired.
When I've time I "lurk around on here".
I didn't make any claims about a Brexodous. I responded to one of your posts - which of course is always a mistake - as others have learnt. If you want people to engage with you then you need to learn to debate sensibly otherwise posters ultimately stop replying to you.
Anyhow;
On May 15th you claimed that MIGRATION was in hundreds of thousands.
(As Aggi pointed out but you typically didn't grasp, you didn't really mean MIGRATION)
But if we're talking about NET IMMIGRATION then it was down last year to 60,000, so not the hundreds of thousands you claimed.
Furthermore the charts and stats in the actual link that you posted demonstrate a steady trend since the referendum of net EU immigration reducing, (now well below May's target of 100,000), and correspondingly non - EU immigration compensating for this.
It doesn't matter that you've dragged us back to a post 11 days ago, the answer remains the same, and your link doesn't disprove it.

Huff n puff all you like.

There are more eu citizens here in the UK compared to before the referendum.

Has there been a "Brexodus"


Yes





Or






No?

[dsr]

1. A tumbling currency
2. Checks at the border, causing delays, turning the M20 into a lorry park in a matter of hours
3. Shortage of goods we import such as food, medicines, nuclear material etc
4. Price increases due to the shortage of goods and the weakness of the pound

They're just the immediate concerns. On top of that we'll no longer part of any legal or regulatory framework, which will have far reaching consequences. We will have no trade agreements with any other country other than the couple that Liam Fox has managed to cobble together. We will be the only country in the world in that position. Well, us and Mauritania.

The government's own impact assessments show that a no deal situation would be catastrophic for us. No sane person would even consider it, let alone do it.

The EU have also done their own impact assessments and have come to the same conclusion as our government. That the UK will be a complete basket case within a fortnight, and we'll be back at the table, desperate. And the things we didn't like about the WA will be the first thing on the agenda. There's no getting away from those issues.

But hey. What do all those experts know. Nigel and Boris said everything will be fine, so why worry about it.

1. A tumbling currency has been done before and will happen again. As has a rising currency, for that matter. Life somehow seems to go on.

2. This depends on the intelligence and political will of the government. Will they allow the checks to be reduced, or will they cause gridlock in the UK transport system? answer - they will reduce checks. Even if they can't work it out for themselves, someone will tell them.

3. This also depends on the intelligence and political will of the government. Will they abolish tariffs on food coming into the country, or will they say "Let them eat cake"? Answer - they will abolish tariffs. Even if they can't work it out for themselves, someone will tell them.

4. Won't happen because of (2) and (3) above.

[RingoMcCartney]

Point of Order here

Leaving with a "No Deal" is just as undemocratic as cancelling the referendum result.

The vast majority of MPS voted to trigger Article 50.


Read the small print.


It stated that on March 29th the UK will leave the European Union with or without a withdrawal deal.

I didn't think you could keep up your hot streak of "not making things up"

[AndrewJB]

The vast majority of MPS voted to trigger Article 50.


Read the small print.


It stated that on March 29th the UK will leave the European Union with or without a withdrawal deal.

I didn't think you could keep up your hot streak of "not making things up"

MPs voted more recently to force May out of that no deal exit Two months after 29th March, and we haven’t left yet.

[RingoMcCartney]

MPs voted more recently to force May out of that no deal exit Two months after 29th March, and we haven’t left yet.

Correct.

[IanMcL]

That hag widdlecom is filling my TV. She is scary. Next time we see her will be Halloween....then she will disappear.
Phew!

May out!
Cable out!
Corbyn out!

That would be nice!

SNP storming it in Scotland.
I think they should vote on 6 April 2020 and escape the sinking ship again!

[RingoMcCartney]

That hag widdlecom is filling my TV. She is scary. Next time we see her will be Halloween....then she will disappear.
Phew!

May out!
Cable out!
Corbyn out!

That would be nice!

SNP storming it in Scotland.
I think they should vote on 6 April 2020 and escape the sinking ship again!

She's just been elected in a democratic vote.



You haven't ........

[dsr]

SNP storming it in Scotland.
I think they should vote on 6 April 2020 and escape the sinking ship again!

Considering that 60% of the Scottish exports go to the rest of the UK, and that we now know that the EU will insist on a hard border between Scotland and England and full price tariffs - what's that going to do to the economy? If the UK can't cope with changing the terms of EU trade, then Scotland will certainly struggle with changing terms of UK trade.

Good luck on 6th April!

[IanMcL]

She's just been elected in a democratic vote.



You haven't ........

Not today.

Actually, she hasn't.
It was a block vote for a 'party' and she stood, as long as she was number one on the list for that 'party'.

