Ashley Barnes - don't read Oliver Kay in The Times

[Paul Waine]

Oliver Kay, Chief Football Correspondent, in today's The Times:

"No wonder referees are living in fear."

It's a long article - and my online Times is "playing up" so I can't copy/paste.

Simple summary:

Zaha booked for sarcastic dissent, plus further ban and fine.

"Just go mad. Scream at the referee, or linesman, as Ashley Barnes. Such "passion" is fine according to a leading former Premier League official...."

But, in the semi-pro and amateur games this "passion" is copied - and a list of referees who've been assulted in lower leagues are quoted as examples.

Kay, of course, is not in support of Ash's "passion."

But, he ends with:

"A very small apology here to the Burnley player for singling him out, because you can be certain it will be another Premier League player today and next weekend and the one after that. And you can be equally certain that worse will be happening away from the cameras, on park pitches up and down the country, where referees live in fear not of verbal dissent but of far worse."

Somewhere in the article Kay does say that Ash's yellow card for diving was unjustified.

[mybloodisclaret]

There are many reasons I don't lime tabloid journalists and even more why I don't buy their rags. It would take too long to list them all. I suppose Mr Kay omitts from his article that it was one of the worst decisions in the history of the Premier League?

[TVC15]

Yep Barnes should not have done it but don’t think it happens now as much as it used to tbh.
Is it worse than what many of the big teams do when 6 or 7 of them surround the referee pushing and barging him knowing that there is no way of telling which one of them is doing it ?
Is it worse than the unfair influence the top managers have on referees or the tantrums they regularly throw on the sideline when unhappy about a decision 80 yards away ? They should use Dyche as an example here of good behaviour - but that’s not an interesting article is it ?

Bit of perspective would be good - far worse things happening on the pitch and sidelines than a one off incident like Barnes which was caused by a disgracefully incompetent ref and linesman

[Ashingtonclaret46]

Oliver Kay, Chief Football Correspondent, in today's The Times:

"No wonder referees are living in fear."

It's a long article - and my online Times is "playing up" so I can't copy/paste.

Simple summary:

Zaha booked for sarcastic dissent, plus further ban and fine.

"Just go mad. Scream at the referee, or linesman, as Ashley Barnes. Such "passion" is fine according to a leading former Premier League official...."

But, in the semi-pro and amateur games this "passion" is copied - and a list of referees who've been assulted in lower leagues are quoted as examples.

Kay, of course, is not in support of Ash's "passion."

But, he ends with:

"A very small apology here to the Burnley player for singling him out, because you can be certain it will be another Premier League player today and next weekend and the one after that. And you can be equally certain that worse will be happening away from the cameras, on park pitches up and down the country, where referees live in fear not of verbal dissent but of far worse."

Somewhere in the article Kay does say that Ash's yellow card for diving was unjustified.

Yes, Ashley should not have reacted like he did, however, any referee on any park pitch up and down the country who made such a decision as Anthony Taylor did would have to expect some verbal dissent for the same reasons that Ashley expressed his opinions.
Any player who sarcastically applauds a decision made by an official just can't complain if the official takes exception to his actions. In Zaha's case, he had already received a yellow card for his tussle on the touch line, therefore, he left himself wide open to another by applauding the official for booking him.
Ashley had not received a caution at the time he erupted and, although he could have been dismissed for foul and abusive at an official, he received the caution for simulation.
I am still trying to work out exactly how Mister Taylor came to that decision.

As far as Oliver Kay is concerned, he is reporting that referees have been assaulted and I know this to be true because it has happened in my area. The problem then arises that not every County FA dishes out the harshest punishment which, if they did, would hopefully deter future offenders.
A lot of incidents which happen on local park pitches are down to the way that indiscipline has crept into society generally and there is very little respect from some players for anyone in authority, whether it is on the pitch or off it..

[Bordeauxclaret]

Barnes should have gone for his reaction.

You shouldn’t be allowed to do that to officials no matter how useless they are.

[ClaretPope]

Kay's words: Walton was casting his eye, on BT Sport, over an incident at Turf Moor, where Barnes was aggrieved (justifiably, as it happened) that he and Burnley were denied a penalty against Southampton.

[icu81b4]

You don't see players shouting at officials in rugby, maybe whatever process is used in rugby could be used in footy?

