Boris
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Re: Boris
Priorities
Re: Boris
I can't believe I'm gettibg involved in this but. Macmillan sacked people. Hitler's night of the long knives involved people dying ( was one the leader of the SA Rhoem ? ) Really really not comparable.Imploding Turtle wrote:When they referred to Macmillan's reshuffle as Night of the Long Knives it was because of its similarities to Hitler's.
Any comparison to Macmillan's is by definition a comparison to Hitler's.
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Re: Boris
Then tell that to the people who in the 60s were drawing the comparisons, and who attached the name.Fenwick wrote:I can't believe I'm gettibg involved in this but. Macmillan sacked people. Hitler's night of the long knives involved people dying ( was one the leader of the SA Rhoem ? ) Really really not comparable.
Re: Boris
Incidentally, if you're that far adrift with the way the English language works, it may be helpful to let you know that when Jeremy Corbyn said "We have met in memory of the Jarrow crusade", he wasn't claiming that the Jarrow marchers invaded the Holy Land and slaughtered thousands of moslems.Imploding Turtle wrote:Then tell that to the people who in the 60s were drawing the comparisons, and who attached the name.
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Re: Boris
The word "crusade" doesn't mean "invade the Holy Land". It has a dictionary definition.dsr wrote:Incidentally, if you're that far adrift with the way the English language works, it may be helpful to let you know that when Jeremy Corbyn said "We have met in memory of the Jarrow crusade", he wasn't claiming that the Jarrow marchers invaded the Holy Land and slaughtered thousands of moslems.
Night of the Long Knives, in the context of Macmillan, was specifically called that because of the similarities between Hitler's version of it.
So if you use the term in comparison to Macmillan's version of it then you are by definition comparing it to Hitler's version of it. This is not a difficult thing to understand, unless you are trying really ******* hard not to understand it.
Re: Boris
If you're trying to say that you know all the rules for usage and idioms in English and no-one else can have any input, then I would respectfully disagree. I doubt that the Academie Francaise can reasonably claim to order how French should be spoken; I certainly don't agree that you have the same rights over English.Imploding Turtle wrote:The word "crusade" doesn't mean "invade the Holy Land". It has a dictionary definition.
Night of the Long Knives, in the context of Macmillan, was specifically called that because of the similarities between Hitler's version of it.
So if you use the term in comparison to Macmillan's version of it then you are by definition comparing it to Hitler's version of it. This is not a difficult thing to understand, unless you are trying really ******* hard not to understand it.
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Re: Boris
Neither do you.dsr wrote:If you're trying to say that you know all the rules for usage and idioms in English and no-one else can have any input, then I would respectfully disagree. I doubt that the Academie Francaise can reasonably claim to order how French should be spoken; I certainly don't agree that you have the same rights over English.
But i understand maths. And when you compare 1+1 to 3-1 after someone compared 3-1 to the number 2, then you're also comparing 1+1 to the number 2.
And yes, i chose that number deliberately because i want to compare you to it too.
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Re: Boris
No. I've never thought that. You're making that up.dsr wrote:So you still think that English is a ruthlessly logical language with no nuances of rules or usage?
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Re: Boris
nil_desperandum wrote:Maybe we could simplify this if you can actually find a quote from me where I've made a direct comparison between Johnson and Hitler.
As someone else correctly pointed out, the fact that the names "Johnson" and "Hitler" happen to be in the same paragraph doesn't mean that you are drawing comparisons between them. But if you go back to my original post, you'll see that I consciously avoided including Hitler's name in my point for fear that someone - guess who - would choose to misinterpret what I was saying.
nil_desperandum wrote: you can't just assume that you can get rid of Johnson as easily as he has been anointed.
Who was the "fool" or "conman" that "intellgent people" put into power in 1930s Germany?nil_desperandum wrote:There are many occasions in history, with 1930s Germany being the most obvious example, where clever, intelligent people have assumed that putting a fool or conman nto power is a good idea, and that he can quickly and easily be sidestepped or replaced.
You must have someone in mind? Otherwise why mention 1930s Germany!
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Re: Boris
I think we'd all agree that Chamberlain was kinda foolish. Although i doubt the people who put him in power were all that intelligent.RingoMcCartney wrote:Who was the "fool" or "conman" that "intellgent people" put into power in 1930s Germany?
