The country is in turmoil

[vinrogue]

They asked the people what they wanted and the people got the wrong answer in a Yes No vote. Foolish to even believe it was a democratic vote and you could get the answer to the question wrong. Will I bother voting ever again probably not, this fiasco has proved voting is pointless because it really doesn't count for diddly squat.

[NottsClaret]

I think he's actually got a point has cricketfield, in that it is possible to be completely unaffected. This isn't a global war or tsunami. It's a bit like the 'greatest financial catastrophe' since the Great Depression about 10 years ago. If I hadn't read about it, I'd never have known. The only change to my life was my mortgage got a bit cheaper. That was it.

As with Brexit though, that's one (lucky) person in 60m. So not a fair reflection overall. Plus, we haven't left yet.

[Lancasterclaret]

Nothing to do with getting the question wrong.

It's just a very complicated process, which we've gone about the wrong way round and it looks like we are going to have to live with the consequences of that.

[claret2018]

It's affected me in a professional sense. My workload in the past 12 months has been focused on preparing the business I work for to be ready in case of a no-deal, so that our supply chains are impacted as little as possible. We've also had to re-structure the group slightly to make sure there would be minimal corporate issues with no-deal.

It's also massively increased demand for my profession, I get invited to go and interview for a new job once every 2 weeks on overage now, which didn't happen 2 years ago.

I still think it's a terrible idea despite doing very well personally out of it.

[AndrewJB]

I eased their worries though, because no one is going to be getting dragged to an airport and be made to leave, even if we left the EU with no deal.

This is exactly what the government has been doing since 2014 to people who have lived here all their lives. If we leave with no deal there's no saying how many EU citizens will get deported in order for the government to hit their meaningless 100K target.

[WestMidsClaret]

You're all being played.

[ClaretMoffitt]

Its turned you into something that isn't the alright bloke of a couple of years ago. So yes, its been affecting people significantly.

Really? I'd say it was the response of others than turned me into what I am.


It didn't start the media and political elites war against the working class, but it sure did reveal it.

[claret2018]

I'd say the alarming rise of the far-right is another significant effect

[thatdberight]

This is exactly what the government has been doing since 2014 to people who have lived here all their lives. If we leave with no deal there's no saying how many EU citizens will get deported in order for the government to hit their meaningless 100K target.

Apparently, there were 83 wrongful deportations of "Windrush" immigrants. You could be forgiven for thinking it was 83,000. Of those, 35 were pre-2010 (to correct the implicit party political point you make).

[AndrewJB]

Windrush affected thousands of people - tens of thousands when you consider the wider families and friends. At least 83 people were deported, but many more were refused entry to Britain after going away on holiday. If people were deported under Labour then they're also culpable, however the hostile environment policy (which came into effect in October 2010, and the change of the law in 2014 that made the deportations possible were definitely Tory.

Going back to the original point, if the government was happy enough to aggressively target people who had lived here for many decades, who is to say they wouldn't also do it with EU citizens who have done the same?

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Windrush affected thousands of people - tens of thousands when you consider the wider families and friends. At least 83 people were deported, but many more were refused entry to Britain after going away on holiday. If people were deported under Labour then they're also culpable, however the hostile environment policy (which came into effect in October 2010, and the change of the law in 2014 that made the deportations possible were definitely Tory.

Going back to the original point, if the government was happy enough to aggressively target people who had lived here for many decades, who is to say they wouldn't also do it with EU citizens who have done the same?

The windrush people had massive families and a huge base of friends judging by your calculations..

[nil_desperandum]

Of course the country's in turmoil - though I agree we can't be compared to Yemen.
It's not been like this for centuries, (and I'm not being dramatic).
During the war everyone (in the UK) was on the same side and pulled together against the odds, but at present there's civil "war" across the country with families and friends split right down the middle and a total lack of respect for the other side. I've never known the country so unhappy.
Parliament has no answer, it's extremely unlikely that a General Election would resolve anything and a People's Vote is likely to polarise positions even more.
It's hard to see these rifts being repaired for at least a decade irrespective of what sort of brexit we eventually get.
We were a relatively happy and united country until Cameron let the genie out of the bottle.

