Vydra exit now inevitable?

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ZizkovClaret
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Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby ZizkovClaret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:35 pm

I just can't see him accepting being 4th choice striker. I wanted it to work but it hasn't so its time to end a failed experiment

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martin_p
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby martin_p » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:37 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:I just can't see him accepting being 4th choice striker. I wanted it to work but it hasn't so its time to end a failed experiment


He spent the whole of last season as 4th choice striker.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby ZizkovClaret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:40 pm

martin_p wrote:He spent the whole of last season as 4th choice striker.


2nd half wasnt expected though, i expect him not to accept it this season again

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby randomclaret2 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:43 pm

We need 4 strikers vying for 2 places

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby mdd2 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:44 pm

Surely Jay is Sam's replacement not an addition to the squad. We only have a squad of 20 plus 3 keepers and McNeil with these two signings so if there are no leavers and we exclude Ageyi and Dunne from our 25 there is only room for two more additions of players over 21 years of age on Jan 1st 2019.
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby tiger76 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:44 pm

Leeds were interested weren't they,if we can recoup most of our £11 million outlay i'd let him go,the lad might as well be playing regular games,even if it's at Championship level,i can't see him getting into the side in any of the wide positions now either,we're well stocked in that area now Jay's been confirmed.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby ZizkovClaret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:45 pm

mdd2 wrote:Surely Jay is Sam's replacement not an addition to the squad. We only have a squad of 20 plus 3 keepers and McNeil with these two signings so if there are no leavers and we exclude Ageyi and Dunne from our 25 there is only room for two more additions of players over 21 years of age on Jan 1st 2019.


I'm sure Dyche wants 4 strikers, im just not convinced Vydra will want to be that 4th one

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby elwaclaret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:46 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:I just can't see him accepting being 4th choice striker. I wanted it to work but it hasn't so its time to end a failed experiment


With it looking like Crouch is running out of time to decide, and Jay Rod being able to play as a ten, or even attacking midfield. I actually think Vydra will fancy playing alongside JR rather than Ash or Wood.
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby FactualFrank » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:47 pm

4 forwards and a youth is ideal.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Quickenthetempo » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:47 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:I'm sure Dyche wants 4 strikers, im just not convinced Vydra will want to be that 4th one

He's been wanting out since January but he's under contract, so it's up to Dyche what he wants to do.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby ZizkovClaret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:49 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:He's been wanting out since January but he's under contract, so it's up to Dyche what he wants to do.


I dont think modern football works like that tbh. Vydra has form for being a bad apple if he's not getting game time so wouldnt be inadvisable to let him go for the right money.

Part of me wonders if the Jansson sale at Leeds could be partly to fund a bid

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Papabendi » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:50 pm

it is up to Vydra to show he is either #1 or #2. I don't see why he starts the season in any set position.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Quickenthetempo » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:51 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:I dont think modern football works like that tbh. Vydra has form for being a bad apple if he's not getting game time so wouldnt be inadvisable to let him go for the right money.

Part of me wonders if the Jansson sale at Leeds could be partly to fund a bid

He's never been in a Sean Dyche headlock before though has he.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby agreenwood » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:53 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:I just can't see him accepting being 4th choice striker. I wanted it to work but it hasn't so its time to end a failed experiment


Only Zikov. :roll: #obsessed
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby ClaretTony » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:55 pm

I'm told it is unlikely he'll be leaving - we needed a striker to, in effect, replace Sam Vokes.
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby theroyaldyche » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:56 pm

All it takes is vydra to have a good pre season and he may give him a run

Only takes barnes or wood to get injured in the warm up games

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Spijed » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:56 pm

ClaretTony wrote:I'm told it is unlikely he'll be leaving


So we've now got our four strikers sorted.

Good stuff!

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby ClaretTony » Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:57 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:Vydra has form for being a bad apple if he's not getting game time so wouldnt be inadvisable to let him go for the right money.


Not from what I'm told

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby JohnMac » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:03 pm

I'd sooner keep Vydra than not and if we can make it work it will allow more options.
Last edited by JohnMac on Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby houseboy » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:04 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:I just can't see him accepting being 4th choice striker. I wanted it to work but it hasn't so its time to end a failed experiment

How can an experiment be *'failed' when it hasn't been carried out? Vydra got ridiculously little time on the pitch despite not exactly disgracing himself when he was used. If I was him I'd be itching to get away - it's a year of his life he won't get back. One can only assume that his lack of use may be down to some personal difficulties between him and Dyche. I suppose we will never know.




