Mike Garlick says we have £24m in bank

nyclaret · Post by **nyclaret** » Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:20 pm

Aren’t the accounts public?

NRC · Post by **NRC** » Sat Mar 02, 2019 2:23 pm

FFS nyclaret, I bet you’re one of these types that sits in meetings, but not really present because you’re cruising t’interweb instead..... and then you ask a question which has all the eyes in the room quickly glance at each other

Paul Waine · Post by **Paul Waine** » Sat Mar 02, 2019 6:22 pm

nyclaret wrote:Aren’t the accounts public?

Hi ny, the answer I think you are looking for is "yes." The accounts will be filed on Companies House by 31-March-2019 for the accounting y/end 30-Jun-2018. (Things can go wrong, and some clubs subject to these rules may be late in filing. Some other clubs are publicly traded, so file accounts sooner).

You can access Companies House for free and read previous seasons accounts and other corporate stuff any time you like:
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It's a good idea to be able to understand the "hows, whens and wheres" of accounting. The accounts, when they are filed, will be for the period 1-Jul-2017 to 30-Jun-2018, so they include information about the transfers in and out of the club in that period, the wages paid in that period and the tv money for that period. Any player signed in the Jan-2018 transfer window will only impact wages for max 6 months of that accounting year. Similarly, any transfers out will impact up to the date of transfer out. New contracts will also impact to the extent of the date the new contract starts - and, I'd expect a few only start to pay increased wages later than the dates the new cotracts are announced.

Then we all try to project the information from last season onto the money available to spend in this season. OK, it will give us an indication, but it will also require a number of "Inspired guesses" - unless we are lucky enough to be the club's accountant.

For me, thank goodness that Mike Garlick says we have £24 million cash in the bank. It's many times better than Mr Garlick saying we've nothing in the bank and we owe £X millions, and we've mortgaged out the ground or no longer own it, etc, etc, etc.

Now, if we can stay in the Premier League for 10 more seasons and Sean Dyche is still our manager at the end of that period - and contracted for another 10 beyond - we might have the chance to dream about an upgraded and expanded ground with a few, smart, modern facilities.

UTC

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sat Mar 02, 2019 6:48 pm

After todays performance, I presume the quote "Build it and they will come" no longer applies?

Turfytop · Post by **Turfytop** » Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:37 pm

CrosspoolClarets · Post by **CrosspoolClarets** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 12:12 am

Spijed wrote:After todays performance, I presume the quote "Build it and they will come" no longer applies?

Chatting to a pal of mine in the pub before the game, we were discussing the Spurs ground and the great day out it would probably be (on-site brewery before, live band afterwards etc).

Away from home when we have a few beers it is a great day out, win or lose. The same should be said for home games but can’t be to the same extent. Not so much “build it and they will come” but certainly “build it and they will have a great day regardless”. And that is a bloody good start when you are running a business.

Bordeauxclaret · Post by **Bordeauxclaret** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 12:33 am

It’s long been my opinion that playing wise under Dyche we are very much a Premier League outfit.

Away from the actual football side we are League One at best.

MACCA · Post by **MACCA** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 1:01 am

Bordeauxclaret wrote:It’s long been my opinion that playing wise under Dyche we are very much a Premier League outfit.

Away from the actual football side we are League One at best.

Thats Certainly the case regards to several areas of the club Mr Dyche isn't directly involved with.

Claretforever · Post by **Claretforever** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 7:57 am

I got to wondering yesterday why our board are so reluctant to invest in redevelopment of the ground whilst we are a Premier League outfit with a large income.

Right now the board do not take a wage from the club but, I assume, gain a bonus like the players should we retain our status? Going back a few years they made money by loaning it to the club and receiving it back with interest. Right now there’s no need so they can’t do that.

Would it make more sense for them personally to wait until we’re back in the lower division(s), with a small income and then loan us chunks of money which they will then receive back with benefits?

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 10:26 am

Claretforever wrote:I got to wondering yesterday why our board are so reluctant to invest in redevelopment of the ground whilst we are a Premier League outfit with a large income.

