Looks like someone else thinks a lot of posters are on hard drugs

[Lancasterclaret]

and wants to make a killing

[claretonthecoast1882]

After last nights Question Time think we should all have some.

The day Jon Ashworth seems somewhere close to normal is pill time, probably the worst panel ever to be grouped together with a special mention to the bellend actor

[Lancasterclaret]

Think they need to rethink the policy of

a) picking the audience from the ranks of the mad

b) having a special guest who is bonkers

[nil_desperandum]

Think they need to rethink the policy of

a) picking the audience from the ranks of the mad

b) having a special guest who is bonkers

On might have thought that having that sort of combination would have been highly entertaining and amusing - but it really wasn't.

[Im_not_Robbie_Blake]

Every time anyone dared to give their opinion that there should be a 2nd Brexit referendum or that Donald Trump should not be given a State visit to UK there was a chorus of 'Boooooo!' from many pathetic members of the audience. LIttle wonder that debates in parliament are getting nowhere with this kind of intolerance rife in our country!

[gtclaret]

Every time anyone dared to give their opinion that there should be a 2nd Brexit referendum or that Donald Trump should not be given a State visit to UK there was a chorus of 'Boooooo!' from many pathetic members of the audience. LIttle wonder that debates in parliament are getting nowhere with this kind of intolerance rife in our country!

Normally its the other way round, open door immigration is all good, because every immigrant walks in with a halo, and the EU is perfect

[elwaclaret]

Every time anyone dared to give their opinion that there should be a 2nd Brexit referendum or that Donald Trump should not be given a State visit to UK there was a chorus of 'Boooooo!' from many pathetic members of the audience. LIttle wonder that debates in parliament are getting nowhere with this kind of intolerance rife in our country!

What about your intolerance of people ‘pathetic’; what makes them pathetic? That they have a different view from you?
Nobody is willing to listen to others views... both sides, that is what is pathetic about politics. People who think they no longer need to listen to other opinions because they are right... that is pathetic.

[Lancasterclaret]

What about your intolerance of people ‘pathetic’; what makes them pathetic? That they have a different view from you?
Nobody is willing to listen to others views... both sides, that is what is pathetic about politics. People who think they no longer need to listen to other opinions because they are right... that is pathetic.

I don't know where they get them from, but the blokes and women in their 50s, 60s and 70s who keep applauding and cheering utter crap that has been debunked 100s of times in the media is very worrying.

And Gimli was dreadful.

[nil_desperandum]

What about your intolerance of people ‘pathetic’; what makes them pathetic? That they have a different view from you?
Nobody is willing to listen to others views... both sides, that is what is pathetic about politics. People who think they no longer need to listen to other opinions because they are right... that is pathetic.

It's nothing to do with what your views are. it's all about knowing how to behave and conduct yourself in an adult debate. it's not a reality TV show where you boo and hiss the villains and cheer for your favourite as soon as they open their mouth.
Last night was appalling, and not Fiona Bruce's fault. It was almost like they selected the audience from a list of Jeremy Kyle Show applicants.

[Lancasterclaret]

It's nothing to do with what your views are. it's all about knowing how to behave and conduct yourself in an adult debate. it's not a reality TV show where you boo and hiss the villains and cheer for your favourite as soon as they open their mouth.
Last night was appalling, and not Fiona Bruce's fault. It was almost like they selected the audience from a list of Jeremy Kyle Show applicants.

It was unwatchable drivel last night. It can't continue like that.

[elwaclaret]

I don't know where they get them from, but the blokes and women in their 50s, 60s and 70s who keep applauding and cheering utter crap that has been debunked 100s of times in the media is very worrying.

And Gimli was dreadful.

Granted Lancaster, he did himself no favours.... but the guy spends a lot more time Stateside than you, I or any member of the panel. Surely any sensible person should have the sense to listen, and then counter his arguments in a way that made him defend his position not just try to shout him down. Who knows behind the poor self expression, he may well have an insight none of us are aware of... political arrests down, black employment up, less border arrests than in B.O.’s time and apart from the ‘wall’ (which is nothing more than a populist gimmick) using the policy on immigration set up under the democrats....

All points made the night before on news night... all left the Democratic Party rep fumbling in the dark....

I’m no fan of Trump but a hell of a lot of people who know a lot more of internal American policies than me love him. I think only arrogance of the first order would lead me to assume I know more.... unless I could listen to what was being said and listen to his responses to my questioning his view... only then can I realistically say the bloke is a blow hard. People are truly unable to accept others may just know a little more, and will ridicule rather than question... that is not a healthy state of affairs for anyone.

