Rule changes from next season

dpinsussex · Post by **dpinsussex** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:21 pm

The substitution is interesting.

I can see the benefit at the top of the game down to semi pro level with enclosed stadia.

The problems occur at grass roots on the local parks.
Here is a scenario.

Billy has just scored a goal and is gloating and winding up the opposition. Gets into a bit of a confrontation. He is substituted to save him getting sent off.
He leaves the pitch level with the penalty area and walks up the touch line to join his mates on the other side of the half way line. Problem is he has to walk past the opposition management and subs who stand between him and his desired destination.
They have taken a dislike to his antics and seek retribution as he passes.
Major problem for the referee (who is on his own) to sort out the arguement or worse.

Laws apply all the way down the system and so needs to be considered.

FCBurnley · Post by **FCBurnley** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:22 pm

The wall rule is stupid. `Attacking` players will just stand in front of the wall. rather than in it.Other rules seem ok. Another rule I would like to see is one to prevent `loan` players playing in the same league as their parent club. EG this would prevent Chambers scoring against Chelsea yesterday which could have been to the benefit of Arsenal ( his parent club). Loan system is great for say Jimmy Dunne getting experience at Sunderland.

Reckoner · Post by **Reckoner** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:30 pm

dpinsussex wrote:The substitution is interesting.

I can see the benefit at the top of the game down to semi pro level with enclosed stadia.

The problems occur at grass roots on the local parks.
Here is a scenario.

Billy has just scored a goal and is gloating and winding up the opposition. Gets into a bit of a confrontation. He is substituted to save him getting sent off.
He leaves the pitch level with the penalty area and walks up the touch line to join his mates on the other side of the half way line. Problem is he has to walk past the opposition management and subs who stand between him and his desired destination.
They have taken a dislike to his antics and seek retribution as he passes.
Major problem for the referee (who is on his own) to sort out the arguement or worse.

Laws apply all the way down the system and so needs to be considered.

Or martians could land a space ship in between the place a substitution is effected and the substituted player's tracksuit top leading to hypothermia.

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:32 pm

thatdberight wrote:Almost certainly considering the number of laws refs already don't bother with.

Not just that.

A manager sets up his team for various circumstances. Defending a corner or a freekick within the final third he doesn’t set the team up the same way he would if they have a corner or a freekick in the final third.

Eg, on paper Tarkowski is a defender and Wood an attacker. Our corner/freekick Tarkowski is an attacker. Opponents corner/freekick Wood is a defender.

The rule can not be implemented. It’s wrong.

FCBurnley · Post by **FCBurnley** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:37 pm

Dyched wrote:Not just that.

A manager sets up his team for various circumstances. Defending a corner or a freekick within the final third he doesn’t set the team up the same way he would if they have a corner or a freekick in the final third.

Eg, on paper Tarkowski is a defender and Wood an attacker. Our corner/freekick Tarkowski is an attacker. Opponents corner/freekick Wood is a defender.

The rule can not be implemented. It’s wrong.

Pretty sure the word Attacker means a member of the attacking team ( eg the team taking the free kick). Have to say I misunderstood it at first. Its badly worded

andyh · Post by **andyh** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:41 pm

No rebounds from penalties

If a penalty is saved or hits the bar/post, the game will then be stopped.

So if it hits the post and rebounds and hits the back of the keeper and goes in then is that a goal?
My guess is the rules for a shootout would apply and therefore it is active until it comes to a stop. Ricochets allowed just no new touches from the attacker. However from the wording it sounds as though the ball would be dead if it hit the bar/post.

SalisburyClaret · Post by **SalisburyClaret** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:43 pm

Every rule change has the capacity to create new problems

This is the FA doing what they do best

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:24 pm

Dyched wrote:Not just that.

A manager sets up his team for various circumstances. Defending a corner or a freekick within the final third he doesn’t set the team up the same way he would if they have a corner or a freekick in the final third.

Eg, on paper Tarkowski is a defender and Wood an attacker. Our corner/freekick Tarkowski is an attacker. Opponents corner/freekick Wood is a defender.

The rule can not be implemented. It’s wrong.

