Poppies for Remembrance

[Hipper]

Here's something people might like to get their teeth into!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-50068785" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Devils_Advocate]

Combo for me this year

[Lancasterclaret]

I'll be getting one as always, as I don't want to lose this symbol of the sacrifices made to far right tools.

But I'm also 100% supportive of those who don't wear one, and why James McClean won't wear one.

[DomBFC1882]

Combo for me this year

Laughable

[Tricky Trevor]

Not for me. The poppy symbolises the killing fields of Northern France in WW1 and since has been used for all combatants who have given their life for the country.
I would not be adverse to a remembrance day for civilians lost to terrorism/war but not for them to jump on the BL appeal.

[TheFamilyCat]

Is the British Legion using money to aid the victims of terrorist attack and/or their families? It isn't clear from the article.

If not, it feels as if they are just "using" them to promote the cause.

[bfcjg]

The poppy is to remember the fallen regardless of your views and legality of wars and conflicts that politicians start but don't take part in. Monies raised helps veterans and their families it tends to support working class folk the most.

[Pearcey]

Ah, the annual poppy debate. I will be wearing one to remember the fallen. I just can’t stand the controversy that seems to have developed around it. I you don’t wear one, that’s fine. Nobody should be abused for not wearing one.

[Hipper]

Ah, the annual poppy debate. I will be wearing one to remember the fallen. I just can’t stand the controversy that seems to have developed around it. I you don’t wear one, that’s fine. Nobody should be abused for not wearing one.

If you read the link it is not 'the annual poppy debate'.

My views on this development are similar to Trick Trevor's, namely that red poppies are meant for the military victims of war.

We don't use poppies to remember the victims of the Blitz for example so using them for those lost or injured to terrorist actions seems wrong.

May be it's more about the British Legion running out of war victims and still wanting a purpose.

[Funkydrummer]

BFC poppy badge.PNG (86.9 KiB) Viewed 2638 times

This is the one for me. Two birds with one stone.

Available from all club shops near you.

[Lord Beamish]

I still put my money in the tin, but I haven’t worn a Poppy for nearly a decade. I feel its meaning has been sullied by misuse by folk who wish to bask in the Glory of other people’s Sacrifice.

[fatboy47]

I still put my money in the tin, but I haven’t worn a Poppy for nearly a decade. I feel its meaning has been sullied by misuse by folk who wish to bask in the Glory of other people’s Sacrifice.

this...and that poppy day has evolved into poppy month and is now a means of distractng the sun reading underclass from the realities of their lives.

[AlargeClaret]

It’s a personal choice for anyone . While the state sponsored “ BBC force wearing “ of poppies does grate a little . It matters not if you wear one or not but a quiet minute or so’s reflection and perspective of the sacrifices made down the ages goes a long way .

[AlargeClaret]

this...and that poppy day has evolved into poppy month and is now a means of distractng the sun reading underclass from the realities of their lives.

The annual Poppy appeal has stated in mid Oct for as long I can remember . It’s good to see that you regard the millions of Sun readers as untermenchen ( do you really think the underclass read a paper?) as opposed to say the Guardian and Indy reading army of military hating social workers,Corbynistas and self loathing luvvies ?

[claret2018]

Those Burnley FC poppy badges are abhorrent

[Quickenthetempo]

Luckily I still see the Poppy as respect for the fallen. A little chance to show our appreciation.

Kudos to the volunteer sellers who give their day up sat in Tesco.

[Blackrod]

The ‘pledge peace union’ should get off this cause and leave this for what it’s supposed to be for.

[houseboy]

Is the British Legion using money to aid the victims of terrorist attack and/or their families? It isn't clear from the article.

If not, it feels as if they are just "using" them to promote the cause.

My thoughts entirely.

[houseboy]

The poppy is to remember the fallen regardless of your views and legality of wars and conflicts that politicians start but don't take part in. Monies raised helps veterans and their families it tends to support working class folk the most.

I stopped buying them years ago when I discovered that apparently the veterans and families of officers got more than your normal 'squaddie'. Until this stops or it is proved to be wrong I will not buy one.

[Acting Claret]

What game are we having the last post and minutes silence this year? It was weeks away from armistice day last year and felt quite false to me.

