Boris

[martin_p]

This whole thing is about having freedom to be ourselves, to improve our culture, have our own laws, to have a better balanced economy, to have politicians who have learned to be independant minded not just subservient technocrats.

So using that list, what specifically has being in the EU stopped us doing? Note - this question isn’t rhetorical.

[Spijed]

The Conservative will be pretty much wiped out in Scotland at the next election, losing all their 13 seats very easily:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4Zk7YyniFo" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Stalbansclaret]

I don't usually post on any Brexit thread on here but I'm utterly baffled by Crosspool Claret thinking that leaving the EU will enable us to "improve our culture". I'd really welcome an explanation of what this is envisaged to look like as whenever I visit Europe I'm generally struck by generally how much more civilised their culture and lifestyle is than ours. Britain has it's strengths and is a great country NOW within the EU but goodness knows how becoming more isolated from the rest of Europe improves anything in this day and age.

[Imploding Turtle]

I don't usually post on any Brexit thread on here but I'm utterly baffled by Crosspool Claret thinking that leaving the EU will enable us to "improve our culture". I'd really welcome an explanation of what this is envisaged to look like as whenever I visit Europe I'm generally struck by generally how much more civilised their culture and lifestyle is than ours. Britain has it's strengths and is a great country NOW within the EU but goodness knows how becoming more isolated from the rest of Europe improves anything in this day and age.

I think we can probably make an accurate guess as to what he means with "improve our culture".

[GodIsADeeJay81]

The manifesto specifically said "against Scotland's will".

No one really needs to point that out though, the way you mention it sometimes people would think it's one of the greatest travesties of recent times

[Imploding Turtle]

No one really needs to point that out though, the way you mention it sometimes people would think it's one of the greatest travesties of recent times

What the **** you on about? I'm making it clear to you that it leaving the EU was cited in the manifesto as a cause for a referendum only if Scotland was opposed to leaving the EU. I'm trying to getting through your thick skull that if Scotland had voted to leave the EU then leaving the EU wouldn't give the SNP cause for a referendum on independence.

"against Scotland's will" is an important caveat in the manifesto pledge you keep missing out. Presumably because it doesn't sit well with your anti-SNP agenda, or your determination to portray Scotland as being unreasonably uppity.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Careful, you'll lose your dummy.

We all know it's against their will, you remind of that all the time and like I said the way you mention it, some would think it's the greatest travesty of recent times.

Put your dummy back in and go have a nap before you start crying

Ps, if it wasn't Brexit they'd find another reason to have a crack at leaving the UK.

[Stalbansclaret]

I think we can probably make an accurate guess as to what he means with "improve our culture".

Aaaah...I seeeeeeeeee

[Erasmus]

Well I asked my question and I got a bit of an answer: first of all 'sovereignty' and avoiding possible future problems that will afflict us if we are in the EU.

Then a list consisting of freedom, improving our culture, making our own laws, having a more balanced economy and being more independent-minded.

But these are all such nebulous concepts that I find it hard to apply them to the lives of the people of the country. Have we ever been harmed by our perceived lack of sovereignty (as the Germans would have harmed us in the war)?

The imagined future problems like an EU army don't sound at all realistic, a bit of project fear going on there.

And then I don't think I will be any more free after leaving. As individuals we are probably as free as we can be. Nothing will change to bring people any more freedom. Improving our culture? I just don't get that at all, it seems a quite meaningless assertion as does becoming more independent-minded. I just can't see how leaving the EU will make me any more or less independent-minded. And a more balanced economy? Are economists saying that leaving the EU will improve our economy?

All in all, the gains being offered in exchange for wrecking our economy seem to add up to the best part of nothing. If we ruin the economy, real people will really suffer. And what we are being offered in return seems just a load of flimsy, romantic, idealistic nothingness.

It all seems so stupid. Isn't there anything more?

[GodIsADeeJay81]

How wrecked are we talking?
Genuine question, because we have recessions on a semi regular basis.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

independant minded

The first step to becoming independent is learning how to spell it properly.

Remember, you may think you sound authoritative and credible when you ceaselessly bang-on on some message board but if you can't spell the grand political ideas you present, you don't sound credible at all...

You sound stupid.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

How wrecked are we talking?
Genuine question, because we have recessions on a semi regular basis.

Yep, let's shrug our shoulders, tighten our belts and get on with it

We'll be the greatest country in the world in 2050.

