Mike Garlick says we have £24m in bank

[elwaclaret]

Is anyone who goes to watch a game at Burnley likely to be interested in having more than a pie & a pint at half time?

Modern expectations. We used to think it just part of the experience to visit grounds where the loos had overflowed the season before and had never been fived, standing on cinders and railway sleepers for terracing, without a second thought. Now fans complain that the soap in the toilets isn't Baylis and Hardin.

[aggi]

It does happen sometimes with minimal risks involved providing the finances are there & usually lay dormant & re-emerge at a later date or when suspicions arouse, as a risk assessment will vary on the circumstances, usually companies in trouble desperate for investment are more likely to be candidates carrying out this practice.

It happens at smaller companies which aren't being audited. Much more difficult to get away with at larger companies, there are strict rules on disclosing payments to directors.

[Bordeauxclaret]

Bit harsh with my comment last night after a long day out.

There are a lot of areas I think we need to improve off the pitch, not everything.

[boatshed bill]

Modern expectations. We used to think it just part of the experience to visit grounds where the loos had overflowed the season before and had never been fived, standing on cinders and railway sleepers for terracing, without a second thought. Now fans complain that the soap in the toilets isn't Baylis and Hardin.

Great post!

[boatshed bill]

Is anyone who goes to watch a game at Burnley likely to be interested in having more than a pie & a pint at half time?

I'd like prawn cocktail vol au vents and prosecco (pint of) if possible

[TVC15]

Is anyone who goes to watch a game at Burnley likely to be interested in having more than a pie & a pint at half time?

Errr yep - pies are usually poor and you have to wait far too long for your beer.
I’m sure lots of people would prefer a bit more choice of food - but they buy a pie simple because there is no other choice
We have only 900 corporate spaces available every week which is never enough to meet the demand.

As someone else has said above off the field we are nowhere near what we should be as a club.

We had the opportunity to buy the Park View for £40k and I know that this was put to the club by a few shareholders as a good way of increasing corporate facilities and using for a range of things....but the board did not want to do this.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Is anyone who goes to watch a game at Burnley likely to be interested in having more than a pie & a pint at half time?

There we have it.

Burnley people are far too simple for anything more complex than a pie and a pint (and make the pint Carling or John Smiths, not decent craft ale).

It’s about standards. We all have different. We shouldn’t be snobbish (or inverted snobbish) about others being different to us, but we ARE all different.

The multitude of fantastic pubs, restaurants, houses and other facilities around the Burnley rural catchment area goes to show that many fans will like classy, fine fare. Others like pie and a pint. Both are fine.

[CrosspoolClarets]

Who would guess that an original sweeping statement on here would turn out to specifics on a match day experience?

Am I the only one who turns up, sits down, goes for a half time pee, claps the kids who are playing football, watches the rest of the game and then goes home and I never notice anything wrong with the "match day experience"?

Where is there to sit down in the concourse (we aren’t all Lancaster’s age, and many need to get out of the cold at half time)?
Where are the “gender neutral” toilets?
Where are the disabled toilets for those not quite disabled enough to need the new facilities (like people prone to fainting)?
Where is the hot running water?
Why are the first 20 rows soaking wet?
Why do we need to queue for 20 minutes to upgrade a ticket?
Where did the peas go?
Why no decent craft beer inside?

You could go on forever. It is all about standards. Basic standards.

[jrgbfc]

The two newer stands are basically cheap, badly designed monstrosities. Not really sure what we can do about it now tbh. Likewise the scrum at half time in the Cricket field stand, without knocking it down and rebuilding it don't think there's much we can do.

[TVC15]

The facilities that we have for our fans before the game and at half time are no better than they were 30 years ago and no better than the away grounds many of us have visited several times...like Rochdale, Stockport, Oldham etc.
The lack of spend on the fans is shocking.

[Paul Waine]

Aggi, How do you know whether or not they take money, the board have abolished the AGM so can do exactly as they wish without questions being asked.