[Lancasterclaret]

Granted Lancaster, he did himself no favours.... but the guy spends a lot more time Stateside than you, I or any member of the panel. Surely any sensible person should have the sense to listen, and then counter his arguments in a way that made him defend his position not just try to shout him down. Who knows behind the poor self expression, he may well have an insight none of us are aware of... political arrests down, black employment up, less border arrests than in B.O.’s time and apart from the ‘wall’ (which is nothing more than a populist gimmick) using the policy on immigration set up under the democrats....

All points made the night before on news night... all left the Democratic Party rep fumbling in the dark....

I’m no fan of Trump but a hell of a lot of people who know a lot more of internal American policies than me love him. I think only arrogance of the first order would lead me to assume I know more.... unless I could listen to what was being said and listen to his responses to my questioning his view... only then can I realistically say the bloke is a blow hard. People are truly unable to accept others may just know a little more, and will ridicule rather than question... that is not a healthy state of affairs for anyone.

All the justification you've said there can be put into one killer line

"at least the trains ran on time"

[elwaclaret]

Haha... very true.

Another for you.... the road to good intentions...
Robespierre, Benito Mussolini both liberals... both relied of fascist type dictatorships to try to force liberalism. Fair enough Mussolini later embraced fascism but on the political roundabout he started a million miles from where he ended up


Liberals tend not to so liberal when they get power.

[Lancasterclaret]

So that all Liberals then?

Jolly good.

[elwaclaret]

I don’t know ‘Gimli’s’ politics, and I’m not interested enough in him to see if he has form. He clearly came across as right wing last night, but is he? I suspect he is far from a Nazi, given his history, and the amount of work he gets from left wing leaning directors in Hollywood.

[elwaclaret]

So that all Liberals then?

Jolly good.

No not at all.. bu5 not all people on the right goose step either... that is the point. He may speak an hour of shite, but in it may be a truth you or I have missed. You don’t need to share someone’s politics to accept part of their reasoning, or at least be open to question your own view.

Discussion is a two sided tool. Not allowing sensible discussion is repression. If talking stops offering a option people look for other means.

[Damo]

Wait.. let me get this right... we have had over 2 years worth of people being called thick/racist/nazi. Hundreds of thousands of pensioners wandering around London dressed as unicorns. People spending hours and hours per day complaining on football message boards
All because the country voted to leave the EU, when said people dont agree. And people on here are offended by a few people Booing in an audience?

It's difficult to tell who is a parody and who is serious these days

[Im_not_Robbie_Blake]

What about your intolerance of people ‘pathetic’; what makes them pathetic? That they have a different view from you?
Nobody is willing to listen to others views... both sides, that is what is pathetic about politics. People who think they no longer need to listen to other opinions because they are right... that is pathetic.

Actually I can tolerate anyone's opinion. Those I consider be be 'pathetic' in their behaviour are those who boo, whatever their opinion. People should reply with words when it's their turn to speak, not just 'boo' like animals.

[elwaclaret]

Wait.. let me get this right... we have had over 2 years worth of people being called thick/racist/nazi. Hundreds of thousands of pensioners wandering around London dressed as unicorns. People spending hours and hours per day complaining on football message boards
All because the country voted to leave the EU, when said people dont agree. And people on here are offended by a few people Booing in an audience?

It's difficult to tell who is a parody and who is serious these days

It’s all very confusing for someone like me who loves debate... I don’t have all the answers, my search continues. I feel somewhat sorry for those who think they no longer need to question themselves and are happy to surround themselves with sycophants. The day I think I can no longer learn is the day I hope to shuffle off this coil.

[Lancasterclaret]

No not at all.. bu5 not all people on the right goose step either... that is the point. He may speak an hour of shite, but in it may be a truth you or I have missed. You don’t need to share someone’s politics to accept part of their reasoning, or at least be open to question your own view.

Discussion is a two sided tool. Not allowing sensible discussion is repression. If talking stops offering a option people look for other means.

I think what you and I feel is "sensible discussion" is way, way apart.

To me, bringing on a climate change denier (which is what JRD turned out to be last night) is not sensible, and he shouldn't be given that platform.

You can bring Farage (for example) on to these platforms no problem, as long as there are fact checking software at the same time.