Right now the board do not take a wage from the club but, I assume, gain a bonus like the players should we retain our status? Going back a few years they made money by loaning it to the club and receiving it back with interest. Right now there’s no need so they can’t do that.

Would it make more sense for them personally to wait until we’re back in the lower division(s), with a small income and then loan us chunks of money which they will then receive back with benefits?

No. The profit-related dividend that they would be able to take with the PL television money would dwarf any interest they could make from loaning money to the club.

They’re running a business, why would they want the business to be in a position where it needs to borrow money when it could be making tens of millions of pounds profit?

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 12:11 pm

Claretforever wrote:I got to wondering yesterday why our board are so reluctant to invest in redevelopment of the ground whilst we are a Premier League outfit with a large income.

Right now the board do not take a wage from the club but, I assume, gain a bonus like the players should we retain our status? Going back a few years they made money by loaning it to the club and receiving it back with interest. Right now there’s no need so they can’t do that.

Would it make more sense for them personally to wait until we’re back in the lower division(s), with a small income and then loan us chunks of money which they will then receive back with benefits?

If they wanted they could take a salary or dividends. Waiting for us to be relegated and then making money from interest seems convoluted, self defeating (there's less money for them to take) and, off the top of my head, less tax efficient for the individual than dividends.

At the moment they don't take any money out of the club. The interest they received previously was probably less than commercial rates (a championship club making losses isn't an attractive proposition for a lender).

bfcwest · Post by **bfcwest** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:35 pm

Spijed wrote:After todays performance, I presume the quote "Build it and they will come" no longer applies?

Yeah, that's right. We were about to develop the ground because it is a total embarrassment, but we lost to Palace so it's all been cancelled.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:38 pm

aggi wrote:If they wanted they could take a salary or dividends. Waiting for us to be relegated and then making money from interest seems convoluted, self defeating (there's less money for them to take) and, off the top of my head, less tax efficient for the individual than dividends.

At the moment they don't take any money out of the club. The interest they received previously was probably less than commercial rates (a championship club making losses isn't an attractive proposition for a lender).

It does amaze me the amount of people, clearly without any business knowledge, who insinuate that the board of directors are siphoning money from the club.

winsomeyen · Post by **winsomeyen** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:39 pm

aggi wrote:If they wanted they could take a salary or dividends. Waiting for us to be relegated and then making money from interest seems convoluted, self defeating (there's less money for them to take) and, off the top of my head, less tax efficient for the individual than dividends.

At the moment they don't take any money out of the club. The interest they received previously was probably less than commercial rates (a championship club making losses isn't an attractive proposition for a lender).

Aggi, How do you know whether or not they take money, the board have abolished the AGM so can do exactly as they wish without questions being asked.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:39 pm

winsomeyen wrote:Aggi, How do you know whether or not they take money, the board have abolished the AGM so can do exactly as they wish without questions being asked.

The accounts are made public.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:43 pm

I'm hoping that this current outbreak of "see who can outdo the last poster for the most ridiculous claim" dies soon.

Its soul destroying wondering if I, who support one of the best run football clubs in the country, support the same one as many on here.

winsomeyen · Post by **winsomeyen** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:44 pm

Rileybobs wrote:The accounts are made public.

Without suggesting any malpractice is afoot I think we all know a half decent accountant can make figures say what is required.

bfcwest · Post by **bfcwest** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:45 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:I'm hoping that this current outbreak of "see who can outdo the last poster for the most ridiculous claim" dies soon.

Its soul destroying wondering if I, who support one of the best run football clubs in the country, support the same one as many on here.

Who do you support then?

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:45 pm

winsomeyen wrote:Without suggesting any malpractice is afoot I think we all know a half decent accountant can make figures say what is required.

Are you suggesting that accountants who commit fraud are half decent?

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:46 pm

I don't know any half decent accountants that would do that, because you are suggesting malpractice and they would lose their license.

How about you just say "I know **** all about it and I made a daft claim and I apologise"?

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:47 pm

So you don't think we are one of the best run football clubs in the country?

I love this board, it has so many posters who can't wait to prove just how silly they are.

