Brexit: Uniting the Country Since 31/01/2020

[RingoMcCartney]

You are asking me if I'm going to vote Lib Dem if they support a revoking of Article 50.

Every answer I've given you tells you the answer.

And you have , indeed, confirmed previously, with

Of course

You also said about any party that achieves a majority or can form a majority government

in theory with a majority they could do whatever they wanted

So you've admitted that , even though you may not agree with everything in a manifesto, youd vote for a party that would stop brexit without a referendum

Given the inevitable purge, and deselection of remainers in the Tory party before a general election. The tory party could go into an election on a ticket of leaving the EU without a referendum or form a coalition with the brexit who certainly would.

So again, I ask you, if a party has been elected on a manifesto pledge to take us out of the European Union without a referendum, did just that?

Be honest.

How would you feel?

[Imploding Turtle]

Still pretending to give a **** about democracy, eh Ringo?

[Lowbankclaret]

lol. It's more democratic than this country.

Yep, every single country that has voted against anything the EU wanted was either made to vote again or just simply ignored.

We will end up voting again. Project fear will get a remain vote.

In ten years people will be pleading to get out.

But the controlling elite won’t make the same mistake and allow the plebs a vote.

[RingoMcCartney]

Still pretending to give a **** about democracy, eh Ringo?

No. But certainly not pretending that I give a toss about what you think.

Thank you.

[Imploding Turtle]

Yep, every single country that has voted against anything the EU wanted was either made to vote again or just simply ignored.

We will end up voting again. Project fear will get a remain vote.

In ten years people will be pleading to get out.

But the controlling elite won’t make the same mistake and allow the plebs a vote.

You're full of ****. You know that, right? You know I know that, right? Who do you think is going to blindly accept your bullshit? Ringo? Andy? Maybe, but they probably don't even think climate change is human's fault and probably don't even think evolution is real. That's the calibre of mind you're going to get believing you.

[Right_winger]

You're full of ****. You know that, right? You know I know that, right? Who do you think is going to blindly accept your bullshit? Ringo? Andy? Maybe, but they probably don't even think climate change is human's fault and probably don't even think evolution is real. That's the calibre of mind you're going to get believing you.

You were bullied as a child weren’t you?

[Jakubclaret]

Because climbing a mountain is a good reference point

Just thinking of a challenging analogy, I could have said swimming the English Channel or something similar, I dread to think of if there had families to support & the wage was on some sort of commission based piece rate, they'd all go hungry.

[AndrewJB]

I know people don’t like this but it’s a fact.
We contribute either the second or third most amount of money into the EU.
Not only does it need that money, it’s budget has already spent future contributions.

It’s also not a level playing field or a democracy.

That’s my main issues.

Germany has a regional bank that can and does bail out German companies but we cannot.

The EU stifle the UK actively and that I fundamentally disagree with.

I disagree with most of what you’ve written there on a point by point basis, but are you saying these are reasons why the government’s approach of aiming at a harder Brexit immediately (and all the consequent pitfalls, problems, time it’s taken that have arisen as a result - many of which have been unfairly blamed on parliament) is better than what I suggested?

[RingoMcCartney]

You're full of ****. You know that, right? You know I know that, right? Who do you think is going to blindly accept your bullshit? Ringo? Andy? Maybe, but they probably don't even think climate change is human's fault and probably don't even think evolution is real. That's the calibre of mind you're going to get believing you.

Your posts single handedly disprove the theory of evolution.

[RingoMcCartney]

You were bullied as a child weren’t you?

You talk of him being a child in the past tense Right Winger.

You could be being a little premature!

[RingoMcCartney]

You do seriously need some help.

I grow some seedlings every year and go plant them in the countryside when they are about a year old.

I take cuttings of fruit shrubs like blackcurrent etc and plant them around for birds to be able to eat them.

I go on litter picking trips with other groups around Burnley.

So wtf do you do.

Hides deep in the bowels of the Turtle Bunker.

