Reuters Dyche interview

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Reuters Dyche interview

Postby 4:20 » Mon May 06, 2019 9:44 am

Apologies if already posted but here's a recent interview with Sean talking about the way we play, British signings etc..

https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-socce ... KKCN1SC0GX

Edit, here's the text for convenience..

SPORTS NEWS
MAY 6, 2019 / 9:23 AM

Dyche continues to buck trends with very British Burnley

Simon Evans

BURNLEY, England (Reuters) - In the cosmopolitan Premier League, with around two thirds of regular starting players drawn from across the globe, Burnley are unusual for their reliance on English players and manager Sean Dyche says that is unlikely to change next season.

The Clarets have secured Premier League football for a fourth straight season with a regular starting line-up that features nine Englishmen, an Irishman and a New Zealander.

While he will look to strengthen the Burnley squad this close-season, Dyche thinks the notion that investing in European players is an automatic route to success is flawed thinking.

“You don’t have to look very far this season for clubs that have spent heavily in Europe and they’ve gone down,” Dyche told Reuters in an interview at Burnley’s training centre.


Fulham invested over 100 million pounds in multinational players while Huddersfield Town’s more modest outlay was also focussed mainly on European players.

“There’s a bit of a myth that you pre-suppose every European player is better than every English player. And it’s dying a little bit now because there’s obviously a resurgence in the (England) national side, the under-19s, the under-20s and so on,” he added.

Dyche believes the demands of the Premier League mean technical skill is not sufficient to succeed in England’s high-tempo, physical game.

“Our club don’t want to take a gamble, so they don’t want to sign a 15 million pound French player who’s never played in the Premier League, who’s 21, and then that ends up being a four million pound French player going back the other way,” he said.


“If you look through the Premier League there are a lot of those stories.”

Burnley’s squad does feature some European talent but their most expensive signing, Belgium international Steven Defour, struggled initially to adapt to the physical demands of the Premier League before shining last season.

“That was a top, top player for a club like Burnley who still took six months to get used to it... and he’s no mug,” said Dyche.

“It is not easy to adapt and the thing is we haven’t got that much time – you can’t spend £30 million on two European players who then take eight months to get involved in what we do.

“But the big clubs can, they can carry those players for an amount of time...,” he said.

Dyche’s side have gained a reputation for playing what some view, in the era of Pep Guardiola and the preference for short passing, as ‘old school’ English football — a 4-4-2 formation, solid defending and a tendency to play quickly to their forwards.

While that image ignores some of the good football Burnley have played at times under Dyche, the 47-year-old former lower league defender, makes no apologies for his approach.

“I don’t want just pure roll out of the back four. I want productive mixed play... how many ways can you affect a game?

“Manchester United at their pomp, they could fight it out, they could play their way out of it, they could counter attack, they could win with a set piece. They were fit, they were strong, all the things you want to represent a very good football side,” he said.


“We try many different ways of working but you do get put in a box sometimes, that is just one of them things and it is certainly not something I lose sleep over.”

The results for a club that spent four decades out of the top flight speak for themselves, with Dyche twice taking Burnley out of the Championship before three seasons of stability in the Premier League.

“Six and a half years, the change in this football club is enormous, enormous. You can’t just put that on to – ‘oh they just get the ball forward’ because you need to see the whole thing to know what we actually do,” he said.

Dyche’s work is certainly appreciated by the club’s fans who showed little discontent, even when the team was in the bottom three at the half-way stage this season.

“I think there is an earthiness to this area and that is a positive thing,” said Dyche.


“I think they trust me. I tell them every season is going to be a tough season but not in a negative way. They have been fantastic this season because they could easily have cracked against the team and gone ‘right change everything’.

