Abolish the BBC television license

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wembley94
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Abolish the BBC television license

Post by wembley94 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 9:38 am

Do you still get value for money from the BBC...https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/235653" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by brexit » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:36 am

What really annoys me about the licence fee is I can't watch iplayer overseas due to commercial licences

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Lancasterclaret » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:41 am

Signing a petition is about as useful as Tarkowski in midfield

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by DCWat » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:44 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Signing a petition is about as useful as Tarkowski in midfield
Wherever Ablue is, he will smell that post!
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by kaptin1 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:46 am

brexit wrote:What really annoys me about the licence fee is I can't watch iplayer overseas due to commercial licences
Use a VPN and set to the UK

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Foshiznik » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:49 am

I get my money's worth.

MOTD, BBC Website used daily, BBC News channel, Five Live, 6 Music, Natural world docs, Crime dramas, history docs, World Service when I'm on holiday abroad, etc. all with no adverts and that's only about 10% of what the beeb do. Imagine if I like cooking, dancing, baking, painting, reading, antique collecting, soap operas, period dramas, etc. I would be even more appreciative of it.
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Lancasterclaret » Wed Jun 12, 2019 10:52 am

Reading far too many posts by the terminally bewildered on social media yesterday, and I think a lot of people think that if they sacked Gary Lineker, then they wouldn't have to get over-75s to pay the license fee.
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 11:00 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Reading far too many posts by the terminally bewildered on social media yesterday, and I think a lot of people think that if they sacked Gary Lineker, then they wouldn't have to get over-75s to pay the license fee.

I think a lot of issues with Lineker stem from his passionate care for the NHS and other services while employing people to help him pay far less tax than he should ( I know it isn't criminal but it is morally wrong) along with hammering FIFA for many years for being so corrupt then defending them when offered a 6 figure sum to help to the World Cup draw by the same people. He is one of the fastest to comment on things when it is with something he disagrees with i.e Brexit but hasn't yet give his opinion on this licence fee story.
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by aggi » Wed Jun 12, 2019 11:47 am

kaptin1 wrote:Use a VPN and set to the UK
Most VPNs tend to get blocked by the BBC. I ended up setting my own up at home which was an easy/cheap option.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by martin_p » Wed Jun 12, 2019 11:51 am

How does anyone think that those poor pensioners who won’t be getting free tv licences will be able to afford an inevitability more expensive subscription based BBC?

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by aggi » Wed Jun 12, 2019 11:52 am

Given what you pay for Spotify, Netflix, Sky, etc I think the BBC is great value.

I probably spend at least five hours a day listening to 6 music, 5 live, 4 extra and a variety of other stations. Add to that the BBC website and app are the first place I go to for news and info. All of this is before any of the TV output as well.
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Foulthrow » Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:15 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Reading far too many posts by the terminally bewildered on social media yesterday, and I think a lot of people think that if they sacked Gary Lineker, then they wouldn't have to get over-75s to pay the license fee.
In fairness though they are needlessly paying 'talent' way too much. Who are they competing with and why? Would it matter if ITV got a few more viewers for Corrie than the Beeb does for Eastenders? And, I'm not being funny, but some of the jobs that these presenters do is not that specialised or unique - I'm sure you'd have thousands of people falling over themselves to replace Tess Daly or Claudia WInkleman at a fraction of the price and would do a very similar standard of job. It's basically reading words aloud. As Yosser Hughes might say - I could do that.

But, the main problem with the licence fee is that it isn't really optional, therefore it's basically a tax.
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by claret wizard » Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:19 pm

Foshiznik wrote:I get my money's worth.

MOTD, BBC Website used daily, BBC News channel, Five Live, 6 Music, Natural world docs, Crime dramas, history docs, World Service when I'm on holiday abroad, etc. all with no adverts and that's only about 10% of what the beeb do. Imagine if I like cooking, dancing, baking, painting, reading, antique collecting, soap operas, period dramas, etc. I would be even more appreciative of it.
In that case you should pay £50 a month and then 4 others who consume nothing can opt out.