[Devils_Advocate]

What game are we having the last post and minutes silence this year? It was weeks away from armistice day last year and felt quite false to me.

Sky will confirm the games that will have it towards the end of Nov

[Rileybobs]

Those Burnley FC poppy badges are abhorrent

Abhorrent? Really?

[claretonthecoast1882]

Those Burnley FC poppy badges are abhorrent

Somewhere between rapists and murderers on the list ?

[Quickenthetempo]

I stopped buying them years ago when I discovered that apparently the veterans and families of officers got more than your normal 'squaddie'. Until this stops or it is proved to be wrong I will not buy one.

Strange words you choose.

I discovered (definitive) that apparently (rumour)

Make thee mind up.

[houseboy]

Strange words you choose.

I discovered (definitive) that apparently (rumour)

Make thee mind up.

Nothing wrong with it mate. No conflict. I discovered (an article) which alleged that apparently (subject to proof of which I have none) stated the above. I could have written more detail of course but I didn't legislate for pedantry. Thanks for the English lesson though, I'll remember it next time I write an article in one of the magazines I occasionally write for.

[Quickenthetempo]

Nothing wrong with it mate. No conflict. I discovered (an article) which alleged that apparently (subject to proof of which I have none) stated the above. I could have written more detail of course but I didn't legislate for pedantry. Thanks for the English lesson though, I'll remember it next time I write an article in one of the magazines I occasionally write for.

I wouldn't dream of giving anyone an English lesson, it's a messageboard.

But it was just too contradictory, even for me.

[houseboy]

What game are we having the last post and minutes silence this year? It was weeks away from armistice day last year and felt quite false to me.

The last post and minutes silence should be on the actual day. No other. I find that the 'dragging out' of these things somewhat false and that people often comply because they feel they have to not because they want to.

[claret2018]

Abhorrent? Really?

I guess I’m not sure who is insecure enough not to be able to wear a poppy without some other symbol attached to it. They’re like those gaudy jewel embezzled ones that women on Saturday night light entertainment shows wear.

I mean fair enough it’s you’re choice, but I always think these football poppy badges give off a bit of a Football Lads Alliance/Free Tommy kind of vibe.

[houseboy]

I wouldn't dream of giving anyone an English lesson, it's a messageboard.

But it was just too contradictory, even for me.

As stated bud there is no contradiction if you look at my explanation. Sometimes we write things that aren't perfect because as you rightly say it's a message board not a literary criticism forum, but as you took the time to try to offer a critique I took the time to offer an explanation. Nothing more. There are far, far worse examples of writing on here but I don't recall you jumping on them all, are you having a bad day?

[Lord Beamish]

Abhorrent? Really?

I think “abhorrent” is overstating it, somewhat.
They are however, in my opinion, pretty tasteless.

[Quickenthetempo]

As stated bud there is no contradiction if you look at my explanation. Sometimes we write things that aren't perfect because as you rightly say it's a message board not a literary criticism forum, but as you took the time to try to offer a critique I took the time to offer an explanation. Nothing more. There are far, far worse examples of writing on here but I don't recall you jumping on them all, are you having a bad day?

Thank you for taking the time to reply, you're right I don't jump all over posts for spelling or English.

Probably done because it's on a thread with people claiming the poppy is politicised.

[houseboy]

Thank you for taking the time to reply, you're right I don't jump all over posts for spelling or English.

Probably done because it's on a thread with people claiming the poppy is politicised.

No worries mate. The poppy is a very debatable and emotive subject, which I generally try to shy away from. I don't know why I even got involved in the thread. Incidentally I am having a bad day, I am currently working with a computer program that is just not playing the game and I am moving between extreme anger (illogical I know) and boredom. Maybe that's why I got involved with the poppy debate. All the best to you bud and have a good day.

[Bfc]

post 15 re abhorrent badge. I bought one, as it's a reminder to me of the Burnley FC players, who gave their lives in the First World War. One of our 1947 Cup Final players Billy Morris was hit by bullets and survived in WW2.
I can see some sympathy to giving to those relatives of those killed, who were not directly in fighting. My father joined as a soldier on the day war was announced and survived, while my mother made bombs and dynamite during WW2 and there were a hell of a lot of people killed when they exploded while making them.