[Hipper]

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2015/m ... side-story

Blair criticizing anyone about immigration and what to do with migrants is hilarious considering it was during his tenure that the doors were thrown wide open for migrants!!
He's part of the problem, so he needs to sit down and shut up for once, the massive clown.

They made a mistake, but within the rules of the EU they couldn't do much different. No-one really knew what would happen and using those rules he could have delayed it for two years, but that would probably only have postponed the inevitable. With free movement of people, we are an attractive country - the easy language and generally welcoming attitude so people who want to can get on.

As for how this whole business has affected us so far, it has had some direct effect because of the behaviour of the pound and markets generally. This has not been catastrophic though.

For some in this country I know it has affected them. I know people whose work relied on EU grants and these have dried up so they no longer have work.

At the moment it is a political chaos, as has been said. There needs to be some outcome and it seems the powers that be are just incapable of providing it. Of course the main concern is if they get the decision wrong there is a potential for real chaos. The warring parties and their spokesmen - media, politicians etc. - are speculating the dire consequences unless the authorities choose their option. Who knows who is right, if any.

[Lancasterclaret]

Really? I'd say it was the response of others than turned me into what I am.


It didn't start the media and political elites war against the working class, but it sure did reveal it.

Always someones elses fault isn't it?

You couldn't be more a classic case if you tried.

[thatdberight]

Windrush affected thousands of people - tens of thousands when you consider the wider families and friends. At least 83 people were deported, but many more were refused entry to Britain after going away on holiday. If people were deported under Labour then they're also culpable, however the hostile environment policy (which came into effect in October 2010, and the change of the law in 2014 that made the deportations possible were definitely Tory.

Going back to the original point, if the government was happy enough to aggressively target people who had lived here for many decades, who is to say they wouldn't also do it with EU citizens who have done the same?

"Hostile environment" in this context was first used by Alan Johnson to be clear although, yes, clearly followed through and formalised by the coalition and later Conservative governments with very poor implementation having a catastrophic impact on some of our fellow citizens.

I'm all in favour of a hostile environment for illegal immigrants by the way as long as it's effected competently.

[thatdberight]

Of course the country's in turmoil - though I agree we can't be compared to Yemen.
It's not been like this for centuries, (and I'm not being dramatic).
During the war everyone (in the UK) was on the same side and pulled together against the odds, but at present there's civil "war" across the country with families and friends split right down the middle and a total lack of respect for the other side. I've never known the country so unhappy.
Parliament has no answer, it's extremely unlikely that a General Election would resolve anything and a People's Vote is likely to polarise positions even more.
It's hard to see these rifts being repaired for at least a decade irrespective of what sort of brexit we eventually get.
We were a relatively happy and united country until Cameron let the genie out of the bottle.

You're extrapolating too much from your own experience. Most of my social circle; I don't even know how they voted. The closest members of my family voted differently than I and it's had no impact on our relationship and, when we discuss it, doesn't result in any raised hackles and won't, whether we eventually exit or remain.

[Caballo]

You're extrapolating too much from your own experience. Most of my social circle; I don't even know how they voted. The closest members of my family voted differently than I and it's had no impact on our relationship and, when we discuss it, doesn't result in any raised hackles and won't, whether we eventually exit or remain.

This!!

[Quickenthetempo]

Of course the country's in turmoil - though I agree we can't be compared to Yemen.
It's not been like this for centuries, (and I'm not being dramatic).
During the war everyone (in the UK) was on the same side and pulled together against the odds, but at present there's civil "war" across the country with families and friends split right down the middle and a total lack of respect for the other side. I've never known the country so unhappy.
Parliament has no answer, it's extremely unlikely that a General Election would resolve anything and a People's Vote is likely to polarise positions even more.
It's hard to see these rifts being repaired for at least a decade irrespective of what sort of brexit we eventually get.
We were a relatively happy and united country until Cameron let the genie out of the bottle.

The country has always been split politically with Labour and Conservative parties too big in my opinion. If there were 5 or 6 parties similar sizes it would blend the country together better.
The country is together on despising MPs/parliament at the moment and you only normally get such togetherness when England play in tournaments.

There's nothing I can't do today that I could 5 years ago. Turmoil, my arse.