[SalisburyClaret]

Some seasons ago it was decided that referees would clamp down on dissent, swearing, being touched and being surrounded by players

Great idea - wonder what happened to it

[DAVETHEVICAR]

One of the most obvious penalties ever but I feel Ash has got away without any further action .

[Quickenthetempo]

Barnes should issue an apology. It is ruining the game, just another way of cheating, trying to influence referees decisions.

[thatdberight]

Oliver Kay, Chief Football Correspondent, in today's The Times:

"No wonder referees are living in fear."

It's a long article - and my online Times is "playing up" so I can't copy/paste.

Simple summary:

Zaha booked for sarcastic dissent, plus further ban and fine.

"Just go mad. Scream at the referee, or linesman, as Ashley Barnes. Such "passion" is fine according to a leading former Premier League official...."

But, in the semi-pro and amateur games this "passion" is copied - and a list of referees who've been assulted in lower leagues are quoted as examples.

Kay, of course, is not in support of Ash's "passion."

But, he ends with:

"A very small apology here to the Burnley player for singling him out, because you can be certain it will be another Premier League player today and next weekend and the one after that. And you can be equally certain that worse will be happening away from the cameras, on park pitches up and down the country, where referees live in fear not of verbal dissent but of far worse."

Somewhere in the article Kay does say that Ash's yellow card for diving was unjustified.

It's a very reasonable, balanced and true article.

[Stayingup]

Barnes should issue an apology. It is ruining the game, just another way of cheating, trying to influence referees decisions.

Cheating, you think Barnes was cheating??? I would say the referee was out of order, once when he didnt book the Southampton player for his foul on Taylor and then when he ludicrously did not award a penalty for Barnes. It was a shocking decision and he deserved to be told about it.

I can see your point but generally Burnley players do not abuse referees and do not waving imaginary cards like Sanchez did a few yaers back at Turkf Moor. he should have been booked for that but wasn't.

[Quickenthetempo]

Cheating, you think Barnes was cheating??? I would say the referee was out of order, once when he didnt book the Southampton player for his foul on Taylor and then when he ludicrously did not award a penalty for Barnes. It was a shocking decision and he deserved to be told about it.

I can see your point but generally Burnley players do not abuse referees and do not waving imaginary cards like Sanchez did a few yaers back at Turkf Moor. he should have been booked for that but wasn't.

He lost it with the linesman not the ref.

The ref was poor but we have to get away from officials taking abuse from players. From the top level to kids football.

They are scared of microphoning refs as it would damage the product showing how badly behaved these premier league players are.

Most teams pressure refs to try and get decisions, it worked for Burnley getting the 2nd penalty.

[ALP]

No excuse for Ash, he should have gone. No matter how bad the decision was, there is no justification for tirades being aimed at officials. No wonder there is a lack of good officials, too few people want to go into it now, and without them the game dies.

[Tricky Trevor]

All they have to do is get a card out every time. It would soon stop. Should have happened years ago.

[evensteadiereddie]

That's fair enough but any inadequate or corrupt refs or assistants should also be punished.

[thatdberight]

...corrupt refs or assistants should also be punished.

Have you any evidence they aren't? Have you any evidence there are corrupt officials? Or just a vivid imagination?

[Shore claret]

He lost it with the linesman not the ref.

The ref was poor but we have to get away from officials taking abuse from players. From the top level to kids football.

They are scared of microphoning refs as it would damage the product showing how badly behaved these premier league players are.

Most teams pressure refs to try and get decisions, it worked for Burnley getting the 2nd penalty.

We didn't pressure the ref for the penalty,he gave it straight away.

[Quickenthetempo]

We didn't pressure the ref for the penalty,he gave it straight away.

The idea is you pressure the ref so he thinks he owes you a decision so gives you the next one.

[IanMcL]

There are many reasons I don't lime tabloid journalists and even more why I don't buy their rags. It would take too long to list them all. I suppose Mr Kay omitts from his article that it was one of the worst decisions in the history of the Premier League?

I think The Times would take issue with your description of them!

[Shore claret]

The idea is you pressure the ref so he thinks he owes you a decision so gives you the next one.

I'm assuming he'd been told how bad his decision was, we shouldn't of had to pressure him.
According to the refs on bt sport they never try to even things up, once a decision has been made that's it they don't try to rectify mistakes.