It's a tax, and should be funded from central Gov. Or it's a commercial org and it should live by subscriptions and/or adverts. I already see adverts all over apart from the TV channels.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Hipper » Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:23 pm

I'm a pensioner - only 66 though - and I don't really see why things should be free or cheaper for me generally speaking.

The £10 bonus near Christmas is silly, the £200 heating allowance was thought at the time to be a good idea but I don't think it is. These items should simply be incorporated into the state pension. The bus pass may have some merit but I don't see why it shouldn't be means tested.
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Bosscat » Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:23 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Reading far too many posts by the terminally bewildered on social media yesterday, and I think a lot of people think that if they sacked Gary Lineker, then they wouldn't have to get over-75s to pay the license fee.
It might not pay for the over75's licences but the benefits of sacking G Lineker are huge... we wouldn't have the grinning goblin and his jug eared mug on the telly-box on MotD :D

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by RingoMcCartney » Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:29 pm

It's 2019. The idea of being forced, through threat of imprisonment, to pay for the privilege of what for millions, is one of their few reliefs from loneliness they have left. Is an anathema to anybody who believes in basic fairness.

It's a regressive tax that is placed upon the unemployed, those on minimum wage regardless of their actual ability to pay. Yet millionaires are allowed to pay exactly the same.

It's an unfair poll tax that should be scrapped immediately. If the BBC is so supremely confident in its output, scrap this unjust TV poll tax , and let the market be a judge of that. If people want the BBC, let them pay for the BBC. At least they should have a choice. Not be obliged to do, through fear of prison.

Last week the BBC was proclaiming how the veterans were a generation that the country owed so much to for their courage and valour.


This week the BBC is saying "by the way, you owe us 154 quid"
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by AndrewJB » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:00 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:It's 2019. The idea of being forced, through threat of imprisonment, to pay for the privilege of what for millions, is one of their few reliefs from loneliness they have left. Is an anathema to anybody who believes in basic fairness.

It's a regressive tax that is placed upon the unemployed, those on minimum wage regardless of their actual ability to pay. Yet millionaires are allowed to pay exactly the same.

It's an unfair poll tax that should be scrapped immediately. If the BBC is so supremely confident in its output, scrap this unjust TV poll tax , and let the market be a judge of that. If people want the BBC, let them pay for the BBC. At least they should have a choice. Not be obliged to do, through fear of prison.

Last week the BBC was proclaiming how the veterans were a generation that the country owed so much to for their courage and valour.


This week the BBC is saying "by the way, you owe us 154 quid"
We already have a big variety of commercial radio and television to choose from. Not being run for commercial considerations is what makes the BBC different (I would say better). And in this way it sets the standard for quality against which the commercial stations have to compete. By all means scrap the license fee, but don't de-fund the BBC and run it the same way as has worked well so far.

At the same time I think all media organisations should be forced to publish lists of which companies and products provide advertising revenue, so people can base their consumer choices on which media organisations they fund through what they buy.
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Vino blanco » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:05 pm

I've said it many times on here: commercialise the BBC and scrap all licence fees.
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Stalbansclaret » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:24 pm

For me the breadth and quality of the beeb's output (radio, TV and online) makes it easily worth the money. It's also a great pleasure to listen and watch stuff uninterrupted without someone trying to sell me stuff at very regular intervals.I get the debate about whether it's fair for everyone with a telly to pay for it but for me it's such a good aspect of living in this country I have no problem with it being regarded as a special case as find it hard to believe anyone couldn't derive sufficient/enjoyment value from it's output.
I am a huge fan of the BBC BUT , as has been commented above, the "stars" earning excessive salaries could, with very few exceptions, be replaced by cheaper alternatives and the money potentially reinvested in programming.
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by RingoMcCartney » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:30 pm

AndrewJB wrote:We already have a big variety of commercial radio and television to choose from. Not being run for commercial considerations is what makes the BBC different (I would say better). And in this way it sets the standard for quality against which the commercial stations have to compete. By all means scrap the license fee, but don't de-fund the BBC and run it the same way as has worked well so far.