[Lowbankclaret]

You're full of ****. You know that, right? You know I know that, right? Who do you think is going to blindly accept your bullshit? Ringo? Andy? Maybe, but they probably don't even think climate change is human's fault and probably don't even think evolution is real. That's the calibre of mind you're going to get believing you.

6B9C10F0-EAAE-431A-89A2-6147C208EC34.jpeg (1.94 MiB) Viewed 1052 times

This years seeds planted to germinate and plant out next year as seedlings.

[AndrewJB]

That could be true, but my point remains that the process should be far more advanced than it is currently, it just seems everytime progress is being made, some stalling mechanism kicks in & it's more regression than progression.

Letwin’s amendment just keeps the chance of a no deal at arms length. It doesn’t stop Brexit. Consider that it was put forward and voted for by people who intend to vote for the deal the EU forced on Johnson. What it highlights is the extremely low level of trust a majority of MPs have in Johnson, and his more extreme ERG people. A level of mistrust they’ve earned through their scandalous extremism.

[Imploding Turtle]

You do seriously need some help.

I grow some seedlings every year and go plant them in the countryside when they are about a year old.

I take cuttings of fruit shrubs like blackcurrent etc and plant them around for birds to be able to eat them.

I go on litter picking trips with other groups around Burnley.

So wtf do you do.

And none of that matters because you vote for and support politicians who deny climate science and inhibit action. What do you think Brexit is? It is, in part, an attempt by billionaires to deregulate this country, including the limited regulations we have intended to encourage greener energy.

If XR are hypocrites for taking money from someone who profits from the aviation industry then you're certainly a hypocrite for supporting policies that are intended to reverse what little action we've taken on climate change.

[Lowbankclaret]

And none of that matters because you vote for and support politicians who deny climate science and inhibit action. What do you think Brexit is? It is, in part, an attempt by billionaires to deregulate this country, including the limited regulations we have intended to encourage greener energy.

If XR are hypocrites for taking money from someone who profits from the aviation industry then you're certainly a hypocrite for supporting policies that are intended to reverse what little action we've taken on climate change.

Like al ER people you don’t answer the question.

What the F ck do you do.

Like them nothing.

Just spout sh t on a website.

[Imploding Turtle]

Like al ER people you don’t answer the question.

What the F ck do you do.

Like them nothing.

Just spout sh t on a website.

I didn't think your question was serious. I thought you were joking, that's how dumb i thought your question was. But anyway...

I have the carbon footprint of a gnat, i share climate science with those who are ignorant, and i donate to climate change awareness charities. Oooh, look at me and how virtuous I am.

Oh, and none of that would matter one iota is i voted for climate science denying *****, and those who oppose action.

[Lowbankclaret]

I didn't think your question was serious. I thought you were joking, that's how dumb i thought your question was. But anyway...

I have the carbon footprint of a gnat, i share climate science with those who are ignorant, and i donate to climate change awareness charities. Oooh, look at me and how virtuous I am.

Oh, and none of that would matter one iota is i voted for climate science denying *****, and those who oppose action.

Oh really, you have the internet, one of the biggest contributors to carbon footprint.

You have a way to contribute to this forum, a modern use of electric.

So let’s explore how your carbon footprint is so small.

Do you have a TV.

Do you have a car?

How far is your food transported before it gets to you??

[Imploding Turtle]

Oh really, you have the internet, one of the biggest contributors to carbon footprint.

You have a way to contribute to this forum, a modern use of electric.

So let’s explore how your carbon footprint is so small.

Do you have a TV.

Do you have a car?

How far is your food transported before it gets to you??

lol. Yes. I "have the internet". Nothing gets past you does it, genius?

I'm such a hypocrite on climate change because I "have the internet".

[Imploding Turtle]

Uh oh. He's going to accuse me of not answering his prying questions.

No, no, and I don't know.

[Lowbankclaret]

Uh oh. He's going to accuse me of not answering his prying questions.

No, no, and I don't know.

Well if your going to have an educated debate.

