Brexit: Uniting the Country Since 31/01/2020

[JohnMcGreal]

We're going to end up revoking article 50 at the last minute.

[Lancasterclaret]

Been mentioned by his assistants outside Andy!

[Inchy]

Blair was sound apart from the war sh*t.

[AndyClaret]

Nadine Dorries and David Davis voted for the deal.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

Were you born a dim gormless undemocratic narrow minded repetitive tw@t or have you had to work hard at it..?

Have you any idea how cretinous your posts are?

But RIGHT.

Don't you see what's happening? I've been RIGHT from the start and I'll be RIGHT at the end.

And I'll be LAUGHING, LAUGHING long and hard.

And I'll be QUOTING, QUOTING all my old posts.

And you'll be SICK, SICK and defeated and wrong like poor little Theresa May tonight.

[South West Claret.]

If we dont honour the referendum then what is the point in anyone voting for anything
Government included

What referendum? oh you mean the “uninformed referendum” all that was Cameron trying to and failing to silence his ant-European lot and got the biggest surprise of his life when most people used the ref. to give this useless Government a good kicking.

[Lancasterclaret]

Got to admit here Claret-On-A-T-Rex, not sure this is helping.

Hampers is never going to change his mind, but others might, and its not a good idea to stick them all together.

[dpinsussex]

What referendum? oh you mean the “uninformed referendum” all that was Cameron trying to and failing to silence his ant-European lot and got the biggest surprise of his life when most people used the ref. to give this useless Government a good kicking.

At least this government had a plan unlike the dithering idiot on the other side of the house.

[CrosspoolClarets]

I will predict that tomorrow the same people who abused others for disagreeing with “experts” will selectively ignore the “experts” who have predicted that a clever, managed no deal will be only marginally damaging to us but disasterous to Ireland. These models are now becoming clear and it would massively help our deal if we used it as a bargaining chip.

Sadly, our muppet MPs will do the exact opposite.

(I would have voted for her deal of course tonight but I am talking about taking no deal off the table)

[JohnMcGreal]

I will predict that tomorrow the same people who abused others for disagreeing with “experts” will selectively ignore the “experts” who have predicted that a clever, managed no deal will be only marginally damaging to us but disasterous to Ireland. These models are now becoming clear and it would massively help our deal if we used it as a bargaining chip.

Sadly, our muppet MPs will do the exact opposite.

(I would have voted for her deal of course tonight but I am talking about taking no deal off the table)

No deal is suicide. No sane Parliament would ever vote for it.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

R.I.P. BREXIT



Two choices from Brussels which May agreed to last night, second referendum or revoke article 50.

Oh well, it was fun while it lasted.

[Lancasterclaret]

I will predict that tomorrow the same people who abused others for disagreeing with “experts” will selectively ignore the “experts” who have predicted that a clever, managed no deal will be only marginally damaging to us but disasterous to Ireland

Show us the plans Crosspool, show us the managed "No Deal" plans that get us out of this mess.

We haven't planned for a "No Deal", because people said we'd never need it, because its all "Project Fear".

This is reality, and we need to deal with the issues in a realistic way.

Unicornism was so last week.

[CrosspoolClarets]

I’d also say that the CU Labour deal would be great if all had been rosy in the U.K. / EU economic garden over the last decade, but the truth it it hasn’t.

We have had stagnant wages, been decimated by free movement, and it has hugely contributed to poverty and food banks in my view. The tariffs in the CU haven’t helped which is why I oppose it.

If there is a 25 year old Spanish Business Studies graduate who is here because they can’t get a job in Spain due to austerity (hence the MASSIVE youth unemployment in the southern EU), and they apply for a job in a supermarket here, why on earth would the boss choose a youngster from the U.K. instead? Of course they wouldn’t. That’s the problem with free movement. Amazes me that Corbyn seems happy with it.

[Taffy on the wing]

As someone who is by no means a Tory supporter, I do think she's proven her willpower. I do think she's trying to do whatever she feels is best for the country, unlike pretty much every other politician in that House.

Is that supposed to be funny?...........take a look in the doorways all around the UK...full of homeless, destitute people!
All because of this stupid, stubborn woman!........May she rot in Hell.