[IanMcL]

Considering that 60% of the Scottish exports go to the rest of the UK, and that we now know that the EU will insist on a hard border between Scotland and England and full price tariffs - what's that going to do to the economy? If the UK can't cope with changing the terms of EU trade, then Scotland will certainly struggle with changing terms of UK trade.

Good luck on 6th April!

English folk will flock over the border for their duty free whisky and tartan!

[nil_desperandum]

Huff n puff all you like.

There are more eu citizens here in the UK compared to before the referendum.

Has there been a "Brexodus"


Yes





Or






No?

If you can find where I ever made that claim then I'll answer the question. It's a claim that you claim I made, but there's no evidence on this thread that I made any such claim.

[Colburn_Claret]

I’m not confident that, if things do go badly, leave supporters won’t still just blame the EU.

That is true. It all depends on who is in charge of negotiations and how good the team is selling Britain to the rest of the world. IF they make a mess of it, I for one wont be blaming the EU. Getting out is imperative, but what we do with it is entirely up to us.
I'm confident that a deal will be reached with the EU, but not until after we've left. The increase in Brussels of parties less pro federalism should help that.

[AndrewJB]

To me the impasse is around Theresa May's red lines on the customs union, and free movement. If the new leader moves in that direction and ditches the red lines, then both a withdrawal agreement and trade deal will be easy with the EU; however I can't see any new leader going that way. Bear in mind nothing will have changed in parliament, and there's no reason for the EU to suddenly change their position, so it looks as though the new leader will have to move toward a no deal exit - and because of the parliamentary maths - this will lead to either an election, or another referendum (I think the latter).

[RingoMcCartney]

Remoaners have decided to apply their desperate logic to the premier league. And it's a blow for Manchester city. 

They've added up the final points tally for Chelsea, Spurs and Arsenal.

And they've announced that LONDON won the Premier League!

[RingoMcCartney]

So essentially by your method of calculating the population of the UK will always rise, since even if at some point those leaving the country outstripped the number coming in, you would only record those who arrived, and ignore those leaving

Stop arguing the toss.


QUESTION -Has there been a ‘Brexodus’ of EU citizens since the referendum?

Published: 19th Dec 2018

Around 3.7 million people living in the UK are citizens of another EU country. That’s about 6% of the UK population, according to the latest figures covering the year to June 2018.

That compares to 3.4 million in the year before the EU referendum. Overall, the EU citizen population in the UK has gone up by an estimated 35,000 in the last 12 months, an increase of 1%. Between 2016 and 2017, the number increased by 240,000, an increase of 7%

ANSWER - IT WAS ANOTHER REMOANER LIE

.https://fullfact.org/immigration/eu-citizens-brexodus/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Has there been the much promised "Brexodus" since the referendum?


Yes




Or





No?

[dsr]

To me the impasse is around Theresa May's red lines on the customs union, and free movement. If the new leader moves in that direction and ditches the red lines, then both a withdrawal agreement and trade deal will be easy with the EU; however I can't see any new leader going that way. Bear in mind nothing will have changed in parliament, and there's no reason for the EU to suddenly change their position, so it looks as though the new leader will have to move toward a no deal exit - and because of the parliamentary maths - this will lead to either an election, or another referendum (I think the latter).

I doubt there will be time for another referendum. Four months? The MPs would have to agree what question to put on the referendum, and whether it should be 3 options or two; then get the approval of the Electoral Commission; then leave time for a campaign. And it has to be finished before 31st October. I doubt this could be set in train before the new PM takes office, which will likely be late July or August.

[tiger76]

I doubt there will be time for another referendum. Four months? The MPs would have to agree what question to put on the referendum, and whether it should be 3 options or two; then get the approval of the Electoral Commission; then leave time for a campaign. And it has to be finished before 31st October. I doubt this could be set in train before the new PM takes office, which will likely be late July or August.

No i tend to agree which is why i can foresee another extension,unless the EU 27 grow bored of this impasse and say non in the case of Macron,Merkel would be more agreeable to a further extension,but given her domestic troubles will she still be a major player by the Autumn.

[aggi]

Despite your predictable wriggling and swerving of answering a straight forward question. The following quotes prove I was right and you were , yet again, wrong.

Goal posts? A clear thrashing for aggi!

This is what I said.


b]"2008[/b]- Labour bail out the banks and saves London based bankers jobs. Costing the nation billions. 

The EU says , " that's fine."

2019- The tories want to save thousands of steel workers jobs in the industrial north. Costing the nation millions. 

