The New Labour Leader

dermotdermot · Post by **dermotdermot** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:16 pm

Apparently a two horse race between Rebecca Long Bailey and Laura Pidcock. God help us!

Tricky Trevor · Post by **Tricky Trevor** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:36 pm

Nag, nag.

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:39 pm

Rebecca Wrong Daily

Steve1956 · Post by **Steve1956** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:39 pm

Has Steptoe gone?

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:39 pm

It'll be a re-run of when Corbyn got it - the Momentum stooge will win.

Talent and compentency are not necessary with Momentum backing.

dermotdermot · Post by **dermotdermot** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:43 pm

Well, I never would have thought that!

nil_desperandum · Post by **nil_desperandum** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:46 pm

Since when was there a vacancy?
Am I missing something?

Rowls · Post by **Rowls** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:50 pm

nil_desperandum wrote:Since when was there a vacancy?
Am I missing something?

The vacancy is between Jeremy Corbyn's ears.

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:57 pm

Rowls wrote:The vacancy is between Jeremy Corbyn's ears.

Remind me how well things are going for Boris at the moment.

Darthlaw · Post by **Darthlaw** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:00 pm

Whataboutery alert.

Clarets4me · Post by **Clarets4me** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:02 pm

fidelcastro wrote:Remind me how well things are going for Boris at the moment.

Seems to have a 12 point lead over Labour at present,( Observer poll, today ), and personal approval ratings far better than Mr Corbyn's ....

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:02 pm

Darthlaw wrote:Whataboutery alert.

You know things are bad when people want to focus on the leader of the opposition, rather than the man in 10 Downing Street... or at least you do, if you're a Tory.

Darthlaw · Post by **Darthlaw** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:04 pm

That’s kind of the subject of the thread, though. What were you expecting it to be about, or are you suggesting Boris Johnson could be the new Labour leader?

More importantly, a strong opposition is better for the country. With JC in charge of the opposition, it’s anything but.

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:05 pm

Clarets4me wrote:Seems to have a 12 point lead over Labour at present,( Observer poll, today ), and personal approval ratings far better than Mr Corbyn's ....

Of course he does! Because he's said exactly what rabid Brexiters want to hear, in that we'll leave on October 31st "do or die".

The trouble is, the law isn't on his side and neither is a majority in Parliament.

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:07 pm

Darthlaw wrote:That’s kind of the subject of the thread, though. What were you expecting it to be about, or are you suggesting Boris Johnson could be the new Labour leader?

More importantly, a strong opposition is better for the country. With JC in charge of the opposition, it’s anything but.

It's rather odd that people are speculating on the leadership of the Labour Party when there isn't even a vacancy.

It'd be a bit like me starting a thread on who the next Burnley manager is going to be. Utterly pointless!

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:11 pm

How many elections will Corbyn lose before he gives his job up?

ksrclaret · Post by **ksrclaret** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:12 pm

Laura Pidcock is quite fit, for a Geordie lass.

Whatever our politics, one thing we can all surely agree on is that all Tories are absolutely and utterly minging to look at; seriously, seriously ugly.

jrtod61 · Post by **jrtod61** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:16 pm

Disagree. Penny Mordaunt, for a start.

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:16 pm

ksrclaret wrote:Laura Pidcock is quite fit, for a Geordie lass.

Whatever our politics, one thing we can all surely agree on is that all Tories are absolutely and utterly minging to look at; seriously, seriously ugly.

How dare you!

Nicky Morgan is gorgeous!

Burypaddy · Post by **Burypaddy** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:18 pm

You say corbyn but how many votes will johnson lose in parliament before he gives up his job??? He hasnt won one in seven!!!

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:20 pm

There's more likely to be a new Tory leader before there's a new Labour leader.

Clarets4me · Post by **Clarets4me** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:20 pm

fidelcastro wrote:Of course he does! Because he's said exactly what rabid Brexiters want to hear, in that we'll leave on October 31st "do or die".
The trouble is, the law isn't on his side and neither is a majority in Parliament.

Or it could be that the majority of people regard Corbyn as unsuitable to be our Prime Minister ...

yTib · Post by **yTib** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:22 pm

if labour and corbyn especially had any real conviction to boot the tories out corbyn would fall on his sword and they'd elect a more centrist leader.

alas, this will not happen and johnson will get a majority in the impending election.

never have i been so depressed at the state of politics, not just domestically but worldwide.

johnson or corbyn. sweet baby jesus and the orphans!

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:25 pm

Clarets4me wrote:Or it could be that the majority of people regard Corbyn as unsuitable to be our Prime Minister ...

I hear that a lot, but I can't see a single policy of his that is especially controversial.