You don’t have a carbon footprint of a gnat as you claim.

[BennyD]

You do seriously need some help.

I grow some seedlings every year and go plant them in the countryside when they are about a year old.

I take cuttings of fruit shrubs like blackcurrent etc and plant them around for birds to be able to eat them.

I go on litter picking trips with other groups around Burnley.

So wtf do you do.

What I do is foe the dozy prick, and having done so life is much, much better. Consequently, I regard him as nothing more than a troll, and everything he says is purely for effect. Just watch him have a pop at me, but I can’t see it so bollocxs to him. Happy days.

[ClaretAndJew]

We need to make society better.

BUT YOU TAKE PART IN SOCIETY.

[BennyD]

And that’s whyI voted to leave.

[BennyD]

Letwin’s amendment just keeps the chance of a no deal at arms length. It doesn’t stop Brexit. Consider that it was put forward and voted for by people who intend to vote for the deal the EU forced on Johnson. What it highlights is the extremely low level of trust a majority of MPs have in Johnson, and his more extreme ERG people. A level of mistrust they’ve earned through their scandalous extremism.

Bollocxs.

[BennyD]

Like al ER people you don’t answer the question.

What the F ck do you do.

Like them nothing.

Just spout sh t on a website.

That sums up exploding tortoise to a T. That’s why I foe the ****.

[nil_desperandum]

Bollocxs.

So you consider Johnson to be trustworthy then?
Despite all the evidence to the contrary in his dubious past?
Even his own brother and sister have serious issues with him.

[Lancasterclaret]

Bollocxs.

Well no

Thats why we are where we are.

The ERG have voted en masse for this deal.

Why?

Ask yourself why.

[BennyD]

Among the current crop of egotistical wannabes, he is trustworthy. Churchill had a sh!t history, but that didn’t stop him becoming the best PM we’ve ever had and it’s not what he has done that matters, it’s what he’s doing that counts and he’s doing more than most people thought he would.

[Lancasterclaret]

Among the current crop of egotistical wannabes, he is trustworthy. Churchill had a sh!t history, but that didn’t stop him becoming the best PM we’ve ever had and it’s not what he has done that matters, it’s what he’s doing that counts and he’s doing more than most people thought he would.

Thats true.

I didn't think he'd lose every vote he's tried to be fair.

[TheFamilyCat]

Among the current crop of egotistical wannabes, he is trustworthy. Churchill had a sh!t history, but that didn’t stop him becoming the best PM we’ve ever had and it’s not what he has done that matters, it’s what he’s doing that counts and he’s doing more than most people thought he would.

Wow, you're really gay for Boris aren't you?

[Jakubclaret]

Letwin’s amendment just keeps the chance of a no deal at arms length. It doesn’t stop Brexit. Consider that it was put forward and voted for by people who intend to vote for the deal the EU forced on Johnson. What it highlights is the extremely low level of trust a majority of MPs have in Johnson, and his more extreme ERG people. A level of mistrust they’ve earned through their scandalous extremism.

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing on BJ or any of the European research group, I've never personally met or spoken to any of them, so it wouldn't be fair criticising any of them, you could be right though that certain MPs mistrust them, that assessment & judgement could perhaps be based on them knowing each other on a professional/personal level. It's wise I think to base opinions when the full facts have been established.

[RingoMcCartney]

Thats true.

I didn't think he'd lose every vote he's tried to be fair.

You are asking me if I'm going to vote Lib Dem if they support a revoking of Article 50.

Every answer I've given you tells you the answer.

And you have , indeed, confirmed previously, with

Of course

You also said about any party that achieves a majority or can form a majority government

in theory with a majority they could do whatever they wanted

So you've admitted that , even though you may not agree with everything in a manifesto, youd vote for a party that would stop brexit without a referendum

Given the inevitable purge, and deselection of remainers in the Tory party before a general election. The tory party could go into an election on a ticket of leaving the EU without a referendum or form a coalition with the brexit who certainly would.