[South West Claret.]

Absolutely. Strong supporter of Tony Blair as far as "political compass" goes - obviously, don't agree with everything he did.

But, boy, doesn't Labour need someone like him right now?

Political Compass? Oh you mean governing like a sudo Tory Government, in all the wasted years that the so called Labour Government were in power under Blair he managed to achieve what?

Cosying up to that neo-con Bush junior to prosecute an illegal very bloody war which has led to hundreds and thousands of people being killed and opened up the can of worms we see today in the Middle East,getting into bed with Murdoch rather then crushing him and his empire and failing to repeal Thatchers anti-employee laws leading to today’s low wage economy.

Thanks thanks for nothing.

[Greenmile]

Have a look at my comments and you'll see me quite clearly stating that neither side are any good at running the country, I can use Bold text if it helps.
I've also said that if the Tories hadn't frozen council tax I've no doubt it would've also risen at a similar rate to when Labour were in charge etc.

I'm also of the opinion that Labour put the wrong Miliband in charge and that's led them to where they are now.

I'm happy to stick the knife into both of the main political parties because I don't think either are fit for office, but their core supporters are blind to that idea.

Tory cut backs have been far to harsh, but like Labour who throw money at everything, they can't seem to find a decent balance.
Tories have also royally mucked up Brexit, which will end up making it harsher than it actually needed to be, but that's what happens when they put a weak PM in charge.

I wanted a cross party group to handle Brexit but they wouldn't ever do that, because the opposition parties wouldn't dream of passing on the chance to sling mud over it for years and the Tories wouldn't dare share the responsibility for it incase it works.
I have the same opinion about the NHS, amongst other things.
Yeah I'll point out where Labour have been crap at something when someone's sticking the boot into the Tories, but that's what happens when the last Labour governments made many mistakes, some of which were horrendous or laughable.
I'll do the same to the Tories when they're eventually booted out and Labour start slipping from being half decent to crap, resulting in people getting misty eyed about Tories.

I’m surprised you haven’t condensed your “both sides” rubbish a bit more than that by now, given how often you’ve used it.

Nothing wrong with criticising Labour for the mistakes / faults of Labour, but Brexit and austerity are 100% the fault of the Tories. You can’t “both sides” those two sh1tshows (and maintain any credibilty).

[South West Claret.]

At least this government had a plan unlike the dithering idiot on the other side of the house.

A plan? you are joking of course this mob doesn’t know the meaning of the word plan let alone implement one.

[aggi]

No deal is suicide. No sane Parliament would ever vote for it.

I don't want to worry you here but ...

[Lowbankclaret]

You’ve never voted Tory in your life? you do surprise me given your views expressed above.

It’s a fact I never have, never will.

What I could never do is vote to plunge this country into an ideology which Corbyn wants to implement.

130 Labour MP’s met yesterday to look at moving Labour in a different direction, they may have to set up a new party to do that.

[Burnley Ace]

She's an idiot. She could have reached out to Labour MPs by offering them a deal where UK workers rights never fall below those of the EU.

So we should accept EU laws that we have no input to, overseen by the ECJ where we will have no representation, and subsequent Parliaments will be bound by this International Treaty?

If we have that, a Custom Union and Single Market- what exactly are we leaving?

[aggi]

I will predict that tomorrow the same people who abused others for disagreeing with “experts” will selectively ignore the “experts” who have predicted that a clever, managed no deal will be only marginally damaging to us but disasterous to Ireland. These models are now becoming clear and it would massively help our deal if we used it as a bargaining chip.

Sadly, our muppet MPs will do the exact opposite.

(I would have voted for her deal of course tonight but I am talking about taking no deal off the table)

Have you got a link to these? When you say marginally damaging to us compared to Ireland, how damaging to us are they compared to the withdrawal agreement or remain for us as that is what we should be comparing them to.

[DCWat]

Political Compass? Oh you mean governing like a sudo Tory Government, in all the wasted years that the so called Labour Government were in power under Blair he managed to achieve what?

Cosying up to that neo-con Bush junior to prosecute an illegal very bloody war which has led to hundreds and thousands of people being killed and opened up the can of worms we see today in the Middle East,getting into bed with Murdoch rather then crushing him and his empire and failing to repeal Thatchers anti-employee laws leading to today’s low wage economy.