“They knew this team deserved the credit of them standing by them and they have been rewarded because since Christmas we have been first class.”
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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby CleggHall » Mon May 06, 2019 10:11 am

Little to argue with there, he's dead right about fancy-dan foreign players. Defour overall has been an expensive flop, we tried but failed with him. Dyche knows what he wants and is generally right, performances/results since Xmas have been excellent, let's hope next season kicks off in similar style not like screwed-up 2018.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby claptrappers_union » Mon May 06, 2019 10:49 am

Harsh to call him a flop. He by far our most natural footballer in the team... we are team mainly made up of good quality Championship quality players.

Defour is a top, top player, but his injury record is the reason he plays for Burnley and not a top 4 club.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby ClaretTony » Mon May 06, 2019 11:03 am

Simon Evans btw is eli's son
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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Lancasterclaret » Mon May 06, 2019 11:08 am

Playing with Defour meant we could play a more expansive game, while remaining solid at the back and the results reflected that.

We were 4th until the imjuries kicked in, and we'd never have stayed there, but we might well have bothered 5th/6th

Put it one way, without that "expensive flop", we'd never have qualified for Europe through league position.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby ClaretTony » Mon May 06, 2019 11:11 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Playing with Defour meant we could play a more expansive game, while remaining solid at the back and the results reflected that.

We were 4th until the imjuries kicked in, and we'd never have stayed there, but we might well have bothered 5th/6th

Put it one way, without that "expensive flop", we'd never have qualified for Europe through league position.


He got the injury in the home defeat against Man U and we were 8th after that game. We went up to 7th with a 1-1 draw at Newcastle in the first game without him and never moved position again.

We've certainly missed Defour though.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Bordeauxclaret » Mon May 06, 2019 11:13 am

I’m glad we signed Defour. Ability wise he’s a long way in front of anything else I’ve seen for Burnley.
Sadly we’ve not seen as much as we’d like. I hope he regains his fitness with us and shows some of the levels from last season but I suspect he’ll move on in the summer.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby AndyClaret » Mon May 06, 2019 11:14 am

The players are out there if you look for them, Brentford payed £1.5m for Maupay, what is he worth now ? £20M + ?

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Lancasterclaret » Mon May 06, 2019 11:17 am

ClaretTony wrote:He got the injury in the home defeat against Man U and we were 8th after that game. We went up to 7th with a 1-1 draw at Newcastle in the first game without him and never moved position again.

We've certainly missed Defour though.


We have, but we've also missed the fully fit Brady and the form that pretty much all our players showed over that period.

Glad the form has come back, but we do need an upgrade in CM (even if Defour is fit next year) for next season

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby ClaretTony » Mon May 06, 2019 11:19 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:We have, but we've also missed the fully fit Brady and the form that pretty much all our players showed over that period.

Glad the form has come back, but we do need an upgrade in CM (even if Defour is fit next year) for next season


Without a doubt we've also missed Brady. We were just about to go 4th when he got injured. I thought we got some real glimpses of the real Brady on Friday at Everton. Defour, for me, was a real influence in that side. I'm not sure Cork has had many decent games since he went out injured.
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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby CombatClaret » Mon May 06, 2019 11:48 am

AndyClaret wrote:The players are out there if you look for them, Brentford payed £1.5m for Maupay, what is he worth now ? £20M + ?


There will always be a few successes you can point to with the benefit of hindsight.
I think Dyche explains the clubs reasoning perfectly.
Last edited by CombatClaret on Mon May 06, 2019 6:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby tim_noone » Mon May 06, 2019 12:01 pm

ClaretTony wrote:Without a doubt we've also missed Brady. We were just about to go 4th when he got injured. I thought we got some real glimpses of the real Brady on Friday at Everton. Defour, for me, was a real influence in that side. I'm not sure Cork has had many decent games since he went out injured.

Re.Brady...Did you have a seat with restricted views?