[AndrewJB]

The windrush people had massive families and a huge base of friends judging by your calculations..

Four to six thousand people will have forty to sixty thousand relatives and friends.

[dsr]

Four to six thousand people will have forty to sixty thousand relatives and friends.

Virtually all friends, then. Because if a single person arrived in the UK forty years ago, they're unlikely to have ten descendants; a married couple is unlikely to have twenty descendants between them; and a couple with two children is unlikely to have forty descendants between them. An individual may have ten members of the family, and so may her husband; but you can't add them up to get twenty.

[AndrewJB]

"Hostile environment" in this context was first used by Alan Johnson to be clear although, yes, clearly followed through and formalised by the coalition and later Conservative governments with very poor implementation having a catastrophic impact on some of our fellow citizens.

I'm all in favour of a hostile environment for illegal immigrants by the way as long as it's effected competently.

The ball certainly started rolling under Labour (and that was just as wrong). A lot of the anti immigration legislation has severely affected British people. My brother in law is married to a Thai person and she had endless amounts of trouble and huge expense obtaining visas and rights to travel from the time hostile environment was enacted (having lived in the U.K. on and off since 1997 without any problems). The man from Colne who has never lived anywhere else, told he had to leave the country because his mother was born in Australia. There are tens of thousands more people like this, and what is the point? It costs a lot of money to go about searching for people to deport, and I can’t see what the gain is for the country.

[houseboy]

Just had the misfortune of flicking over to the news. The story was 'the country is in turmoil due to brexit!!!'

Is it really? Honestly?

Cant actually say its affected me in any way whatsoever other than reading the odd bit of nonsense on here, social media and some fruitcake at work occasionally mentioning the word.

Is the country actually in turmoil?

Its all a load of **** isnt it? Hasnt affected us, wont affect us, never will affect us!

True - the sun still rises in the morning and all is well with the world. My main gripe is yet another hike in council tax and that has f*ck all to do with the dreaded 'B' word.

[aggi]

Virtually all friends, then. Because if a single person arrived in the UK forty years ago, they're unlikely to have ten descendants; a married couple is unlikely to have twenty descendants between them; and a couple with two children is unlikely to have forty descendants between them. An individual may have ten members of the family, and so may her husband; but you can't add them up to get twenty.

Get married, a few children, those children may also get married and have children, and you're around 10 relatives before you even start counting various in-laws, etc.

I'd say four to six thousand people having forty to sixty thousand relatives and friends is probably a fair under-estimation.

[ngsobob]

It's affected all of us already. If you haven't noticed, you're not looking. GDP is 2.5% lower than it otherwise would have been. That's cost all of us about £4000 per household. It's affecting finances for public services, which is why they are deteriorating evermore from the drop caused by failed austerity economics. And we haven't left yet. Hedge Funders are waiting to bet against a colossal drop in the pound if we crash out (we won't). That's why the rich are Brexiters.

[cricketfieldclarets]

Did you vote in the referendum?

Yes the one and only time I have voted. And what I did vote won. Yet the despite that, as I predicted vote doesn't matter. Because if vote against what the establishment wants it either doesn't win or wont be allowed to win.

I am not really arsed tbh. As it hasn't and wont affect me. And I only voted to prove a point.

[cricketfieldclarets]

They asked the people what they wanted and the people got the wrong answer in a Yes No vote. Foolish to even believe it was a democratic vote and you could get the answer to the question wrong. Will I bother voting ever again probably not, this fiasco has proved voting is pointless because it really doesn't count for diddly squat.

Spot on

[dougcollins]

It hasn't started yet.

[aggi]

In terms of how this has affected me. I know a few people who have lost jobs due to Brexit and friends who have left the UK. Also plenty of people suffering from stress over whether their business will still be viable after Brexit (and whether the time/capital expended on Brexit planning rather than their core business means their business will be able to survive in general).

[Quickenthetempo]

In terms of how this has affected me. I know a few people who have lost jobs due to Brexit and friends who have left the UK. Also plenty of people suffering from stress over whether their business will still be viable after Brexit (and whether the time/capital expended on Brexit planning rather than their core business means their business will be able to survive in general).

Can you provide details of the company that sacked people due to Brexit please. I will investigate further.