[Paul Waine]

from BBC: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/47099270" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

They ended a 67-game wait for a Premier League penalty against Southampton, with Ashley Barnes winning and converting their first spot-kick in the top flight since April 2017.


Yes, I know, just careless BBC editing, or maybe the BBC do think that the "penalty that wasn't" in the first half won the "penalty that was" at the end of the game.


Keep you passion, Ashley, and keep your cool, like you did with the spot kick at the end of the game!

UTC

[boatshed bill]

Barnes should issue an apology. It is ruining the game, just another way of cheating, trying to influence referees decisions.

The ref should issue an apology. he's called Ash a cheat as well as denying us the penalty.

[South West Claret.]

Oliver Kay, Chief Football Correspondent, in today's The Times:

"No wonder referees are living in fear."

It's a long article - and my online Times is "playing up" so I can't copy/paste.

Simple summary:

Zaha booked for sarcastic dissent, plus further ban and fine.

"Just go mad. Scream at the referee, or linesman, as Ashley Barnes. Such "passion" is fine according to a leading former Premier League official...."

But, in the semi-pro and amateur games this "passion" is copied - and a list of referees who've been assulted in lower leagues are quoted as examples.

Kay, of course, is not in support of Ash's "passion."

But, he ends with:

"A very small apology here to the Burnley player for singling him out, because you can be certain it will be another Premier League player today and next weekend and the one after that. And you can be equally certain that worse will be happening away from the cameras, on park pitches up and down the country, where referees live in fear not of verbal dissent but of far worse."

Somewhere in the article Kay does say that Ash's yellow card for diving was unjustified.

As I have said before what do people expect when reading the gutter press...especially Murdoch gutter
Press.

[agreenwood]

Whatever your line of work, you shouldn’t have to put up with someone screaming in your face.

I was as livid with the incident as anyone else, but that kind of behaviour, however hard done to he’d been, is clearly a yellow card offence.

If one of my children did that to a referee or linesman I’d be embarrassed and disappointed.

[Rileybobs]

Whatever your line of work, you shouldn’t have to put up with someone screaming in your face.

I was as livid with the incident as anyone else, but that kind of behaviour, however hard done to he’d been, is clearly a yellow card offence.

If one of my children did that to a referee or linesman I’d be embarrassed and disappointed.

His behaviour towards the officials clearly warranted a second yellow card. However he hadn’t been shown the original yellow card which was coming his way so the referee couldn’t book him twice.

[Siddo]

As I have said before what do people expect when reading the gutter press...especially Murdoch gutter
Press.

The Times gutter press? I find it difficult to agree with that description.

[Burnley Ace]

You don't see players shouting at officials in rugby, maybe whatever process is used in rugby could be used in footy?

They tried it (moving the kick forward 10m). Wasn’t a success, especially in countries with no rugby)

[tim_noone]

Barnes should have gone for his reaction.

You shouldn’t be allowed to do that to officials no matter how useless they are.

Great reaction on the penalty award today.... from Barnes. the Brighton players seemed to lose a little concentration just prior to him being fouled.

[Bordeauxclaret]

Ok...............

[nil_desperandum]

His behaviour towards the officials clearly warranted a second yellow card. However he hadn’t been shown the original yellow card which was coming his way so the referee couldn’t book him twice.

Genuine question. Surely it doesn't it say that in the rules?
Surely you can commit a yellow card offence, and then be booked again (or even shown a red) if you commit a 2nd bookable offence, even if the ref hasn't had time to pull the card out of his pocket for the first one?
What if he'd gone a little further and pushed the lino?

[Rileybobs]

Genuine question. Surely it doesn't it say that in the rules?
Surely you can commit a yellow card offence, and then be booked again (or even shown a red) if you commit a 2nd bookable offence, even if the ref hasn't had time to pull the card out of his pocket for the first one?
What if he'd gone a little further and pushed the lino?

I asked Ashington (former referee) this and he said that a player can't be given a second yellow card for an offence committed before the first yellow is shown. What happens if a player tugs an opposition player back on a break away and the ref plays advantage and the same player does the same 10 seconds later. Two yellow card offences but the player in question isn't already on a yellow card so his behaviour/decisions would be different if he had already been cautioned.

If he had pushed the lino then that would have been a straight red for violent conduct.