The only people that should be worried are the super rich... and that's a good thing in my book!

taffy · Post by **taffy** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:25 pm

He won't win any votes because he doesn't have a majority, the only way he can alter that is to have a general election and that won't happen because corbyn will lose heavily. I have never voted tory in my life but I will this time just to get brexit through, it's costing the country a fortune to have these idiots in parliament blocking everything and arguing the toss.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:25 pm

Clarets4me wrote:Or it could be that the majority of people regard Corbyn as unsuitable to be our Prime Minister ...

A majority think that of Johnson too. Funny how you're ignoring that. Almost like you're doing so because it doesn't fit your preferred argument.

dales_claret · Post by **dales_claret** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:28 pm

Rowls wrote:The vacancy is between Jeremy Corbyn's ears.

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:30 pm

taffy wrote:He won't win any votes because he doesn't have a majority, the only way he can alter that is to have a general election and that won't happen because corbyn will lose heavily. I have never voted tory in my life but I will this time just to get brexit through, it's costing the country a fortune to have these idiots in parliament blocking everything and arguing the toss.

Was Brexit always this important to you?

Even before the referendum?

box_of_frogs · Post by **box_of_frogs** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:30 pm

ksrclaret wrote:Laura Pidcock is quite fit, for a Geordie lass.

Whatever our politics, one thing we can all surely agree on is that all Tories are absolutely and utterly minging to look at; seriously, seriously ugly.

mkmel · Post by **mkmel** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:32 pm

yTib wrote:if labour and corbyn especially had any real conviction to boot the tories out corbyn would fall on his sword and they'd elect a more centrist leader.

alas, this will not happen and johnson will get a majority in the impending election.

never have i been so depressed at the state of politics, not just domestically but worldwide.

johnson or corbyn. sweet baby jesus and the orphans!

You're not wrong!

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:32 pm

taffy wrote:He won't win any votes because he doesn't have a majority, the only way he can alter that is to have a general election and that won't happen because corbyn will lose heavily. I have never voted tory in my life but I will this time just to get brexit through, it's costing the country a fortune to have these idiots in parliament blocking everything and arguing the toss.

If you were at all concerned about the country being cost "a fortune" then you wouldn't have supported Brexit in the first place, so stop your bullshit.

Clarets4me · Post by **Clarets4me** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:38 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:If you were at all concerned about the country being cost "a fortune" then you wouldn't have supported Brexit in the first place, so stop your bullshit.

He could have considered Sovereignty as more important than money, or indeed he might be a supporter of Democracy in wanting to see the expressed will of the people enacted, as we were promised.

mkmel · Post by **mkmel** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:38 pm

Johnson must be the most disliked PM since Thatcher....

And yes I haven't forgotten the dislike of Tony Blair at the Iraq war

Bosscat · Post by **Bosscat** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:40 pm

ksrclaret wrote:Laura Pidcock is quite fit, for a Geordie lass.

Is she the one out of "Little Mix" that Andre Gray is rear ending

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:46 pm

Clarets4me wrote:He could have considered Sovereignty as more important than money, or indeed he might be a supporter of Democracy in wanting to see the expressed will of the people enacted, as we were promised.

Brexit hasn't been cancelled. No one is standing in the way of the will of the people. That's just bullshit that is being spread by extremists who want the most damaging form of Brexit possible, for which there is absolutely no mandate.

The will of the people is to leave the EU based on campaign promises. You have just demanded that the will of the people be enacted "as we were promised" during the campaign. You can't pick and choose what campaign promises must be followed. We were promised that there would not be a "no deal" Brexit just like you were promised Brexit.

You can have what you were promised. But I want what I was promised too. But the problem is that you and your lot seem to think that the only way you can have what you were promised is if what I was promised is denied to me. Why?

During the campaign we were promised brexit with a deal if we voted to leave. That's what I'm demanding from my politicians, why aren't you?

Clarets4me · Post by **Clarets4me** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:47 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:A majority think that of Johnson too. Funny how you're ignoring that. Almost like you're doing so because it doesn't fit your preferred argument.

Fully aware that Johnson isn't very popular but according to YouGov's polling last week, his net approval is -16, whereas Corbyn's is -49 ....

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:49 pm

Clarets4me wrote:Fully aware that Johnson isn't very popular but according to YouGov's polling last week, his net approval is -16, whereas Corbyn's is -49 ....

Your point was "a majority" though. Now you're changing your position. Make up your mind before it starts to look like you're moving the goalposts of debate.

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:50 pm

mkmel wrote:Johnson must be the most disliked PM since Thatcher....

And yes I haven't forgotten the dislike of Tony Blair at the Iraq war

Yeah, but what about Blair AFTER the Iraq war, when we'd learned he'd bullshat the nation, and got away with it?

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:50 pm

mkmel wrote:Johnson must be the most disliked PM since Thatcher....

And yes I haven't forgotten the dislike of Tony Blair at the Iraq war

Both Johnson and Corbyn would bite your hand off for the majorities Thatcher and Blair enjoyed.

There is a fair chance that Boris and the Conservatives could win an outright majority even if they only poll a 3rd of the vote.