[Damo]

After his trips to Scotland and Wales this week, it's great that we finally have a prime minister we can all get behind. It's great to see Boris uniting the nation

[TVC15]

Aye - the welsh and Scottish people I saw were definitely all united in telling Boris to f-uck off.

[evensteadiereddie]

After his trips to Scotland and Wales this week, it's great that we finally have a prime minister we can all get behind. It's great to see Boris uniting the nation

Christ Almighty - another pi$$head.

[mkmel]

After his trips to Scotland and Wales this week, it's great that we finally have a prime minister we can all get behind. It's great to see Boris uniting the nation

Shouldn't he first be uniting the Tory Party?

[keith1879]

Well I asked my question and I got a bit of an answer: first of all 'sovereignty' and avoiding possible future problems that will afflict us if we are in the EU.

Then a list consisting of freedom, improving our culture, making our own laws, having a more balanced economy and being more independent-minded.

But these are all such nebulous concepts that I find it hard to apply them to the lives of the people of the country. Have we ever been harmed by our perceived lack of sovereignty (as the Germans would have harmed us in the war)?

The imagined future problems like an EU army don't sound at all realistic, a bit of project fear going on there.

And then I don't think I will be any more free after leaving. As individuals we are probably as free as we can be. Nothing will change to bring people any more freedom. Improving our culture? I just don't get that at all, it seems a quite meaningless assertion as does becoming more independent-minded. I just can't see how leaving the EU will make me any more or less independent-minded. And a more balanced economy? Are economists saying that leaving the EU will improve our economy?

All in all, the gains being offered in exchange for wrecking our economy seem to add up to the best part of nothing. If we ruin the economy, real people will really suffer. And what we are being offered in return seems just a load of flimsy, romantic, idealistic nothingness.

It all seems so stupid. Isn't there anything more?

There are plenty of problems affecting us in the UK today ....but in my view they have nothing at all to do with being in the EU. The UK appears to be (AS A WHOLE) fairly prosperous, fairly stable and fairly peaceful. Dig down however and within the country we have appalling problems caused I believe by the ever increasing inequality between rich and poor. I am in no way a communist but the conservatives (whom I once supported) have long ago ceased to have any relevance to the lives of ordinary people ...they just try and convince enough people to vote for them when election time comes round. Unfortunately you can say the same of the labour party at present. My only real hope now from this unholy mess is that the conservatives get trashed beyond repair and that we get a proper representative voting system ...ie proportional. I have just returned from Italy which has the reputation in the Daily Mail of being an unstable basket case of a country where nothng gets done properly. It all looked pretty good to me. If leaving the EU is going to be so great for Joe Bloggs in his council flat then how is it that all the principle cheerleaders for it are rich eton/oxbridge educated chinless gits or the clinically insane (of whom some post on this forum)?

[dsr]

I have just returned from Italy which has the reputation in the Daily Mail of being an unstable basket case of a country where nothng gets done properly. It all looked pretty good to me.

I'm surprised you don't see 35% youth unemployment as a problem. Not that it's their own politicians fault, particularly; it's a function of being in the Euro when their economy doesn't match the central banker countries.

[android]

It says it all about our present political situation that I have posted a serious piece of investigative journalism and the contributors to this thread are more interested in memes and bickering. You would all do well to read more and write less.

Hello HBH. I read the "investigative journalism" you linked in post 700 and found it interesting. I was going to let it pass but as you are looking for comment...

The extract you quoted is an attempt at describing the fund management business and particularly the business that Rees Mogg part owns. The author makes a decent fist of it, although he doesn't seem to know what to do with the information. The thrust of the article is about Faragism, which is not a term I have heard before. I can't see JRM being too impressed by being described as a Faragist and I can't see the term catching on.

The most common mistake when describing the fund management business is to confuse the fund manager (the business owned by JRM) and the funds they manage (his clients money). The author seems to get the gist of it and he says that 99% of the funds managed by SCM are invested overseas and a majority in emerging markets. It confirms that Brexit is largely irrelevant to the success of his business unless you think that Brexit has a predictable impact on the share price of a Korean micro chip maker or a South American brewer. Brexit is just one uncertainty in a world of uncertainties and JRM's firm will look to make money whether Brexit happens or not.

The author can't help himself from repeating ludicrous attempts at muck raking such as Dispatches quote that JRM had made £7m from his firm "since the referendum". How much have the owners of HSBS or Ford Motors made "since the referendum"? All he is really saying is that SCM did not cease trading on 24 June 2016 - they carried on trading and making profits like the vast majority of other profitable businesses in the country - amazing!