Hi winsomeyen, you can find Burnley's financial accounts for the year end 30-June-2017 at this link, here:

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/comp ... ng-history" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I recommend you read pages 1 thru 7:

Strategic report; Directors' report; Statement of Directors' responsibilities and the Independent Auditor's report.

The name and address of the audit firm is given. They are in Haslingden.

Also worth reading Notes to the Financial Statements - note 9 Directors's remuneration - on page 16.

That's why aggi and several others on this mb know "whether or not they take money...."

Hope this helps.

UTC

[bfcwest]

I think many of you are missing the point by saying you are happy for yourselves with how things are inside Turf Moor. You have season tickets and go to every game. The problem is there are another maybe 30,000 fans who go on either very occasionally, or have just stopped going on all together. Then there are the potential NEW fans who might be drawn to Burnley the longer we stay in the Prem. My points about needing to improve Turf Moor and increase capacity are about trying to bring new and occasional fans to Turf Moor. Those of you who are currently happy are not the target for the need to invest, to put it bluntly.

I bet there are loads of Tottenham fans who were happy with their season tickets at White Hart Lane, and plenty of Wolves fans who like the Steve Bull stand at present. But their clubs want to improve the facilities for there existing fans, and more importantly in order to attract new fans as they increase capacity. They also don't want to fall behind their rivals who have all invested and continue to invest.

[Vegas Claret]

People will go and watch if we are playing decent football and showing a little bit more ambition. People stood on open terraces for decades because they were entertained, I genuinely think people would prefer us to spend 25 million on a top midfielder as opposed to a new stand

[Rileybobs]

Who goes to Turf Moor to eat and drink?

[Jakubclaret]

It happens at smaller companies which aren't being audited. Much more difficult to get away with at larger companies, there are strict rules on disclosing payments to directors.

Yes of course, I did say in my last post based on risk “it will vary in the circumstances” I wasn’t using any particular example of cooking the books or implying or suggesting the directors are taking back handers, it was just a general view of how that practice can happen again in some “circumstances” yes strict rules on disclosing payments to directors appear to be the norm, I wasn’t referring to any individual example before & resent any inference that I was.

[Paul Waine]

The facilities that we have for our fans before the game and at half time are no better than they were 30 years ago and no better than the away grounds many of us have visited several times...like Rochdale, Stockport, Oldham etc.
The lack of spend on the fans is shocking.

Hi TVC15, but the club is better, we are now in our 3rd consecutive season in the Premier League - and 5 in total.

Our finances weren't great when we won the play-offs in 2009. Very few expected the Clarets to get promoted again in 2014. We were all more expectant in 2016.

I think we've all lost count of the number of times we've set a new transfer record in the past 3 seasons. We all know the club have not got a smart new, state of the art training centre - and have moved up a level in academy status.

I guess many have lost sight of the fact that we spent a little over £61 million (including social security payments) on staff in the season to 30-Jun-2017. My guess is that total wages (and NI) will be towards £80 million when we see the accounts - in a few weeks time - for the season to 30-Jun-2018. Cash in and cash out from transfer dealings are a lot harder to track - in part because there is no clear disclosure of transfer fees (and agents shares) and in part because of the timings of payments.

How many seasons do we need to stay in the Premier League before we expect we are a "fixture" there? Of course, we all know, it's only fine margins.

At what stage de we start re-developing the ground - rather than continuing to build the squad? I'm sure the directors know their answer to this question. Small scale and required/compulsory work, yes. The rest, I'd expect, only when we "win the pools."

[Goody1975]

People will go and watch if we are playing decent football and showing a little bit more ambition. People stood on open terraces for decades because they were entertained, I genuinely think people would prefer us to spend 25 million on a top midfielder as opposed to a new stand

They will if that midfielder performs like one, buying someone for £25 Million and paying them a fortune guarantees nowt.

Things change, as do people, standards have improved throughout society over the years that is no different in football grounds.