If Burnley get a free kick against Blackburn Rovers, the players in claret & blue are attackers, the players in blue & white are defenders.

peter_nobles_fringe · Post by **peter_nobles_fringe** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:28 pm

"No attacking players in wall

Attacking players will not be permitted to join the defensive wall at a free kick. "

So the referees are now that in charge they can determine what every players duties are on the field of play and will be aware this, supposing the manager has dropped a striker to holding midfield can he then apply to use him in a defensive wall for example. These rules are becoming more than a joke nowadays

claretdj · Post by **claretdj** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:30 pm

Q. Are these changes just in the premier league or throughout the football league's as well?

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:31 pm

peter_nobles_fringe wrote:So the referees are now that in charge they can determine what every players duties are on the field of play and will be aware this, supposing the manager has dropped a striker to holding midfield can he then apply to use him in a defensive wall for example. These rules are becoming more than a joke nowadays

No. Already answered several times. The attacking players are the players on the attacking side, and the defending players are the players on the defending side.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:44 pm

Dyched wrote:Not just that.

A manager sets up his team for various circumstances. Defending a corner or a freekick within the final third he doesn’t set the team up the same way he would if they have a corner or a freekick in the final third.

Eg, on paper Tarkowski is a defender and Wood an attacker. Our corner/freekick Tarkowski is an attacker. Opponents corner/freekick Wood is a defender.

The rule can not be implemented. It’s wrong.

You've misunderstood entirely.

Rileybobs · Post by **Rileybobs** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:48 pm

Hilarious how many people can’t grasp that the team with the free kick are the attackers.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:48 pm

SalisburyClaret wrote:Every rule change has the capacity to create new problems

This is the FA doing what they do best

Except it's not the FA. Apart from that, "Spot On!".

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:48 pm

Rileybobs wrote:Hilarious how many people can’t grasp that the team with the free kick are the attackers.

It has been a truly enlightening thread.

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:52 pm

FCBurnley wrote:`Attacking` players will just stand in front of the wall. rather than in it.

They're OK with that. It's to stop players pushing defenders out if the wall.

Rick_Muller · Post by **Rick_Muller** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:16 pm

So many people removing any doubt that they don’t understand the game of football on this thread...

SalisburyClaret · Post by **SalisburyClaret** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:18 pm

thatdberight wrote:Except it's not the FA. Apart from that, "Spot On!".

I’m afraid it is the FA - along with their friends from Scotland, Wales and Ireland. They even involved some representatives from FIFA to make sure they mess things up good n proper

WadingInDeeper · Post by **WadingInDeeper** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:44 pm

Rick_Muller wrote:So many people removing any doubt that they don’t understand the game of football on this thread...

I can't work out if some of them are deliberate or sarcastic.

duncandisorderly · Post by **duncandisorderly** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:54 pm

There's some (relatively to proper) clever folk on this thread, yet half of them don't seem to understand the word 'attack' as in 'an attacking free kick'. It's really bizarre. That is the one new law that I thought wouldn't need explaining, yet here we are!

bfcmik · Post by **bfcmik** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:27 pm

The problem with the substituted player walking around the pitch is that he would still have on his playing shirt making it possible that the linesman on the opposite side, for instance, could allow an offside opposition player to score believing their was a player on the far side keeping them onside.

blake's wand · Post by **blake's wand** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:33 pm

Can't see many places reporting that the 'no rebounds' penalty rule has been approved? Is there anything official on it?

conyoviejo · Post by **conyoviejo** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:34 pm

bfcmik wrote:The problem with the substituted player walking around the pitch is that he would still have on his playing shirt making it possible that the linesman on the opposite side, for instance, could allow an offside opposition player to score believing their was a player on the far side keeping them onside.

It's quite easy for them to remove their shirt when they are coming off.. It doesn't take long as we see in goal celebrations..

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:37 pm

SalisburyClaret wrote:I’m afraid it is the FA - along with their friends from Scotland, Wales and Ireland. They even involved some representatives from FIFA to make sure they mess things up good n proper

Oh, I see. You're an equal opportunities, "Everybody is doing everything wrong." sort of complainant. You should probably set up your own governing body - I imagine you'd have the world's most popular sport under your control by Christmas.

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:39 pm

is it April ?

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:41 pm

they should try and stop players cheating and diving long before they stop rebounds from penalties. Every season I fall less and less in love with the game

No Ney Never · Post by **No Ney Never** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:03 pm

Can't see the subbed player going off the pitch at the nearest touch line, then making his way round to the dugout rule lasting long. The hand gestures from opposition fans won't make for good t.v., then there's the missiles such as coins etc. Hardly conducive to player safety.

Hibsclaret · Post by **Hibsclaret** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:05 pm

Given that refs have a hard enough time getting everything/anything right already, adding stupidity like attacking players not allowed in the wall for them to focus on seems like giving them something else to balls up.