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Stalbansclaret » Mon May 06, 2019 12:19 pm

Didn't our best moment on Friday, when Gudmundsson put a half-chance over the bar at the back stick, come from a humdinger of a cross from Brady ?
Anyway I think the interview above is a pretty clear explanation of our/SD's policy and who can say it hasn't worked well for us. We are sustaining existence in the Premier League which the other Lancashire town clubs can only dream of in this era.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Tall Paul » Mon May 06, 2019 12:25 pm

Stalbansclaret wrote:Didn't our best moment on Friday, when Gudmundsson put a half-chance over the bar at the back stick, come from a humdinger of a cross from Brady ?


Yes. He also put in the excellent ball from which Barnes scored the disallowed goal.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby ClaretTony » Mon May 06, 2019 2:11 pm

Stalbansclaret wrote:Didn't our best moment on Friday, when Gudmundsson put a half-chance over the bar at the back stick, come from a humdinger of a cross from Brady ?


Certainly did and the Ashley Barnes offside goal came from a superb ball into him from Brady.



EDIT: Should read on, just seen the post above from Tall Paul.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon May 06, 2019 2:54 pm

bit of a depressing backward thinking read in parts

"Dyche believes the demands of the Premier League mean technical skill is not sufficient to succeed in England’s high-tempo, physical game."

Not sure obviously if Dyche said any of these things but that line is complete and utter nonsense

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Bullabill » Mon May 06, 2019 3:34 pm

Tell us why, Vegas.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Herts Clarets » Mon May 06, 2019 4:01 pm

Bordeauxclaret wrote:I’m glad we signed Defour. Ability wise he’s a long way in front of anything else I’ve seen for Burnley.
Sadly we’ve not seen as much as we’d like. I hope he regains his fitness with us and shows some of the levels from last season but I suspect he’ll move on in the summer.


If you look at the stats through his career Defour has a track record of playing around 50% of games during a season. Whilst with Burnley, he rarely lasts more than an hour, so his time on the pitch equates to 35% of available time on the pitch. We cannot afford to carry such a liability and he needs to move on in the summer. Would have been much easier had we not extended his contract by a year.....

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby GodIsADeeJay81 » Mon May 06, 2019 4:01 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:bit of a depressing backward thinking read in parts

"Dyche believes the demands of the Premier League mean technical skill is not sufficient to succeed in England’s high-tempo, physical game."

Not sure obviously if Dyche said any of these things but that line is complete and utter nonsense


Why is it?

Numerous foreign players have struggled in the English game due to the pace and physicality over here.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby GodIsADeeJay81 » Mon May 06, 2019 4:04 pm

Herts Clarets wrote:If you look at the stats through his career Defour has a track record of playing around 50% of games during a season. Whilst with Burnley, he rarely lasts more than an hour, so his time on the pitch equates to 35% of available time on the pitch. We cannot afford to carry such a liability and he needs to move on in the summer. Would have been much easier had we not extended his contract by a year.....


Rock and a hard place.
If he'd become fully fit there would've been some clamouring on here as to why we didn't extend his contract etc.
Look at Trippier and Ings, people on here are still stupid about those contract situations and cannot seem to get it into their sense skulls.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Herts Clarets » Mon May 06, 2019 4:11 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:Rock and a hard place.
If he'd become fully fit there would've been some clamouring on here as to why we didn't extend his contract etc.
Look at Trippier and Ings, people on here are still stupid about those contract situations and cannot seem to get it into their sense skulls.


Ings and Trips didn't sign extensions because they knew their future lay at bigger clubs and bigger wages. Defour probably couldn't believe his luck when there was a knock on the door of the treatment room to let him know we are happy to pay you 40k a week for another year keeping our medical team gainfully employed.

Look at his career history as a marker for how many games he will feature in.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby mdd2 » Mon May 06, 2019 4:12 pm

But you have to laugh spending 30million on two European players who aren’t up to speed for 8 months.
Lucky we got Gibson and Vydra who slotted straight in. Oh hang on a minute or season of 38 plus games

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon May 06, 2019 4:38 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:Why is it?

Numerous foreign players have struggled in the English game due to the pace and physicality over here.