You must have someone in mind? Otherwise why mention 1930s Germany!
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Re: Boris
Reports of a clown attacking passengers on a cruise ship.
Anybody seen Boris
Anybody seen Boris
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Re: Boris
Why not give Boris a chance? It’s all too easy to write someone off without seeing what they can do. Churchill was written off as a politician in 1916 but made a spectacular comeback and is now regarded as one of, if not the best, Prime Ministers of all time. Time will tell.
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Re: Boris
Give him a chance? You're talking as if we've had any choice in the matter. The reality is he's been foisted on the country by a handful of daft old bats in the home counties.BennyD wrote:Why not give Boris a chance? It’s all too easy to write someone off without seeing what they can do. Churchill was written off as a politician in 1916 but made a spectacular comeback and is now regarded as one of, if not the best, Prime Ministers of all time. Time will tell.
If he wants people to give him a chance, he should go to the polls and ask them to do just that.
Until then, he should be treated like the impostor that he is.
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Re: Boris
That sounds a lot like when May took over, then she went and won an election and still wasn't wanted....JohnMcGreal wrote:Give him a chance? You're talking as if we've had any choice in the matter. The reality is he's been foisted on the country by a handful of daft old bats in the home counties.
If he wants people to give him a chance, he should go to the polls and ask them to do just that.
Until then, he should be treated like the impostor that he is.
Just say what you're really thinking, Boris wouldn't get a chance from some folk even if he did win an election.
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Re: Boris
He'll always be a sack of **** regardless, but if he won a majority in a GE then he would at least be a sack of **** with some democratic legitimacy.GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:That sounds a lot like when May took over, then she went and won an election and still wasn't wanted....
Just say what you're really thinking, Boris wouldn't get a chance from some folk even if he did win an election.
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Re: Boris
That definitely sounds like you'd give him a chance then
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Re: Boris
Boris pledging money for the deprived towns is very similar to when Theresa May was appointed and stood on the steps of Downing Street pledging to help the JAM'S (Just About Managing).
Re: Boris
Only parliament can decide if there is to be an early election, not Boris Johnson.JohnMcGreal wrote:Give him a chance? You're talking as if we've had any choice in the matter. The reality is he's been foisted on the country by a handful of daft old bats in the home counties.
If he wants people to give him a chance, he should go to the polls and ask them to do just that.
Until then, he should be treated like the impostor that he is.
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Re: Boris
I also doubt they were German.........Imploding Turtle wrote:I think we'd all agree that Chamberlain was kinda foolish. Although i doubt the people who put him in power were all that intelligent.
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Re: Boris
Better Boris than that tw4t Corbyn.JohnMcGreal wrote:Give him a chance? You're talking as if we've had any choice in the matter. The reality is he's been foisted on the country by a handful of daft old bats in the home counties.
If he wants people to give him a chance, he should go to the polls and ask them to do just that.
Until then, he should be treated like the impostor that he is.
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Re: Boris
We will never know if she'd done what she promised, let's hope he does.kentonclaret wrote:Boris pledging money for the deprived towns is very similar to when Theresa May was appointed and stood on the steps of Downing Street pledging to help the JAM'S (Just About Managing).
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Re: Boris
Why not give Corbyn a chance? It’s all too easy to write someone off without seeing what they can do.BennyD wrote:Better Boris than that tw4t Corbyn.
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Re: Boris
Why not give Jeremy a chance? It’s all too easy to write someone off without seeing what they can do. Churchill was written off as a politician in 1916 but made a spectacular comeback and is now regarded as one of, if not the best, Prime Ministers of all time. Time will tell.BennyD wrote:Better Boris than that tw4t Corbyn.
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Re: Boris
We were engaged in a major global conflict in 1940 and didn't really have time to start holding elections. You cannot compare Churchill becoming PM in 1940 to Johnson becoming PM today. The context is completely different.Sproggy wrote:Churchill didn't win a GE when he became PM in 1940. Presumably you're equally angry about that lack of legitimacy?
Also, Churchill didn't become PM via a GE, but his party did at least command a working majority in parliament. He was the PM of a legitimate government. Whereas Johnson is PM of a government with virtually no working majority, and it's almost as illegitimate as he is. Again, there is simply no comparison between the two cases.