I would at least like the chairman/board to talk of the need for medium to long term redevelopment of Turf Moor rather than a stern NO when the discussion arises.

It may be two or three years from fruition but at least bring the possibility into the public domain.

My major concern is a year on year rise in wages, it is fine when you are at the Premier League table but as was seen at Blackburn and Bolton it can go pear shaped in a massive way if you are relegated and don't bounce back.

[Claretforever]

Perhaps by redevelopment MG meant that they were going to arrange a permanent fan zone with better facilities?

Our fan zone is packed most Saturday games, so it would be great to make it look the part of a Premier League fan zone.

This is Manchester City’s around one side, with permanent bar, seating, cover, and with decent toilets.




And this is the Blues Bar at Blackburn which can accommodate around 300 fans before and after the game.

[Vegas Claret]

They will if that midfielder performs like one, buying someone for £25 Million and paying them a fortune guarantees nowt.

Things change, as do people, standards have improved throughout society over the years that is no different in football grounds.

I would at least like the chairman/board to talk of the need for medium to long term redevelopment of Turf Moor rather than a stern NO when the discussion arises.

It may be two or three years from fruition but at least bring the possibility into the public domain.

My major concern is a year on year rise in wages, it is fine when you are at the Premier League table but as was seen at Blackburn and Bolton it can go pear shaped in a massive way if you are relegated and don't bounce back.

I could have picked any random number tbh. I just don't see them wanting to redevelop when the stadium isn't full most weeks, a shiny new plastic seat will do far less to attract someone than a midfielder to two would imho.

[ClaretShaun]

Who would guess that an original sweeping statement on here would turn out to specifics on a match day experience?

Am I the only one who turns up, sits down, goes for a half time pee, claps the kids who are playing football, watches the rest of the game and then goes home and I never notice anything wrong with the "match day experience"?

Nope. That’s what every single, normal, fan does. But it’s the 1%, literally 1%, who make all the noise.

File alongside the 1% who doubted Dyche.

You can’t educate pork though.

[ClaretShaun]

Where is there to sit down in the concourse (we aren’t all Lancaster’s age, and many need to get out of the cold at half time)?
Where are the “gender neutral” toilets?
Where are the disabled toilets for those not quite disabled enough to need the new facilities (like people prone to fainting)?
Where is the hot running water?
Why are the first 20 rows soaking wet?
Why do we need to queue for 20 minutes to upgrade a ticket?
Where did the peas go?
Why no decent craft beer inside?

You could go on forever. It is all about standards. Basic standards.

Get well soon

[Goody1975]

I could have picked any random number tbh. I just don't see them wanting to redevelop when the stadium isn't full most weeks, a shiny new plastic seat will do far less to attract someone than a midfielder to two would imho.

The two go hand in hand.

Putting plans in place to extend the BLS (subject to retaining our Premier League place) doesn't impact on buying players, we get plans drawn up and then put a certain amount of money each season to cover the cost, this money will come out of the profits we make each season.

If we lose our top flight status then we put the cash towards getting back there, the playing squad and it's budget is totally unaffected.

[Goody1975]

Nope. That’s what every single, normal, fan does. But it’s the 1%, literally 1%, who make all the noise.

File alongside the 1% who doubted Dyche.

You can’t educate pork though.

There are still some people who take a **** in the back yard as they don't have an indoor toilet, i mean why not, everybody manage before the second world war.

Time moves on as do standards and what people want.

What happens on the pitch is the most important thing but it shouldn't be the only thing we are focused on during our Premier League journey. I don't want a new stand next season but i do want it to be a subject for discussion.

[aggi]

Yes of course, I did say in my last post based on risk “it will vary in the circumstances” I wasn’t using any particular example of cooking the books or implying or suggesting the directors are taking back handers, it was just a general view of how that practice can happen again in some “circumstances” yes strict rules on disclosing payments to directors appear to be the norm, I wasn’t referring to any individual example before & resent any inference that I was.

I didn't suggest that you were, it's the realities of the situation - it's easier to get away with things at a small, unaudited company.