As for the stoppage after penalty it will be the only time the game is stopped without a foul, offside or going out of play. VAR should negate the need for anything like this but given the VAR examples they seem to get wrong every time I see it being used it will no doubt become a farce. The Man City game in Germany the other week was a complete shambles of 5 minutes to get the decision wrong.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:28 pm

Oh great. Even more **** rules. While not addressing actual issues like diving, cheating and the like.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:55 pm

cricketfieldclarets wrote:Oh great. Even more **** rules. While not addressing actual issues like diving, cheating and the like.

They've got rules for those already, just the referee's aren't strong enough to enforce them.

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:00 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:They've got rules for those already, just the referee's aren't strong enough to enforce them.

Hence not addressing...

dandeclaret · Post by **dandeclaret** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:13 pm

Is it April 1st?

What a load of nonsense these are.

Imagine if they focused on fixing stuff that matters, such as limiting loan players out, stopping clubs stockpiling young players, putting proper tests in place for fit and proper owners and retrospective banning of people diving.

Oh no - we're all sorted, last year kick offs could go backwards, next year subs don't have to come to the half way line..... Hallelujah the game is f'kin saved.

Spike · Post by **Spike** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:17 pm

But pushing and pulling in the box will still be tolerated? Total madness! Anyone should be in a wall and rebounds from pens is a great part of the game

cricketfieldclarets · Post by **cricketfieldclarets** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:19 pm

What does the wall thing actually achieve?

And the penalty change. Not addeessing the core issue. And rebounds are one of the most entertaining parts of the game. It now adds more pressure on the striker to score. When he should be the one gaining the advantage not the defending side.

Blackrod · Post by **Blackrod** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:23 pm

Substitution one seems a good idea. The penalty rebound one and defensive wall one seem odd.

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Mon Mar 04, 2019 11:31 pm

Hibsclaret wrote:Given that refs have a hard enough time getting everything/anything right already, adding stupidity like attacking players not allowed in the wall for them to focus on seems like giving them something else to balls up.

The wall one will be the easiest of all to enforce. If the attacking player is committing an offence by being in the wall, he won't be in the wall. You know what refs are like for enforcing pushing on defenders - if an attacker close enough to the wall to give the defender the slightest push, then it will be free kick to the defence and the attack will get no advantage. It's not as if a slight push makes any difference - the attacker would need to give a fairly hefty obstruction to do any good. It'll be like the back pass rule - hardly ever enforced because players don't do it.

MT03ALG · Post by **MT03ALG** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:29 am

Can 'attacking' players form a wall of their own in front of or behind the defensive wall ?

HunterST_BFC · Post by **HunterST_BFC** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:09 am

No Ney Never wrote:Can't see the subbed player going off the pitch at the nearest touch line, then making his way round to the dugout rule lasting long. The hand gestures from opposition fans won't make for good t.v., then there's the missiles such as coins etc. Hardly conducive to player safety.

Agree ^^^

But the clock then stops when a sub is signaled - if he is not off the pitch sharpish (30 sec), the sub can't then come on = down a player.
Clock starts.

The way it is, every game is cheated so much time. Ball not in play.
It's not even good acting!

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:04 am

MT03ALG wrote:Can 'attacking' players form a wall of their own in front of or behind the defensive wall ?

Yes. As they currently can. The fact that you don't see this suggests that the instinctive reaction of, "But why would they?" is how coaches feel about it.

Dyched · Post by **Dyched** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:24 am

thatdberight wrote:You've misunderstood entirely.

Yes, yes I did.

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:27 am

The wall and players makes sense to me. Attacking players trying to stand in the place where the wall would be is, in the old terms, ungentlemanly conduct - basically they are just being awkward, it's not proper football. Attacking players can still stand in front of the wall. I would like a similar rule for players deliberately obstructing goalkeeper movements , notably at corners.

https://www.skysports.com/football/news ... t-the-game" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

According to this link, the penalty rule will not come in to effect. I can see the benefit of this rule - it allows refs to concentrate on the goalkeeper's movements (and remember these rules will apply at all levels, not just televised matches) but it's a major change of how a penalty is seen so I think it requires more thought.

