dilly dallying

[Belgianclaret]

I'm all for playing it out nicely, but for goodness' sake Jeff, boot it away !

[dougcollins]

Somebody will be on to tell you he's MOM again. You just cant see it.

[cricketfieldclarets]

We don't half create our own problems at times. Just effing hoof it!

[MACCA]

He's a cultured footballer, he doesn't just kick it, hense running the ball out of play at 46 mins. Don't bother trying to win corners or put a ball in, no point.

[Tribesmen]

That's Jeff for yer . Shocker .......................

[BOYSIE31]

good old jeff

[MACCA]

Somebody will be on to tell you he's MOM again. You just cant see it.

You're right. 2 votes for MOM already putting him 4th. I even so a 7 on the ratings thread.

I know Irish folk love their international players, but surely if they watch them so closely they'd see what the rest of us do?

Either that or it's Steve and Spice trying to Rigg the votes again to suit their ever diminishing argument.

[Steve1956]

Oh dear we are losing games again,err who can we blame Jeff Hendrick,people on here have very very short memories,one of the best players at our club.

[MACCA]

Oh dear we are losing games again,err who can we blame Jeff Hendrick,people on here have very very short memories,one of the best players at our club.

Put the rod away Steve, he's a long way down the list. He has half a dozen good games a season at very best.
His Ave ratings and MOM points show what he offers and how regularly he offersit.

He wasn't the reason we lost today, but he was 1 of a couple of players who had a stinker.

[Steve1956]

In your opinion Macca.

[Dark Cloud]

He looked a very, very good (Championship) player today. Close thread!

[MACCA]

In your opinion Macca.

In about 80% if not more people's opinion.

I get that It's extremely hard to admit you're wrong, but staying quiet is better than keep banging the same drum hoping he has 1 of his better games every dozen and using it to try and make you feel better.

The only thing he does with any sort of consistency is finish very low in all the stats tables, polls, and ratings.

[Steve1956]

In about 80% if not more people's opinion.

I get that It's extremely hard to admit you're wrong, but staying quiet is better than keep banging the same drum hoping he has 1 of his better games every dozen and using it to try and make you feel better.

The only thing he does with any sort of consistency is finish very low in all the stats tables, polls, and ratings.

Ok,wouldn't want you on my side in the trenches.

[Devils_Advocate]

Ok,wouldn't want you on my side in the trenches.

I wouldn't want you with your attitude.
"So Steve did you get those weapons to help us fight the enemy."
"Yep there you go"
"But these are spoons Steve not guns, their useless!!"
"In your opinion"

[houseboy]

Can you cast your mind back a couple of weeks ago when we were on our run of good form. Who was one of the outstanding players? Will you lot please just get off Hendricks back. It's becoming boring. A while ago I was Barnes biggest critic, and with some justification, but now he has proved me wrong and I'm man enough to admit it. Hendrick is a GOOD player and blaming him for every defeat is as bad as when people were blaming Hart for the same. We have lost 3 on the bounce now - two of them were just very poor TEAM performances and the other was an unsurprising defeat at Anfield (and we still scored two). Stop looking for scapegoats, there are none, just because you don't like a player and get it fixed in your head he's rubbish doesn't make that player bad, it just makes your opinion of him out of place.

Why don't you just boo him every time he touches the ball - that should really lift his game.

[Lancasterclaret]

He was poor yesterday, but he's one of the reasons we got ourselves into a position where we are not favourites to be relegated.

[JTClaret]

I don't think Hendrick has been playing badly, and I'm surprised he's back to scapegoat again.
The way I saw that goal was Lallana's work-rate closing down Bardsley's clearance, which Hendrick had left the ball for Bardsley to hoof.

I certainly wouldn't be putting Hendrick as a worst performer, though I appreciate not everybody likes him anyway.

[claretspice]

The principle of what Hendrick was trying to do was fine. Hendrick had his back to goal and was on his left foot. All he could have done was to clear it down the middle of the pitch. It would have put Liverpool straight back on the attack. What he tried to do was perfectly sensible - lay it back to a better placed teammate who can make a more calculated clearance to touch, or for one of the strikers to chase down. We did the same thing as a team countless times in similar positions through the game, which makes me think it's an instruction and Hendrick was doing the right thing as per those instructions.

Two things went wrong - firstly Hendrick's touch was a bit soft, and secondly Bardsley had switched off and wasn't alert to it. Had Bardsley been alert to it, I suspect he'd have got a clearance away, albeit a less convincing one than a better touch from Hendrick would have allowed. I'd probably point the finger at both of them, but for that reason probably more at Bardsley.

As to Hendrick's general performance it was OK, but not great, and he was certainly the weakest link in a midfield that generally competed OK. He was a lot better defensively than in possession, that's for certain.

[Steve1956]

I wouldn't want you with your attitude.
"So Steve did you get those weapons to help us fight the enemy."
"Yep there you go"
"But these are spoons Steve not guns, their useless!!"
"In your opinion"

[Steve1956]

I wouldn't want you with your attitude.
"So Steve did you get those weapons to help us fight the enemy."
"Yep there you go"
"But these are spoons Steve not guns, their useless!!"
"In your opinion"

If the spoons are sharp....we have a great chance.

[Woodleyclaret]

Too much mauling sideways and back passing.
Jeff was not the only culprit.Jack Cork too
We need to move into the space infront playing out of defence.Tarks is a quality passerr but why pass it sideways to Ben Mee .Get the ball out wide to feet so Dwight or Joey can continue the quick break then cross for Ash or Woody to score.