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Re: Boris
Give Jeremy a chance? Jesus Christ! He is a protester, nothing more nothing less!
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Re: Boris
If it has escaped your limited attention, Corbin has been the (puppet) leader of the Labour Party for some time. Fortunately, we will, most probably, never have to experience his advanced level of ineptness in the UK’s highest political office.JohnMcGreal wrote:Why not give Jeremy a chance? It’s all too easy to write someone off without seeing what they can do. Churchill was written off as a politician in 1916 but made a spectacular comeback and is now regarded as one of, if not the best, Prime Ministers of all time. Time will tell.
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Re: Boris
Oh, and what about Gordon Brown? Did he win an election? I’m not particularly a Boris fan but claims from the left that he has no mandate to serve as PM is a bit rich.
Re: Boris
And James Callaghan so that's 2 each.PaintYorkClaretnBlue wrote:Oh, and what about Gordon Brown? Did he win an election? I’m not particularly a Boris fan but claims from the left that he has no mandate to serve as PM is a bit rich.
Edit, I forgot Macmillan and Major.
Last edited by cbx750 on Sat Jul 27, 2019 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Boris
I was one of the 60,000 daft old bats who voted for him.JohnMcGreal wrote:Give him a chance? You're talking as if we've had any choice in the matter. The reality is he's been foisted on the country by a handful of daft old bats in the home counties.
If he reverses austerity, employs loads more coppers, funds underfunded schools up to the average, and gets high speed rail building in the north (all very likely if he has a year or more in the job) then he'll have done the people of Burnley and areas like it a huge service. I don't expect thanks (being a daft old bat) but I would feel some sense of pride for making the right decision. Yes, of course he has to deliver before we praise him.
Besides, it is far from unusual to have a PM foisted on the country. As said above, for Labour Callaghan and Brown were. For the Tories Macmillan and Major both were. It's normal for a new PM to be either like this or for an opposition party to win an election.
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Re: Boris
But I’m not the one complaining, and I didn’t when Brown was PM.cbx750 wrote:And James Callaghan so that's 2 each.
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Re: Boris
We already covered that the other day. Brown essentially took over seamlessly from Blair and kept most of the cabinet, along with Blair's policies. I'm not saying that he had a mandate from the people, but the party did, and although there was a change of leader, there was no real change of direction.PaintYorkClaretnBlue wrote:Oh, and what about Gordon Brown? Did he win an election? I’m not particularly a Boris fan but claims from the left that he has no mandate to serve as PM is a bit rich.
It's totally different with Johnson and his 17 cabinet changes.It's clearly a new direction - an internal coup within the Tory Party that gives us a new PM, cabinet and policies.
Oh, and let's not forget of course, that when Brown took over, Johnson as one of the loudest voices questioning his legitimacy and demanding a GE!
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Re: Boris
Nor did he fill the cabinet with inexperienced, talentless, sycophants carved in his own image to form an ultra-right-wing executive.Sproggy wrote:Churchill didn't win a GE when he became PM in 1940. Presumably you're equally angry about that lack of legitimacy?
In order to bring the country together Churchill put together a cabinet of talents from across the parties, including the Leader of the Opposition - Attlee - as Deputy Prime Minister.
As it happens a cross-party coalition may well turn out to be the way forward if Johnson fails to deliver Brexit on Oct 31st. It's quite possibly the only other alternative to a General Election that no party really and truly wants.
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Re: Boris
PaintYorkClaretnBlue wrote:Oh, and what about Gordon Brown? Did he win an election? I’m not particularly a Boris fan but claims from the left that he has no mandate to serve as PM is a bit rich.
Theresa May didn't even have a mandate after the last election. She had to buy one by bribing the DUP.
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Re: Boris
WhooshPaintYorkClaretnBlue wrote:Give Jeremy a chance? Jesus Christ! He is a protester, nothing more nothing less!
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Re: Boris
Come on Damo. Words won’t unite people. Actions do.Damo wrote:Looking around at opinions online, it seems like Boris is starting to unite the people (apart from the far left moonbats) of the country
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Re: Boris
Remember when this was called Project Fear™?
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/0 ... rn-direct/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/0 ... rn-direct/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Boris
This is what propaganda looks like.
