Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

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Lancasterclaret
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Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Lancasterclaret » Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:17 am

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer ... 8?mode=amp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Sausage » Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:58 am

Enjoyed that. Some insightful stats.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by dushanbe » Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:58 am

Thats a good read.

I heard Chris Sutton on the 5 live phone in last night talking about how rather than getting rid of him, United should 'build their team around Pogba'. It struck me as such legacy thinking. City and Liverpool haven't built their team around anyone, they have built their team around a system.
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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:08 pm

I think that's the first article I've read to basically say Keane is out of date as an analyst...

Excellent read though.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by randomclaret2 » Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:35 pm

157 goals for City this season ? Truly incredible...and yet some are complaining about a performance where we we restricted them to 1 ( just about over the line ) goal yesterday

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by ksrclaret » Mon Apr 29, 2019 12:45 pm

What a brilliant article, really enjoyed that.

Funnily enough I think Dyche has cracked what they’re on about, the system over the individual, albeit we present it in a less attractive way.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by thatdberight » Mon Apr 29, 2019 1:09 pm

ksrclaret wrote:What a brilliant article, really enjoyed that.

Funnily enough I think Dyche has cracked what they’re on about, the system over the individual, albeit we present it in a less attractive way.
The financial limitations are still the same. Whether it's 11 brilliant individuals or 11 who can brilliantly play as a team, you still get what you pay for and you have to find a different system if you're us.

For what it's worth, City as a team are brilliant. The movement, fluidity and precision both with and without the ball are exemplary. That's not about building the team around a Pogba, that's about building a way of playing and seeing who can do that best. If you build a team around one player and he lets you down you're lost. If you're City, that doesn't matter. Helped of course by the gross inequality in money, but still based on a foundation of having a way of playing.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Hipper » Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:08 pm

On this closing down thing, when we try it, against City, or Chelsea last week, they are just too good and are able to pass their way out of trouble. Usually if we try to do that we get into trouble. Occasionally we can do that but mostly our quality is not so consistently high.

These top players pass with such accuracy and perfect pace and their ball control is so good too.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Quickenthetempo » Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:37 pm

Hipper wrote:On this closing down thing, when we try it, against City, or Chelsea last week, they are just too good and are able to pass their way out of trouble. Usually if we try to do that we get into trouble. Occasionally we can do that but mostly our quality is not so consistently high.

These top players pass with such accuracy and perfect pace and their ball control is so good too.
You have got to want to press and have your team mates backing you up.
Chris Wood doesn't seem to enjoy doing anything that he can't score from.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by thatdberight » Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:48 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:You have got to want to press and have your team mates backing you up.
Chris Wood doesn't seem to enjoy doing anything that he can't score from.
In the last two games, controlling the ball so he can shoot seems like something he's not keen on so it's not fair to suggest he's doing it out of selfishness.
Last edited by thatdberight on Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Chester Perry » Mon Apr 29, 2019 2:50 pm

You could almost say that Liverpool goal against Huddersfield was similar to the Vokes one against them a couple of years back - we pressed them into an obvious pass, intercepted and punished them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjIrABICe4M" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Sproggy » Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:33 am

Doesn't this just prove that if you give some clubs access to unlimited amounts of money that they buy better footballers? You don't have to build a team around one player if you can afford to buy the best player in the world in every position.
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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by THEWELLERNUT70 » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:05 am

It's just a real life game of Top Trumps for the real powerhouses of football

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by dushanbe » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:10 am

It will be interesting to see how the less well off clubs respond to this new way of thinking. It seems that we already have with our general framework

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Lancasterclaret » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:10 am

It is, but its money plus a great coach and a long term plan and a workable system.

But yeah, money is the key, but Man City have had a superb long term plan from the start and boy, is it working.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Spijed » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:22 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:It is, but its money plus a great coach and a long term plan and a workable system.

But yeah, money is the key, but Man City have had a superb long term plan from the start and boy, is it working.
Ironically Guardiola might not be the manager to deliver the prize that the owners really want, the Champions league. Plenty of articles about hoe he seems to overthink European football.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by NottsClaret » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:28 am

Spijed wrote:Ironically Guardiola might not be the manager to deliver the prize that the owners really want, the Champions league. Plenty of articles about hoe he seems to overthink European football.
He certainly did at Spurs away in the CL. Just pick DeBruyne and Sane. He seemed to get lost in his own tactical genius there. Whatever 'system' Barcelona employ, it will always involve playing Messi in any game you actually need to win.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Lord Beamish » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:49 am

Money is important, no doubt, but Guardiola is a peerless Coach, too. As is our very own Sean Dyche. They both set out to improve what they have got, and polish a system until it gleams,albeit at different ends of the fiscal scale.
That said, I don’t think Guardiola could do what Dyche has done here. I also don’t think that Dyche could do what Pep has done at City. They are both gifted Coaches, but their milieu is completely different.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by JTClaret » Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:51 am

For our money and players the system we play at the moment is fantastic.
Dyche wants us to be a 'pressing team' and in the first half especially on Sunday we were great at it, pressing them in their own half.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Sproggy » Wed May 01, 2019 9:55 am

Lord Beamish wrote:Money is important, no doubt, but Guardiola is a peerless Coach, too.
Ajax have won as many Champions League knockout away games this season as Manchester City have ever. They promote youth, play expansive football and get 10m Euros a year in TV revenue. That team will get broken up this summer and they'll start again. That's peerless.

What's Pep's USP? Keep buying players until it works?

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Spijed » Wed May 01, 2019 10:03 am

Sproggy wrote:What's Pep's USP? Keep buying players until it works?
Guardiola had an easy opportunity to win the Champions league with Bayern Munich and made a complete mess of it.

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by Spijed » Wed May 01, 2019 10:13 am

Spijed wrote:Guardiola had an easy opportunity to win the Champions league with Bayern Munich and made a complete mess of it.

https://inews.co.uk/sport/football/cham ... ster-city/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Superb article on modern football in the Irish Times

Post by scouseclaret » Wed May 01, 2019 10:32 am

Chester Perry wrote:You could almost say that Liverpool goal against Huddersfield was similar to the Vokes one against them a couple of years back - we pressed them into an obvious pass, intercepted and punished them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjIrABICe4M" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
We also did it against City in the cup match but missed the chance. Even the best teams will make mistakes if you put them under pressure. I don’t think we did it enough on Sunday.

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