"Our club don’t want to take a gamble" was the depressing part lol. Like I said though, it's an article so who knows what was "actually" said :)

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Leisure » Mon May 06, 2019 4:52 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:"Dyche believes the demands of the Premier League mean technical skill is not sufficient to succeed in England’s high-tempo, physical game."


Possibly the word 'alone' is missing after 'skill'.
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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon May 06, 2019 4:58 pm

Leisure wrote:Possibly the word 'alone' is missing after 'skill'.


more than likely ! that's why I said we don't know what was actually said :) That's why I like the video interviews

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby GodIsADeeJay81 » Mon May 06, 2019 5:00 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:"Our club don’t want to take a gamble" was the depressing part lol. Like I said though, it's an article so who knows what was "actually" said :)


You've only got to see the amount of drama or stupid on here during the course of a season to understand his comments about a gamble.

As a club we can't afford big costing gambles.
I know the usual suspects like to tot up the costs for our recent transfers who haven't done much, then try to claim its similar, but we know we can move on who we've got.
Gibson for example has already shown he can do well in the PL.

A foreign lad may be more of a struggle to shift on.

Nor can we afford multiple players to take X amount of months to adjust to the English game.
Our current squad didn't need X amount of months to adjust to English football, just Dyche's ideology.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon May 06, 2019 5:32 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:You've only got to see the amount of drama or stupid on here during the course of a season to understand his comments about a gamble.

As a club we can't afford big costing gambles.
I know the usual suspects like to tot up the costs for our recent transfers who haven't done much, then try to claim its similar, but we know we can move on who we've got.
Gibson for example has already shown he can do well in the PL.

A foreign lad may be more of a struggle to shift on.

Nor can we afford multiple players to take X amount of months to adjust to the English game.
Our current squad didn't need X amount of months to adjust to English football, just Dyche's ideology.


see you read the above (complete sense) into the comments attributed to him - whilst I read they don't want to scout abroad (it's all conjecture anyway I could (hopefully) be completely wrong)

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby bfccrazy » Mon May 06, 2019 6:31 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:see you read the above (complete sense) into the comments attributed to him - whilst I read they don't want to scout abroad (it's all conjecture anyway I could (hopefully) be completely wrong)


If you look at the players we’ve been linked with from abroad over the last couple of windows. Hakim Ziyech etc ... then to me it shows the scouting network is working abroad. The next step is getting the system right to get those deals over the line.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon May 06, 2019 7:47 pm

bfccrazy wrote:If you look at the players we’ve been linked with from abroad over the last couple of windows. Hakim Ziyech etc ... then to me it shows the scouting network is working abroad. The next step is getting the system right to get those deals over the line.


for sure, i just hope the board back Dyche and the lads as much as they can to give them the best chance. As to who we sign and where from that's up to them ! No doubt there is better value abroad though if you can find the right players

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Spijed » Mon May 06, 2019 7:52 pm

It'll be fine. We won't get relegated anyway! :)
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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby GodIsADeeJay81 » Mon May 06, 2019 7:53 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:for sure, i just hope the board back Dyche and the lads as much as they can to give them the best chance. As to who we sign and where from that's up to them ! No doubt there is better value abroad though if you can find the right players


They've always backed Dyche as best as they can, it's usually various fans who can't see that, usually cos of their own agendas, and blame the board with usual moronic dry powder comments....

Your last sentence sums it up though tbh, it's all about finding the right players when looking abroad.
I'd rather the club took more care when signing players from abroad, instead of just signing for the sake of it.
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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby GodIsADeeJay81 » Mon May 06, 2019 7:54 pm

Spijed wrote:It'll be fine. We won't get relegated anyway! :)


I'd rather check the odds with that other user first if that's ok.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Vegas Claret » Mon May 06, 2019 8:15 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:They've always backed Dyche as best as they can, it's usually various fans who can't see that, usually cos of their own agendas, and blame the board with usual moronic dry powder comments....