So again, I ask you, if a party has been elected on a manifesto pledge to take us out of the European Union without a referendum, did just that?

Be honest.

How would you feel?

[martin_p]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing on BJ or any of the European research group, I've never personally met or spoken to any of them, so it wouldn't be fair criticising any of them, you could be right though that certain MPs mistrust them, that assessment & judgement could perhaps be based on them knowing each other on a professional/personal level. It's wise I think to base opinions when the full facts have been established.

There’s numerous times Boris Johnson has been caught lying and that’s a fact.

[RingoMcCartney]

Thats true.

I didn't think he'd lose every vote he's tried to be fair.

Why is it proving so so difficult for you to answer a genuine question?

if a party has been elected on a manifesto pledge to take us out of the European Union without a referendum, did just that?

Be honest.

How would you feel?

[Jakubclaret]

There’s numerous times Boris Johnson has been caught lying and that’s a fact.

That's something I can't be 100% about, if you can be 100% that's upto you.

[Devils_Advocate]

Stay strong Ringo

[IanMcL]

Mr Johnson is self deluded, immature and a danger to us all.
He certainly is not representing the country very well. Just showing his childish petulance, learned at his Top hat club.

[AndrewJB]

Among the current crop of egotistical wannabes, he is trustworthy. Churchill had a sh!t history, but that didn’t stop him becoming the best PM we’ve ever had and it’s not what he has done that matters, it’s what he’s doing that counts and he’s doing more than most people thought he would.

Attlee was a better prime minister than Churchill. Arguably the Pitts were better “war PMs” and in terms of achievements, Palmerston, Gladstone, Disraeli (widening the franchise), and Asquith are ahead too. All a matter of opinion, of course. Churchill is often held up as a kind of “peoples’ choice“ best PM - though a better judge should be the people of the time, who turfed him in a Labour landslide. Johnson is far from being in any of this company. To go to Brussels and return with a worse deal than May’s is not an achievement of merit. You don’t want to consider his past failures - fine, but he’s racked up a fair few failures very quickly as PM.

[martin_p]

That's something I can't be 100% about, if you can be 100% that's upto you.

Here’s a handy summary for you.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.inde ... html%3famp

[IanMcL]

Churchill was good at war....because he did not lose any sleep, when sending folk to their death.

It is probably what war needs.

[nil_desperandum]

Among the current crop of egotistical wannabes, he is trustworthy. .

That's quite a claim to make.
I'm hard pressed to think of any current MP who is less trustworthy based on the available evidence.
He was initially sacked by The Times for lying in an important article.
He later became editor of the Spectator in 1999 after telling owner Conrad Black, (who was later convicted of fraud), that he would not pursue a political career. This promise was broken in 2001 when he won election as Conservative MP for Henley in Oxfordshire.
Three years later he was forced to apologise for an article in tht magazine which blamed drunken Liverpool fans for the 1989 Hillsborough disaster and suggested that the people of the city were wallowing in their victim status.
When Michael Howard became leader of the Conservatives in 2003 he gave Boris Johnson two new jobs – party vice-chairman and shadow arts minister.
He was sacked from both positions in November 2004 after assuring Mr Howard that tabloid reports of his affair with Spectator columnist Petronella Wyatt were false and an “inverted pyramid of piffle”. When the story was found to be true, he refused to resign.
As London Mayor: Having promised in his 2008 manifesto to ensure there would be manned ticket offices at every train station, he quickly agreed to widespread closures to pay for a 24-hour tube.
He also promised to eradicate rough sleeping by 2012, only for it to double during his leadership. He was also accused of telling “barefaced lies” after he stated that police numbers had increased in London despite government cuts.
He also backed the infamous claim on the side of the bus that the UK was sending £350m a week to the EU, followed by “let’s fund our NHS instead”. The UK Statistics Authority issued an official statement in May 2016 describing the claim as “misleading”, but Mr Johnson repeated it in an article in the Telegraph in September 2017.
Additionally he made ridiculous claims about Turkey's imminent membership of the EU, despite no evidence to support this, and of course an innocent British woman is stuck in an Iranian prison due to his careless undiplomatic talk.
Oh, and lest we forget, he is widely assumed to have lied to the Queen over the reasons for prorogation, though that cannot be proven.
Edit: Martin you linked an article whilst I was busy extrapolating the info from a few sources. Anyway, people don't always open links, so my research might go a little further to bring Johnson's character into question.