[Quickenthetempo]

It's affected all of us already. If you haven't noticed, you're not looking. GDP is 2.5% lower than it otherwise would have been. That's cost all of us about £4000 per household. It's affecting finances for public services, which is why they are deteriorating evermore from the drop caused by failed austerity economics. And we haven't left yet. Hedge Funders are waiting to bet against a colossal drop in the pound if we crash out (we won't). That's why the rich are Brexiters.

You make it sound like the 4k per household is split equally.

More like the working class areas who voted Brexit will have lost 10 pounds and the super rich £3800.

Working class areas voted Brexit.

[Lancasterclaret]

Aggi lives in London. Brexit is having an effect there but it will be quicker and more short term.

Up here it will be more long term and more damaging.

But blue passports and less Poles so its swings and roundabouts I guess.

[Espia]

The BBC 10 o'clock news the other night had a woman on there who had her own business of supplying soft fruit drinks in plastic bottles. The bottles were from France and she said Brexit would probably kill off 50% of her business straight away. When asked if she just couldn't simply switch to a British supplier of plastic bottles she said that manufacturers in Britain didn't produce bottles that were pretty enough.

Not sure if the BBC were taking the **** or whether this was the best example of the effects of Brexit on small businesses that they could come up with.

[JohnMcGreal]

Yes the one and only time I have voted. And what I did vote won. Yet the despite that, as I predicted vote doesn't matter. Because if vote against what the establishment wants it either doesn't win or wont be allowed to win.

I am not really arsed tbh. As it hasn't and wont affect me. And I only voted to prove a point.

I think you have proved a point. You've written an open and honest post which I find interesting. You've helped prove that a binary referendum on a complicated and vital issue is completely flawed when a significant portion of the electorate are largely detached from and disinterested in politics, and generally ignorant to the current affairs that surround them.

For democracy to work well we need an informed and engaged electorate. As citizens I believe we all have a responsibility to pay attention to what’s going on, and to try and be as informed as possible so we can make good decisions.

Prior to the referendum, millions of people never gave a toss about politics, and they reverted to not giving a toss as soon as it was over. It’s one of the reasons why the referendum result ought to be taken with a huge pinch of salt, instead of being held up as some unquestionable truth from an ancient text.

[Vino blanco]

Many of the people on here will be dead in twenty years or so: chill out and enjoy what you have left of your short lives

[Colburn_Claret]

To be fair, these are pretty seismic political times to be living in.

True, but if you'd read the post, and take the blinkers off.
Its Parliament thats in turmoil, the country certainly isn't. 3 years on, and we are still waiting for the world to end. The longer it goes on like this, the more and more stupid the profits of doom look. I doubt if there is 1% of the people on this message board who have had any interruption to their daily lives since the referendum, apart from listening to the bullshit on the news emanating from the House of commons.

[Colburn_Claret]

I think you have proved a point. You've written an open and honest post which I find interesting. You've helped prove that a binary referendum on a complicated and vital issue is completely flawed when a significant portion of the electorate are largely detached from and disinterested in politics, and generally ignorant to the current affairs that surround them.

For democracy to work well we need an informed and engaged electorate. As citizens I believe we all have a responsibility to pay attention to what’s going on, and to try and be as informed as possible so we can make good decisions.

Prior to the referendum, millions of people never gave a toss about politics, and they reverted to not giving a toss as soon as it was over. It’s one of the reasons why the referendum result ought to be taken with a huge pinch of salt, instead of being held up as some unquestionable truth from an ancient text.

What a load of ********. The people weren't informed........You wouldn't have been claiming they weren't informed if they'd voted remain, would you? You wouldn't have been demanding a second referendum then, would you? Why can't you see how petty and childish your argument is.
Complaining that a binary referendum is flawed. As the HOC has shown a multi choice referendum would just have muddied the water up even more. Not to mention the fact that in order to give multi options of Brexit or Remain, would require the agreement of the EU on all of the options prior to the vote. Or do you really think we can vote for one, if one can get a majority, then try and sell it afterwards to the EU. It's you that are living in a fantasy world.

It could only ever be Leave or Remain, if it wasn't black and white you end up with the **** we've had to put up with for the last 6 months, and the reason for that **** isn't the referendum result, just the idiots in and out of Parliament who can't accept it.