Thanks thanks for nothing.

Had a brief google on the back of your post, SWC. Can you elaborate on the anti-employee laws comment?

Only one article / opinion but this was the first I came across.

https://www.personneltoday.com/hr/the-i ... workplace/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Imploding Turtle]

Brexit

[hampsteadclaret]

3051.. JM.. of course we are - I put a post on this thread a couple of weeks (ish) saying that BETRAYAL was just around the corner.. that is where we are headed..
It was 52% > 48%, clear cut for getting out.

I know it’s been a mess, I know it’s been difficult but that result should have been implemented, despite the difficulties.

I favoured OUT, tomorrow I will be happy with NO DEAL..briefly as I’ve said before that would give us 2/3 years of difficulty and re-arrangement and new deals and opportunities. We are a MAJOR PLAYER and new important initiatives and trade agreements will take place, including with the EU....this is what will matter..£££££££’s

The Banking Crisis and fallout PLUS 8/9 years of ridiculous failed Austerity did us more damage than this nonsense will do.

The EU is a corrupt damaged institution which will go under at some point anyway.

There is something very wrong about being in a club or institution that you are not allowed to leave.

Worst of all is the damage that this has done to our democracy and trust in the system. I don’t need to go through it all do I, and spell it out. There will be damaging serious repercussions for years to come..

No weasel words please or ‘reasonable explanations’ - I’ve heard it all.

Never mind BREXIT, our political parties and system are a calamitous joke, never again I hope will I hear one of our finest lecturing Iran, Iraq, Syria, China,Russia, Venezuela or dozens of others, about how to do Democracy.

[South West Claret.]

It’s a fact I never have, never will.

What I could never do is vote to plunge this country into an ideology which Corbyn wants to implement.

130 Labour MP’s met yesterday to look at moving Labour in a different direction, they may have to set up a new party to do that.

That lot might as well join the Tory Party as splitting the opposition vote will only help this utterly useless Government get back in again. If true and I have no evidence that it is, those 130 should be deselected as soon as.

[Greenmile]

If we dont honour the referendum then what is the point in anyone voting for anything
Government included

You mean the advisory referendum which should have been declared null and void due to illegal spending by one side? That referendum?

You should probably take your own advice and never vote again.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

I’m surprised you haven’t condensed your “both sides” rubbish a bit more than that by now, given how often you’ve used it.

Nothing wrong with criticising Labour for the mistakes / faults of Labour, but Brexit and austerity are 100% the fault of the Tories. You can’t “both sides” those two sh1tshows (and maintain any credibilty).

Austerity is mainly fault of Tories, but are you refusing to accept Labours **** poor financial running of the UK and their mistakes led to it?
Yet you say I can't maintain credibility....right oh.

Brexit, again is mainly Tories with an absolute shower of a Labour party failing to provide a credible opposition at the last GE.
So yeah I'd say it's easy enough to lay the blame on both sides, but mainly Tories.

That credible enough for you, or do you need a hand peeling off those blinkers?

[CrosspoolClarets]

Show us the plans Crosspool, show us the managed "No Deal" plans that get us out of this mess.

We haven't planned for a "No Deal", because people said we'd never need it, because its all "Project Fear".

This is reality, and we need to deal with the issues in a realistic way.

Unicornism was so last week.

I’ve linked to various recent economic papers elsewhere on this thread. It’s all there. The only unicorn is in the minds of those who see a soft Brexit leading to a long term economic outcome that is in any way acceptable to the British people. By definition a soft Brexit has to be worse than staying, by losing advantages of membership but not taking the benefits of leaving. The only way forward was a FTA Brexit, which did have risks but all manageable. Sadly, I think I was right in predicting in 2016 that it wouldn’t happen.

[Greenmile]

Austerity is mainly fault of Tories, but are you refusing to accept Labours **** poor financial running of the UK and their mistakes led to it?
Yet you say I can't maintain credibility....right oh.

Brexit, again is mainly Tories with an absolute shower of a Labour party failing to provide a credible opposition at the last GE.
So yeah I'd say it's easy enough to lay the blame on both sides, but mainly Tories.