[AndrewJB]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing on BJ or any of the European research group, I've never personally met or spoken to any of them, so it wouldn't be fair criticising any of them, you could be right though that certain MPs mistrust them, that assessment & judgement could perhaps be based on them knowing each other on a professional/personal level. It's wise I think to base opinions when the full facts have been established.

Does your wisdom extend to judging the promises made by leave supporters that have turned out not to be true?

[Lancasterclaret]

Why is it proving so so difficult for you to answer a genuine question?

if a party has been elected on a manifesto pledge to take us out of the European Union without a referendum, did just that?

Be honest.

How would you feel?

We've been here before Ringo

I've already answered it.

I genuinely don't get why you think I haven't.

Anyone who follows this thread and reads my posts will know where I stand on this one.

[Jakubclaret]

Here’s a handy summary for you.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.inde ... html%3famp

I can't think of a better way of knowing a mans integrity with certainty than actually speaking & spending time in somebody's company psychically, I'm not saying you are wrong at all by stating BJ is a liar you can't expect me to share that view, if I believed everything I read in the newspapers & everything I watched on the television, I'd be believing some truth & some BS. It works for me to keep a open mind that's just the way I do things.

[Lancasterclaret]

I can't think of a better way of knowing a mans integrity with certainty than actually speaking & spending time in somebody's company psychically, I'm not saying you are wrong at all by stating BJ is a liar you can't expect me to share that view, if I believed everything I read in the newspapers & everything I watched on the television, I'd be believing some truth & some BS. It works for me to keep a open mind that's just the way I do things.

The "I never met Fred West so I've got to keep an open mind whether he killed all those people" is a bonkers defence.

[martin_p]

I can't think of a better way of knowing a mans integrity with certainty than actually speaking & spending time in somebody's company psychically, I'm not saying you are wrong at all by stating BJ is a liar you can't expect me to share that view, if I believed everything I read in the newspapers & everything I watched on the television, I'd be believing some truth & some BS. It works for me to keep a open mind that's just the way I do things.

Yeah, well a man I worked with and managed over a number of years and seemed sound as a pound was convicted of murdering his wife last week. So it doesn’t really work that way.

[TheFamilyCat]

The "I never met Fred West so I've got to keep an open mind whether he killed all those people" is a bonkers defence.

And if Jakub did meet Boris and spend time with him psychically (eh?) and Boris said "I've never lied" he'd believe that over all the evidence to the contrary.

[Spijed]

Reading the tweets from Lewis Goodall (Sky) it's now becoming apparent how much of a disaster the Letwin amendment is for the Government.

https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/statu ... 0279352322" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Jakubclaret]

Yeah, well a man I worked with and managed over a number of years and seemed sound as a pound was convicted of murdering his wife last week. So it doesn’t really work that way.

Exactly, you never know & what you did think about the man initially being a nice bloke & later it transpiring that he was capable of murdering his wife, it was probably a shock that you made that incorrect judgement, you don't know what led up to this particular course of action. With that story it demonstrates never be sure & people change, it actually reinforces my point in keeping a open mind.

[martin_p]

Exactly, you never know & what you did think about the man initially being a nice bloke & later it transpiring that he was capable of murdering his wife, it was probably a shock that you made that incorrect judgement, you don't know what led up to this particular course of action. With that story it demonstrates never be sure & people change, it actually reinforces my point in keeping a open mind.

Nope, it destroys your point that you have to meet someone to know their character. I found out far more about him in the press than I ever did face to face.