[ClaretTony]

Better than Westwood yesterday and significantly better than Cork, but we lost so it's on his back time again.

[Quickenthetempo]

What the stats men say. Taken from twelve on twitter but I can't get the full picture of everyone.

[Belgianclaret]

Better than Westwood yesterday and significantly better than Cork, but we lost so it's on his back time again.

Maybe this comment goes for some, but not for me.

I think Hendrick and Heaton will know that they made mistakes, and if not, the gaffer will have spelt it out to them.

[claretspice]

Maybe this comment goes for some, but not for me.

I think Hendrick and Heaton will know that they made mistakes, and if not, the gaffer will have spelt it out to them.

I'm sure that's right Belgian. But I'm also sure Bardsley will know he was also culpable for the second goal (perhaps more so) and that he contributed to the fourth by giving the ba away cheaply and getting caught out of position. And of course there will be others who know they made mistakes that weren't so obviously punished.

[Devils_Advocate]

I'm sure that's right Belgian. But I'm also sure Bardsley will know he was also culpable for the second goal (perhaps more so)

Cant agree with this at all. I don't mind Hendrick and thought his number 10 role was key to our success last season and Ive never been a fan of Bardsley but no way id say he's more culpable.

My view is it was a bad header back as it should have gone to the right of Hendrick so if he got in trouble he could easily clear it out of touch. I think Hendrick panicked a bit cos suddenly he had a ball behind him and facing inwards and as a result he duffed the pass. Bardsley looked to be a bit switched off (that was my initial thought) cos he braced himself ready to boot clear Hendricks pass but when it fell short suddenly he had to motion forwards to the ball and that natural reaction time allowed Lalana to do a brilliant block.

So I would say poor header (by Barnes I think) and maybe Bardsley could have reacted a littler quicker but it was Hendricks awful pass that was the main reason for me

[claretspice]

Cant agree with this at all. I don't mind Hendrick and thought his number 10 role was key to our success last season and Ive never been a fan of Bardsley but no way id say he's more culpable.

My view is it was a bad header back as it should have gone to the right of Hendrick so if he got in trouble he could easily clear it out of touch. I think Hendrick panicked a bit cos suddenly he had a ball behind him and facing inwards and as a result he duffed the pass. Bardsley looked to be a bit switched off (that was my initial thought) cos he braced himself ready to boot clear Hendricks pass but when it fell short suddenly he had to motion forwards to the ball and that natural reaction time allowed Lalana to do a brilliant block.

So I would say poor header (by Barnes I think) and maybe Bardsley could have reacted a littler quicker but it was Hendricks awful pass that was the main reason for me

I can only refer you back to what I wrote in post 18 above as to the reason why I think Hendrick was trying to do the right thing, and why Bardsley should have been expecting a pass. Certainly, Hendrick's pass was a bad one, but had Bardsley been expecting the pass he'd have got there in time to get enough on it to avert the original danger. The problem was he wasn't anticipating the pass at all, which allowed Lallana to win the ball cleanly; in my opinion based on the way we worked clearances inside the box throughout the rest of the game, he should have done.

But perhaps the real point here is that all this is debatable, all players make mistakes and it's just unfortunate that that one, whoever was at fault, was punished.

[ClaretTony]

Maybe this comment goes for some, but not for me.

I think Hendrick and Heaton will know that they made mistakes, and if not, the gaffer will have spelt it out to them.

It’s not just about one potential mistake but about overall performance. Cork, for me, was our worst player on Sunday. I think Hendrick should have cleared it for the second goal but Bardsley, otherwise playing well,was equally at fault.

[Devils_Advocate]

I can only refer you back to what I wrote in post 18 above as to the reason why I think Hendrick was trying to do the right thing, and why Bardsley should have been expecting a pass. Certainly, Hendrick's pass was a bad one, but had Bardsley been expecting the pass he'd have got there in time to get enough on it to avert the original danger. The problem was he wasn't anticipating the pass at all, which allowed Lallana to win the ball cleanly; in my opinion based on the way we worked clearances inside the box throughout the rest of the game, he should have done.

But perhaps the real point here is that all this is debatable, all players make mistakes and it's just unfortunate that that one, whoever was at fault, was punished.

I agree with you that Hendrick was doing the right thing but I think Bardsley was ready for the pass as in he steadied himself ready to clear it. I guess we just disagree on the second bit for the reasons we state and as you say its all debateable and what a messageboard is for

[Belgianclaret]

It’s not just about one potential mistake but about overall performance. Cork, for me, was our worst player on Sunday. I think Hendrick should have cleared it for the second goal but Bardsley, otherwise playing well,was equally at fault.

That's what makes football & this message board interesting (sometimes ), it's all about opinions.

There were a few more players slightly off peak on Sunday, but who can blame them after their efforts during the last weeks.

I was just disappointed in the manner we gave away three of their goals, but anyhow, I'm still convinced Liverpool would have won the game. There just is no equal playing field with the top six nowadays, so our victory against Tottenham should be perceived as a minor miracle.

Let us beat Leicester and put this difficult season to bed as soon as possible.

[ClaretTony]

I was just disappointed in the manner we gave away three of their goals

We all were, but to point the finger at Jeff Hendrick is somewhat harsh