Letting people spout all sorts of ******** because its good TV only will end up with an autocratic government with far too much power.

IMHO of course!

[elwaclaret]

I think what you and I feel is "sensible discussion" is way, way apart.

To me, bringing on a climate change denier (which is what JRD turned out to be last night) is not sensible, and he shouldn't be given that platform.

You can bring Farage (for example) on to these platforms no problem, as long as there are fact checking software at the same time.

Letting people spout all sorts of ******** because its good TV only will end up with an autocratic government with far too much power.

IMHO of course!

See that is where you and I do differ Lancaster. I think he’s dead wrong on climate change, but that is my opinion and I have little more to back my view than he does his? Am I right and him wrong... because you happen to agree with me? I’d prefer to have these people on and then decide if they make any sense whatsoever to my ‘reality’. Even if they don’t one thing you will not often if ever hear me say is”I’m right”, how can anyone be so sure is way beyond me.

[nil_desperandum]

Wait.. let me get this right... we have had over 2 years worth of people being called thick/racist/nazi. Hundreds of thousands of pensioners wandering around London dressed as unicorns. People spending hours and hours per day complaining on football message boards
All because the country voted to leave the EU, when said people dont agree. And people on here are offended by a few people Booing in an audience?

It's difficult to tell who is a parody and who is serious these days

Out of interest. Did you actually try to watch QT last night?
If you did, then I'm surprised you posted the above. No one denies that people have the right to boo / hiss / jeer etc. but there's a time and place for this and a supposedly serious debate isn't the place for it.
There's a reason why many of us watch QT and avoid Jeremy Kyle and BGT.

[Lancasterclaret]

See that is where you and I do differ Lancaster. I think he’s dead wrong on climate change, but that is my opinion and I have little more to back my view than he does his? Am I right and him wrong... because you happen to agree with me? I’d prefer to have these people on and then decide if they make any sense whatsoever to my ‘reality’. Even if they don’t one thing you will not often if ever hear me say is”I’m right”, how can anyone be so sure is way beyond me.

You have **** loads of evidence that he's wrong. That is the whole ******* point.

It does sound like you don't want a sensible debate, it sounds like you want batshit mental theories to be debated with the same authority and credence as actual, real, stuff.

Which isn't remotely sensible.

[Billy Balfour]

QT has lost its way big time.

If I want to see a shed load of bellends yelling at each, while their friends and foes either boo or cheer them on, I can go and stand outside a busy chav pub at chucking out time.

[nil_desperandum]

QT has lost its way big time.

If I want to see a shed load of bellends yelling at each, while their friends and foes either boo or cheer them on, I can go and stand outside a busy chav pub at chucking out time.

Exactly this.

[quoonbeatz]

no idea who the daft old actor was (seemed like a poundshop brian blessed) but, unfortunately for him, talking actory doesn't disguise talking shite.

[Bosscat]

I blame brexit

[elwaclaret]

You have **** loads of evidence that he's wrong. That is the whole ******* point.

It does sound like you don't want a sensible debate, it sounds like you want batshit mental theories to be debated with the same authority and credence as actual, real, stuff.

Which isn't remotely sensible.

No The evidence I have is what I hear other people discussing same as you. I have not researched it, so I don’t KNOW.

I have no more right to express my opinion on climate change than the next man. Because his view is massively different than mine does not give me the right to assume I’m right and you or Gimli or anyone I don’t know is wrong.

One thing I do believe is if you stop people expressing themselves they find other means, usually more extreme to get their points across. Know your enemy, know yourself and keep your friends close and enemies closer.... democracy = debate.

[Lancasterclaret]

No The evidence I have is what I hear other people discussing same as you. I have not researched it, so I don’t KNOW.

I have no more right to express my opinion on climate change than the next man. Because his view is massively different than mine does not give me the right to assume I’m right and you or Gimli or anyone I don’t know is wrong.

One thing I do believe is if you stop people expressing themselves they find other means, usually more extreme to get their points across. Know your enemy, know yourself and keep your friends close and enemies closer.... democracy = debate.

You do know though. Because the evidence is there.

You can give them a platform, as long as you point out the falsehoods and the lies.

[elwaclaret]

Exactly my point.

You let them talk, and then you interrogate them. That Green women had every opportunity to kill Gimli with knowledge (I would hope) did she really do that or play to the crowd as Pointed out by Balfour (I think)? Question time has lost its ‘serious debate’ format, and did so long before the change in present or... think it’s a sad reflection on the level of British politics in general.