Torybot wrote:Looking around at opinions online, it seems like Boris is starting to unite the people (apart from the far left moonbats) of the country
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Re: Boris
In the interests of uniting the country and bringing both right and left together, might I suggest that Johnson will need Dianne Abbott in charge of the numbers as Chancellor of the Exchequer if he's going to pay for all that in 12 months whilst also funding a "no deal" brexit.CrosspoolClarets wrote:I was one of the 60,000 daft old bats who voted for him.
If he reverses austerity, employs loads more coppers, funds underfunded schools up to the average, and gets high speed rail building in the north (all very likely if he has a year or more in the job) then he'll have done the people of Burnley and areas like it a huge service.
.
Good luck!
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Re: Boris
nil_desperandum wrote:In the interests of uniting the country and bringing both right and left together, might I suggest that Johnson will need Dianne Abbott in charge of the numbers as Chancellor of the Exchequer if he's going to pay for all that in 12 months whilst also funding a "no deal" brexit.
Good luck!
Hey, maybe he'll increase taxes on the people who can afford it the most.
https://i.imgur.com/dT30Rzt.png" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Boris
Don’t get me started on Theresa May! If she was on fire and I had a glass of water I’d drink it!!Imploding Turtle wrote:Theresa May didn't even have a mandate after the last election. She had to buy one by bribing the DUP.
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Re: Boris
Labour had lost their overall majority by the time Callaghan took over from Wilson in April 1976, they were kept in power for over 3 years by a combination of Liberal, SNP and Welsh Nationalist votes , and the horse-trading that went with it ..Imploding Turtle wrote:Theresa May didn't even have a mandate after the last election. She had to buy one by bribing the DUP.
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Re: Boris
Double spaces after full stops?Imploding Turtle wrote:Priorities
At least we know how he will be funding the police, by abolishing modern computers in the government and civil service and using typewriters instead.
Re: Boris
Don't modern computers have full stops and space bars? Mine must be an old-fashioned one, then.SingaporeClarets wrote:Double spaces after full stops?
At least we know how he will be funding the police, by abolishing modern computers in the government and civil service and using typewriters instead.
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Re: Boris
Rees-Mogg has purposely leaked this to the press to draw attention to himself, and quite possibly to deflect from anything more serious he or his chums might get up to in government. He purposely cultivates this Edwardian persona for his own political gain, likely working under the assumption that 'all publicity is good publicity'. He's been doing it for years and people fall for it every time. BoJo did a similar trick, albeit more Jeeves and Wooster, with his various Have I Got News for You appearances.
Unless you're pulling in a six figure income and have a substantial investment portfolio, voting for this lot is to be played for a fool.
Unless you're pulling in a six figure income and have a substantial investment portfolio, voting for this lot is to be played for a fool.
https://www.lrb.co.uk/v41/n15/james-meek/the-two-jacobs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;James Meek, 'The Two Jacobs' wrote:In 2007, a few years before Jacob Rees-Mogg became, as the Labour MP Jack Dromey put it, ‘the honourable member for Downton Abbey’, his alter ego Jacob Rees-Mogg set up Somerset Capital Management with two friends, Dominic Johnson and Edward Robertson. Since its foundation SCM, which has a handful of staff in London and Singapore and contracts out most of its back-office functions, has grown to the point where it claims to manage more than $7 billion of other people’s money. Rees-Mogg was comfortably off before, had worked in other people’s fund management firms, came from a prosperous family and attended Eton – his father was editor of the Times – but his share in the fees SCM charges has made him wealthy. In the world of global fund managers, which at the top level has people who actually own, as opposed to manage, billions of dollars in assets, Rees-Mogg is one of the petty rich, but relative to the world as a whole, he’s done very well. Based on his ownership of at least 15 per cent of SCM, and its declared profits in the last two years of £47 million, Channel 4’s Dispatches calculated he would have made £7 million from the firm since the referendum. Rees-Mogg wouldn’t confirm the amount to Dispatches, and Dominic Johnson told the finance news agency Citywire that the figure was inaccurate, but it doesn’t seem implausible. As well as a share of profits Rees-Mogg receives part of a ‘management charge’ that Somerset Capital Management the limited liability partnership – the main firm managing other people’s money – pays each year to Somerset Capital Management the limited company, which in turn is owned by three other limited companies, which in turn are owned by the three founding partners. That £47 million in profits was only paid out after the three founders’ limited company got almost £17 million in fees. To make matters more complicated Somerset Capital Management Ltd is also a partner in Somerset Capital Management the partnership, and SCM has an opaque (to the public) relationship with a vehicle in the Caribbean tax haven of the Cayman Islands, Somerset Capital Management (Cayman) Ltd, owned by Rees-Mogg, Johnson and Robertson. This is all perfectly legal, and one might assume it relates to the entirely legal practice of moving money between jurisdictions in order to pay as little tax as possible, although when I put this to Rees-Mogg in an email, he replied: ‘As I have pointed out before, the Cayman entity does not make any profits and provides no tax advantage to Somerset Capital Management. Furthermore, there is no tax benefit to me as a United Kingdom taxpayer from any of our structures.’