Rules on disclosing payments to directors aren't just the norm, they're the legally enforceable rules.

[Claretforever]

People will go and watch if we are playing decent football and showing a little bit more ambition. People stood on open terraces for decades because they were entertained, I genuinely think people would prefer us to spend 25 million on a top midfielder as opposed to a new stand

People did stand on open terraces for years, you’re right, but they did that at most grounds. Times move on, expectations and standards change. When you travel away and see some of the facilities that other clubs have it heightens your own expectations.

Someone else has already mentioned it, but we average around 18,500 home fans. That doesn’t mean we have 18,500 home fans, but probably 30-40,000 or more who will attend at some stage during a season. How do we get them to attend more often, and how do we also attract new fans to Burnley, making the experience appealing for them?

[Jakubclaret]

I didn't suggest that you were, it's the realities of the situation - it's easier to get away with things at a small, unaudited company.

Rules on disclosing payments to directors aren't just the norm, they're the legally enforceable rules.

They can get circumvented generally speaking, I'm not going there on this thread, i feel I've said enough on this particular subject matter. I don't wish things to be taken out of context or misconstrued, I'm very clued up on finances & how they operate & how payments can be worded & structured without impinging legally.

[bfcwest]

If we stand still in terms of fanbase then we will continue to be at a disadvantage, and in the long term there won't be any 25 million midfielders being bought. We don't have a big investor, so we have to maximize commercial revenues, and having a ground that can accommodate an increasing average attendance and also generate none match day revenue can be key. We can't wait until we are out of the Prem before we try to do this.

If we only ever invest in players, then one day, when we do go down and don't bounce back, then I fear we will really regret it.

People will go and watch if we are playing decent football and showing a little bit more ambition. People stood on open terraces for decades because they were entertained, I genuinely think people would prefer us to spend 25 million on a top midfielder as opposed to a new stand

[Murger]

Our fanzone facilities are pathetic and not even league 1 standard. A tent and portaloo's are a joke for a Premier League side.

[CrosspoolClarets]

One or two people on this excellent thread are sailing a little close to the wind but hopefully we can all agree that there is nothing dodgy going on. It is simply a question of priorities.

I see things very simply-

The board have done a super job at stabilising the finances and investing in the team and training ground whilst ensuring we stay (so far) in the top division. For that I applaud them.

However I wasn’t happy with the lack of ambition to make a crack at Europe (e.g. buying Jay no matter the extra few million), or clearly not telling Dyche it was a top priority.
I am also not happy with the lack of investment in fans facilities other than what is mandatory (motives for this unknown). There is a bit of a mushroom culture, keep us in the dark etc etc.

That’s it as far as I am concerned, it sums it up. A balanced view. Pros and cons. And posts like Lancaster’s, professing to be content with his experience, frankly don’t help. If fans don’t ask, they don’t get. We have to show that in 2019 in the richest league in the world we have moved on with our expectations.

[TsarBomba]

Is anyone who goes to watch a game at Burnley likely to be interested in having more than a pie & a pint at half time?

Well yes, actually.

I’ve spent the last 12 years travelling the length of the country for home games, as do a lot of other fans. I’ve done 12 hour night shifts, then driven 4-5 hours straight from work.

I’ve forgotten count of the many times I’ve dumped the car and run to the ground, sometimes arriving as late as half time. My only option at times has been to eat at the ground.

You might live around the corner from the Turf, but not all of us are that fortunate.

[jrgbfc]

Our fanzone facilities are pathetic and not even league 1 standard. A tent and portaloo's are a joke for a Premier League side.

Plenty of people seem to use it though. Can't see the appeal of standing in a car park drinking warm, overpriced Carlsberg meself but each his own! Would rather go and support one of the local pubs personally.

[Winstonswhite]

One or two people on this excellent thread are sailing a little close to the wind but hopefully we can all agree that there is nothing dodgy going on. It is simply a question of priorities.