JRM wants Brexit because he thinks it is best for the country. By all means say he is deluded - you might be right. But claiming his firm is all set to make windfall profits from Brexit or some such claim is for the birds. You might as well investigate the moon landing being faked.

[CrosspoolClarets]

I don't usually post on any Brexit thread on here but I'm utterly baffled by Crosspool Claret thinking that leaving the EU will enable us to "improve our culture". I'd really welcome an explanation of what this is envisaged to look like as whenever I visit Europe I'm generally struck by generally how much more civilised their culture and lifestyle is than ours. Britain has it's strengths and is a great country NOW within the EU but goodness knows how becoming more isolated from the rest of Europe improves anything in this day and age.

I agree, some countries in Europe have a fantastic culture. I love the extended family culture in Italy, where big family groups spend a lot of time together. I also love the Italians dining culture, 4 course meals with smaller courses, lasting two hours or more.

So yes, the U.K. drifting off into the Atlantic and having even more of a benefit entitlement culture, with high streets full of betting shops and charity shops, grabbing a Macdonalds on the way home from work then sticking Eastenders on. Sounds terrible, and must be avoided.

But I do express bemusement at how generally clever Remain voters cannot see how our culture can be positively transformed by leaving, as long as we have the right leadership. For example, the Brexit vote has already triggered a huge debate about left behind areas, and now funding is set to follow. That started with a group of people finally having a vote that mattered to them, people who feel distant culturally from Westminster let alone Brussels, and who are desperate for locally accountable decision making.

Another cultural element is that I view hyper-liberalism as a perverse stain on society. The EU is a hyper-liberal construct. It then affects the types of politicians here that rise to the top too, a bunch of technocrats obsessed with protectionism and virtue signalling. I’m liberal in the general sense such as equal rights for all under the law, but things like safe spaces at universities and “no platforming” world famous speakers for having right of centre views - that’s going way too far. University culture now is a perfect example of what has gone to the dogs and needs to change. Not directly linked to the EU, but my judgement is that if we don’t leave, none of it will change.

[Spijed]

I agree, some countries in Europe have a fantastic culture. I love the extended family culture in Italy, where big family groups spend a lot of time together. I also love the Italians dining culture, 4 course meals with smaller courses, lasting two hours or more.

So yes, the U.K. drifting off into the Atlantic and having even more of a benefit entitlement culture, with high streets full of betting shops and charity shops, grabbing a Macdonalds on the way home from work then sticking Eastenders on. Sounds terrible, and must be avoided.

But I do express bemusement at how generally clever Remain voters cannot see how our culture can be positively transformed by leaving, as long as we have the right leadership. For example, the Brexit vote has already triggered a huge debate about left behind areas, and now funding is set to follow. That started with a group of people finally having a vote that mattered to them, people who feel distant culturally from Westminster let alone Brussels, and who are desperate for locally accountable decision making.

Another cultural element is that I view hyper-liberalism as a perverse stain on society. The EU is a hyper-liberal construct. It then affects the types of politicians here that rise to the top too, a bunch of technocrats obsessed with protectionism and virtue signalling. I’m liberal in the general sense such as equal rights for all under the law, but things like safe spaces at universities and “no platforming” world famous speakers for having right of centre views - that’s going way too far. University culture now is a perfect example of what has gone to the dogs and needs to change. Not directly linked to the EU, but my judgement is that if we don’t leave, none of it will change.

Funding set to follow in left behind areas?

Is that why Boris is being booed in those areas?

[dsr]

Funding set to follow in left behind areas?

Is that why Boris is being booed in those areas?

Well, obviously the Scots have higher things in mind than money. We're planning to leave a political union to whom we sell 8% of our GNP, and the Brexiters are getting all sorts of stick for wrecking the economy. And yet the Scots are planning to leave a political union to whom they sell 19% of their GNP, and they propose to build a big wall under EU rules to makes those exports physically more difficult as well as politically, and they're getting admiration from the same people who despise the Brexiters. How odd.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Ah but the Scots are breaking free from the brutal and oppressive regime that runs in Westminster, that's why they should be lauded for wanting their independence.

[aggi]

For example, the Brexit vote has already triggered a huge debate about left behind areas, and now funding is set to follow.

Has it really? It's triggered some debate but it has generally been overwhelmed by Brexit, and any political progress has certainly been overwhelmed by Brexit.