[Clarets4me]

I would have more time for those, particularly on the left, bemoaning the booing and jeering of others, if they'd been making the same point when Vote Leave campaigners were being harrassed, spat at, and being forced to take refuge in a Pub whilst in Scotland, during the Referendum campaign. This was one of many such incidents, including Bob Geldof's behaviour on his Thames launch. Much of the abuse was coming in part from people who had obscured their faces, whilst the police stood by and did very little ...

[Lancasterclaret]

Exactly my point.

You let them talk, and then you interrogate them. That Green women had every opportunity to kill Gimli with knowledge (I would hope) did she really do that or play to the crowd as Pointed out by Balfour (I think)? Question time has lost its ‘serious debate’ format, and did so long before the change in present or... think it’s a sad reflection on the level of British politics in general.

She can't, because she get interupted by either him or some gammon in the crowd.

But you are making the mistake that a lot make. People don't have time/knowledge/interest/whatever to research this kind of thing so they rely on the tv/radio/internet to get what they need. Thats fine up to a point.

The point being is all the crap spread around about literally everything by literally everybody.

You need to have some sort of control so that the information that is getting out there is factually accurate.

[Lancasterclaret]

I would have more time for those, particularly on the left, bemoaning the booing and jeering of others, if they'd been making the same point when Vote Leave campaigners were being harrassed, spat at, and being forced to take refuge in a Pub whilst in Scotland, during the Referendum campaign. This was one of many such incidents, including Bob Geldof's behaviour on his Thames launch. Much of the abuse was coming in part from people who had obscured their faces, whilst the police stood by and did very little ...

I've got no time whatsoever for whataboutery. You are either serious about sorting this kind of stuff out, or you are not.

[elwaclaret]

She can't, because she get interupted by either him or some gammon in the crowd.

But you are making the mistake that a lot make. People don't have time/knowledge/interest/whatever to research this kind of thing so they rely on the tv/radio/internet to get what they need. Thats fine up to a point.

The point being is all the crap spread around about literally everything by literally everybody.

You need to have some sort of control so that the information that is getting out there is factually accurate.

Agree QuestionTime has lost its ‘role’ and is no longer fit for purpose. As for ‘keeping control’ that bird has flown. I visit other social media as little as possible for that very reason. Also why I turn so often to historical presidents. What we hear is filtered... what is behind the filters is what I need to know. Because someone is vastly different in views to me, makes me want to know why they think like that. Had I not met you many years ago at a clarets and do I would not chose to debate with you so regularly... but I know you are an intelligent individual and if I have missed some reasoning, you have as good a chance of pointing it out as anyone... once you are out of your barricade. I believe totally in debate, I am utterly willing to be wrong. I am utterly willing to raise points that I may not even hold to develop further my understanding of others view.

[Lancasterclaret]

Agree QuestionTime has lost its ‘role’ and is no longer fit for purpose. As for ‘keeping control’ that bird has flown. I visit other social media as little as possible for that very reason. Also why I turn so often to historical presidents. What we hear is filtered... what is behind the filters is what I need to know. Because someone is vastly different in views to me, makes me want to know why they think like that. Had I not met you many years ago at a clarets and do I would not chose to debate with you so regularly... but I know you are an intelligent individual and if I have missed some reasoning, you have as good a chance of pointing it out as anyone... once you are out of your barricade. I believe totally in debate, I am utterly willing to be wrong. I am utterly willing to raise points that I may not even hold to develop further my understanding of others view.

But because I've met you I don't get your position.

You appear (and apologies if I'm reading you wrong) one of these people who is convinced that everything he's learnt is wrong and that there are conspiracies everywhere and the real truth is out there.

My father in law is exactly the same. Lovely bloke, but completely lost the plot in regards to so many things because he wants to believe that he's right about so many things. He got books by David Icke for example.

I'm not going to change my mind on climate change (self evident), Trump (not the right man to lead the free world) or Brexit (waste of time and money with no benefits)

That doesn't mean I've got a closed mind, it means that I've spent enough time looking and researching all three and drawing the correct conclusions without resorting to anything other than rationale.

On this board, that is an absolute rarity (sadly)

[elwaclaret]

But because I've met you I don't get your position.

You appear (and apologies if I'm reading you wrong) one of these people who is convinced that everything he's learnt is wrong and that there are conspiracies everywhere and the real truth is out there.