At the same time I think all media organisations should be forced to publish lists of which companies and products provide advertising revenue, so people can base their consumer choices on which media organisations they fund through what they buy.
I'm sorry, I have to disagree. If, as you say, the BBC sets the standards, and viewers and listeners agree. Then let them put their money where their mouths are and pay for it. The idea that the BBC is a special case and should receive it's funding from a captive audience who are obliged to pay , through fear of imprisonment. Or it receives it's funding , presumably if the licence is scrapped , then comes directly from the government (tax payer). Would inevitably see a continuation of the top heavy, bloated, London centric, extremely profligate , and increasingly, for under 30s, irrelevant, organisation we have today.

Rather than assume the viewing public are happy to pay for its output. The BBC should have have the courage of its convictions and give them the choice.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by CrosspoolClarets » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:34 pm

The bit I find unbelievable is how people who are in support of leftie economics come out in support of probably the most regressive tax of them all.

A billionaire will pay the same as a 80 year old widow who owns her house and has a bit saved up in case she needs social care. She keeps the TV because it is her only contact with the outside world and thus pays the license even though she struggles to find the cash for the electric bill. That story will be commonplace.

I agree that Osborne forced this on the BBC originally, but they still had a choice, and yes, that choice did include paying Lineker and others what they do.

I love some of the drama and the website but am moving fast towards revoking the Royal Charter and the license fee.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by elwaclaret » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:36 pm

If the BBC boosted the signal for other broadcasters to the same level the BBC use they could have charged the other providers for it and generated cash that way... they chose not to do that and allowed them to find alternative solutions, as they assumed the license to be sacrosanct. They later then allowed the Government to foist government policy over to them to keep their monopoly....

Just two of the other not often stated reasons the BBC has been forced to drop free licensees for the over 75’s. Not so much financing as rank mis- mismanagement due to their protected service system allowing them to survive in a quasi national institution on the backs of taxpayers.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by martin_p » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:41 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:I'm sorry, I have to disagree. If, as you say, the BBC sets the standards, and viewers and listeners agree. Then let them put their money where their mouths are and pay for it. The idea that the BBC is a special case and should receive it's funding from a captive audience who are obliged to pay , through fear of imprisonment. Or it receives it's funding , presumably if the licence is scrapped , then comes directly from the government (tax payer). Would inevitably see a continuation of the top heavy, bloated, London centric, extremely profligate , and increasingly, for under 30s, irrelevant, organisation we have today.

Rather than assume the viewing public are happy to pay for its output. The BBC should have have the courage of its convictions and give them the choice.
So you do want veterans to pay for the BBC then, and you want them to pay more.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by RingoMcCartney » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:49 pm

martin_p wrote:So you do want veterans to pay for the BBC then, and you want them to pay more.
I'd like a level playing field.

1, Either commercialisation, 2

2 If it's subscription. Let the viewing public have a choice of whether they want to pay or not, and drop the idea of making over 75s have to pay , should they want to watch a subscription based BBC. Best of both worlds for the veterans really.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by RingoMcCartney » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:54 pm

This morning , LBC radio were discussing the licence fee. Saying "millions set to defy TV licence rule change as they say they'd be willing to go to prison"

A caller came on. His dad was a Normandy veteran and he said he'd had a chat with his dad. He said his dad, semi joking, that at over 80, he'd refuse to pay for a TV license and the idea of jail wasn't as unattractive as it might first seem. At least he'd be given 3 square meals a day, jump the queue for access to a doctor, and be able to watch a large screen television without the need to pay for a bloody TV licence!  :lol:

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by martin_p » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:00 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:I'd like a level playing field.

