Brexit: Uniting the Country Since 31/01/2020

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Lancasterclaret
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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Lancasterclaret » Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:51 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:Yep there we go pull out the R card.

When you run out of real arguments, just call them racists.
You've got some front mate, I'll give you that.

You forgot what you posted last week or something?
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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Lowbankclaret » Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:51 pm

bfcmik wrote:The voting public is split somewhere around the 50% mark - if both sides go for tactical voting will it all balance out?
Well I live in a 66.6 % leave place.

Not sure that’s gunna help your 50/50 argument.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Lancasterclaret » Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:53 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:Well I live in a 66.6 % leave place.

Not sure that’s gunna help your 50/50 argument.
And there are people who live in 85% remain places in London.

If there is tactical voting, then absolutely anything could happen, but its very, very, very likely to be another hung parliament that doesn't help anyone sort this out.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Spijed » Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:58 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:Now come on, I have met you and your an intelligent guy.

No matter what he says, Parliament is not going to let him get out of the EU.

Parliament is a remain parliament and hence they will stop him.

That will play into his hands and the support of the public in my view.

My view is they will pay at the ballot box, but I may be wrong.

However I think not.
But how does he backtrack on the statement that he made that "We'll be leaving on the 31st October come what may, do or die"?

Most political commentators think he's finished if we don't leave by that date, and they think he will look weak if we haven't left.

And if it plays into his hands at the ballot box it'll mean the Brexit Party have suffered.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Lowbankclaret » Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:59 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:You've got some front mate, I'll give you that.

You forgot what you posted last week or something?
What the fact that Eastern European’s go around killing our fish.

That’s just real truth.
However I make no distinction, if it was African, Muslim or English people.

I would still want to kill them.

That’s not being racist, that’s animal protection.

If they were killing dogs or cats many would be in uproar.

But because it’s a fish, no one gives a ****.

So you can accuse me of being an angry ****, but I make no apology for defending helpless animals from anyone.

No matter of gender , colour, creed, religion, sexual orientation or otherwise.


You however called the R card. Typically.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Lancasterclaret » Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:03 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:What the fact that Eastern European’s go around killing our fish.

That’s just real truth.
However I make no distinction, if it was African, Muslim or English people.

I would still want to kill them.

That’s not being racist, that’s animal protection.

If they were killing dogs or cats many would be in uproar.

But because it’s a fish, no one gives a ****.

So you can accuse me of being an angry ****, but I make no apology for defending helpless animals from anyone.

No matter of gender , colour, creed, religion, sexual orientation or otherwise.


You however called the R card. Typically.
No words

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Darthlaw » Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:16 pm

Spijed wrote:But how does he backtrack on the statement that he made that "We'll be leaving on the 31st October come what may, do or die.
It seems the way he is doing it. He’s creating a people vs parliament argument. Suggesting that MP’s are frustrating our negotiations and actively trying to subvert Brexit.

It’s obvious to see. “I was taking you out and they stopped me. I was negotiating and they took my trump card off the table.” I’ll guarantee you no **** will stick to Teflon Boris.

Pretty much Trump 101 divide the people strategy.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by bfcmik » Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:22 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:Yep there we go pull out the R card.

When you run out of real arguments, just call them racists.
You're saying the spectre of Turks joining the EU and keeping our borders safe from those johnny foreigners wasn't used by the Leave campaign?

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Spijed » Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:25 pm

Darthlaw wrote:It seems the way he is doing it. He’s creating a people vs parliament argument. Suggesting that MP’s are frustrating our negotiations and actively trying to subvert Brexit.

It’s obvious to see. “I was taking you out and they stopped me. I was negotiating and they took my trump card off the table.” I’ll guarantee you no **** will stick to Teflon Boris.

Pretty much Trump 101 divide the people strategy.
But opinion polls look far more favourable for Boris if the UK has left by the 31st. He'll be seen as the PM who has managed to get Britain out of the EU. Whereas, if we are still in Europe the Tories will lose votes to the Brexit party.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by summitclaret » Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:27 pm

Darthlaw wrote:It seems the way he is doing it. He’s creating a people vs parliament argument. Suggesting that MP’s are frustrating our negotiations and actively trying to subvert Brexit.

It’s obvious to see. “I was taking you out and they stopped me. I was negotiating and they took my trump card off the table.” I’ll guarantee you no **** will stick to Teflon Boris.

Pretty much Trump 101 divide the people strategy.
Add to that and they won't even agree to a GE because they are scared of the outcome and just want to block brexit. Also the HOC will probably vote any new deal down, which will strengthen his hand even more at the GE. So I don't think the 31st Oct is that big an issue for him anymore.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by aggi » Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:36 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:Well as far as I understand it.

