The Big Step - asking football clubs to review relationship with gambling

[Grumps]

Bloomin heck, according to some on this thread nobody will be going on turf moor next season......or is it only on a message board they object.......how many took the discounted away tickets? Did jdrobbo?
They were only available because of the income the club generate, which include betting sponsorship

[GodIsADeeJay81]

So just to be clear, are we also asking for the half time draw to be banned?
It is a form of gambling.
Along with the closure of betting booths in grounds?
The betting shop outside TM, and other grounds?

The multiple betting shops on the high streets and dotted around the poorer areas of the UK, which is intentional by the way, will also need addressing.

I suppose it's time to stop the football pools too if it's still going.

Yes gambling in football needs addressing but it would appear that people are mainly getting hung up on the shirts...

[Grumps]

So just to be clear, are we also asking for the half time draw to be banned?
It is a form of gambling.
Along with the closure of betting booths in grounds?
The betting shop outside TM, and other grounds?

The multiple betting shops on the high streets and dotted around the poorer areas of the UK, which is intentional by the way, will also need addressing.

I suppose it's time to stop the football pools too if it's still going.

Yes gambling in football needs addressing but it would appear that people are mainly getting hung up on the shirts...

At least someone gets the point

[TVC15]

At least someone gets the point

Nope....just somebody else missing the point.

What you are saying basically is that why are people protesting against one thing that is wrong when there are bigger things that are wrong that they could be protesting against.

The reality is that the really big things like Sky TV and big media companies are much more difficult to change because of the commercial and political power they have. So some people start with smaller or more localised things like football clubs which they believe they can influence or easier lobby to change...doing this with a Premier League club will also attract publicity.
Luton have already taken a stance and Villa previously. If you got a big premier league club to take this stance that could start some real momentum amongst other clubs and across the public....and also the regulators etc.

Where would you start campaigning against Murdoch and his media empire ?

[claptrappers_union]

The amount of advertising from betting companies is very intense around football. I’m not a betting man so most of it goes over my head and I don’t even see it most of the time.

It annoys me on Sky Sports coverage when they cut to Ray Winstone spouting some odds just before kick off. However, the Premier League call it the Fair Play handshakes... it’s a load of ********. Its advertising opportunities for TV companies.

Have you noticed there’s no more Half Time analysis anymore. It’s half time whistle, adverts, back to show, plug for other programmes on Sky, bit of a chat no more than 2 mins, Adverts, another plug, chat, players emerge, Betting Ad. Kick off.

[Grumps]

Nope....just somebody else missing the point.

What you are saying basically is that why are people protesting against one thing that is wrong when there are bigger things that are wrong that they could be protesting against.

The reality is that the really big things like Sky TV and big media companies are much more difficult to change because of the commercial and political power they have. So some people start with smaller or more localised things like football clubs which they believe they can influence or easier lobby to change...doing this with a Premier League club will also attract publicity.
Luton have already taken a stance and Villa previously. If you got a big premier league club to take this stance that could start some real momentum amongst other clubs and across the public....and also the regulators etc.

Where would you start campaigning against Murdoch and his media empire ?

So...jdrobbo who is taking this fight on, doesnt have a cheap season ticket funded in some part by a betting company? Doesnt have cheap away tickets funded in part by betting companies...first game next season 20,000 fans will be on turf moor, irrespective of the 10 or so on here trying to make a point

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Nope....just somebody else missing the point.

What you are saying basically is that why are people protesting against one thing that is wrong when there are bigger things that are wrong that they could be protesting against.

The reality is that the really big things like Sky TV and big media companies are much more difficult to change because of the commercial and political power they have. So some people start with smaller or more localised things like football clubs which they believe they can influence or easier lobby to change...doing this with a Premier League club will also attract publicity.
Luton have already taken a stance and Villa previously. If you got a big premier league club to take this stance that could start some real momentum amongst other clubs and across the public....and also the regulators etc.

Where would you start campaigning against Murdoch and his media empire ?

I haven't missed the point of anything.
I just mentioned other forms of gambling that's advertised, marketed or located in a way to make it easier to access in and around TM.

Most people on here only mention the shirt sponsor and/or the CFS sponsor.

Protesting against something isn't the issue, the issue I have is if you're just going to focus on the singular part of a much wider issue.

Don't buy the shirts, don't sit in the CFS, don't buy tickets for the half time draw, email the club constantly, make some placards and stand outside the betting shop by TM, block access to the betting booths inside grounds etc.

For what it's worth, I don't tend to agree with the way gambling is advertised in football, nor do I like the way betting shops are given free reign to sprout up around poorer communities.
I don't think enough is done to stop addicts from gambling either.

I've had numerous chats with my teenage boys about gambling and how they're never going to be told about someone's losses, just their winnings.
I'll always chat to them about it, because I don't want them ruining their lives by becoming addicted to it.

[TVC15]

I haven't missed the point of anything.
I just mentioned other forms of gambling that's advertised, marketed or located in a way to make it easier to access in and around TM.