That credible enough for you, or do you need a hand peeling off those blinkers?

Are you blaming Labour for the global financial crisis?

Do you blame Hillary for Trump’s awful policies and behaviour because she failed to provide a (sufficiently) credible opposition?

At least you accept austerity and Brexit are mainly the fault of the Tories - if by “mainly” you mean c99% then perhaps we can agree.

[South West Claret.]

Had a brief google on the back of your post, SWC. Can you elaborate on the anti-employee laws comment?

Only one article / opinion but this was the first I came across.

https://www.personneltoday.com/hr/the-i ... workplace/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

History shows that the low wage, zero hours contracts rip-off Britain culture we see today is very very bad for our economy, which doesn’t effect the million and billionaires but does everyone else.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Have you got a link to these? When you say marginally damaging to us compared to Ireland, how damaging to us are they compared to the withdrawal agreement or remain for us as that is what we should be comparing them to.

I linked them earlier on this thread. I recall the German one had Ireland’s GDP drop as 10x ours.

You can’t compare anything to the WA because the trade impact is unknown. It hasn’t been negotiated yet. Whereas with no deal the “smart” actions are clear - stimulus, lower Corp Tax, slashing tariffs.

No deal would be a GDP blip but a temporary and if smartly managed a small one (some in some sectors would lose their jobs but we are talking about the lives of 70m people, it’s all cost/benefit at this level, you have to make sure the benefits are higher and support the losers). We would then be in a strong position to negotiate the trade deals, from a position of power (the EU won’t want us staying on zero tariffs).

[Greenmile]

I linked them earlier on this thread. I recall the German one had Ireland’s GDP drop as 10x ours.

You can’t compare anything to the WA because the trade impact is unknown. It hasn’t been negotiated yet. Whereas with no deal the “smart” actions are clear - stimulus, lower Corp Tax, slashing tariffs.

No deal would be a GDP blip but a temporary and if smartly managed a small one (some in some sectors would lose their jobs but we are talking about the lives of 70m people, it’s all cost/benefit at this level, you have to make sure the benefits are higher and support the losers). We would then be in a strong position to negotiate the trade deals, from a position of power (the EU won’t want us staying on zero tariffs).

And as an added bonus (to you) it would be disastrous for Ireland. If you’re really lucky we might even see a return of the Troubles.

[Lowbankclaret]

So we should accept EU laws that we have no input to, overseen by the ECJ where we will have no representation, and subsequent Parliaments will be bound by this International Treaty?

If we have that, a Custom Union and Single Market- what exactly are we leaving?

That’s not leaving as you say, we would still be ruled by the EU, pay the same in and get no EU money for improvements. We would be severely worse off.

[hampsteadclaret]

You mean the advisory referendum which should have been declared null and void due to illegal spending by one side? That referendum?

You should probably take your own advice and never vote again.

I wouldn’t worry too much about that Greenmile.

There will be plenty not bothering to vote in future at all levels.. local, EU and General Elections.. there’s a whole lot of other stuff they won’t bother with either, if they have been made to feel irrelevant and disenfranchised.... millions of them may feel less inclined to pay their taxes, obey the law and be good citizens ( and quite a lot more).

It’s not going to be pretty.
A very bad day (week ?) for the United Kingdom.

[Greenmile]

I wouldn’t worry too much about that Greenmile.

There will be plenty not bothering to vote in future at all levels.. local, EU and General Elections.. there’s a whole lot of other stuff they won’t bother with either, if they have been made to feel irrelevant and disenfranchised.... millions of them may feel less inclined to pay their taxes, obey the law and be good citizens ( and quite a lot more).

It’s not going to be pretty.
A very bad day (week ?) for the United Kingdom.

If you’re going to threaten civil unrest because you didn’t get your way, just come right out with it instead of dancing around it like this.

I suspect we may just have enough coppers left to cope with a handful Tommy Robinson types and pensioners who don’t feel “inclined to be good citizens”. Maybe Boris will get chance to use those water cannons he wasted a load of taxpayers money on.

[claret2018]

I wouldn’t worry too much about that Greenmile.