My father in law is exactly the same. Lovely bloke, but completely lost the plot in regards to so many things because he wants to believe that he's right about so many things. He got books by David Icke for example.

I'm not going to change my mind on climate change (self evident), Trump (not the right man to lead the free world) or Brexit (waste of time and money with no benefits)

That doesn't mean I've got a closed mind, it means that I've spent enough time looking and researching all three and drawing the correct conclusions without resorting to anything other than rationale.

On this board, that is an absolute rarity (sadly)

Fair synopsis but no i’m Not a conspiratorial-it’s. I don’t discount anything of the things I’ve learned, but I don’t either accept that because I’ve formed my opinion that there is no room for others to influence it, if they have a way of looking at that I had not considered for example. It’s a way of looking at things you more than most I would of thought more than many would recognise. There has been such a land shift in historical thinking over the last thirty years much of what we accepted as fact is now correctly and seriously questioned. My point is do we ever truly know.... is there ever one truth? Without wanting to wander off into philosophy, post modernist analysis suggests not...

[CrosspoolClarets]

Agree QuestionTime has lost its ‘role’ and is no longer fit for purpose. As for ‘keeping control’ that bird has flown. I visit other social media as little as possible for that very reason. Also why I turn so often to historical presidents. What we hear is filtered... what is behind the filters is what I need to know. Because someone is vastly different in views to me, makes me want to know why they think like that. Had I not met you many years ago at a clarets and do I would not chose to debate with you so regularly... but I know you are an intelligent individual and if I have missed some reasoning, you have as good a chance of pointing it out as anyone... once you are out of your barricade. I believe totally in debate, I am utterly willing to be wrong. I am utterly willing to raise points that I may not even hold to develop further my understanding of others view.

I enjoyed the above post, as well as the one about America higher up.

I also post on here to test out and develop my own views - far easier to do that with posters whose views you have a sense of, rather than total strangers who could be talking total nonsense. Mind you, you have to be careful not to debate too much with friends, I have deleted FB because of this, but have kept Tw because I use it for news research not for social engagement.

On the wider debate up this thread, I didn't watch QT last night but have seen some clips, and I do agree that Trump is really upsetting liberals but conservatives think he is doing a great job. I also agree with the actor last night when he said that many thoughtful, normal people he meets are as angry as they have ever been.

There may be a reckoning in the Leave voting Labour seats, but there will be an even bigger reckoning in the Leave voting Tory seats. May after all leads the sitting government, so she will get the punishment full blast. This latest furore over Huawei (where I suspect Hammond and Liddington have persuaded her to back the Chinese on economic grounds) will further anger those who view protection of sovereignty as sacrosanct. The Tories will go on the "you can't risk Corbyn in No 10" message, but that won't work this time. I suspect they are finished. I'm talking the next general election not just the local and EU ones.

[AlargeClaret]

While I didn’t watch it judging by the frothing rags one can only surmise that the left didn’t get much of a look in from either the panel or the audience . Though the BBC do try awfully hard for balance in all fairness QT does tilt ever do slightly to the left of centre .

If this thread proves anything it’s the absolute blind intolerance of the left to others views

[Lancasterclaret]

While I didn’t watch it judging by the frothing rags one can only surmise that the left didn’t get much of a look in from either the panel or the audience . Though the BBC do try awfully hard for balance in all fairness QT does tilt ever do slightly to the left of centre .

If this thread proves anything it’s the absolute blind intolerance of the left to others views

MY IRONY FILTER CRASHED AGAIN.

[Imploding Turtle]

While I didn’t watch it judging by the frothing rags one can only surmise that the left didn’t get much of a look in from either the panel or the audience . Though the BBC do try awfully hard for balance in all fairness QT does tilt ever do slightly to the left of centre .

If this thread proves anything it’s the absolute blind intolerance of the left to others views

Alargeclaret: I didn’t watch it
Also Alargeclaret: If this thread proves anything it’s the absolute blind intolerance of the left to others views

[Lancasterclaret]

Fair synopsis but no i’m Not a conspiratorial-it’s. I don’t discount anything of the things I’ve learned, but I don’t either accept that because I’ve formed my opinion that there is no room for others to influence it, if they have a way of looking at that I had not considered for example. It’s a way of looking at things you more than most I would of thought more than many would recognise. There has been such a land shift in historical thinking over the last thirty years much of what we accepted as fact is now correctly and seriously questioned. My point is do we ever truly know.... is there ever one truth? Without wanting to wander off into philosophy, post modernist analysis suggests not...