...
SCM, and hundreds of fund management firms like it, exist because institutions, families and individuals have wealth which they want to turn into lasting power. An individual may want to secure the power to be looked after when he no longer has the power to look after himself, for instance by investing in a pension. A first-generation entrepreneur may want to transmit power to a future dynasty so that her descendants don’t have to work as hard as she did. A trust looking after a charitable bequest may want to preserve, indefinitely, the power to support a cause, or back a newspaper, or run medical research labs. Or the already rich might simply want to stay that way. What SCM does, along with many other emerging market funds just like it, is to protect other people’s money, money that is liable to spoil, or diminish, if simply left in a bank or in precious metal and jewels in a vault. The fund invests it on the owners’ behalf by buying shares in companies around the world that its specialists – including, until he became more hands-off in 2010, Rees-Mogg – deem likely to become more valuable and pay out good dividends. The aim is for the original capital to grow enough to beat inflation and sooner or later provide an excess that can be creamed off and turned into ready money for the client, while still leaving enough for SCM’s fee. (The reason fund managers become so stonkingly rich is that they charge a percentage, rather than a flat fee, the implicit assumption being that £1 million is orders of magnitude more difficult to invest wisely than £10,000. But unlike other percentage-based arrangements, such as house sales or the talent business, in this case the fund manager keeps on getting his percentage year after year, long after an investment is made, even if the investment shrinks.)
The founders of SCM were able to kick-start their partnership thanks to clients who knew them from their previous jobs in fund management. The firm was initially incubated within the hedge fund run by their pro-Brexit friend Crispin Odey, the ex-son-in-law of Rupert Murdoch. Thanks to those earlier contacts it picked up a mandate to manage money for the $5 billion Alfred I Dupont Testamentary Trust, set up in 1935 with a bequest from the eponymous gunpowder maker to support the Nemours network of children’s hospitals in the US. It was entrusted with capital from the Superannuation Investments Corporation of Canada, responsible for the pensions pot of public employees in the province of Manitoba. In 2014 SCM picked up one of its biggest clients, the State Board of Administration of Florida, which does the same job in the Sunshine State. The money SCM manages for past and present Florida state employees is a drop in the ocean of the SBA’s $200 billion assets, but for SCM, it’s huge – $940 million. SCM manages or has managed money for Prince Charles, the Dunhill Medical Trust, the Foyle Foundation (set up by the family behind Foyles bookshops), the Health Foundation and the Institution of Civil Engineers.
More than half the money SCM invests goes to five countries: India, Russia, South Korea, China and Taiwan. One per cent is invested in Britain. These are the top ten holdings in SCM’s biggest sub-fund, Somerset Emerging Markets Dividend Growth: SK Hynix, a Korean chip maker; Sberbank, the Russian part of the former Soviet state savings bank, now privatised; Compañía de Cervecerías Unidas, Chile’s largest brewer; Kweichow Moutai, Chinese distillers of a luxury sorghum spirit favoured for gifts and hospitality by Communist Party officials; OTP, a privatised Hungarian savings bank; Housing Development Finance Corporation, an Indian financial conglomerate; the giant Korean multinational Samsung; the Indian car and motorbike maker Maruti Suzuki, a subsidiary of Suzuki of Japan; the Russian supermarket and convenience store chain X5 Retail, listed in both London and Moscow; and AmBev, a Brazilian brewer that belongs to a larger Belgian-based global booze empire called AnheuserBusch InBev.