Most people on here only mention the shirt sponsor and/or the CFS sponsor.

Protesting against something isn't the issue, the issue I have is if you're just going to focus on the singular part of a much wider issue.

Don't buy the shirts, don't sit in the CFS, don't buy tickets for the half time draw, email the club constantly, make some placards and stand outside the betting shop by TM, block access to the betting booths inside grounds etc.

For what it's worth, I don't tend to agree with the way gambling is advertised in football, nor do I like the way betting shops are given free reign to sprout up around poorer communities.
I don't think enough is done to stop addicts from gambling either.

I've had numerous chats with my teenage boys about gambling and how they're never going to be told about someone's losses, just their winnings.
I'll always chat to them about it, because I don't want them ruining their lives by becoming addicted to it.

And I agree about most of what you have said.
From what you have said it does seems like you are strongly against gambling and the advertising of it where it has been proven beyond doubt that the more advertising the more people bet...and the more people get addicted.
Part of this increase in advertising in recent years has definitely been sponsoring football clubs.
Would you rather your club not have betting companies sponsor us and take say £0.5m less a year in sponsorship revenue ?
And would you rather all betting companies were banned from sponsoring football clubs ?...which would mean that it also became a level playing field and there was just a bit less overall money in football - which to me would be a good thing anyway.

Personally I would like both to happen for a few reasons but the main one being it would be very likely to be a sign of progress against regulating the amount of overall advertising betting companies are allowed to do (or banning altogether eventually ) which is the ultimate aim for all those against it.

[Claretmatt4]

I can't be arsed going through every post grumps but can you show me where one person has said that they won't attend the turf if we have a gambling sponsor on our shirts?

That seems to be your main gripe but I'm pretty sure it's in your head.

[Grumps]

I can't be arsed going through every post grumps but can you show me where one person has said that they won't attend the turf if we have a gambling sponsor on our shirts?

That seems to be your main gripe but I'm pretty sure it's in your head.

On the thread about the new shirt sponsor

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

It’s not just about that. It’s the prevalence of it throughout sport and the amount of pressure it puts on people to gamble.

Like anything. In moderation it’s fine. But even as someone with a pretty strong discipline when it comes to addiction I’ve fell for it plenty.

You can’t watch any live game without ray winstone trying to convince you to put a bet on the next outcome of the game. And with how quick, easy and shame free it is to do it from the comfort of your phone it’s much easier to fall into it than drink or drugs or any other vice.

I’d say it’s almost religious the routine young lads have for Saturday accumulators. Not to mention betting on anything and everything.

It’s easy to get the feeling you HAVE to bet on the next game.

The difference with gambling and other addictions is the tangible reward that you could easily get. Money. Which most people are obsessed with.

It's now all over social media too. I get the feeling that because I'm in football-related groups I get specifically targeted by betting company ads and sites selling cheap, fake football shirts, especially on fb.

[OssyClaret]

What a magnificent initiative this is! Anybody that knows me will know my current stance on all things gambling at Burnley football club.

I am saddened that Turf Moor is quite literally saturated with gambling sponsorship. During a one minute period in a game last season, I counted 17 types of gambling promotion within the ground… be it on the screen, the shirt, static boards or the rolling digital displays.

I have asked the club on three occasions if they will be engaging with this initiative and I have not been given a response.

The money we get from Ladbrokes for a single season is an absolute drop in the ocean when you consider just how much we are exposed to it on match days!

Whoever is responsible for the club’s social media page has absolutely no sense of sensitivity towards the issues of mental health and the effect that gambling can have on it (as well as on relationships)....as was seen last season when a tweet promoting gambling was issued less than 30 seconds after a tweet about promoting mental health awareness… To rub salt in, the gambling promotion on that instance implied that ‘you’d be a sucker not to’ have a bet on that day!

I have engaged with a couple of people from the club, as well as GamblingwithLives and BeGambleAware. It’s interesting that the response I received from people at the club was that, ‘...there’s no harm in it’ (gambling) and that, ‘Money talks!’ Not surprisingly, the online charities had something very different to say, especially about working-class towns such as Burnley.

I desperately wish we would follow the example set by Lutontow I desperately wish we would follow the example set by Luton Town, who have completely removed any form of gambling advertisement from their ground, as they acknowledged l the effect gambling can have on their own fans away from the stadium each week and that they had a sense of responsibility to work with their own fans within their community!!

I’m pleased that people are starting to talk about this. There is clearly a lot of resentment about and allowed people speak up nationwide, the sooner something will be done about it because it really can destroy lives!

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Fantastic the effort you are putting in to seek the club to engage with this. I don’t think society fully grasps the number of men gambling affects.

I wonder if the leader of Burnley in the Community is best placed to spell out the club’s social responsibility here to the people responsible for these commercial deals and social media activity?

[paulatky]

The bookies quite naturally only want losers.
Canny people who “ match-bet” are very quickly banned.