[Imploding Turtle]

Where's Damo? He loves calling things virtue-signalling. I wonder if he'll call wearing a poppy virtue-signalling. Or will he not because that might upset the Nationalist Conservatives he aligns with.

[Bosscat]

Those Burnley FC poppy badges are abhorrent

Some may find your post "Abhorent" especially of families who have lost loved ones in recent conflicts....

Just thinking aloud like

[Rowls]

As we move further and further away from the original tragedy of WWI and the second great tragedy of WWII the direct emotional attachment of the annual memorial services will be obscured.

For well over 70 years nearly everybody in the country either knew somebody who had served in a world war, knew somebody who had fallen in one of these conflicts or was directly bereaved as a result.

Even the generations who followed had parents and/or grandparents who had seen active service. We were all taught and understood what their generation had done because we knew them personally and they all had medals and dusty black and white photos of them wearing uniforms and standing to attention.

We didn't understand their sacrifice entirely, especially when we were very young, but we sat on their laps, cuddled and hugged them and we knew them personally - this made their story relatable.

It's only natural that as their story moves from living memory and into what becomes history that the movement loses the exact emotional attachment.

For many, it becomes less relevant. Sadly and foruntately it is less relevant.

And at the same time, it becomes more ritualized and more about public displays. The further we move from the two main wars which inspired the movement the larger and showier the poppies seem to become. There's nothing wrong with this, as long as it doesn't become something which is enforced.

It might be time for the poppy appeal to move subtly away from direct "remembrance" (because fewer and fewer people actually do remember) and more about recognizing the wider social role that our armed forces provide us. They protect our democracy and our society and those who serve -and their families- can suffer in exactly the same as the veterans of years gone by.

We need to appreciate that although the scale of their sacrifice has changed enormously, their individual sacrifices are exactly the same. I'd like to see the movement move towards covering those who gave service in later campaigns whilst pointing out that their service helps to prevent the wider scale tragedies of the two world wars.

I hope the organization adapts and evolves and helps servicement from all generations.

[Hipper]

It might be time for the poppy appeal to move subtly away from direct "remembrance" (because fewer and fewer people actually do remember) and more about recognizing the wider social role that our armed forces provide us. They protect our democracy and our society and those who serve -and their families- can suffer in exactly the same as the veterans of years gone by.

We need to appreciate that although the scale of their sacrifice has changed enormously, their individual sacrifices are exactly the same. I'd like to see the movement move towards covering those who gave service in later campaigns whilst pointing out that their service helps to prevent the wider scale tragedies of the two world wars.

I hope the organization adapts and evolves and helps servicement from all generations.

Did you write this Rowls or was it lifted from somewhere?

I thought you would know better that poppy sales and the British Legion already support armed forces personnel and their families from later conflicts and activities. Indeed seeing as WW2 veterans must now be in their 90s and their numbers must be relatively small, what did you think they did with all their money?

[Lord Beamish]

Did you write this Rowls or was it lifted from somewhere?

I thought you would know better that poppy sales and the British Legion already support armed forces personnel and their families from later conflicts and activities. Indeed seeing as WW2 veterans must now be in their 90s and their numbers must be relatively small, what did you think they did with all their money?

He does know an awful lot about Psychology, mind.

[JarrowClaret]

Excellent words Rowls I would like a day to come where no Services charities are required and we find a more appropriate method of funding such care without asking people to dip in there pockets. As for the act of remembrance for me this is a personal thing I remember those friends colleagues that were lost either on exercises, driving around or on Operations and less about the 2 great wars although granted I do that throughout the year as well so maybe I am selfish a bit. I understand and fully appreciate the sacrifice etc of the servicemen who served during them. Most of the Remembrance Sunday commemorations I attended did have mentions of more modern deaths or tragedies as well as the 2 Great War references.

[evensteadiereddie]

Some may find your post "Abhorent" especially of families who have lost loved ones in recent conflicts....

Just thinking aloud like

Don't do it. It just makes you appear stupid.

[Blackrod]

As we move further and further away from the original tragedy of WWI and the second great tragedy of WWII the direct emotional attachment of the annual memorial services will be obscured.

For well over 70 years nearly everybody in the country either knew somebody who had served in a world war, knew somebody who had fallen in one of these conflicts or was directly bereaved as a result.