There have been plenty of promises of funding, look at all of the Northern Powerhouse stuff. Obviously, for whatever reason (not historical precedent I assume), you believe that Johnson is to be trusted and this funding will actually happen and progress will be made but personally I can't say I've seen much of a real strategy to fix those left behind areas.

[Imploding Turtle]

Well, obviously the Scots have higher things in mind than money. We're planning to leave a political union to whom we sell 8% of our GNP, and the Brexiters are getting all sorts of stick for wrecking the economy. And yet the Scots are planning to leave a political union to whom they sell 19% of their GNP, and they propose to build a big wall under EU rules to makes those exports physically more difficult as well as politically, and they're getting admiration from the same people who despise the Brexiters. How odd.

The reasons for Scotland wanting to leave the UK are not economic ones, they're political. Scotland and England have opposing ideologies, yet it's England's ideology that is dominant and Scotland, no matter how much they vote against it, continue to have to be ruled by England's increasingly neoliberal right-wing ideology.

But nice try.

[claretonthecoast1882]

The reasons for Scotland wanting to leave the UK are not economic ones, they're political. Scotland and England have opposing ideologies, yet it's England's ideology that is dominant and Scotland, no matter how much they vote against it, continue to have to be ruled by England's increasingly neoliberal right-wing ideology.

But nice try.

When you say the reasons for Scotland ? You don't mean the country do you seen as they voted no. Do you just mean the odious odd looking one and her party

[Imploding Turtle]

They're a good party. They actually want to do good for the people and not just corporations. People like to attack them with "Sturgeon looks like Jimmy Krankie" or "they're nationalists and all nationalists are bad", but it'a tough to argue against their policies without making yourself look silly which is why, I think, most of their critics don't.
If I lived in Scotland i'd be a member of their party.

Here's my point being supported by someone incapable of making any coherent argument, and so who doesn't even try.

When you say the reasons for Scotland ? You don't mean the country do you seen as they voted no. Do you just mean the odious odd looking one and her party

[claretonthecoast1882]

Here's my point being supported by someone incapable of making any coherent argument, and so who doesn't even try.

No answer then ok

[dsr]

The reasons for Scotland wanting to leave the UK are not economic ones, they're political. Scotland and England have opposing ideologies, yet it's England's ideology that is dominant and Scotland, no matter how much they vote against it, continue to have to be ruled by England's increasingly neoliberal right-wing ideology.

But nice try.

Exactly. It's the same with the Brexit Party as it is with the SNP - the reasons for leaving are political, not economic. Which is why there is no understanding between EU Remainers, who want to stay purely for economic reasons, and Brexiters, who want to leave for political reasons.

[Foshiznik]

Ah but the Scots are breaking free from the brutal and oppressive regime that runs in Westminster, that's why they should be lauded for wanting their independence.

I know Boris is a bit of a wet quilt, but calling the Tories brutal and oppressive like they are the UK branch of the Khmer Rouge is a bit OTT.

[Stalbansclaret]

For example, the Brexit vote has already triggered a huge debate about left behind areas, and now funding is set to follow. That started with a group of people finally having a vote that mattered to them, people who feel distant culturally from Westminster let alone Brussels, and who are desperate for locally accountable decision making.

Another cultural element is that I view hyper-liberalism as a perverse stain on society. The EU is a hyper-liberal construct. It then affects the types of politicians here that rise to the top too, a bunch of technocrats obsessed with protectionism and virtue signalling. I’m liberal in the general sense such as equal rights for all under the law, but things like safe spaces at universities and “no platforming” world famous speakers for having right of centre views - that’s going way too far. University culture now is a perfect example of what has gone to the dogs and needs to change. Not directly linked to the EU, but my judgement is that if we don’t leave, none of it will change.

I would say that the EU has provided very significant funding for left behind areas in the UK. More than a Westminster public-schoolboy packed Government would have been inclined to do anyway. I have spent significant time in South Wales with work over the past few years and towns like Ebbw Vale are fairly festooned with signage indicating major EU development fund contribution to significant improvements.In the case of that particular town the transformation of the old steelworks site into an education, leisure and business area. Only for a majority of the populace to vote "leave" seemingly on the back of a ridiculous fear of immigrant bogey-men and £350M pw for the NHS.

There are aspects of the PC "snowflake" culture I dislike also but as you say this is "Not directly linked to the EU".