No Ney Never · Post by **No Ney Never** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:00 am

It's absurd to rule that an attacking player cannot stand where a wall has been formed by the defence, or anywhere else on the pitch providing he is not in infringement of the offside rule.
Why has a wall been elevated to such status in the game from being nothing other than a defensive tactic, to a right of exclusivity in favour of one side? Particularly since a free kick is awarded due to foul play.
How many defending players are required for such a formation to be recognised as a wall?
What is the minimum distance from the wall that an attacking player can stand to be classed as not interfering?
Suppose the ref sprays the ten yard line then a couple of attacking players stand there before the defence get the chance to form their wall, what then?

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:05 am

Hipper wrote:The wall and players makes sense to me. Attacking players trying to stand in the place where the wall would be is, in the old terms, ungentlemanly conduct - basically they are just being awkward, it's not proper football. Attacking players can still stand in front of the wall. I would like a similar rule for players deliberately obstructing goalkeeper movements , notably at corners.

https://www.skysports.com/football/news ... t-the-game" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

According to this link, the penalty rule will not come in to effect. I can see the benefit of this rule - it allows refs to concentrate on the goalkeeper's movements (and remember these rules will apply at all levels, not just televised matches) but it's a major change of how a penalty is seen so I think it requires more thought.

That article seems to me (unless I misunderstood what's happening) very poor. It rolls together two handball changes which are - please jump in if I'm wrong;
1) If a goal is scored which last came off an attacker's hand, no matter what the circumstances, it doesn't count and,
2) Entirely separately to 1), a clearer definition of when a handball will be given based on some definition of a "natural silhouette".

1) is rather vaguely extended to include creating the chance. That'll be clear as mud when VAR spots that a breakaway goal started with a "natural silhouette" handball two passes ago in the scoring team's penalty area. I'd also love to see the "natural silhouette" definition. We'll need it for jumping, sliding tackle, standing tackle, in the wall, defending a cross, defending your body when the ball's hit at you etc etc...

thatdberight · Post by **thatdberight** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:08 am

No Ney Never wrote:It's absurd to rule that an attacking player cannot stand where a wall has been formed by the defence, or anywhere else on the pitch providing he is not in infringement of the offside rule.
Why has a wall been elevated to such status in the game from being nothing other than a defensive tactic, to a right of exclusivity in favour of one side? Particularly since a free kick is awarded due to foul play.
How many defending players are required for such a formation to be recognised as a wall?
What is the minimum distance from the wall that an attacking player can stand to be classed as not interfering?
Suppose the ref sprays the ten yard line then a couple of attacking players stand there before the defence get the chance to form their wall, what then?

It's been defined as 1 metre from the wall. Refs will police this as a 1 metre exclusion zone from the 10 yard marker. It's just another example of the game making new laws instead of using the existing laws to deal with the problem.

dpinsussex · Post by **dpinsussex** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:10 am

SalisburyClaret wrote:I’m afraid it is the FA - along with their friends from Scotland, Wales and Ireland. They even involved some representatives from FIFA to make sure they mess things up good n proper

It is IFAB who make law changes not the FA

SalisburyClaret · Post by **SalisburyClaret** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:19 am

dpinsussex wrote:It is IFAB who make law changes not the FA

And the IFAB is made up of the FA of the home countries and some FIFA reps

bfccrazy · Post by **bfccrazy** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:37 am

The penalty rule is absolutely stupid for the excitement in football.

It means we’d never have the possibility of anything like this happening again which is one of the best moments of recent football IMO and shows why the game is special.

https://youtu.be/PrFOTT_y8C0

No Ney Never · Post by **No Ney Never** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:49 am

thatdberight wrote:It's been defined as 1 metre from the wall. Refs will police this as a 1 metre exclusion zone from the 10 yard marker. It's just another example of the game making new laws instead of using the existing laws to deal with the problem.

After walking ten yards and spraying a line, the ref will then spray a one metre circle around the line?

claptrappers_union · Post by **claptrappers_union** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:57 am

bfccrazy wrote:The penalty rule is absolutely stupid for the excitement in football.

It means we’d never have the possibility of anything like this happening again which is one of the best moments of recent football IMO and shows why the game is special.

https://youtu.be/PrFOTT_y8C0

I agreed with the initial rule change, but this has made me change my mind.

Herts Clarets · Post by **Herts Clarets** » Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:11 pm

tiger76 wrote:Time they clamped down on keepers stepping off their goal line before the pens are taken as well,.

They did a few seasons ago. But as with many of these changes, they soon stop being flavour of the month and are then ignored. Remember the '6 second rule' for keepers, where for a season or so you had forwards stood in front of the keeper counting to 6 on their fingers. And if they weren't from Blackburn having to use a second hand to do so