1, Either commercialisation, 2

2 If it's subscription. Let the viewing public have a choice of whether they want to pay or not, and drop the idea of making over 75s have to pay , should they want to watch a subscription based BBC. Best of both worlds for the veterans really.
Presumably you’ll be banging on about Sky, Netflix and Amazon offering free subscriptions to the over 75s then.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by claretonthecoast1882 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:00 pm

martin_p wrote:Presumably you’ll be banging on about Sky, Netflix and Amazon offering free subscriptions to the over 75s then.

They have a choice with all those 3 services, hardly the same

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by martin_p » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:02 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:They have a choice with all those 3 services, hardly the same
Wrongo wants the BBC to become a subscription service and offer it free for over 75s.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by RingoMcCartney » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:03 pm

martin_p wrote:Presumably you’ll be banging on about Sky, Netflix and Amazon offering free subscriptions to the over 75s then.
Probably not. Perhaps they'd have a choice of one from 4.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by aggi » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:07 pm

martin_p wrote:Wrongo wants the BBC to become a subscription service and offer it free for over 75s.
That's because he wants a level playing field though ...

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by RingoMcCartney » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:08 pm

martin_p wrote:Wrongo wants the BBC to become a subscription service and offer it free for over 75s.
Now you're attempting to put words into my mouth.

Where do I say "I want the BBC to become a subscription service?

I said a level playing field.

And looking at potential options.

You'll notice my number one choice would be commercialisation.

In fact my over riding request would be the immediate reversal to make over 75s pay for a TV licence.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by RingoMcCartney » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:09 pm

aggi wrote:That's because he wants a level playing field though ...
See above

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Stayingup » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:24 pm

claretonthecoast1882 wrote:I think a lot of issues with Lineker stem from his passionate care for the NHS and other services while employing people to help him pay far less tax than he should ( I know it isn't criminal but it is morally wrong) along with hammering FIFA for many years for being so corrupt then defending them when offered a 6 figure sum to help to the World Cup draw by the same people. He is one of the fastest to comment on things when it is with something he disagrees with i.e Brexit but hasn't yet give his opinion on this licence fee story.
He won't be in too much of a hurry to give his opinion on this as he probably disagrees with it but doesn't want to compromise his lucrative contract with the BBC.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by martin_p » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:27 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:Now you're attempting to put words into my mouth.

Where do I say "I want the BBC to become a subscription service?

I said a level playing field.

And looking at potential options.

You'll notice my number one choice would be commercialisation.

In fact my over riding request would be the immediate reversal to make over 75s pay for a TV licence.
But the BBC has obligations through their character that other broadcasters don’t, presumably you’d want to abandon those as well. May as well call it ITV5.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Stayingup » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:33 pm

The BBC has moved progressively away from its neutral reporting, where its supposed to be. Its very biased on some some issues and seems to me to think that listenrs and viewers must be thick. Just like most politicians when they come out with absolute claptrap. Its for this reason I think that there are calls for the Licence fee to be scrapped. Also because it wastes millions. It should be made to stand on its own two feet. Anther grouse is sport coverage. Its very poor.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by RingoMcCartney » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:37 pm

martin_p wrote:But the BBC has obligations through their character that other broadcasters don’t, presumably you’d want to abandon those as well. May as well call it ITV5.
I have obligations to put a crust on my table through gainful employment. The thought of engagement with your good self, gets less attractive as each minute passes. But one quick question, with a one word answer.
Out of interest. And now you've stopped putting words into my mouth.

Do you agree with making over 75s pay for their TV licence?

Yes Or No?
Last edited by RingoMcCartney on Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by martin_p » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:38 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:I have obligations to put a crust on my table through gainful employment. The thought of engagement with your good self, gets less attractive as each minute passes. But one quick question, with a one word answer.
Out of interest.

Do you agree with making over 75s pay for their TV licence?

Yes Or No?
Yes, on a means tested basis.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by RingoMcCartney » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:40 pm

Fine.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Greenmile » Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:45 pm

RingoMcCartney wrote:It's 2019. The idea of being forced, through threat of imprisonment, to pay for the privilege of what for millions, is one of their few reliefs from loneliness they have left. Is an anathema to anybody who believes in basic fairness.
You can’t go to prison for not paying your TV licence, any more than you can go to prison for littering.