Beyond weird lad

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:51 pm

bfcwest wrote:Yeah, that's right. We were about to develop the ground because it is a total embarrassment, but we lost to Palace so it's all been cancelled.

I agree we need to re-develop the ground, but I don't want us to end up like Swansea and a few other clubs that pushed the boat out too far.

The point is, performances will always be the driver behind any capacity. Do well and the crowds improve, get relegated and they drop.

And the lustre of being in the Prem will wear off slightly as time goes on, it's only natural. For example, going to away games at the Etihad and playing currenly one of the best sides in Europe no longer has the same appeal, simply because of the fear that we'll lose by a big margin.

Last season there was a scramble to get tickets for the game at the Emirates, this season not so much. Even playing Spurs at Wembley wasn't the same as last season, thus more empty seats.

When we play at home, the draw of the big names will remain, but, like yesterday, playing Crystal Palace had a Championship feel to it.

bfcwest · Post by **bfcwest** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:57 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:So you don't think we are one of the best run football clubs in the country?

I love this board, it has so many posters who can't wait to prove just how silly they are.

Beyond weird lad

I think Sean Dyche and his team have done amazingly well and I congratulate the board for appointing them. Does that mean I think the Club is "one of the best run in the country"? No, of course it doesn't. Just because we are having success on the field doesn't mean the club is automatically being run really, really well. The club make so many mistakes and misses so many opportunities to market itself better, develop and grow. It treats the fans with little regard in terms of match day experience at a time when record profits are being posted. Not sure how "well run" that is?

Tall Paul · Post by **Tall Paul** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:57 pm

winsomeyen wrote:Without suggesting any malpractice is afoot I think we all know a half decent accountant can make figures say what is required.

lol

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 3:58 pm

bfcwest wrote:I think Sean Dyche and his team have done amazingly well and I congratulate the board for appointing them. Does that mean I think the Club is "one of the best run in the country"? No, of course it doesn't. Just because we are having success on the field doesn't mean the club is automatically being run really, really well. The club make so many mistakes and misses so many opportunities to market itself better, develop and grow. It treats the fans with little regard in terms of match day experience at a time when record profits are being posted. Not sure who "well run" that is?

We are one of the biggest overachievers on the pitch and one of the most profitable off the pitch. Of course the club could do things better and we appear to be upping our game in many regards, but if you don’t think we’re we’ll run you’re talking twaddle.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:00 pm

Unbelievable.

Ask any football fan, any football commentator, any football administrator, any expert on football at all, ,and ask them for an example of a well run club massively over achieving.

If 99% don't say Burnley first I'd be amazed.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:08 pm

bfcwest wrote:I think Sean Dyche and his team have done amazingly well and I congratulate the board for appointing them. Does that mean I think the Club is "one of the best run in the country"? No, of course it doesn't. Just because we are having success on the field doesn't mean the club is automatically being run really, really well. The club make so many mistakes and misses so many opportunities to market itself better, develop and grow. It treats the fans with little regard in terms of match day experience at a time when record profits are being posted. Not sure how "well run" that is?

Have you got any examples of a better run club?

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:10 pm

winsomeyen wrote:Without suggesting any malpractice is afoot I think we all know a half decent accountant can make figures say what is required.

Cooking the books is usually done for the avoidance of tax & to conceal dubious expenses you’d have to explain, it’s a more common practice than people think, the finances to appear normal & healthy has a multitude of advantages on a facade front, no way implying or suggesting anything untowards with the topic in hand.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:11 pm

Of course we are a very well run club. Amazing that any Burnley fan could dispute that.

Winstonswhite · Post by **Winstonswhite** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:14 pm

Spijed wrote:Have you got any examples of a better run club?

You’re totally missing his point

bfcwest · Post by **bfcwest** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:15 pm

Rileybobs wrote:We are one of the biggest overachievers on the pitch and one of the most profitable off the pitch. Of course the club could do things better and we appear to be upping our game in many regards, but if you don’t think we’re we’ll run you’re talking twaddle.