As long as the new information is evidence based, then I've no problem with it.

But a lot of the time its not, and thats the problem.

[elwaclaret]

While I didn’t watch it judging by the frothing rags one can only surmise that the left didn’t get much of a look in from either the panel or the audience . Though the BBC do try awfully hard for balance in all fairness QT does tilt ever do slightly to the left of centre .

If this thread proves anything it’s the absolute blind intolerance of the left to others views

I found it hard to fully understand the points ‘Gimli’ (I should really look up his name, I’m not intending disrespect) made because of the amount of over shouting going on. I can see validity in his arguments I could make out and think the BBC needs to look long and hard at getting serious intellectual debate. Shoot him down in flames by all means... by logical and reasoned argument, if I give an opinion, it’s facts and sources that are important not what I say, that is just opinion... only as valid as anyone else’s. Labeling and rubbishing others off hand without deep genuine attempt to empathise and then discredit merely suggests to me their own view is invalid for lack of supporting evidence.

[nil_desperandum]

While I didn’t watch it judging by the frothing rags one can only surmise that the left didn’t get much of a look in from either the panel or the audience . Though the BBC do try awfully hard for balance in all fairness QT does tilt ever do slightly to the left of centre .

If this thread proves anything it’s the absolute blind intolerance of the left to others views

Why not try watching it, rather than commenting and making yourself look a bit silly?
I don't think any of our resident "right wingers" have been on this thread to say what a good programme it was, since anyone who watched it, unless they'd tuned into the wrong channel by mistake, wouldn't have recognised it as the serious programme that it normally purports to be.
It wasn't really a a left versus right sort of programme, although climate change got quite a lot of time, (which some people incorrectly label as a "left wing" issue, whereas in fact it's an issue for us all, and there are plenty on the "right" who share concerns about the planet).
The issue last night was the appalling "behaviour" of the audience, (for which the BBC must accept much of the blame for selecting them), and their appalling choice of the actor chap to be a panellist, whose behaviour was also incompatible with a serious debate.
We've seen some fairly feisty clashes on QT In the past, but this guy resorted to yelling at other panellists and a member of the audience. If this is the way that the BBC see the programme going then it will lose the vast majority of its usual viewers.

[elwaclaret]

Why not try watching it, rather than commenting and making yourself look a bit silly?
I don't think any of our resident "right wingers" have been on this thread to say what a good programme it was, since anyone who watched it, unless they'd tuned into the wrong channel by mistake, wouldn't have recognised it as the serious programme that it normally purports to be.
It wasn't really a a left versus right sort of programme, although climate change got quite a lot of time, (which some people incorrectly label as a "left wing" issue, whereas in fact it's an issue for us all, and there are plenty on the "right" who share concerns about the planet).
The issue last night was the appalling "behaviour" of the audience, (for which the BBC must accept much of the blame for selecting them), and their appalling choice of the actor chap to be a panellist, whose behaviour was also incompatible with a serious debate.
We've seen some fairly feisty clashes on QT In the past, but this guy resorted to yelling at other panellists and a member of the audience. If this is the way that the BBC see the programme going then it will lose the vast majority of its usual viewers.

He lost his rag in frustration, it didn’t help him.

However the point he was trying to make was valid. Many American’s take a different view to climate change... and did long before Trump and domestic policies. Whether they were his views were not clear... he was speaking of his experience of living in and moving around America.

I truly believe in the need to act and act hard on climate change, but pretending that it’s one or two cranks that don’t is nonsense. Had I been asked to go and give my experience of what others are saying I may well have made the same statements, even if they were not my personal views. We never really got to find out because nobody was interesting in finding out why he was saying what he said, only in shouting each other down. Agree with previous posters more Jeremy Kyle than Question Time.

[Clarets4me]

I've got no time whatsoever for whataboutery. You are either serious about sorting this kind of stuff out, or you are not.

It's not " whataboutery ", it's simply calling out double standards !!

[elwaclaret]

It's not " whataboutery ", it's simply calling out double standards !!

People shout others down only when they fear they will be out reasoned if they try to engage. It’s easier than having to think.

It’s why Farage is seen as such a menace, and is ridiculed in his absence so often. Like him or loath him he is a quality orator who asks awkward questions others would rather not have to deal with.