I see things very simply-

The board have done a super job at stabilising the finances and investing in the team and training ground whilst ensuring we stay (so far) in the top division. For that I applaud them.

However I wasn’t happy with the lack of ambition to make a crack at Europe (e.g. buying Jay no matter the extra few million), or clearly not telling Dyche it was a top priority.
I am also not happy with the lack of investment in fans facilities other than what is mandatory (motives for this unknown). There is a bit of a mushroom culture, keep us in the dark etc etc.

That’s it as far as I am concerned, it sums it up. A balanced view. Pros and cons. And posts like Lancaster’s, professing to be content with his experience, frankly don’t help. If fans don’t ask, they don’t get. We have to show that in 2019 in the richest league in the world we have moved on with our expectations.

I, for probably the first time ever, second what Lancaster says and am completely content with my Matchday Experience

[TVC15]

Hi TVC15, but the club is better, we are now in our 3rd consecutive season in the Premier League - and 5 in total.

Our finances weren't great when we won the play-offs in 2009. Very few expected the Clarets to get promoted again in 2014. We were all more expectant in 2016.

I think we've all lost count of the number of times we've set a new transfer record in the past 3 seasons. We all know the club have not got a smart new, state of the art training centre - and have moved up a level in academy status.

I guess many have lost sight of the fact that we spent a little over £61 million (including social security payments) on staff in the season to 30-Jun-2017. My guess is that total wages (and NI) will be towards £80 million when we see the accounts - in a few weeks time - for the season to 30-Jun-2018. Cash in and cash out from transfer dealings are a lot harder to track - in part because there is no clear disclosure of transfer fees (and agents shares) and in part because of the timings of payments.

How many seasons do we need to stay in the Premier League before we expect we are a "fixture" there? Of course, we all know, it's only fine margins.

At what stage de we start re-developing the ground - rather than continuing to build the squad? I'm sure the directors know their answer to this question. Small scale and required/compulsory work, yes. The rest, I'd expect, only when we "win the pools."

Hi Paul
I know what you are saying but I study the accounts too and have a good understanding of these. I am not expecting (or wanting) the club to spend tens of millions every year on the ground.
But irrespective of whether we survive another season in this league or not the club has generated more revenue (and profit) in the last few years than put together in its entire history. To spend virtually nothing during this period in improving the fans facilities is in my view short sighted....and i’m Including away fans in this. Would not be surprised if we are the ground that are last on the list for most away fans following their teams.

I’m not saying this is the most important issue - it’s clearly not. I am delighted at what we have done on the pitch and also our training ground is unbelievable. I just think spending a million or two on the fans facilities would go a long way in good will. Even if we put season ticket prices up by a tenner a year I think many fans would be fine with this if they could see some real improvement in our facilities.

Our concourses are colder than actually staying in your seat outside ! Seriously they have not improved in 20 or 30 years.

[DCWat]

I, for probably the first time ever, second what Lancaster says and am completely content with my Matchday Experience

That’s fine - absolutely nothing wrong with that. It’s naive though to think that the club doesn’t need to keep up with the market.

Like it or not, people’s expectations increase and we have to think about making the football experience more appealing to a wider base of people. Importantly though, this needs to be done without losing what your average football fan wants.

You only have to look at the shifts in high streets. Those that thrive are the ones understanding a wider client demand. Not the ones standing still and with an insular mentality.

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

I long for the day when it doesn’t take the bar staff 5 minutes to pour a beer into a plastic pint pot!

[Clarets4me]

Who goes to Turf Moor to eat and drink?

Someone quoted on this post, that we have 900 or so " Premium/Hospitality " seats, so these are detailed as follows ...

https://www.burnleyfootballclub.com/tic ... spitality/

Whilst season ticket holders are the lifeblood of any club, there needs to be an increased offering for those who can afford, or are willing to pay more for an enhanced experience. The big " well run " Clubs that we hear about from some on here, have a measure that they work to, which is " Average spend per matchday ", which calculates how much is spent at the Club ( Ticket + spend at the Club's various retail outlets ) per match day attendee.