*Strictly speaking there is no such thing as a failed experiment. Scientifically an experiment is carried out to observe the results, not to pre-judge them. Even when testing a theory it should not be done to try to prove someone right, it should be done with a completely open mind, otherwise you may inadvertantly (or otherwise) introduce factors that affect the result.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby jrgbfc » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:12 pm

Unfortunately for Vydra he is even less likely to see any action now. May as well let the lad go and keep Wells as 4th choice.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby ZizkovClaret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:14 pm

houseboy wrote:How can an experiment be *'failed' when it hasn't been carried out? Vydra got ridiculously little time on the pitch despite not exactly disgracing himself when he was used. If I was him I'd be itching to get away - it's a year of his life he won't get back. One can only assume that his lack of use may be down to some personal difficulties between him and Dyche. I suppose we will never know.




*Strictly speaking there is no such thing as a failed experiment. Scientifically an experiment is carried out to observe the results, not to pre-judge them. Even when testing a theory it should not be done to try to prove someone right, it should be done with a completely open mind, otherwise you may inadvertantly (or otherwise) introduce factors that affect the result.


I would argue the experiment was on Vydra's part, having a crack at a PL club rather than being 1st or 2nd choice for a Championship side

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby houseboy » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:24 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:I would argue the experiment was on Vydra's part, having a crack at a PL club rather than being 1st or 2nd choice for a Championship side

I think you are right in that respect but I can't help but wonder (probably along with 90% of other Clarets) what he might have done given a run in the team. One thing is for sure, if he does leave he would go with no ill will from the fans because he did nothing wrong. He never got the chance to fail.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby keith1879 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:25 pm

houseboy wrote:How can an experiment be *'failed' when it hasn't been carried out? Vydra got ridiculously little time on the pitch despite not exactly disgracing himself when he was used. If I was him I'd be itching to get away - it's a year of his life he won't get back. One can only assume that his lack of use may be down to some personal difficulties between him and Dyche. I suppose we will never know.




*Strictly speaking there is no such thing as a failed experiment. Scientifically an experiment is carried out to observe the results, not to pre-judge them. Even when testing a theory it should not be done to try to prove someone right, it should be done with a completely open mind, otherwise you may inadvertantly (or otherwise) introduce factors that affect the result.


I must applaud the objective and logical nature of your footnote regarding scientific experiments. On an internet forum however it represents a complete waste of several hundred keystrokes since half the readers can't understand it and most of the other half don't want to. And I say this with 125% certainty. FACT
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Vegas Claret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:27 pm

I would imagine Wells will be the first out of the door

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby houseboy » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:31 pm

jrgbfc wrote:Unfortunately for Vydra he is even less likely to see any action now. May as well let the lad go and keep Wells as 4th choice.

Unfortunately I have to agree. If we keep Wells though we need to keep him in the club, not out on loan, because he now needs to be around Jay, Barnes and Wood in training and maybe given game time as a sub occasionally, he can't help but learn from these 3 now surely. The only down side for him though is unless we get a couple of bad injuries it is difficult seeing him getting much time on the pitch with those three now.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Longside4evr » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:32 pm

Vydra will be giving it ago to try and break through this season
With Crouch most likely to continue his career or what ever he decides to do elsewhere
Rodriguez signing is to fill in the gap that selling Vokes left
Same as Pieters as filled the gap that Ward as left so we have filled the gaps and need that competitive edge with these players to push what we have
4 strikers is essential in this league it's just where Wells is going to fit in he'll be the one to readjust things I would of thought
Vydra could have a major part to play this season
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby northernpowerhouse » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:35 pm

Going off past form Dyche will give Vydra a chance and stick Jay on the bench until he gets up to speed.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Hedontplayforyou » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:36 pm

Keane, Tarkowski, Ward, and to an extent Westwood all bided their time when joining, and they didn’t turn out to be bad servants to the club.

Vydra will have a full pre-season to knuckle down and show what he’s about, including more game time in friendlies which can only be a good thing. He has , as others have in the past, had to adapt and learn the way we operate, this season will make or break him in terms of playing at Premier League level , let’s hope he turns out like said players I mentioned at the beginning .