The EU says, "No can do , UK"

Apologies for not spending a sunny bank holiday weekend waiting with bated breath for your latest attempt to justify yourself.

Plenty of other people have dealt with the second claim so let's look at the first:

The EU says , " that's fine."

Except that they really didn't. The government opted to bail out the banks first and deal with the repercussions later. This involved things like forcing the breakup of Lloyds and TSB, Bradford and Bingley closing down, having to pay smaller banks to help them remain competitive, etc

(Also, good to see that you're consistent with your belief that Scotland is in London.)

[Lancasterclaret]

Simple solutions for simple people.

[RingoMcCartney]

Apologies for not spending a sunny bank holiday weekend waiting with bated breath for your latest attempt to justify yourself.

Plenty of other people have dealt with the second claim so let's look at the first:

The EU says , " that's fine."

Except that they really didn't. The government opted to bail out the banks first and deal with the repercussions later. This involved things like forcing the breakup of Lloyds and TSB, Bradford and Bingley closing down, having to pay smaller banks to help them remain competitive, etc

(Also, good to see that you're consistent with your belief that Scotland is in London.)

"Sunny bank holiday!" In the metropolitan bubble maybe!!!

Taken from the left wing w3bsite, Labour Heartlands, that you've clearly ignored

https://labourheartlands.com/british-st ... o-save-it/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Would it be against EU regulations to provide funding to British Steel in a time of need?

Unfortunately, yes. The fact that all the economic factors go against the UK steel industry is not relevant, nor is the potentially devastating impact on the wider local economy were it to close. The EU has already ruled on this: in January 2016 the competition commissioner ruled that the Belgian government had illegally provided €211m to steel companies in one of its depressed regions, and ordered that the money be repaid. She also announced an investigation into €2bn of similar aid given by the Italian government to support its steel industry.

So how come the banks were bailed out?

There is a fundamental difference between banks and steel. If the UK, or Belgian, or Italian steel industry has to shut down, then other steel companies will pick up their contracts. Such commercial competition is the thrust behind most of the legislation: saving any of the ailing companies would adversely affect the other steel providers, who would not be able to take those contracts. In the case of the banks, their mutual interdependence made that impossible. Because they had all lent to each other, the collapse of any of the banks would have led to the collapse of the whole financial system. So, saving the banks was not anti-competitive, it was in fact supporting the market economy.


Then the EU bent the rules for the banks?

No, it did not bend the rules, it used provisions in the Rescue and Restructuring Guidelines which enable State aid in certain very limited circumstances. Unfortunately, this would be difficult to apply to steel.

So you're spouting "outright lies " aggi !!!!The labour government did not "opt to bail out the banks first and deal with the repercussions later."

What they did, did not breach EU LAW!!!

In other words "the EU says - that's fine!

As for my 2nd claim. I smashed the lot of you out of the park. Look at the text of the legal advice the government received from its advisors and there is countless references to breaching EU law.

In other words

The EU says " No can do, UK "

Stamp your trotters as much as you like I'm done on this one. And I've wiped the floor with the lot of you. And I've done it with facts and legal advice. You've spouted "outright lies " something you originally tried to accuse new of!

Hoist by you're own petard aggi.




Have a great day in the M25 Echo Chamber

[aggi]

I guess most people wouldn't view a fundamental restructuring of the British banking sector as the EU saying "that's fine" which obviously your response doesn't deal with at all.

[RingoMcCartney]

I guess most people wouldn't view a fundamental restructuring of the British banking sector as the EU saying "that's fine" which obviously your response doesn't deal with at all.

"OUTRIGHT LIES"

Hoist by your own Petard aggi.

[RingoMcCartney]

LBC - maajid nawaz in for James Obrain.

10.45, Ringo McCartney spoke to the nation. Again.


Bringing truth, enlightenment and facts to hundreds of thousands.

[Lancasterclaret]

I heard it.

You came across well

[RingoMcCartney]

I heard it.

You came across well

Despite the rumours , I'm not a bad person.

Did you recognise the "Islington Dinner Party" line?

[Lancasterclaret]

I didn't know it was you but I did think you over egged the metropolitan elite bit about the Labour party.

And there is no argument that the Labour Party in Burnley and the Labour Party in Islington has completely different problems BUT (and remember I don't vote Labour) nationwide solutions are still possible that work for both Islington and Burnley.

And no one on here has any problem with the idea of us spending more money in the north, its just that you think that will come from the EU money, and I think that money will be used for anything else but that.

[RingoMcCartney]

I didn't know it was you but I did think you over egged the metropolitan elite bit about the Labour party.