[dsr]

Get married, a few children, those children may also get married and have children, and you're around 10 relatives before you even start counting various in-laws, etc.

I'd say four to six thousand people having forty to sixty thousand relatives and friends is probably a fair under-estimation.

How many people did that happen to, though? Was the typical Windrush immigrant a single person who married an English-born person who had three children, who had two children each? That would give the 10 relatives, it's true.

But what about the families who arrived? Mother, father, two children, say? for them to have an average of ten relatives, that means the two kids are going to have to produce twenty descendants each, and that's assuming that they married a non-Windrush immigrant. It often happened that West Indian immigrants married other West Indian immigrants, which again means that they need to average twenty descendants to keep the numbers up.

There's a awful lot of double counting in the ten friends and relatives each.

[gtclaret]

Its having an effect on the young skilled graduates who cannot get jobs as companies are not recruiting due to the uncertainty. This is totally avoidable

[MRG]

Tell me. How has it affected you.

What system do you use to help you to remember if it’s effected or affected?

[Tall Paul]

You make it sound like the 4k per household is split equally.

More like the working class areas who voted Brexit will have lost 10 pounds and the super rich £3800.

Working class areas voted Brexit.

So everyone loses, but as long as the super rich (who can afford it) lose more than the working class, that's fine

[Lancasterclaret]

True, but if you'd read the post, and take the blinkers off.
Its Parliament thats in turmoil, the country certainly isn't. 3 years on, and we are still waiting for the world to end. The longer it goes on like this, the more and more stupid the profits of doom look. I doubt if there is 1% of the people on this message board who have had any interruption to their daily lives since the referendum, apart from listening to the bullshit on the news emanating from the House of commons.

Yeah, well as I've always said, if I'm wrong (and thats me and 99% of experts btw) and nothing happens. Hurrah, I get a lot of **** on here but nothing goes wrong. I can live with that easily enough!

If I'm right (and the 99% of experts btw) then this isn't going to be pretty. And thats not good for any of us.

[RingoMcCartney]

LONDON — Remainers: getting angry isn't working. It's time to see a shrink.

Visit any middle-class gathering this summer and even the vaguest hint of Brexit sympathy is likely to elicit a swift and angry response. "It's broken the social contract," one senior City lawyer told this author over wine one evening, in a broadside aimed squarely at those who voted for Brexit. "We paid all the taxes which propped them up. Now they've gone and f****d us. So, f**k them. We'll be fine, but they're screwed.

At another gathering, at the embassy of a major EU27 country, senior figures laughed, joked and despaired at the stupidity of the country voting to leave. Brexit was like a cancerous tumor which had to be surgically removed from the EU, one prominent official said. Few demurred.In Westminster's bars and restaurants, MPs often talk of the "catastrophe," "humiliation" and "nightmare" being inflicted on them.For Britain’s pro-European middle classes, Brexit is akin to a psychological traumawhich has left many unable to behave rationally, according to two leading experts. Far from being hyper-rational observers concerned only with what is economically sensible, many have morphed into the "Remainiacs" of Brexiteer disdain.

They are acting no differently to what psychologists would expect from those suffering from chronic anxiety caused by loss of control and insecurity, Dr. Philip Corr, professor of psychology and behavioral economics at the University of London, and Dr. Simon Stuart, a clinical psychologist, told POLITICO.

In such circumstances, Corr and Stuart said, patients can become prone to anger, despair and rumination, while slipping into polarized "in" and "out" groups, seeking solace in the demonization of the "other," whom they blame for the current state of affairs.

Sound familiar?

While it is impossible to put 48 percent of the country on the couch and generalize about their reaction to Brexit, there are common psychological threads running through the train of emotions many Remainers are feeling, the experts said. And at their heart are questions of identity, power and uncertainty.

#FBPE

To an extent unparalleled in British political history, Brexit has ripped away the veneer of security that the managerial and professional classes enjoyed, throwing — in their mind at least — almost everything into question, from the U.K.’s place in the world to the future prosperity of their children. It is a threat that many find hard to cope with psychologically.