And I suspect Wells will be sold on. He simply don’t good enough for this level
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby houseboy » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:37 pm

keith1879 wrote:I must applaud the objective and logical nature of your footnote regarding scientific experiments. On an internet forum however it represents a complete waste of several hundred keystrokes since half the readers can't understand it and most of the other half don't want to. And I say this with 125% certainty. FACT

I am either guilty of overwhelming pedantry or crippling boredom and to be honest I don't know myself which it is. My logical pedantry usually surfaces when I am bored half to death so the conclusion must be that I am bored. Or not. :lol:

What happens if your are bored half to death...twice?

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Rileybobs » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:42 pm

It appears that a lot of our fans struggle with the concept of a squad. I know that historically we haven’t been blessed with a squad full of talent but we’re now playing in one of the world’s best leagues and it’s imperative that we have strong competition for each position.

If Vydra wants regular game time then he needs to either prove himself to the coaching staff or request a transfer. If he chooses the latter and our club agrees he will almost certainly drop down a division and more than likely have to take a wage cut. That’s his choice.

It seems that whenever we have more than one decent player for a single position it scrambles the brains of a number of posters on here.
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby houseboy » Tue Jul 09, 2019 3:51 pm

Hedontplayforyou wrote:Keane, Tarkowski, Ward, and to an extent Westwood all bided their time when joining, and they didn’t turn out to be bad servants to the club.

Vydra will have a full pre-season to knuckle down and show what he’s about, including more game time in friendlies which can only be a good thing. He has , as others have in the past, had to adapt and learn the way we operate, this season will make or break him in terms of playing at Premier League level , let’s hope he turns out like said players I mentioned at the beginning .

And I suspect Wells will be sold on. He simply don’t good enough for this level

It's a hard call given the lack of time either player has seen but I would personally go with keeping Vydra because he at least has shone brightly at Championship level. But as you rightly say, it's down to him. Having 4 strikers of reasonable quality is a luxury I can't remember us having in many a long year. Now just one decent creative midfielder (and hoping we keep the players we've got) and I think we'll be in for a decent (non-struggling) season. The main thing I think will be keeping Tarks and Heaton.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby FCBurnley » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:02 pm

Vydra could be very useful playing just behind our front 2. Clearly has some quality but maybe a bit lightweight to play as a pure striker. Gonna depend on what formation we will be playing . 4-3-1-2 or 4-4-2 as normal

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Colburn_Claret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:18 pm

We never had the team to play to Vydra's strength last season. The addition of Jay will help him, because although JayRod can play the striker role, he has so much more about him. We still need that centre mid who can thread a ball forward, and if we get one, or SD stays injury free, we could see a big change in style of play next season. Sean showed early doors that he wanted to play more 'football', sadly the results didn't come and we reverted to type, or back to our core strengths. If we are successful it will open up the door to changing the way we play, depending on who the opposition is, and give players a rest when they need it.
One centre mid, that's all we need, and it will have been an excellent window. So I hope Vydra stays, and shows all the promise that we only saw in glimpses last season.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Hibsclaret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:25 pm

We now have some good variation in terms of playing style and I think all our strikers are premier league quality. If Vydra stays I think we may be able to mix the football up this season.

As other posters have said we tried the better football early last season but the main problem was the players out of form, lacking confidence and adapting from a strange pre season. This season there are no pre season issues and hopefully we will hit the ground running. It’s all good news so far.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Bosscat » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:29 pm

northernpowerhouse wrote:Going off past form Dyche will give Vydra a chance and stick Jay on the bench until he gets up to speed.

Jay is getting a full Dyche pre-season unlike others in the past... I think you will find he will be up to speed very quickly compared to people that sign in August at the end of the Window

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Bosscat » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:29 pm

houseboy wrote:I am either guilty of overwhelming pedantry or crippling boredom and to be honest I don't know myself which it is. My logical pedantry usually surfaces when I am bored half to death so the conclusion must be that I am bored. Or not. :lol:

What happens if your are bored half to death...twice?

I knew what you meant house m8 ;)

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby ashtonlongsider » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:34 pm

Think JayRod's signing is a good thing for Vydra. It will certainly increase our options. Like quite a few others I don't think for a moment Vydra will leave.
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby LongSider75 » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:36 pm

I now think we have 4 strikers where any combination can work depending on the opposition. Just worried that SD won't adapt when needed. Any thoughts ??

