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In the cases of Timothy Evans and Derek Bentley I'd say Badly......Burnley Ace wrote:If you went to the police and said “I saw Burnley Ace go into my back yard and take my bike” would you espect the police to say “if you haven’t got it on video there is nothing we can do”. How do you think Courts worked before video cameras were invented?
That’s why the Magistrates look at the demeanour of the witness and their credibility. They can (and do) take the word of one witness over the other.Firthy wrote:Stalemate. They can't convict without evidence and take the word of one person over another even if he is an official. You could stitch anybody up if that was the case and that would be corrupt.
Firstly he deliberately reads out the guidelines incorrectly (or he is too thick to actually understand them, it’s debatable). The officer has to give the opportunity to pick up if it’s accidental littering not if it’s done deliberately. Then the offence is committed on land open to the air so it doesn’t matter who owns it, the defence is having owners permission. 2 massive errors in the first minute, and 300,000 views!! What a prick.operator wrote:Interesting vid on littering.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-YNOuUAzfs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
As it happens, neither of those would have been affected by CCTV. In the first case, the murderer (Christie) wasn't going to go to the police and try and get them to ignore Evans' dubious confession; in the second, there was very little doubt about what Bentley was doing during the armed robbery, just the degree of criminality.tim_noone wrote:In the cases of Timothy Evans and Derek Bentley I'd say Badly......
Isn’t any choice in the matter if you’ve got 2 conflicting witness statements & you need to make a decision on the credibility, that’s been standard procedure for years.Burnley Ace wrote:That’s why the Magistrates look at the demeanour of the witness and their credibility. They can (and do) take the word of one witness over the other.
It’s to prove beyond reasonable doubt not beyond all doubt. The prosecutor doesn’t just ask “did you drop the cig” “no” “ok no further questions”Jakubclaret wrote:Isn’t any choice in the matter if you’ve got 2 conflicting witness statements & you need to make a decision on the credibility, that’s been standard procedure for years.
For somebody dropping a cigarette it's a moot point, I'd be surprised if that particular offence ever saw the light of day in a court room, you'd own up or it'd get dropped. The courts are inundated with more serious offences than people littering.Burnley Ace wrote:It’s to prove beyond reasonable doubt not beyond all doubt. The prosecutor doesn’t just ask “did you drop the cig” “no” “ok no further questions”
Littering? There are hundreds of prosecutions a week, the vast majority dealt with by SJP and Courts are empty which is why they are closing them.Jakubclaret wrote:For somebody dropping a cigarette it's a moot point, I'd be surprised if that particular offence ever saw the light of day in a court room, you'd own up or it'd get dropped. The courts are inundated with more serious offences than people littering.
Well I've only been up a hr & they say you learn something new everyday so that's a early start, for something so trivial I was under the impression you received a on the spot fine & had so long to pay it off if you didn't it'd increase, & eventually bailiffs would come knocking if you simply ignored.Burnley Ace wrote:Littering? There are hundreds of prosecutions a week, the vast majority dealt with by SJP and Courts are empty which is why they are closing them.
How can they give you an on the spot fine if, like the OP you didn't do it.Jakubclaret wrote:Well I've only been up a hr & they say you learn something new everyday so that's a early start, for something so trivial I was under the impression you received a on the spot fine & had so long to pay it off if you didn't it'd increase, & eventually bailiffs would come knocking if you simply ignored.
Sorry should have clarified, I meant when it was obvious & the offender admitted, less obvious cases & when people are adamant of not being guilty, things would be contested & evidence would be the crux.Firthy wrote:How can they give you an on the spot fine if, like the OP you didn't do it.
You get given a fixed penalty which is your opportunity to settle the matter without going to Court. If you don’t want to take that opportunity then it goes to Court and you can enter your plea (by post or online). If it’s a not guilty plea then it relisted in Magistrates Court for a trial date to be fixed, trials take about an hour and Magistrates decide.Jakubclaret wrote:Well I've only been up a hr & they say you learn something new everyday so that's a early start, for something so trivial I was under the impression you received a on the spot fine & had so long to pay it off if you didn't it'd increase, & eventually bailiffs would come knocking if you simply ignored.
Haha always nice to win though! I’ve appealed a few things over the years but never won, mainly because I was guiltyFenwick wrote: ↑Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:35 pmUpdate on this. Was supposed to be going to the magistrates this week for a case management hearing which decides how the case is going to be conducted.
Got a letter from Pendle Council saying they are dropping the prosecution. Probably because the enforcement officer hadn't followed the guidelines, had got the time of the alleged offence wrong by 15 minutes and had got the name of the road wrong. All of which I could prove.
Genuinely gutted. Had been rehearsing cross-examination and everything !
But you're in more trouble if ya don't:-claptrappers_union wrote: ↑Tue Nov 24, 2020 8:49 pmI’d just walk away from them. They can’t make you give them your name and address...
I have walked the Greenway regularly for 4 years and never once seen anyone with binoculars. I would notice as I am a birdwatching enthusiast.ClaretAndJew wrote: ↑Wed Oct 23, 2019 4:22 pmThere's people on the Greenway walking path in Padiham that wander around with binoculars trying to spot people not picking up their dog ****.
i just told him to **** before I smack him , he went away, didn't come back. Never heard a thing.Fenwick wrote: ↑Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:01 pmI've been given one of these for alledgedly dropping a cigarette butt on the pavement. I was smoking but put the butt in a bin 20 yards before the enforcement people leapt out of the bushes. I even went back to the bin and fished it out to show them !
Has anyone had experience of challanging this sort of thing, because i will go to prison before paying a penny !
had runnings with one of them lads - he followed me with his mates in a car from Morrisons in Nelson windows down calling me a 'white mother ******'
Was that before or after you told him to **** off and ran away?
had it twice, once morrisons once lidl.Burnley Ace wrote: ↑Wed Nov 25, 2020 10:09 amWas that before or after you told him to **** off and ran away?