I wasn't asked if I think we are well run, I was asked if I think we are one of the BEST RUN IN THE COUNTRY..... I can't honestly say we are one of the best. Just because the board make sure we don't over spend and have built a new training ground doesn't make us the best run!! Our training ground had got to the point of being a laughing stock, so we would have been insane not to redevelop it when we finally had some money coming in. Most other clubs in the top two divisions also have a training ground that isn't a portacabin in a field.

I view Turf Moor as a key part of the equation when it comes to how the Club is run, and also how Burnley FC is marketed to new and existing fans. I think the board fall short on both fronts. This is why I don't think the club is one of the BEST run in the country. It's good, but not one the best.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:17 pm

Winstonswhite wrote:You’re totally missing his point

Am I?

Or is the case that we run the club as well as we can do in the environment we operate, better than virtually everyone else?

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:17 pm

winsomeyen wrote:Without suggesting any malpractice is afoot I think we all know a half decent accountant can make figures say what is required.

How much is the accountant getting for this? Given that what you're suggesting would end up with the accountant being struck off and potentially sent to jail it must be in the millions.

Also obviously the risk for whichever of the directors are involved in this fraud is that they're disqualified as a director (quite apart from the criminal implications) and can't run their own company.

I know people who don't really understand stuff like to believe things like a half decent accountant can make figures say what is required but it's complete ********.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:18 pm

bfcwest wrote:I wasn't asked if I think we are well run, I was asked if I think we are one of the BEST RUN IN THE COUNTRY..... I can't honestly say we are one of the best. Just because the board make sure we don't over spend and have built a new training ground doesn't make us the best run!! Our training ground had got to the point of being a laughing stock, so we would have been insane not to redevelop it when we finally had some money coming in. Most other clubs in the top two divisions also have a training ground that isn't a portacabin in a field.

I view Turf Moor as a key part of the equation when it comes to how the Club is run, and also how Burnley FC is marketed to new and existing fans. I think the board fall short on both fronts. This is why I don't think the club is one of the BEST run in the country. It's good, but not one the best.

Turf Moor has been under continuous improvement.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:20 pm

bfcwest wrote:I wasn't asked if I think we are well run, I was asked if I think we are one of the BEST RUN IN THE COUNTRY..... I can't honestly say we are one of the best. Just because the board make sure we don't over spend and have built a new training ground doesn't make us the best run!! Our training ground had got to the point of being a laughing stock, so we would have been insane not to redevelop it when we finally had some money coming in. Most other clubs in the top two divisions also have a training ground that isn't a portacabin in a field.

I view Turf Moor as a key part of the equation when it comes to how the Club is run, and also how Burnley FC is marketed to new and existing fans. I think the board fall short on both fronts. This is why I don't think the club is one of the BEST run in the country. It's good, but not one the best.

But you said this...

’The club make so many mistakes and misses so many opportunities to market itself better, develop and grow. It treats the fans with little regard in terms of match day experience at a time when record profits are being posted. Not sure who "well run" that is?’

which intimates that you don’t think that we are a well run club.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:23 pm

If there's zero evidence that the Board and their accountants are cooking the books people would be well advised not to make such accusations. It's libel.

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:23 pm

Royboyclaret wrote:Crosspool.....Of one thing I'm certain is that they'll tell us as little as they possibly can. Something happened around six years ago when the Board in their wisdom ended the annual AGM, meaning even the shareholders were denied the opportunity to ask relevant questions. There was a half-hearted acknowledgement at the time that communication with the fans was important and for one year only held an informal shareholders meeting.

Since then, absolutely nothing apart from a five minute interview with the Chairman twice a year. Expect nothing and you won't be disappointed, even the release of the accounts is now left until the last possible moment.

I have a feeling that the decision to no longer hold an AGM was prompted by a change in the rules. The legal requirement changed and the club took advantage of that.

bfcwest · Post by **bfcwest** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:26 pm

taio wrote:Turf Moor has been under continuous improvement.

Is it? Are we getting free rain ponchos and hot running water?

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:27 pm

bfcwest wrote:Is it? Are we getting free rain ponchos and hot running water?

Yes if you haven't noticed open your eyes. Buy your own ponchos

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:28 pm

bfcwest wrote:Is it? Are we getting free rain ponchos and hot running water?

The ground is improved pretty much year on year.