Your last sentence sums it up though tbh, it's all about finding the right players when looking abroad.
I'd rather the club took more care when signing players from abroad, instead of just signing for the sake of it.


agree 100%........but then signing people like Reid etc always worried me. I know we've moved on from there though and hopefully Rigg will help take us to the next level (whatever that means :lol: )
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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Paul Waine » Mon May 06, 2019 8:23 pm

Herts Clarets wrote:Ings and Trips didn't sign extensions because they knew their future lay at bigger clubs and bigger wages. Defour probably couldn't believe his luck when there was a knock on the door of the treatment room to let him know we are happy to pay you 40k a week for another year keeping our medical team gainfully employed.

Look at his career history as a marker for how many games he will feature in.


Hi Herts, August 2017 we drew 1-1 away at Spurs (wembley, of course). Stephen Defour worked very hard that game. I remember him back in defence clearing one from the line. He was Dyche fit and fully up to competing in the Premier League. We were unlucky when Defour got injured. I hope he is fit again to contribute next season.

Danny Ings declined to sign a new contract with Burnley - and went to L'pool on a "free" - but, we picked up good compensation through the Tribunal. Danny, as we know, picked up an injury at Lpool, but that didn't impact the Tribunal's decision, though it has limited Ings' game time since then.

Kieran Trippier did sign a new contract - but, it included a release clause that fixed his transfer fee at the end of that season.

These are all part of the football game.

UTC
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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby GodIsADeeJay81 » Mon May 06, 2019 8:24 pm

Look at the power of players at other clubs and look at how quiet it is here in comparison.

I know we get the usual belmtards on here who will be adamant that Dyche lost the dressing room at some point this season, but nothing is ever in the press suggesting that's the case.
Meanwhile at Leicester and Chelsea it's an annual occurrence.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby South West Claret. » Mon May 06, 2019 8:44 pm

Hand on hart I had no idea that Reuters/Thomson covered football unless they were a listed company like some were and a few still are.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Garnerssoap » Mon May 06, 2019 8:59 pm

Love it when detour is fit enough to play. A real highlight of us being in the prem and having a few quid. Hope we get to see him again.
It’s like having jean Louis Valois all over again

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Herts Clarets » Mon May 06, 2019 9:04 pm

Paul Waine wrote:Hi Herts, August 2017 we drew 1-1 away at Spurs (wembley, of course). Stephen Defour worked very hard that game. I remember him back in defence clearing one from the line. He was Dyche fit and fully up to competing in the Premier League. We were unlucky when Defour got injured. I hope he is fit again to contribute next season.

UTC


You do realise that is nearly 2 years ago. How many games has he played since then? 20? Honest question as I don't know the answer.

Just making the point that for minutes on the pitch, he is a very, very expensive player.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Paul Waine » Mon May 06, 2019 10:29 pm

Herts Clarets wrote:You do realise that is nearly 2 years ago. How many games has he played since then? 20? Honest question as I don't know the answer.

Just making the point that for minutes on the pitch, he is a very, very expensive player.


Hi Herts, considering the amount Burnley paid for Defour - and what we'd have had to pay if he didn't have his injury record - I'd argue that we got a bargain.

Player appearances show Defour has played 52+6 games in league and cup, so far - and scored 2 (PL) + 1 (cup), since his debut v Lpool 20-Aug-2016 - we won 2-0.

Assuming Defour featured in all the 2017/18 games until he picked up injury in home game v ManU 20-Jan-2018 he'd appeared in 27 games that season (I didn't check, if he missed any of the other games...).

We drew 2-2 at Old Trafford in the Boxing Day game. A quote from CT's match report is worth a recall:

"We stunned them with an early goal from Ashley Barnes, who scored from close range following a Jόhann Berg Guðmundsson free kick, and just nine minutes from half time we doubled our advantage with a sensational free kick goal from Steven Defour...."

