Your paragraph of substance above (2nd para) is curious Erasmus (especially in a post which is mainly having a pop at Ringo for a lack of understanding in your eyes).Erasmus wrote:Ringo, I hate to say this but your contributions to this discussion have been very poor. I know the thread has moved away quite a distance from the original topic, but the question of the distinction or identity between socialist and communist ideals is an important one that has both historical and contemporary relevance. Your contributions suggest that you have little understanding of this issue and my advice would be that when you don't have knowledge or understanding of a subject you keep quiet.
This is an important issue because of the accusations of 'Marxism' that are being thrown at the Labour Party because it is more socialist leaning than in the recent past. Always it seems, such slurs (if that is what they are) are not supported by reasoned arguments, and your comments here fall into that category.
If you do support the view that socialism and communism are essentially indistinguishable then please present your arguments to show why you feel this is a valid position. I would be genuinely interested to listen to those arguments and reflect on them. Otherwise, your silly remarks about monkeys and bananas show you up in a very poor light.
Are you really unaware that our Shadow Chancellor is a Marxist? This is not a slur or accusation, as you suggest, it is a fact. He used to be proud of it and has boasted of it as recently as 2016 (presumably without realising he was being recorded). Of course he is now coy about it at times, as he is desperate to be elected. Are you also unaware that one of Corbyn's closest advisers (Murray) is a Communist? Milne is also probably a Communist but perhaps he has been too clever to be tagged. There is little mystery here. The far left takeover of the Labour Party has not been invented by the Daily Mail (or Murdoch or whoever - insert your demon of choice).
Your post 208 was much better when you observed that "Marxists are not and were not socialists, they were using socialism as a first stage towards communism." Worth bearing in mind for would be Labour voters.