There was a run on Northern rock as banks admitted they were in trouble.

I bought £1000 of Northern rock thinking the gov would not let it go bust. Wrong £1000 gone.

I think HBOS were next who I had loads of shares in, think there was some insider dealing as RBS bought it out. Wrongly as it turns out.

Realising RBS and Barclays were next on the going bust list the Gov stepped in and took a 75% stake in RBS with public money and I think a 30% stake in Barclays.

The treasury then stepped in to ease markets as the whole banking system would have collapsed worldwide.

I bought Barclays at 80p, gov sold their stake in Barclays, I sold Barclays shares at £3. Recovering my loss in Northern Rock

I still have loads of shares in RBS, most I got as inheritance from my grandad as HBOS shares which were £8-9 at time and are still worth about 60p today.

The EU did not step in to stop this as it would have been a worldwide catastrophe but it was against EU rules.

What’s more worrying is that the actions of the banks that led to this are still carrying on today.

The next time the world will not be able to afford to bail out the banks.

All the Tory austerity was caused by the banks, don’t ever forget that.
The EU didn't stop it but they certainly intervened which resulted in quite a change in the makeup of UK banking.

As for the actions carrying on today, the capital requirements are much more stringent than they used to be.

I would suspect that post-Brexit a number of UK banking regulations will be relaxed in the interest of generating business and the absence of threat of a transaction tax will boost high frequency trading (whether that is a good or bad thing will obviously depend on your viewpoint).

Tory austerity being solely caused by banks obviously isn't in line with many posters on here who are certain that the labour party was the cause of it. Plus of course austerity wasn't the only solution.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Right_winger » Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:38 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:Yep there we go pull out the R card.

When you run out of real arguments, just call them racists.
The PC brigade love to spam this worn out cliché

They have done a lot of damage to modern society with their manipulation of young minds this PC brigade. Thankfully as people get older and experience real life they begin to see through the fog of PC shite and actually apply common sense to real life situations.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by martin_p » Tue Sep 24, 2019 7:15 am

Right_winger wrote:The PC brigade love to spam this worn out cliché
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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by JohnMcGreal » Tue Sep 24, 2019 7:34 am

Right_winger wrote:The PC brigade love to spam this worn out cliché

They have done a lot of damage to modern society with their manipulation of young minds this PC brigade. Thankfully as people get older and experience real life they begin to see through the fog of PC shite and actually apply common sense to real life situations.
I seem to remember a load of 'older people with real life experience' who applied their idea of 'common sense to real life situations' around three years ago.

How's that working out?

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Spijed » Tue Sep 24, 2019 7:36 am

Right_winger wrote:The PC brigade love to spam this worn out cliché

They have done a lot of damage to modern society with their manipulation of young minds this PC brigade. Thankfully as people get older and experience real life they begin to see through the fog of PC shite and actually apply common sense to real life situations.
........

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 7:44 am

Right_winger wrote:The PC brigade love to spam this worn out cliché

They have done a lot of damage to modern society with their manipulation of young minds this PC brigade. Thankfully as people get older and experience real life they begin to see through the fog of PC shite and actually apply common sense to real life situations.
No words (again)
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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 7:57 am

And today we find out whether its legal to shut down parliament as a PM for whatever reason.

If the government lose, then at least we can still pretend its still a democracy

If the government wins, then all pretence is over.

Brexit is a minor show compared to that

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by aggi » Tue Sep 24, 2019 8:24 am

Personally my bigger issue about the prorogation is the way they're treating the public as stupid.

I'd have had more respect for the process if they'd been honest and said the purpose of it was Brexit. As it is they're just taking the **** out of everyone by pretending it's nothing to do with Brexit.

Whether you're for or against Brexit you should be against politicians lying to you.
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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by claret2018 » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:10 am

YOU MAY TAKE OUR FISH BUT YOU’LL NEVER TAKE OUR FREEDOM!!

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by summitclaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:17 am

Another lie from remainers sunk.

BBC News - Brext: 'No evidence' of crimes by Leave.EU and Arron Banks
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49807401" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by AndrewJB » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:23 am

summitclaret wrote:Another lie from remainers sunk.

BBC News - Brext: 'No evidence' of crimes by Leave.EU and Arron Banks
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49807401" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Is that the Arron Banks who tweeted about freak August storms when Greta Thunberg sailed to the US?

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by martin_p » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:29 am

AndrewJB wrote:Is that the Arron Banks who tweeted about freak August storms when Greta Thunberg sailed to the US?
Surely you remember all those people who crucified Jo Brand for her battery acid/Farage joke coming on here and expressing their outrage?