UTC

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Long Time Lurker » Wed May 08, 2019 11:50 pm

CombatClaret wrote:There will always be a few successes you can point to with the benefit of hindsight.
I think Dyche explains the clubs reasoning perfectly.


Sort of, kind of, maybe.

Dyche makes a very good point and one that should be used to temper the influence of statistical evaluations. Different qualities are emphasised and required in different leagues. It also shows evidence of "common sense" playing a part in our transfer dealings, which I like.

Players in the German leagues will pick up more cards, players in the Dutch leagues will score more goals ( because they care little for defending ), the Spanish league favours technical players and so on. Because of these differences it can be easy to look at a players statistics and buy him, only to find out that his performance levels in another league are very different.

On one hand it can be seen as a downside to doing business, but on the other hand it could be viewed as an opportunity to get good value.

It might be that a player who isn't doing well in a foreign league, because of the particular demands associated with that league, could excel in the Premier League. Simply because they are more suited to the style of play here. It is one of the reasons why I included Moukoudi in my player picks even though he was plying his trade in League 2 of French football.

I would also add his defensive partner from this season, Denys Bain ( also out of contract ), as a name to look at. Sadly, he is 25 which would cut down our options for developing further him here. Doable, and well worth considering over an expensive twilight option like Cahill, but Moukoudi would have been a much better addition at 22.

It could also be the case that a player is in a team that favours technical flair and they plays towards it. If Joe Kicker isn't that type of player he won't excel in that team and post any impressive stats. That doesn't mean that he is a bad player, it simply means that he isn't playing in an environment that is conducive to getting the best out of him.

At the end of the day it all comes down to the quality and ability of the recruitment system and team. Good players are available throughout Europe and a failure to find them is a failure on the identification and scouting front.

The same is true for bringing in players who aren't suited to the particular demands of the English game. Recognising that and taking it into account is part of the job. It's like checking the teeth of a racehorse and why pure scouting is a lot more important than "painting by numbers" statistical scouting.

If a team can't score or they concede a lot of goals the team are to blame ( or the manager ) not the playing pitch. In the same sense, if a club fails to bring in top quality players or they bring in failures the environment isn't to blame it is down to the performance and/or ability of the recruitment team ( or technical director ).

Anybody can identify the current stand out players in the Championship. We don't need a well paid recruitment team to do that, because we could arrive at the same names with a few fans, a pub lunch and a couple of hours discussion.

Unfortunately, we would also end up with a transfer target list containing some very expensive purchases and be faced with the prospect of heavy competition for their signatures.

A recruitment team that doesn't have the ability to unearth hidden gems, here and abroad, is hardly worth the ongoing expense. Finding good players at respectable prices, that other clubs haven't noticed, is the difference between giving 100% and stealing a wage.

The answer to the £15m Frenchman problem is to find players under the radar ( possibly younger ) who can be picked up for £1m-£2m. That way if they don't turn out to be top quality players and we have to move them on for £4m we could still make a tidy little profit.

EDIT: Moukoudi and Bains have both played well this season, one of the previous paragraphs could make it sound like they haven't, which wouldn't be true in my opinion.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby TVC15 » Thu May 09, 2019 8:36 am

Paul Waine wrote:Hi Herts, considering the amount Burnley paid for Defour - and what we'd have had to pay if he didn't have his injury record - I'd argue that we got a bargain.

Player appearances show Defour has played 52+6 games in league and cup, so far - and scored 2 (PL) + 1 (cup), since his debut v Lpool 20-Aug-2016 - we won 2-0.

Assuming Defour featured in all the 2017/18 games until he picked up injury in home game v ManU 20-Jan-2018 he'd appeared in 27 games that season (I didn't check, if he missed any of the other games...).