There are other bad aspects of modern culture where the EU has shown vastly more appetite to improve things than the UK alone ever has...for instance their willingness to take on, rather than just bend-over in front of, large Tech businesses such as Google, Amazon, Apple etc when it comes to their tax-avoidance strategies and sloppy data-protection.

I also, very importantly, prefer my culture to be free of jingoism, xenophobia and war and being in the EU seems to me to be a better bet in these respects.

[Erasmus]

Crosspool, each time you post something the benefits of leaving seem less and less substantial. There will be no extra funding for the north if the economy is wrecked, regardless of any debates that might be happening. And this idea of improving culture away from some form of 'liberalism' is so far fetched. Is it really worth wrecking the economy in exchange for these vague, intangible concepts?

[JohnMcGreal]

Exactly. It's the same with the Brexit Party as it is with the SNP - the reasons for leaving are political, not economic. Which is why there is no understanding between EU Remainers, who want to stay purely for economic reasons, and Brexiters, who want to leave for political reasons.

I think you'll struggle to find many remainers who want to remain in the EU purely for economic reasons.

For me, the political benefits of full membership are just as important as the economic benefits.

Full EU membership is far and away the best thing for this country, and it always has been.

[Fenwick]

What are the political benefits?

[Wile E Coyote]

stop calling the lying **** Boris, don't give the **** an amicable first name reference when it wasn't applicable elsewhere.he is no more than loathsome slime at best.

[willsclarets]

What are the political benefits?

The problem with this debate and others spanning the western world, is that the political and economic benefits (or otherwise) are completely separate and less powerful than identity and ideology. It's the reason we have such derision and a total lack of meaningful debate. For most left leaning liberals a sense of inclusion, a dislike for far right policy and Nigel Farage claiming this as "our independence day" is far more powerful to a voter than the complicated policitcal intricacies of leaving the European Union. You will find the reverse is true for someone with sensibilities leaning to the right.

I'm not saying this is true of everyone at all, but more and more the actual manifesto is irrelevant. The proof in that particular pudding is that the leave campaign didn't actually have a manifesto, and didn't need one.

[nil_desperandum]

So in today's news Johnson's Chancellor has announced another 2.1 BILLION to ease traffic congestion in Kent and tackle queues created by delays at the borders, to stockpile medicines to ensure continued supplies, and on a national programme to help businesses in the event of his "no deal" brexit.
That's on top of the 4.2 BILLION that Hammond spent on "brexit preparations".
This of course is the "no deal" brexit - the chances of which our PM described as "vanishingly small" only 2 days ago in Wales.
Conservative peer Baroness Altmann, a former pensions minister, said: "This is huge amounts of taxpayers' money that is being spent on something the government itself has said will be hugely damaging to the British economy and to the British way of life."

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49183324" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[android]

Following the peoples vote in 2016, Parliament has enacted law that says we leave the EU on 31 October 2019. Parliament has three times rejected the plan for us to leave in an orderly fashion. But you think the government should do nothing to prepare for our departure? Je ne comprends pas!

[nil_desperandum]

Following the peoples vote in 2016, Parliament has enacted law that says we leave the EU on 31 October 2019. Parliament has three times rejected the plan for us to leave in an orderly fashion. But you think the government should do nothing to prepare for our departure? Je ne comprends pas!

If it was planning for a bright positive future then fair enough, but this money is effectively to pay for emergency measures to try to alleviate some of the serious problems that our own government acknowledges we will be faced with. The Conservative Baroness is clear about this.
But you've missed - I think - the main point I was making. Why spend all this money on something that only 2 days ago the PM said is a "vanishingly small" possibility?
Where's the clarity of thinking/ strategy? And why have we had to endure years of austerity when we appear to have so much money to waste?

[dsr]

But you've missed - I think - the main point I was making. Why spend all this money on something that only 2 days ago the PM said is a "vanishingly small" possibility?

Why insure your house?

At least with this spending, you get the infrastructure anyway. Imports from Dover have problems now and then, even in the EU.

[nil_desperandum]

Why insure your house?
.

If I deliberately set fire to my house or trash it in some other way then my insurance is invalidated, so not a very good analogy I'm afraid.
Your 2nd point has more validity, but why haven't we had this money for schools, essential services etc? Is this what we've been saving for?

[android]

I think insurance is a good analogy. It is easy to criticise but in the circumstances the government would be negligent if they did not prepare. The circumstances are that Parliament is in favour of leaving the EU (not really but that is the law they have enacted) but has rejected the orderly withdrawal agreement. No choice but to prepare for all eventualities - just like the EU has done apparently (and sensibly).