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by summitclaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:31 am

The next lie to be slain is that BJ and the Tories want a no deal Brexit. I know that it suits remainers to keep lying but the voters will not be taken in.

How many times does he and others have to say that they want a free trade deal but will leave without a deal if the EU insist on the clearly undemocratic backstop as brexit needs to be sorted.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by martin_p » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:32 am

summitclaret wrote:The next lie to be slain is that BJ and the Tories want a no deal Brexit. I know that it suits remainers to keep lying but the voters will not be taken in.

How many times does he and others have to say that they want a free trade deal but will leave without a deal if the EU insist on the clearly undemocratic backstop as brexit needs to be sorted.
Why is the backstop clearly undemocratic?

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Right_winger » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:41 am

martin_p wrote:Why is the backstop clearly undemocratic?
Because it keeps the UK tied to the EU. People voted to leave the EU therefore it’s in democratic. Not difficult to understand.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by martin_p » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:44 am

Right_winger wrote:Because it keeps the UK tied to the EU. People voted to leave the EU therefore it’s in democratic. Not difficult to understand.
Only until such time as we’ve sorted the Irish border. And if the backstop comes into play we’ll have left the EU. Not difficult to understand.
Last edited by martin_p on Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by summitclaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:44 am

If you don't know by now you must must have no ability to understand another side's views.

I will give you a clue. The backstop could only be left when the EU say we could or a court that always sides with them or an arbitration that they can influence the chair of.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by martin_p » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:47 am

summitclaret wrote:If you don't know by now you must must have no ability to understand another side's views.

I will give you a clue. The backstop could only be left when the EU say we could or a court that always sides with them or an arbitration that they can influence the chair of.
So it takes agreement of both sides to end the backstop rather than one side being allowed to do something unilaterally. Which sounds more ‘democratic’?

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Erasmus » Tue Sep 24, 2019 9:52 am

I completely agree with Aggi on the point about prorogation. Is it now acceptable for a PM to tell bare-faced lies that everyone knows are lies? I just find the the presumption that people will simply accept his lying something terrible. Does Boris Johnson really think we have sunk that low?

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Right_winger » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:18 am

martin_p wrote:So it takes agreement of both sides to end the backstop rather than one side being allowed to do something unilaterally. Which sounds more ‘democratic’?
You clearly have no comprehension of what you are actually saying.

So the backstop is a device mainly designed by the EU in which to protect their SM/CU. If we leave no deal then the EU do not want a backdoor into their protectionist market, however the device is also very useful in negotiations as we will be bound by rules which we have no influence over for ever and a day so the EU can basically bully us into a deal which suits them. If we stand up to them we could be left in the backstop paralysis forever and a day, abiding by rules and regulations we have no influence over.

The democratic will of the United Kingdom is to leave the EU, not be bound by its tentacles forever and a day. If you don’t understand that point you are either more dense than you appear.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by summitclaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:19 am

martin_p wrote:So it takes agreement of both sides to end the backstop rather than one side being allowed to do something unilaterally. Which sounds more ‘democratic’?
A50 says we can leave if no deal agreed by the deadline if we decide not to ask to extend. The draft treaty says we can only leave if the backstop is sorted. It's not rocket science. As a strong leaver ( with a deal) i would rather remain for now than sign up to the current backstop because it retains our right to leave unilaterally.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by martin_p » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:21 am

Right_winger wrote:You clearly have no comprehension of what you are actually saying.

So the backstop is a device mainly designed by the EU in which to protect their SM/CU. If we leave no deal then the EU do not want a backdoor into their protectionist market, however the device is also very useful in negotiations as we will be bound by rules which we have no influence over for ever and a day so the EU can basically bully us into a deal which suits them. If we stand up to them we could be left in the backstop paralysis forever and a day, abiding by rules and regulations we have no influence over.

The democratic will of the United Kingdom is to leave the EU, not be bound by its tentacles forever and a day. If you don’t understand that point you are either more dense than you appear.
It’s this ‘we don’t trust foreigners’ attitude that got us into this mess in the first place. It’s not a trap, it’s to stop a border in Ireland.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Right_winger » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:28 am

martin_p wrote:It’s this ‘we don’t trust foreigners’ attitude that got us into this mess in the first place. It’s not a trap, it’s to stop a border in Ireland.
You think the EU are acting in good faith? How naive.

Here’s a question for you who stipulates that there has to be a hard border in Ireland? Uk or the EU?

Going back to your original point can you provide me with any evidence that the people of the UK democratically expressed a wish for an Irish backstop?

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by RingoMcCartney » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:30 am

martin_p wrote:It’s this ‘we don’t trust foreigners’ attitude that got us into this mess in the first place. It’s not a trap, it’s to stop a border in Ireland.
The uk voted to leave the EU.