We drew 2-2 at Old Trafford in the Boxing Day game. A quote from CT's match report is worth a recall:

"We stunned them with an early goal from Ashley Barnes, who scored from close range following a Jόhann Berg Guðmundsson free kick, and just nine minutes from half time we doubled our advantage with a sensational free kick goal from Steven Defour...."

UTC


When fit he was a great player - tbh he was on another level from the rest of the team the way he read the game and used the ball.
But you mention 56 games above - that could easily be 56 games in 4 years by the time he leaves. And in a lot of these games he did not get past the 60 minute mark.
So with the transfer fee, wages and bonuses he will have cost the club the best part of £20m. This could equate to more than £350k a game - not sure how you could argue that we got a bargain.
All that said i’m not blaming the club - he was a gamble definitely worth taking and we have had the pleasure of watching a player of his calibre in a burnley shirt. I don’t understand the one year extension decision but we don’t know all the details and probably never will do so again not really fair to criticise the club.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Paul Waine » Thu May 09, 2019 10:13 pm

TVC15 wrote:When fit he was a great player - tbh he was on another level from the rest of the team the way he read the game and used the ball.
But you mention 56 games above - that could easily be 56 games in 4 years by the time he leaves. And in a lot of these games he did not get past the 60 minute mark.
So with the transfer fee, wages and bonuses he will have cost the club the best part of £20m. This could equate to more than £350k a game - not sure how you could argue that we got a bargain.
All that said i’m not blaming the club - he was a gamble definitely worth taking and we have had the pleasure of watching a player of his calibre in a burnley shirt. I don’t understand the one year extension decision but we don’t know all the details and probably never will do so again not really fair to criticise the club.


Hi TVC15, I'm interested in your maths. How do you get to £20m? What do we understand his transfer cost? Was it £7.5m? So, £12.5m in wages/bonuses (and the ERS NI - that's always part of the club's costs). How much do you think we are paying Defour? £40k/wk? £50k? more?

Let's imagine we are paying a player £40k per week, so £40k x 52 weeks = £2.4m (incl ERS NI). Let's say the player plays 30 games = £2,700 minutes (if 90 mins per game). That works out at £80k per game, or a little under £900 per minute. (These figures without transfer fee added).

Yes, any player who's on the treatment bench and not playing will play fewer games and the cost per game will increase, but...... it's a squad game and we know what the cost is of not having cover in the squad.
This user liked this post: Darnhill Claret

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby TVC15 » Fri May 10, 2019 12:07 am

Paul Waine wrote:Hi TVC15, I'm interested in your maths. How do you get to £20m? What do we understand his transfer cost? Was it £7.5m? So, £12.5m in wages/bonuses (and the ERS NI - that's always part of the club's costs). How much do you think we are paying Defour? £40k/wk? £50k? more?

Let's imagine we are paying a player £40k per week, so £40k x 52 weeks = £2.4m (incl ERS NI). Let's say the player plays 30 games = £2,700 minutes (if 90 mins per game). That works out at £80k per game, or a little under £900 per minute. (These figures without transfer fee added).

Yes, any player who's on the treatment bench and not playing will play fewer games and the cost per game will increase, but...... it's a squad game and we know what the cost is of not having cover in the squad.


Hi Paul
Defour cost £8m
His salary i’m estimating conservatively at £40k a week. So over a 4 year period (by the time he finishes his contract) will be about £10m with NI etc.
Add to that his bonuses for the high place last year and for the other years and my estimate will be that in total it won’t be far from £20m.
And based on the strong possibility he will have only played less than 60 games then that is a high average cost per game.
He’s played 56 times so I am using that as the number - not sure of the relevance of using the 30 games a season you referenced.
Of course this is down to injury and of course when we sign a player and agree terms we don’t anticipate he will be injured.
So the total cost to the club could end up being around £350k per game he played in the event he does not play again before he leaves at the end of next season.
I realise it’s a squad game but if Vydra ends up staying for the length of his contract and only plays 20 or 30 games nobody will think that is a bargain either !