And there is no argument that the Labour Party in Burnley and the Labour Party in Islington has completely different problems BUT (and remember I don't vote Labour) nationwide solutions are still possible that work for both Islington and Burnley.

And no one on here has any problem with the idea of us spending more money in the north, its just that you think that will come from the EU money, and I think that money will be used for anything else but that.

"nationwide solutions are still possible that work for both Islington and Burnley."

They are. One solution would be to actually implement the referendum result. Nobody is saying people who want to be in the EU should be silenced. Just that democracy be enacted and subsequently, in a democracy remainers should be free to campaign to rejoin the EU.

If money doesn't come north. I'll vote for a party that promises it will. That's democracy. Given the current crop of MPS have betrayed their manifestos it'd be none of the above. Not for ever but not now.

In the last 3 months I've been on Tom Swarbrick, Mike Graham (yesterday) Shelagh Fogerty, Nigel Farage, Rees Mogg, Ian Dale. Radio 5 Live phone in ( twice) Eddie Mair ( last week I think it was) Matt Frei a couple of Saturdays ago . The only one who's production team will not me speak is the socialist with starf, Obrains., production team......

Genuinely. Make of that what you will..

PS. Thought his point that Labour should not campaign for remain and listen to the unions , leaving that to the illiberal antidemocrats was bob on. You'll be pleased to hear.

[Lancasterclaret]

But implementing the referendum result doesn't solve any problems on its own Ringo.

It causes a whole raft of new ones, and more "No Deal" it is, the more problems there are.

The deal was there, and now it isn't.

Thats the immediate problem

[RingoMcCartney]

But implementing the referendum result doesn't solve any problems on its own Ringo.

It causes a whole raft of new ones, and more "No Deal" it is, the more problems there are.

The deal was there, and now it isn't.

Thats the immediate problem

"But implementing the referendum result doesn't solve any problems on its own Ringo."

Apart from.ending the largest betrayal of the majority of voters no, your spot on!

Spoken like a true democracy denying illiberal antidemocrat.

[Lancasterclaret]

"But implementing the referendum result doesn't solve any problems on its own Ringo."

Apart from.ending the largest betrayal of the majority of voters no, your spot on!

Spoken like a true democracy denying illiberal antidemocrat.

Well no, spoken like someone answering the question posed above about the inequalities in the various parts of the UK.

The referendum does not solve that.

[aggi]

Boris Johnson has been ordered to appear in court over claims he lied by saying the UK gave the EU £350m a week.

A little surprised this has got this far. It is indisputably a lie and he clearly knew that but holding politicians to task when they lie could be a potentially welcome but also dangerous precedent.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48445430" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[tiger76]

Just to increase Ringo's blood pressure,Mr Bercow isn't for retiring quite yet.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48441344

So a no-deal brexit is pie in the sky no matter who the PM is come the autumn.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

Just to increase Ringo's blood pressure,Mr Bercow isn't for retiring quite yet.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48441344

So a no-deal brexit is pie in the sky no matter who the PM is come the autumn.

No-deal Brexit was always pie in the sky, it doesn't actually exist.

[RingoMcCartney]

Well no, spoken like someone answering the question posed above about the inequalities in the various parts of the UK.

The referendum does not solve that.

We've been in the EU and the common market for 40 odd years. During that time we've had tory Labour and coalition.

The north and the Midlands, Wales, the west country have been forgotten.

As I said on lbc, the referendum gave a voice , to the voiceless. Whether you believe it is utterly irrelevant. But 17.4 million people believe that EU membership has been bad for themselves, their families, town and country. The spoke and voted on the basis of a " once in a generation decision. What ever you decide, the government will implement that decision."

Now if that decision is ignored. Or its overridden before its implementation, then the suspicion , "they'll only ignore you, there's no point voting" This is what I said to Shelagh Fogerty and Ian Dale last year. And on here. Trust in the political class and democracy will be shattered, "permanently and transgenerationally" I said it would leave to low turnout and the possibility of extremists only needing a small number of votes to get elected.

And look what's happened.? The Brexit Party are not extremists. They've tapped into the anger that having being told that the referendum would be respected and implemented.

No doubt they'll be a load pile in about what I've just said. Couldn't care less. Millions and millions out there agree with those sentiments.

Labour , if they go 2nd referendum / Remain, will turn it's back on the voiceless 5 millions that voted Leave and previously Labour. Will never form a government again. They'll simply strengthen their vote in London gaining no extra seats, and lose seats like burnley, Hartlepool, merthyr, Bolsover, Pontefract, . Turn your back on your core vote and they'll turn their backs on you.

Don't believe me.?



Look at Scotland.