You know this - why do you keep lying?

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by claret2018 » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:03 pm

You do have a choice not to pay the tv licence- just don’t watch live bbc tv

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Stayingup » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:03 pm

Just reading that the BBC has more than 100 staff - not performers - on more than £150,000 p.a. Thats more than the PM. The total in ome is over £5 billion almost 80% of that coming fron Licence fees. It is a huge intake, and shows how profligate it is.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Stayingup » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:04 pm

claret2018 wrote:You do have a choice not to pay the tv licence- just don’t watch live bbc tv
Many dont now because its so out of touch with the bulk of the population.

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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by willsclarets » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:06 pm

I find it absolutely amazing anyone would want rid of the BBC as a public broadcaster. Commercialising it would decrease diversity, increase partiality and undermine the fabric that makes the UK one of the best broadcasting hubs in the world. The BBC helps to police the other outlets simply by being there.

Watch how quickly you'd be subject to adverts every 3 minutes and massively sensationalised news to chase audience share/advertisers. Watch how quickly diversity of programming plummets because creative development is secondary to formulas proven to attract audience and advertisers. Watch how quickly minority groups are catered for even less than they are now. And listen to the quality of radio broadcasts fall to the level TalkSport operate at. Losing the BBC in its current form would be a disaster
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by martin_p » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:08 pm

Stayingup wrote:Just reading that the BBC has more than 100 staff - not performers - on more than £150,000 p.a. Thats more than the PM. The total in ome is over £5 billion almost 80% of that coming fron Licence fees. It is a huge intake, and shows how profligate it is.
What utter nonsense. Plenty of the most efficiently run businesses in the world will have lots of staff on that sort of salaries, and will other broadcasters both here and across the world. Unless you’re telling me they’re cleaning the bogs or doing some photocopying, in which case I agree.

Foshiznik
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Foshiznik » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:20 pm

Les also not forget the great work BBC Monitoring and BBC World Service does for the security of these Isles.

nil_desperandum
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by nil_desperandum » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:26 pm

Stayingup wrote:Just reading that the BBC has more than 100 staff - not performers - on more than £150,000 p.a. Thats more than the PM. The total in ome is over £5 billion almost 80% of that coming fron Licence fees. It is a huge intake, and shows how profligate it is.
Might be wrong, but isn't that 100 out of something in the region of 35,000 - ( that includes part-time, flexible and fixed-contact workers).
In that context, it's a tiny proportion.

Foshiznik
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Foshiznik » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:38 pm

nil_desperandum wrote:Might be wrong, but isn't that 100 out of something in the region of 35,000 - ( that includes part-time, flexible and fixed-contact workers).
In that context, it's a tiny proportion.
I know for a fact that it is lower percentage than those in the entire Civil service. It was also confirmed at the time it was reported that Ant and Dec get paid more by ITV than all of the £150k+ salaried journalists (42 of them) combined.

aggi
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by aggi » Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:18 pm

Stayingup wrote:Just reading that the BBC has more than 100 staff - not performers - on more than £150,000 p.a. Thats more than the PM. The total in ome is over £5 billion almost 80% of that coming fron Licence fees. It is a huge intake, and shows how profligate it is.
There's a weird belief that any publicly funded body should pay their staff peanuts.

If you want the best staff you have to pay for them. It's not like public sector staff don't know that the private sector exists.

Holtyclaret
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Holtyclaret » Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:37 pm

Is it true that our overpaid and crap politicians don’t have to pay it???’

Read it today and find it startling.

I find it disgusting that anyone over pension age has to pay it, I’d rather pay slightly more to cover it. They’ve been paying it for up to 49 years or so as ‘valued customers ‘ they’ve paid enough.

Hipper
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Re: Abolish the BBC television license

Post by Hipper » Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:54 pm

People want to get rid of this?

https://www.bbc.com/pidgin" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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