Using your evangelical europhile logic. Both partners in an abusive relationship would have to give their consent, before they can go their seperate ways!!!

Never ever get a job as a marriage guidance counselor Marty!!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Tall Paul » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:40 am

Right_winger wrote:The democratic will of the United Kingdom is to leave the EU, not be bound by its tentacles forever and a day. If you don’t understand that point you are either more dense than you appear.
..or incapable of finishing a sentence properly.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Bordeauxclaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:47 am

Another good day for Boris.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by BleedingClaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:52 am

Bordeauxclaret wrote:Another good day for Boris.
They want him to resign for democracies sake
But they don’t want a GE ????

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:57 am

*BOOM*

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by AndrewJB » Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:57 am

Right_winger wrote:You clearly have no comprehension of what you are actually saying.

So the backstop is a device mainly designed by the EU in which to protect their SM/CU. If we leave no deal then the EU do not want a backdoor into their protectionist market, however the device is also very useful in negotiations as we will be bound by rules which we have no influence over for ever and a day so the EU can basically bully us into a deal which suits them. If we stand up to them we could be left in the backstop paralysis forever and a day, abiding by rules and regulations we have no influence over.

The democratic will of the United Kingdom is to leave the EU, not be bound by its tentacles forever and a day. If you don’t understand that point you are either more dense than you appear.
The backstop was designed by British negotiators to get around the Irish border issue. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_backstop" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by ClaretMoffitt » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:02 am

The liberal elite are slowly but surely getting their way.

Working class people may as well not bother voting in future. If those at the top don't like their vote, they will just frustrate the process to the point of it never being enacted at all.

That may be absolutely fine with many on here, but one day it will bite them in their rear.
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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by JohnMcGreal » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:03 am

Parliament is sovereign.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by AndrewJB » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:06 am

Erasmus wrote:I completely agree with Aggi on the point about prorogation. Is it now acceptable for a PM to tell bare-faced lies that everyone knows are lies? I just find the the presumption that people will simply accept his lying something terrible. Does Boris Johnson really think we have sunk that low?
It’s the press that are a kind of rudder for British public opinion; playing down Johnson’s transgressions, lies, and outright refusal to even comment on certain issues, while playing him up as a kind of “people’s champion” and misrepresenting the political situation as the people’s own elected representatives and judiciary as against the people. If Corbyn or Swinson had prorogued Parliament, the Daily Mail would be falling for revolution.
Last edited by AndrewJB on Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Mala591 » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:06 am

The democratic will of the people is sovereign.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by ClaretMoffitt » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:07 am

Mala591 wrote:The democratic will of the people is sovereign.
unless you vote the way the powerful and influential don't like.

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Devils_Advocate » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:09 am

Image

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Spijed » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:10 am

ClaretMoffitt wrote:The liberal elite are slowly but surely getting their way.

Working class people may as well not bother voting in future. If those at the top don't like their vote, they will just frustrate the process to the point of it never being enacted at all.

That may be absolutely fine with many on here, but one day it will bite them in their rear.
If the ERG and the Brexit party win enough seats at the next GE then you can get your way.

What's the problem?

Claret-On-A-T-Rex
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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Claret-On-A-T-Rex » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:11 am

ClaretMoffitt wrote: Working class people may as well not bother voting in future.
I totally agree, or rather there should be some sort of IQ test.

One interesting fact that has been brought to light by the referendum is that if there had been a IQ threshold score of 80+ to vote then the result would have been 100% Remain.

Cryssys
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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Cryssys » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:12 am

Perhaps Boris could appeal to the ECJ?

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by BleedingClaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:12 am

AndrewJB wrote:It’s the press that are a kind of rudder for British public opinion; playing down Johnson’s transgressions, lies, and outright refusal to even comment on certain issues, while playing him up as a kind of “people’s champion” and misrepresenting the political situation as the people’s own elected representatives and judiciary as against the people. If Corbyn or Swinson had prorogued Parliament, the Daily Mail would be falling for revolution.
I’ve submitted this to Collins as the greatest example of Irony there has ever been

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Re: Brexit: The Naked Truth

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:13 am

ClaretMoffitt wrote:The liberal elite are slowly but surely getting their way.

Working class people may as well not bother voting in future. If those at the top don't like their vote, they will just frustrate the process to the point of it never being enacted at all.

That may be absolutely fine with many on here, but one day it will bite them in their rear.
The ruling said it was nothing to do with Brexit.

But hey, lets just go off on one about libs eh?

You either have a government that obeys the law, or you don't. Glad to see that you don't want a government to obey the law.

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