[nil_desperandum]

I think insurance is a good analogy. It is easy to criticise but in the circumstances the government would be negligent if they did not prepare.

Well I must have got something wrong. I always thought that you took out insurance to protect you against something bad happening beyond your control, whereas over a long period of time we've been told by our new PM and his team that brexit is good.
Also, as I pointed out, you don't / can't normally insure against something that you can influence or have control of.

[martin_p]

I think insurance is a good analogy. It is easy to criticise but in the circumstances the government would be negligent if they did not prepare. The circumstances are that Parliament is in favour of leaving the EU (not really but that is the law they have enacted) but has rejected the orderly withdrawal agreement. No choice but to prepare for all eventualities - just like the EU has done apparently (and sensibly).

I’ve got building and contents insurance of my house but I’m pretty sure they won’t pay out if I deliberately burn it down.

[dsr]

Well I must have got something wrong. I always thought that you took out insurance to protect you against something bad happening beyond your control, whereas over a long period of time we've been told by our new PM and his team that brexit is good.
Also, as I pointed out, you don't / can't normally insure against something that you can influence or have control of.

Obviously we can give the EU this ridiculous deal that every party in the country has rejected, if that's what you mean by being in control. But no-one thinks it's a good idea, so why keep going on about it? And apart from that, we do not have control over whether we leave with a deal or without one - apart, of course, from the nonsensical suggestions (which we have heard so often) that the referendum result should be ignored by government because that's not what democracy is about.

Good things can cost money, you know. Don't assume that just because something costs money, it must be bad.

[Erasmus]

Dsr, can you explain what this 'good thing' is that is going to cost us so much, and how it will benefit the people of the country?

[android]

I reckon you will be covered Martin if a bunch of anti-democratic MPs burn your house down. I can do silly too!

I thought nil was asking for a serious answer. As I understand it government is responsible for spending and has been instructed by the people and parliament to leave the EU. Parliament not the government is in control of how we leave but unfortunately has no idea how it wants to do it (mainly because contrary to its own instruction it doesn't actually want to leave just to add to the confusion). In these circumstances the government is not entirely in control of proceedings (especially as the EU have a say!) and so - in case it has escaped your notice - leaving without a deal is a real possibility, for which the government would be incredibly negligent not to make preparations. It's not that difficult surely if you can set aside the point scoring for a moment. You can still lament the circumstances that brought us to this place and the possible waste of money.

[Devils_Advocate]

Ringo wont be happy with this news. I recall he was very upset around parliament earmarking money as contingency planning for potentially having to take part in the EU elections.

Wonder if he'll be quite as angry about this current govt "stitch up" to bypass any genuine attempts to avoid a No Deal Brexit

[dsr]

Dsr, can you explain what this 'good thing' is that is going to cost us so much, and how it will benefit the people of the country?

The "good thing" is that the referendum result will finally be implemented, and it will benefit the people of this country because it will show that democracy is still alive and the government is there to serve the people, not vice versa.

Obviously I wanted us to leave the EU all along and IMO it will be good when we do. But there's an even bigger principle about democracy here. And even if I thought it was a stupid decision to leave the EU, I would still think it more important that the people be allowed to make stupid decisions and that no-one has the right to overturn the people's decision - because then, that's not democracy any more.

[nil_desperandum]

Obviously we can give the EU this ridiculous deal that every party in the country has rejected, if that's what you mean by being in control. But no-one thinks it's a good idea, so why keep going on about it? And apart from that, we do not have control over whether we leave with a deal or without one - apart, of course, from the nonsensical suggestions (which we have heard so often) that the referendum result should be ignored by government because that's not what democracy is about.
.

Obviously I'm not referring to May's "deal".
I'm referring to sovereign Parliament being in control of the country's finances and destiny. They have a responsibility to look after the country's best interests and its financial stability / viability. In any normal times no government would risk inflicting damage to the economy and its people. But we live in weird times where a Conservative PM has been elected who is on record as saying F*** business. (This is traditionally the party who support business and enterprise and claim to look after our money).
Equally weirdly, where former miners give a standing ovation to an ultra right winger like Ann Widdecombe in a Yorkshire Working Mens' Club. (This is an area [Yorkshire and Humber] in which - according to government statistics, European Regional Development Fund Projects created 20,149 jobs between 2007 to the end of February 2016. The number of businesses created in this area via this funding in the same period is 2,748.)