I am not criticising the club - I am just saying that it’s not turned out to be the “bargain” you referenced. For a player of his undoubted calibre if he could have stayed fit then he would definitely have been a bargain. But there is a reason why a player as good as Defour ends up going to a club like Burnley for the small fee he did - and whilst hindsight is a wonderful thing we probably also knew that this signing was a pretty big risk given the toughness of this league and the terrible injury he had previously sustained.
As I said it was probably a gamble worth taking for a club like Burnley....and there are a lot of players who cost a hell of a lot more than Defour and who have played less than Defour has for their respective premier league teams....and not because they have been injured either. At least we signed an excellent player and didn’t fork out £30m for Slimani for example - or £25m on Ineacho etc etc !

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby KRBFC » Fri May 10, 2019 5:02 am

Talks in absolute riddles does Dyche whilst spunking millions on Gibson and Vydra. I'd have rather he spunked that £25-30M on 3 foreigners with high potential. Very negative mindset mentioning the examples at other clubs that haven't worked while ignoring the fact 80% of the Premier League is made up of foreign players. If anything, judging by the teams above us, the signs show that actually British players generally aren't as good.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Burnley Ace » Fri May 10, 2019 7:05 am

How much would you have to spend to replace Tarkowski or Mee? Not sure where the 80% comes from when 30% of the Premier League are English! KRBFC making up more rubbish again!!

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Falcon » Fri May 10, 2019 12:45 pm

KRBFC is probably one of those people who post the same negative claptrap on every BFC facebook post.

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Chester Perry » Fri May 10, 2019 1:34 pm

for the benefit of all - the origin of players in the Premier League

http://www.football-observatory.com/IMG ... r/mr43/en/

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Re: Reuters Dyche interview

Postby Herts Clarets » Fri May 10, 2019 2:26 pm

TVC15 wrote:Hi Paul
Defour cost £8m
His salary i’m estimating conservatively at £40k a week. So over a 4 year period (by the time he finishes his contract) will be about £10m with NI etc.
Add to that his bonuses for the high place last year and for the other years and my estimate will be that in total it won’t be far from £20m.
And based on the strong possibility he will have only played less than 60 games then that is a high average cost per game.
He’s played 56 times so I am using that as the number - not sure of the relevance of using the 30 games a season you referenced.
Of course this is down to injury and of course when we sign a player and agree terms we don’t anticipate he will be injured.
So the total cost to the club could end up being around £350k per game he played in the event he does not play again before he leaves at the end of next season.
I realise it’s a squad game but if Vydra ends up staying for the length of his contract and only plays 20 or 30 games nobody will think that is a bargain either !

I am not criticising the club - I am just saying that it’s not turned out to be the “bargain” you referenced. For a player of his undoubted calibre if he could have stayed fit then he would definitely have been a bargain. But there is a reason why a player as good as Defour ends up going to a club like Burnley for the small fee he did - and whilst hindsight is a wonderful thing we probably also knew that this signing was a pretty big risk given the toughness of this league and the terrible injury he had previously sustained.
As I said it was probably a gamble worth taking for a club like Burnley....and there are a lot of players who cost a hell of a lot more than Defour and who have played less than Defour has for their respective premier league teams....and not because they have been injured either. At least we signed an excellent player and didn’t fork out £30m for Slimani for example - or £25m on Ineacho etc etc !


As I have said many time, Defour is a very expensive luxury for a club who pride themselves on prudence and strong financial management. And for those comments about 'if only he hadn't been injured etc.' I am firm believer in examining a player's history as a guide to how they will perform for my club. Throughout his career Defour has averaged 24 appearances per season. Only twice in 14 years has he played more than 30 games in a season. The clues were there. We should not be surprised that a player with his track record, who moves to a physically more demanding league is unable to cope with the demands placed on him.

I bet he couldn't believe his luck when he was offered another £2m a year for doing what most of us pay a fortune to do, that is sit in the stands watching Burnley play.


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