With their bigger grounds, world-wide appeal, and wealthier fan base, both Arsenal and Manchester Utd earnt more from two home EPL games, than Burnley did in a whole season in 2016/17. It is one of the reasons that Spurs have invested nearly a Billion pounds on a new stadium, and why Everton are planning the same ...

We will never match the big " City " clubs at their own game, so we need to offer the traditional Football experience for those who want it, ( Open air bogs and fisticuffs after, should be an optional extra ! ), and expand our 3 Course meal with wine offerings to that market too !

Finally, to those who criticise the " James Hargreaves " and " Jimmy Mac " stands, just remember the state of the Club's finances at the time ... with the grants then available, the net cost to the Club was around £ 2.6m .... I suspect around around half the cost of the two new " disabled facilities " currently nearing completion !

[Winstonswhite]

That’s fine - absolutely nothing wrong with that. It’s naive though to think that the club doesn’t need to keep up with the market.

Like it or not, people’s expectations increase and we have to think about making the football experience more appealing to a wider base of people. Importantly though, this needs to be done without losing what your average football fan wants.

You only have to look at the shifts in high streets. Those that thrive are the ones understanding a wider client demand. Not the ones standing still and with an insular mentality.

We could double our crowd and it would still be less than 10% of the earnings from TV.

[Vegas Claret]

The two go hand in hand.

Putting plans in place to extend the BLS (subject to retaining our Premier League place) doesn't impact on buying players, we get plans drawn up and then put a certain amount of money each season to cover the cost, this money will come out of the profits we make each season.

If we lose our top flight status then we put the cash towards getting back there, the playing squad and it's budget is totally unaffected.

"If we lose our top flight status then we put the cash towards getting back there, the playing squad " and it's that backward type of thinking that means we could well go down this year with no guarantee of coming back up (whilst I understand your point I might add)

[DCWat]

I long for the day when it doesn’t take the bar staff 5 minutes to pour a beer into a plastic pint pot!

I heard we were going to get a multiple pour machine but there was the risk of a pint or two not being sold, so queues and fewer sales was seen as the preferred option.

[Murger]

Heard yesterday the reason we only have 1 card terminal in the longside lower is because they're too expensive. That can't be right.

[Lancasterclaret]

And posts like Lancaster’s, professing to be content with his experience, frankly don’t help.

You've never gotten over looking like a tool on the Brexit threads have you?

[Goody1975]

"If we lose our top flight status then we put the cash towards getting back there, the playing squad " and it's that backward type of thinking that means we could well go down this year with no guarantee of coming back up (whilst I understand your point I might add)

We cannot and must not spend 100% (or anywhere near it) of our income on player purchases and wages, if we do we are literally ****** if we go down, as per Bolton and Blackburn.

Every year we stay up we are in a stronger financial position, the fact we have not added in the right areas this year in either transfer window has zero correlation to the long term financial plan and our ability to redevelop (or at least plan to redevelop) Turf Moor.

[Lancasterclaret]

Taking the replies that are serious, the problem I've always had with the need to attract "new fans" is what exactly does that mean?

I agree fully with the post that any stand redevelopment should wait till we know about safe standing but does anyone really think we have more than 18,000ish people who are willing to come while we are in the premier league? And of course that number drops significantly if we get relegated?

[bfcwest]

Taking the replies that are serious, the problem I've always had with the need to attract "new fans" is what exactly does that mean?

I agree fully with the post that any stand redevelopment should wait till we know about safe standing but does anyone really think we have more than 18,000ish people who are willing to come while we are in the premier league? And of course that number drops significantly if we get relegated?

Do you think the 'walk-ons' are the exact same 'walks-ons' every game?!! There are I'd estimate 20 to 30 thousand fans who come occasionally. We need to get them to come more often so the average goes up. We do this by improving the experience. This will also help attract and then retain new fans.