It is also something many of them feel can be blamed on those over whom Britain’s educated professionals usually have day-to-day political, economic and social control — the working-class, provincial, poor and elderly who were over-represented among Leave voters.

According to Corr and Stuart, this emotional response is “standard psychological stuff." To find solace and some level of security amid the disorder, Remainers are following a well-trodden path to polarized group think, dismissing their social "inferiors" who voted for Brexit as stupid, racist and easily misled.

Such a prognosis goes some way to explaining why other EU countries are far less concerned by Brexit than the U.K., even if it could have similar, if less severe, disruptive economic effects. For Britain, Brexit is existential, affecting almost all its political, diplomatic and economic ties with Europe — and therefore more likely to cause anxiety about the future. For other countries, it is just a pain.

“On both sides of the debate, there is evidence of considerable ‘in-group’ love and ‘out-group’ hate," said Corr. "This is only to be expected given the social psychological dynamics of the debate."

One example is the pro-EU hashtag #FBPEused by Remainers on Twitter to highlight their opposition to Brexit. The acronym stands for "follow back, pro EU" — a calling card for others who agree with them to join their social media circle.

Kick in the rear

Corr said there are two major psychological processes happening for those particularly exercised by Brexit.

First is the “loss of behavioral control” for the Remain group — made up, in the most part, according to academic studies, of wealthier, professional and more educated people.

The lack of control over the direction of the country is “psychologically very disturbing" and “has been long known to undermine psychological stability — including the ability to reason objectively."

Faced with a political situation of unprecedented uncertainty, the brain naturally sends warning signals that all is not well, causing “heightened negative emotions” such as panic and anxiety. While this is happening the body is also put on high alert for new threats.

The second psychological process at play, according to Corr, is “goal conflict” — when people try to resolve the conflict causing them such psychological trauma — in this case, why Brexit is happening. “One powerful way of this is ‘cognitive dissonance,'” explains Corr. “When holding two opposing ideas or behaviors, one can change one to accommodate the other,” he said.

In the case of Brexit, instead of assuming that the Leave camp appraised the situation equally well as the Remain camp, and with equally honorable motives, he said, "the goal-conflict and cognitive dissonance has been resolved by assuming that the Leave camp are — typically speaking but always with exception — stupid, ill-informed and ill-intended. The underlying notion seems to be that they should have listened to ‘their betters’ — rather like naughty school children, if only they had ‘paid more attention in class.’”

Corr says the fact that many working-class people have been subject to this attitude for much of their lives “made the kick up the backside of ‘their betters’ all the more enjoyable.”

Living with anxiety

Stuart agreed that for the traditional liberal elite, the political upheaval happening all around them is likely to be “incredibly anxiety-provoking.”

“Human beings hate uncertainty. If our lives are constantly uncertain, our stress levels increase markedly — this is something that people living in poverty know only too well," he said. "And now, all of a sudden, the professional, liberal, educated middle class is getting a taste of this. It feels horrible — literally 'feels,' because we're experiencing a physical stress response.”

One way to avoid this sensation is to join together with others who feel the same way, Stuart said. “In the absence of anything better, ‘blame and shout at the out-group’ seems to be being constantly, mutually reinforced.”

Part of the problem for Remainers is that their emotional reaction to Brexiteers makes them feel better, even if it fails to address the fundamental cause of their anxiety. "Trouble is, in the longer term it's not really doing anything other than keeping us going round in circles, constantly talking about Brexit and winding ourselves up," he said.

If the Brexit Anxiety Disorder theory holds true in real life, Britain’s angry Remainers can be expected to quickly return to more “normal,” rational behavior once the conflict has been resolved. In the case of Brexit, this means people grabbing hold of any certainty tha comes along, accepting whatever deal the U.K. and EU are able to strike.

“Once this goal-conflict has been resolved, then there will be a major change in these individual and collective psychological states, and the Brexit debate may become more fact-faced rather than resembling the feelings and thoughts that result from hearing a disturbing noise in the night,” Corr said.

Stuart said this may be a little too optimistic though.

“Those suffering anxiety might return to more ‘normal,’ ‘rational’ behavior if the context around them changes,” he said. Clinically, however, this is often a forlorn hope, because contexts don't usually tend to change enough.