Even the generations who followed had parents and/or grandparents who had seen active service. We were all taught and understood what their generation had done because we knew them personally and they all had medals and dusty black and white photos of them wearing uniforms and standing to attention.

We didn't understand their sacrifice entirely, especially when we were very young, but we sat on their laps, cuddled and hugged them and we knew them personally - this made their story relatable.

It's only natural that as their story moves from living memory and into what becomes history that the movement loses the exact emotional attachment.

For many, it becomes less relevant. Sadly and foruntately it is less relevant.

And at the same time, it becomes more ritualized and more about public displays. The further we move from the two main wars which inspired the movement the larger and showier the poppies seem to become. There's nothing wrong with this, as long as it doesn't become something which is enforced.

It might be time for the poppy appeal to move subtly away from direct "remembrance" (because fewer and fewer people actually do remember) and more about recognizing the wider social role that our armed forces provide us. They protect our democracy and our society and those who serve -and their families- can suffer in exactly the same as the veterans of years gone by.

We need to appreciate that although the scale of their sacrifice has changed enormously, their individual sacrifices are exactly the same. I'd like to see the movement move towards covering those who gave service in later campaigns whilst pointing out that their service helps to prevent the wider scale tragedies of the two world wars.

I hope the organization adapts and evolves and helps servicement from all generations.

I think the main difference with the world wars is not only the scale but also the fact people were called up. This is very different to signing on the armed forces and then being in conflict. The sacrifices were huge and often by very young men and whole streets and neighbourhoods were wiped out. I think you make a fair point but this is needed to ensure the soldiers of the world wars are never forgotten. It shouldn’t be diluted by anything even though sacrifices have been made since.

[Rowls]

I think the main difference with the world wars is not only the scale but also the fact people were called up. This is very different to signing on the armed forces and then being in conflict. The sacrifices were huge and often by very young men and whole streets and neighbourhoods were wiped out. I think you make a fair point but this is needed to ensure the soldiers of the world wars are never forgotten. It shouldn’t be diluted by anything even though sacrifices have been made since.

Being called up and signing up is different but the sacrifice made is the same.

Did you write this Rowls or was it lifted from somewhere?

I thought you would know better that poppy sales and the British Legion already support armed forces personnel and their families from later conflicts and activities. Indeed seeing as WW2 veterans must now be in their 90s and their numbers must be relatively small, what did you think they did with all their money?

I wrote it myself. My post does not deny that the poppy appeal already supports all veterans. I know several veterans who accuse the BL of "favouring" older veterans families and having a "hierarchy" of service. Whether it's true or not I know a lot less about but it deserves challenging and tackling whether the problem is real or imagined.

It would be appreciated by myself if you could display a little more tact and diplomacy on this subject. Thanks.

[Jakubclaret]

I’ll be buying 1 & wearing it as I normally do & observing any silences, for me it’s a private thing & other people will have their own valid reasons for the way they conduct themselves in wearing 1 or choosing not to, I don’t think people should be judged either way.

[Hipper]

Being called up and signing up is different but the sacrifice made is the same.



I wrote it myself. My post does not deny that the poppy appeal already supports all veterans. I know several veterans who accuse the BL of "favouring" older veterans families and having a "hierarchy" of service. Whether it's true or not I know a lot less about but it deserves challenging and tackling whether the problem is real or imagined.

It would be appreciated by myself if you could display a little more tact and diplomacy on this subject. Thanks.

There was no 'lack of tact or diplomacy' in my post.

My reading of your post, notably the last two paragraphs, was that it did indeed imply that the British legion and poppy appeal did not already support all veterans.

Of course the British Legion is not the only serviceman's charity. There are loads of them. Here's some for RAF personal:

https://www.charitychoice.co.uk/chariti ... forces-raf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I used to give to the three forces benevolent funds which do good work.

I suspect the British Legion is looking around for a purpose. It has closed a lot of their facilities because of lack of use. Not only are WW2, Suez and such veterans declining in numbers but the National Servicemen are too. Where I live the club hall has been knocked down and there are plans to build flats on the site which will incorporate a hall of sorts. What for is not clear because the place closed from underuse.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

Those Burnley FC poppy badges are abhorrent

It's a few p towards a new midfielder though