There will be plenty not bothering to vote in future at all levels.. local, EU and General Elections.. there’s a whole lot of other stuff they won’t bother with either, if they have been made to feel irrelevant and disenfranchised.... millions of them may feel less inclined to pay their taxes, obey the law and be good citizens ( and quite a lot more).

It’s not going to be pretty.
A very bad day (week ?) for the United Kingdom.

LOL

[Clarets4me]

Of what you mean like the present extremist Tory Government, in that case I certainly agree with you.

If you think this Government is extremist, then you clearly know very little about politics ...

[Bordeauxclaret]

I think we all know the vast vast majority of these people threatening civil unrest are just keyboard warriors who will shat their kecks when it comes to the crunch.

[South West Claret.]

If you think this Government is extremist, then you clearly know very little about politics ...

I know quite enough thank you and yes this is an extremist Government.

[Lancasterclaret]

I take it all back claret in a t rex, itf hampers is advocating civil unrest because he didn't get his way,, call him whatever you want.

Crosspool, managed no deal still negatively affects the UK economy.

That's the reality

[Lowbankclaret]

That lot might as well join the Tory Party as splitting the opposition vote will only help this utterly useless Government get back in again. If true and I have no evidence that it is, those 130 should be deselected as soon as.

Don’t forget the MP’s massive vote in no confidence in Corbyn, which he ignored.

172. - 40 . He will split the party eventually.

[Jakubclaret]

Which pretty accurately sums this shitshow up.

Purely down to the (some) remainers being unable to accept democracy that’s the reason we’ve got a bum deal. Well done. Had everybody united the EU would have been over a barrel & pretty much what we would have demanded would have been a cakewalk, now that’s what I call a result, well done & congratulations it’s impressive.

[Lowbankclaret]

Are you blaming Labour for the global financial crisis?

Do you blame Hillary for Trump’s awful policies and behaviour because she failed to provide a (sufficiently) credible opposition?

At least you accept austerity and Brexit are mainly the fault of the Tories - if by “mainly” you mean c99% then perhaps we can agree.

The financial crisis was caused by the deregulation of the banks allowing them to do the things that caused it.

That was done by the Tories in the mid 80’s.

[hampsteadclaret]

If you’re going to threaten civil unrest because you didn’t get your way, just come right out with it instead of dancing around it like this.

I suspect we may just have enough coppers left to cope with a handful Tommy Robinson types and pensioners who don’t feel “inclined to be good citizens”. Maybe Boris will get chance to use those water cannons he wasted a load of taxpayers money on.

The cannons have gone a few months back...did you not see that?
Flogged off at a substantial loss - keep up.

I wasn’t threatening anything you clown, read my post again, this time more slowly.

Regarding the ‘coppers’ you mention... really.. have you not noticed that there is a substantial shortage of them, we’re about 20,000 down from where we were in 2010
( that’s been in the news a lot this week..?)

Mentioning Tommy Robinson to me, suggests you don’t come on here very often, or you don’t read stuff properly.

[Lancasterclaret]

Cheers for that Jakub

Yet again I do find myself wondering if you have an accurate grasp of what is going on.

[South West Claret.]

..

[hampsteadclaret]

LOL

Is that your best shot 2018?

Is that all you could say?


Post more often, I’ll be looking out for you.

[aggi]

Cheers for that Jakub

Yet again I do find myself wondering if you have an accurate grasp of what is going on.

It's attitudes like this that mean we didn't have the EU over a barrel.

[summitclaret]

Some serious counting of unhatched chickens on here. The DUP/ERG can still just about get a deal through and will before any revocation of A50 or second referendum.
They obviously still think we can get some movement frim the EU.

Also there will be some labour votes for a deal when it comes to it.

[South West Claret.]

Don’t forget the MP’s massive vote in no confidence in Corbyn, which he ignored.

172. - 40 . He will split the party eventually.

No it’s not him that’s thinking of leaving the Labour Party it’s the 130 that you have spoken about.

Anyway you seem to forget that since JC has been the leader the LP has one of the biggest Membership’s around by far, in fact a number of those 130 MPs you speak of have increased their own majority because of him.

What an ungrateful lot of time wasters, as I say the sooner they are deselected the better.