[Lancasterclaret]

Right, so the biggest way of "improving the experience" is on the pitch no?

I'm all for new experiences and all that, but I'm not seeing craft beer on sale on the concourse being a reason for people to come back.

If we win a lot, we'll get more fans, if we lose a lot, we'll get less.

[Claretforever]

Taking the replies that are serious, the problem I've always had with the need to attract "new fans" is what exactly does that mean?

I agree fully with the post that any stand redevelopment should wait till we know about safe standing but does anyone really think we have more than 18,000ish people who are willing to come while we are in the premier league? And of course that number drops significantly if we get relegated?

Why do people always confuse redevelopment and increasing capacity?

Even if we kept to the exact number of seats we have now, it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t improve the facilities we have.

But regarding capacity, a small increase wouldn’t go amiss. We have a lot more than 18,000 fans, and there’ll be a couple of thousand different faces at each game. For the big games where we can attract more fans and offer a better, more comfortable experience, we should do that. They might actually come again and stay.

Right now gate income is partly insignificant, but we won’t always be a Premier League club. When we do eventually drop down that gate income will be like oxygen to our club, and if we have managed to grow our fan base by even 10%, that’s extra income each game.

You invest when you have money, not when you don’t.

[TsarBomba]

We could double our crowd and it would still be less than 10% of the earnings from TV.

That attitude is fine for the Top 6, where relegation isn’t a prospect.

If and when we don’t have the TV money to rely on, the club is back to being largely dependent on us again.

And in 5/10 years time, if we haven’t redeveloped, and the facilities really are at the end of their life, we’ll be rueing not doing it when we could and should have.

There will be no better time than now.

[Paul Waine]

Taking the replies that are serious, the problem I've always had with the need to attract "new fans" is what exactly does that mean?

I agree fully with the post that any stand redevelopment should wait till we know about safe standing but does anyone really think we have more than 18,000ish people who are willing to come while we are in the premier league? And of course that number drops significantly if we get relegated?

Hi Lancs, I'm pretty sure we should include our sons and daughters in the "new fans" category - and our grandsons and granddaughters, for those of a certain generation - and, of course, all their mates.

If we can do that we can add to the fan base - more so, if like some of us, we have moved away from Burnley and can bring in new fans from where we are now living, however far afield.

Some have mentioned the difficulties of getting "two together" - or more than two together. Additional ground capacity, as well as "better facilities" will go towards assisiting this growth.

[Lancasterclaret]

In what way do we improve the facilities we have?

I've seen a clip of MCFC fan zone, and it looks amazing. We can't run something like that will only be used once every two weeks

Running hot water? No problem with that

More toilets? No problem with that

Better food and corporate? No problem with that (but again, does it sell as well in the championship as it does in the prem?)

I mean, I appreciate that as someone who drives in for the games (so only drinks 1 pint, and normally in town), doesn't eat at the ground and doesn't really arrive earlier than five minutes before kick off I'm a different fan (not better, just different!) so I'm not really one who is going to notice but what else can we do that will help us attract more fans to the ground for the less interesting games?

[bfcwest]

Right, so the biggest way of "improving the experience" is on the pitch no?

I'm all for new experiences and all that, but I'm not seeing craft beer on sale on the concourse being a reason for people to come back.

If we win a lot, we'll get more fans, if we lose a lot, we'll get less.

Lancaster, you are hard work. You don't understand the issue because you are happy with your little world at Turf Moor and can't see beyond that. But please don't keep stamping on those that are suggesting progress. There are thousands watching Burnley on dodgy live streams rather than sitting in rubbish pitch level seats where you can't see the action and get **** wet through. There are families who would like to come to Burnley and sit in a family stand but can't because its full (and sadly many in the stand are not even with kids..). There are potential fans who've been 'brought' to Burnley with fans to try it out, but conclude that it will be just a one off experience for a ton of reasons.

The Club need to work harder win the battle to gain and retain loyalty from fans. It is not just about on the pitch.