"In that case, what I'd try to do is help the person become more flexible — in short, to learn how to live with the anxiety, tolerate the uncertainty, and work out how they can continue to engage with what truly matters to them in life, rather than getting caught up trying to change things they can't change.”

In other words, Remainers may just need to relax and get over it.

[nil_desperandum]

The country has always been split politically with Labour and Conservative parties too big in my opinion. If there were 5 or 6 parties similar sizes it would blend the country together better.
The country is together on despising MPs/parliament at the moment and you only normally get such togetherness when England play in tournaments.

There's nothing I can't do today that I could 5 years ago. Turmoil, my arse.

If you are unable to see how brexit has divided the younger generation against the old, and how poisonous the atmosphere is within the country, (as demonstrated by some outside Parliament last week), then you are turning your back on reality.
It might be all fine within your own circle of friends, but open your eyes and look at the country as a whole.
You don't hear of a lot of people rallying round the idea of consensus, and it has to be said the press don't help a all.

[Colburn_Claret]

Yeah, well as I've always said, if I'm wrong (and thats me and 99% of experts btw) and nothing happens. Hurrah, I get a lot of **** on here but nothing goes wrong. I can live with that easily enough!

If I'm right (and the 99% of experts btw) then this isn't going to be pretty. And thats not good for any of us.

You still haven't explained how your life is in turmoil.


And IF life wasn't going to be pretty, then surely we would have seen the first signs of it by now. It's 3 years on, we were told the **** was going to hit the fan the day after the referendum.............
We're still waiting.

[aggi]

Can you provide details of the company that sacked people due to Brexit please. I will investigate further.

They were working on a research project that was funded by EU grants. As there was no certainty on what was happening with Brexit they didn't get the grants to carry on.

It's not just in the UK. A teacher I know in France was also having issues as teachers in France are technically civil servants so must be French or EU citizens. I think this has now been resolved (although maybe not in the case of no deal) but caused a lot of panic at the time.

[Tall Paul]

.

Why are you posting a seven month old article?

[AlargeClaret]

Just wait until the Islington branch of Costa runs out of beans , then you will see Turmoil in the extreme .

It’s pretty outrageous what the media are doing though.BBC 5 live has been in a state of virtual bed wetting hysteria the last couple of weeks with myriad middle class liberals phoning to say things like “ it’s not just me but all my friends are quite simply terrified” or “my 7 yr old daughter asked me today ‘mummy will we die after Brexit ‘“ and other such steaming bullshine

[Quickenthetempo]

If you are unable to see how brexit has divided the younger generation against the old, and how poisonous the atmosphere is within the country, (as demonstrated by some outside Parliament last week), then you are turning your back on reality.
It might be all fine within your own circle of friends, but open your eyes and look at the country as a whole.
You don't hear of a lot of people rallying round the idea of consensus, and it has to be said the press don't help a all.

There will be more arguments between young and old people about kids bringing their cups and plates out of their bedrooms every day than Brexit.

Just like it's massive arguments on here between football fans about Brexit but I haven't heard a single argument about it in real life on the Turf or in pubs on matchdays.

[Colburn_Claret]

If you are unable to see how brexit has divided the younger generation against the old, and how poisonous the atmosphere is within the country, (as demonstrated by some outside Parliament last week), then you are turning your back on reality.
It might be all fine within your own circle of friends, but open your eyes and look at the country as a whole.
You don't hear of a lot of people rallying round the idea of consensus, and it has to be said the press don't help a all.

You don't hear a lot of people FULL STOP.
It isn't the topic of choice anymore, and I know lots of youngsters. Some who voted Leave, others who voted Remain. They aren't at each others throats. I argue the toss like everyone else, but we always laugh about it afterwards. This massive division between young and old, just doesn't exist. I think the truth is most people are just sick to the back teeth with the subject and just want the government to move on. Thats move on and get us out btw.

[Lancasterclaret]

You still haven't explained how your life is in turmoil.


And IF life wasn't going to be pretty, then surely we would have seen the first signs of it by now. It's 3 years on, we were told the **** was going to hit the fan the day after the referendum.............
We're still waiting.

Whatever.

I'm sure that if it all goes down the pan, you'll deny it anyway so I'm not fussed.