Far too much gambling adverts on TV and too many messages to gamble sent to mobile phones.

I agree being sponsored by betting companies does not lie well with being a community club.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

And I agree about most of what you have said.
From what you have said it does seems like you are strongly against gambling and the advertising of it where it has been proven beyond doubt that the more advertising the more people bet...and the more people get addicted.
Part of this increase in advertising in recent years has definitely been sponsoring football clubs.
Would you rather your club not have betting companies sponsor us and take say £0.5m less a year in sponsorship revenue ?
And would you rather all betting companies were banned from sponsoring football clubs ?...which would mean that it also became a level playing field and there was just a bit less overall money in football - which to me would be a good thing anyway.

Personally I would like both to happen for a few reasons but the main one being it would be very likely to be a sign of progress against regulating the amount of overall advertising betting companies are allowed to do (or banning altogether eventually ) which is the ultimate aim for all those against it.

I'm suggesting no more advertising of gambling firms in football.
No more advertising of it on TV or radio, or at least have it after the watershed.
Limit the number of betting shops in communities, because like I said previously, they're located in poorer communities on purpose, like cheap booze shops are.

Shut the betting sections in football grounds.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

The bookies quite naturally only want losers.
Canny people who “ match-bet” are very quickly banned.

Which just goes to show how corrupt it is, the whole thing is marketed on you winning but if you do and you do consistently you will be banned.

[TVC15]

I'm suggesting no more advertising of gambling firms in football.
No more advertising of it on TV or radio, or at least have it after the watershed.
Limit the number of betting shops in communities, because like I said previously, they're located in poorer communities on purpose, like cheap booze shops are.

Shut the betting sections in football grounds.

Yep agree with all that - so I take it that’s a yes that you don’t want Burnley FC being sponsored by a betting firm ?

Given that it may take a long time to get all the things you want because rarely does this country do that - mainly because of a commercial reason like the government losing all their tax revenue....then is not better than doing or getting nothing that initially football clubs taking this stance themselves rather than waiting for a 2 year consultation exercise or a general election ? And is not even better that Burnley FC could be one of those football clubs because that is the team you support taking a stance against something you very clearly disagree with ?

[dandeclaret]

It’s hardly canny using matches betting. It’s exploiting welcome offers, that’s why you’re banned. Less than 0.5% of all betting accounts are closed for “Winning”

[Claretmatt4]

It’s hardly canny using matches betting. It’s exploiting welcome offers, that’s why you’re banned. Less than 0.5% of all betting accounts are closed for “Winning”

Ironically most match bettors will make a loss with most bookies but get canned because they are exploiting bonuses.

Imagine only buying stuff at asda on rollback and being banned?

Their perogative I suppose!

[Sausage]

As you say...little old Burnley.....i doubt weve missed a chance to show the football world how its done, nobody would take a blind bit of notice.....

We've all noticed that little old Luton have done it.

[Pstotto]

I wonder whether the signings of Jo Hart and Peter Crouch were done for the shirt sponsor to increase their profile in China with known faces.

If that were the case, then its paying to watch folks playing a casino in Shanghai, not Burnley trying to win.

[Grumps]

We've all noticed that little old Luton have done it.

Did we? I havent seen it in any paper or news bulletin

[bfcmik]

I have seen the Villa Acorn's Hospice shirt used as an example of a club taking a stand against using a gambling advert on their shirt a few years ago. That was not the case at all. A club statement at the time said, "The club approached Acorns, which cares for life-limited children and their families, after players and staff developed a strong relationship with the charity over the past two years.

Members of the team have met children, parents, nurses and Acorns chief executive David Strudley.

Apart from bringing smiles to the faces of sick children, Villa has already paid for 230 days worth of hospice care.

Duncan Riddle, Villa's head of community, said: "It is through these very personal connections that our relationship has evolved to the point where Aston Villa approached Acorns about becoming a partner and appearing on our match day shirt.

"The players have been so taken with the work being done at Acorns and it's touched some of them very much. It's been a real eye opener for them.""

Gambling was very much not the norm for shirt sponsorship back then and, in addition, they had an owner who, at that time, was prepared to 'assist' in any funding shortfalls so it wasn't too much of a big deal for them

[claretonthecoast1882]

Aston Villa have announced in the last hour or 2 their new shirt sponsor W88 betting company who replace 32red

[Sausage]

Did we? I havent seen it in any paper or news bulletin

Yep.

BBC: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46303940" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Daily Telegraph: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/20 ... -football/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Daily Mail (Sorry!): https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... rship.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/football/fo ... youngsters" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[paulatky]

Dandeclaret,you obviously know nothing about matched betting.

2 years ago matched betting was very lucrative but now the gubbing stick comes very quickly.

[Grumps]

Yep.

BBC: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46303940" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Daily Telegraph: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/20 ... -football/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Daily Mail (Sorry!): https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... rship.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/football/fo ... youngsters" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thats very good of you, thanks, as i said, i hadnt seen anything