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby jrgbfc » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:40 pm

Rileybobs wrote:It appears that a lot of our fans struggle with the concept of a squad. I know that historically we haven’t been blessed with a squad full of talent but we’re now playing in one of the world’s best leagues and it’s imperative that we have strong competition for each position.

If Vydra wants regular game time then he needs to either prove himself to the coaching staff or request a transfer. If he chooses the latter and our club agrees he will almost certainly drop down a division and more than likely have to take a wage cut. That’s his choice.

It seems that whenever we have more than one decent player for a single position it scrambles the brains of a number of posters on here.


Most managers don't stick with the same starting XI for weeks on end though. If you're out of the team under Dyche it's incredibly hard to work your way in.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Hibsclaret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 4:40 pm

LongSider75 wrote:I now think we have 4 strikers where any combination can work depending on the opposition. Just worried that SD won't adapt when needed. Any thoughts ??


Thoughts? I’ve learned not to worry about anything the great man does.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Rileybobs » Tue Jul 09, 2019 5:04 pm

jrgbfc wrote:Most managers don't stick with the same starting XI for weeks on end though. If you're out of the team under Dyche it's incredibly hard to work your way in.


True enough, but when you prove yourself in Dyche’s starting 11 you are given every chance to retain your place.

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aggi
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby aggi » Tue Jul 09, 2019 5:16 pm

If Vydra couldn't get off the bench ahead of Crouch against Leicester in a game desperately crying out for pace then I struggle to see when he will get played.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby SonofPog » Tue Jul 09, 2019 5:34 pm

I see Vydra as similar in style and ability to Jay, personally, I would have preferred us to have not gone for Jay, but instead gone for a younger pacey Striker, to add another dimension to our attacking bow.

But as we've now got Jay, Vydra most likely behind him in the pecking order and similar in style, seems surplus to requirements to me.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Rileybobs » Tue Jul 09, 2019 5:37 pm

SonofPog wrote:I see Vydra as similar in style and ability to Jay, personally, I would have preferred us to have not gone for Jay, but instead gone for a younger pacey Striker, to add another dimension to our attacking bow.

But as we've now got Jay, Vydra most likely behind him in the pecking order and similar in style, seems surplus to requirements to me.


What is it that you see in Vydra and Rodriguez’s style that you think is similar? I don’t see many similarities myself.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby SonofPog » Tue Jul 09, 2019 5:41 pm

I'm assuming they're both be playing that "in the hole" floaty creative Number 10 role Riley. (Not a position or role we often adopt.)

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby CombatClaret » Tue Jul 09, 2019 5:45 pm

jrgbfc wrote:Unfortunately for Vydra he is even less likely to see any action now. May as well let the lad go and keep Wells as 4th choice.


My thoughts also, makes the most financial sense.

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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Long Time Lurker » Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:03 pm

Vegas Claret wrote:I would imagine Wells will be the first out of the door


Agreed. Nahki has made his thoughts and aspirations regarding his future at Burnley very clear.

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/sport/fo ... e-16523375

Whether he spends the coming season competing for a spot on the bench as our fifth option or out on loan I would say that he is very unlikely to sign a new contract with us. That means he will probably leave on a free transfer at the end of the season

The net result is that if we don't move him on in this window we will lose out on getting any money for him and he could be set for a miserable season if a loan doesn't materialise.

What is he worth in today's market, 5-6m ?

At the start of the window, probably, but it might be a lot less after the arrival of Jay. Every other club will be aware of the situation which could affect what they are willing to pay us now.

# 49
Prefeot
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Prefeot » Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:21 pm

ZizkovClaret wrote:I just can't see him accepting being 4th choice striker. I wanted it to work but it hasn't so its time to end a failed experiment

I do hope so

# 50
Rileybobs
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Re: Vydra exit now inevitable?

Postby Rileybobs » Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:54 pm

SonofPog wrote:I'm assuming they're both be playing that "in the hole" floaty creative Number 10 role Riley. (Not a position or role we often adopt.)


Fair enough in the position they may occupy on the pitch but I don’t think their styles are too comparable. I’m not sure exactly how suited Vydra is to the number 10 role at this level either. His touch doesn’t seem great and he’s pretty lightweight.


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