Jakubclaret · Post by **Jakubclaret** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:30 pm

aggi wrote:How much is the accountant getting for this? Given that what you're suggesting would end up with the accountant being struck off and potentially sent to jail it must be in the millions.

Also obviously the risk for whichever of the directors are involved in this fraud is that they're disqualified as a director (quite apart from the criminal implications) and can't run their own company.

I know people who don't really understand stuff like to believe things like a half decent accountant can make figures say what is required but it's complete ********.

It does happen sometimes with minimal risks involved providing the finances are there & usually lay dormant & re-emerge at a later date or when suspicions arouse, as a risk assessment will vary on the circumstances, usually companies in trouble desperate for investment are more likely to be candidates carrying out this practice.

bfcwest · Post by **bfcwest** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:35 pm

Rileybobs wrote:But you said this...

’The club make so many mistakes and misses so many opportunities to market itself better, develop and grow. It treats the fans with little regard in terms of match day experience at a time when record profits are being posted. Not sure who "well run" that is?’

which intimates that you don’t think that we are a well run club.

Absolutely, I don't think it is being well run on those points. That doesn't mean it isn't being well run on other points. Am I not aloud to have an opinion that can't be defined as either black or white? Can't my view on the way the Club is being run be a bit more dynamic than that? Running a business is not just about balancing the books.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:38 pm

bfcwest wrote:Absolutely, I don't think it is being well run on those points. That doesn't mean it isn't being well run on other points. Am I not aloud to have an opinion that can't be defined as either black or white? Can't my view on the way the Club is being run be a bit more dynamic than that? Running a business is not just about balancing the books.

Who’s not allowing you to have an opinion? You intimated that the club wasn’t well run, I challenged that.

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:41 pm

bfcwest wrote:Absolutely, I don't think it is being well run on those points. That doesn't mean it isn't being well run on other points. Am I not aloud to have an opinion that can't be defined as either black or white? Can't my view on the way the Club is being run be a bit more dynamic than that? Running a business is not just about balancing the books.

The best way for a club to develop and grow is to succeed on the pitch and invest in our infrastructure. We've overachieved on the pitch and made significant capital investment into the club's assets

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:41 pm

Who would guess that an original sweeping statement on here would turn out to specifics on a match day experience?

Am I the only one who turns up, sits down, goes for a half time pee, claps the kids who are playing football, watches the rest of the game and then goes home and I never notice anything wrong with the "match day experience"?

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:42 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Who would guess that an original sweeping statement on here would turn out to specifics on a match day experience?

Am I the only one who turns up, sits down, goes for a half time pee, claps the kids who are playing football, watches the rest of the game and then goes home and I never notice anything wrong with the "match day experience"?

Definitely not. I've no issue with the match day experience either

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:44 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Who would guess that an original sweeping statement on here would turn out to specifics on a match day experience?

Am I the only one who turns up, sits down, goes for a half time pee, claps the kids who are playing football, watches the rest of the game and then goes home and I never notice anything wrong with the "match day experience"?

I was about to post similar. Our facilities could be improved without a doubt, but that takes time and money and plans will certainly be being put in place. But I’m curious to hear what improvements people would like to see in the ‘match day experience’.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:45 pm

Is anyone who goes to watch a game at Burnley likely to be interested in having more than a pie & a pint at half time?

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:47 pm

Rileybobs wrote:I was about to post similar. Our facilities could be improved without a doubt, but that takes time and money and plans will certainly be being put in place. But I’m curious to hear what improvements people would like to see in the ‘match day experience’.

Free ponchos apparently

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Sun Mar 03, 2019 5:00 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Who would guess that an original sweeping statement on here would turn out to specifics on a match day experience?

Am I the only one who turns up, sits down, goes for a half time pee, claps the kids who are playing football, watches the rest of the game and then goes home and I never notice anything wrong with the "match day experience"?

I suspect that most of those who are happy with the match day experience are season ticket holders whereas a lot of the talk on here is about improving the experience to entice in new fans.

In terms of facilities, there was the story recently about how the majority of stands don't have accessible toilets which is pretty shocking nowadays.