This shows the flaws in the FPTP system i'm afraid.

My choice for Labpur leader would be Keir Starmer,but their members might feel it's time a female took the reins.

yTib · Post by **yTib** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:52 pm

i would argue there surely is a mandate for a 'hard' brexit.

nowhere on the ballot did it have a single proviso or connotation. i reckon the majority of the majority voted on the basis that it would be a total severance.

i disagree of course cos i'm not fuucking stupid but there we are.

Clarets4me · Post by **Clarets4me** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:52 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:Brexit hasn't been cancelled. No one is standing in the way of the will of the people. That's just bullshit that is being spread by extremists who want the most damaging form of Brexit possible, for which there is absolutely no mandate.

The will of the people is to leave the EU based on campaign promises. You have just demanded that the will of the people be enacted "as we were promised" during the campaign. You can't pick and choose what campaign promises must be followed. We were promised that there would not be a "no deal" Brexit just like you were promised Brexit.

You can have what you were promised. But I want what I was promised too. But the problem is that you and your lot seem to think that the only way you can have what you were promised is if what I was promised is denied to me. Why?

During the campaign we were promised brexit with a deal if we voted to leave. That's what I'm demanding from my politicians, why aren't you?

If the EU refuse to negotiate in good faith, then there's not much we can do ... Will you be voting for the Labour party at the next election, if it's still being led by Jeremy Corbyn ?

taio · Post by **taio** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:53 pm

Best thing that could happen is if the next Labour leader has centre ground values and principles. Someone like Yvette Cooper.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:55 pm

tiger76 wrote:Both Johnson and Corbyn would bite your hand off for the majorities Thatcher and Blair enjoyed.

There is a fair chance that Boris and the Conservatives could win an outright majority even if they only poll a 3rd of the vote.

This shows the flaws in the FPTP system i'm afraid.

My choice for Labour leader would be Keir Starmer,but their members might feel it's time a female took the reins.

I'm hoping that the next election further proves just how ****** up our electoral system is by having the runner up in the popular vote becoming Prime Minister. I think after the last two elections more people are seeing just how undemocratic it is. Maybe if Corbyn gets in with 25% of the vote then perhaps more conservative voters will start to turn away from the voting system they only like because it protects their unpopular politics and allows them to still be enacted.

bobinho · Post by **bobinho** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:57 pm

taio wrote:Best thing that could happen is if the next Labour leader has centre ground values and principles. Someone like Yvette Cooper.

Balls....

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:58 pm

Clarets4me wrote:If the EU refuse to negotiate in good faith, then there's not much we can do ... Will you be voting for the Labour party at the next election, if it's still being led by Jeremy Corbyn ?

**** off, mate.
It's our government that did **** all for two years. It's our government's fault we're in this mess.

But lets entertain your delusion for a moment. Explain how the EU have "refused to negotiate in good faith". Maybe you're right, eh? So explain your opinion that the EU have not been acting in good faith.

I'll be voting tactically at the next election, something i've refused to do before, so yes i'll probably be voting Labour.

Clarets4me · Post by **Clarets4me** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:00 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:Your point was "a majority" though. Now you're changing your position. Make up your mind before it starts to look like you're moving the goalposts of debate.

I used the word " majority " referring to Corbyn, not Johnson.

CardyTheClaret · Post by **CardyTheClaret** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:00 pm

fidelcastro wrote:I hear that a lot, but I can't see a single policy of his that is especially controversial.

For starters. £10 minimum wage for under 18s.

fidelcastro · Post by **fidelcastro** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:11 pm

CardyTheClaret wrote:For starters. £10 minimum wage for under 18s.

It was an idea that, on the face of it , doesn't sound too bad, but as far as I know wasn't actually passed as Party policy at the Labour Party conference.

However, only a Tory would actually want people to be earning less!

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:14 pm

Clarets4me wrote:I used the word " majority " referring to Corbyn, not Johnson.

You're admitting your double standard. That a majority opposing Corbyn is proof of Corbyn's unsuitability, but a majority opposing Johnson is not proof of Johnson's unsuitability.

Clarets4me · Post by **Clarets4me** » Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:16 pm

Imploding Turtle wrote:

**** off, mate.
It's our government that did **** all for two years. It's our government's fault we're in this mess.

But lets entertain your delusion for a moment. Explain how the EU have "refused to negotiate in good faith". Maybe you're right, eh? So explain your opinion that the EU have not been acting in good faith.

I'll be voting tactically at the next election, something i've refused to do before, so yes i'll probably be voting Labour.

Simply by insisting on terms that they know will be unacceptable, in respect of fishing rights, future role of the ECJ, the backstop, and a host of other issues. Mrs May's " withdrawal deal " was written almost entirely by the EU negotiating team, and it has been described as being something more suitable for " a Country defeated in war " . The EU team have done this to discourage others ...

Oh, and **** off yourself !