General Election Is On

Dy1geo · Post by **Dy1geo** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 8:49 am

AndrewJB wrote:When those state owned companies were sold off at below market price was that stealing too (an insider job?)?

Once Labour look likely to win, we’ll see those stocks fall in price, as they get sold off. Possibly below the value of the assets of the companies themselves.

And how are they planning to pay for it?

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:06 am

Damo wrote:Calm down imploding Bercow.
It's a football message board. His post was perfectly valid whether you liked it or not

Only if his intent was to provide weak rationale to those looking to dismiss a challenging opinion. It's pathetic. He's saying he's not going to engage with anyones opinion unless they can demonstrate ideological consistency for the last 13 years. It's dumb as ****.

Lowbankclaret · Post by **Lowbankclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:11 am

Colburn_Claret wrote:I dont suppose they are, but if they think it's bad now they are in for a shock if Jeremy gets his way.
Maybe it's part of the North South divide, the vast majority of train users, or reliant on trains on a daily basis are probably commuting into London. I've used the trains about 3 times in the last 30 years, but I do require the post office, and utilities.
As for not voting for a the party that promises to put money in my pocket, I was a member of the Labour party for 35 years, I never voted for them to improve how much money I would get. The reason I wont vote for Corbyn is because he would wreck this country, and when it falls it's always the people at the bottom who pay the biggest price. The elderly, the sick, the unemployed.

I wish they knew, or at least would listen.

But if somehow they get their way, they will learn the hard way unfortunately.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:22 am

Lowbankclaret wrote:I wish they knew, or at least would listen.

But if somehow they get their way, they will learn the hard way unfortunately.

I suspect we will all learn the hard way what happens when you put your trust in people who lie about stuff to get what they want.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:26 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:Only if his intent was to provide weak rationale to those looking to dismiss a challenging opinion. It's pathetic. He's saying he's not going to engage with anyones opinion unless they can demonstrate ideological consistency for the last 13 years. It's dumb as ****.

I merely asked why it's an issue now if Americans are involved with the NHS if it wasn't an issue for them 13 years ago.
For all I know the poster could be falling for media rhetoric/scare mongering about the NHS being sold off to the yanks, when in actual fact they've been here as part of the NHS for the last 13 years at least, possibly longer.
I even linked the favoured newspaper for your side, the Guardian, to give credibility to my question.

I haven't said I won't engage with anyone about it, that's you making stuff up in an attempt to discredit/dismiss my question

If you don't like my question because it contains facts that discredit the current scaremongering over the NHS then just admit it.

AndyClaret · Post by **AndyClaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:30 am

15 point lead with yougov.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:32 am

AndyClaret wrote:15 point lead with yougov.

Are we back to liking polls again?

Wanna see one from this time in the last election campaign?

NottsClaret · Post by **NottsClaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:34 am

When Corbyn loses his 2nd election, does he go then? Or is still the electorate that’s wrong?

AndyClaret · Post by **AndyClaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:37 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:Are we back to liking polls again?

Wanna see one from this time in the last election campaign?

Yougov were the closest to the actual result.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:40 am

AndyClaret wrote:Yougov were the closest to the actual result.

Yes, and they're the polling company i respect the most. Do you want to know what their polls showed 42 days before the last election?

Tories had a 16 point lead then.

The polling will most likely narrow, especially when Boris opens his mouth and begins his filthy campaign.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:41 am

Yay!

Happy "Andy is posting polls again" Day

Though it is supposed to be another important day today....what was it again Andy?

AndyClaret · Post by **AndyClaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:42 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:Yes, and they're the polling company i respect the most. Do you want to know what their polls showed 42 days before the last election?

Tories had a 16 point lead then.

The polling will most likely narrow, especially when Boris opens his mouth and begins his filthy campaign.

You hope, could go the other way.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:42 am

And btw Andy, for about 63 polls in a row, YouGov polls have shown that the British public no longer wants Brexit. So if you really respected their polls, and really respected the will of the people, you'd be shouting for a second referendum right now.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:43 am

AndyClaret wrote:You hope, could go the other way.

Not really.

AndyClaret · Post by **AndyClaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:51 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:Not really.

Yes really.

AndyClaret · Post by **AndyClaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:52 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:And btw Andy, for about 63 polls in a row, YouGov polls have shown that the British public no longer wants Brexit. So if you really respected their polls, and really respected the will of the people, you'd be shouting for a second referendum right now.

Depends what question you ask, there isn't going to be a losers vote.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:52 am

AndyClaret wrote:Yes really.

You assume too much.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:53 am

AndyClaret wrote:Depends what question you ask, there isn't going to be a losers vote.

You are right there.

Whoever wins the election won't go to a referendum to sort out Brexit.

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:24 am

Labour's anti-semitism coming back to haunt them?

Rabbi urges congregation not to support Labour
A senior rabbi has written to his congregation urging them to vote tactically against the Labour party, reports the Jewish Chronicle.

Rabbi Dr Jonathan Romain is said to have written to 823 families to say a Jeremy Corbyn government would be a "danger to Jewish life as we know it".

According to the Chronicle, Dr Romain wrote: “I should stress that the problem is not the Labour Party itself, which has a long record of fighting discrimination and prejudice, but the problem is Jeremy Corbyn. Corbyn-led Labour, has at best, let anti-Semitism arise within its ranks, or at worst, has encouraged it."

Mala591 · Post by **Mala591** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:27 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:And btw Andy, for about 63 polls in a row, YouGov polls have shown that the British public no longer wants Brexit. So if you really respected their polls, and really respected the will of the people, you'd be shouting for a second referendum right now.

Like it or not this general election IS a second referendum.

Remain - vote Lib Dem
Leave with a deal - vote Conservative

Imo we are likely to have a second REAL general election within 12 months of this one.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:27 am

https://www.politics.co.uk/comment-anal ... olatile-el" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Good analysis of each region and how it might vote, and what might happen.

Look, the Tories have to run a terrible campaign not to win, and Labour have to improve massively.

But 2017 was only two years ago, and I don't think the Conservatives have learnt the lesson from that.

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:27 am

AndrewJB wrote:What brainwashed nonsense. Where have you been for the last ten years? The country is already I ruin due to massive cuts and sell offs so the Tories could reward their paymasters in the City with tax cuts. Privatised railways are being run so well that even a majority of Tory voters want to see them nationalised again. When the East Coast Mainline has (twice) failed as a franchise - which is to say the private venture sucked as much profit out as they could and then walked away from the contract - it turned into the UKs best run railway while under government control.

You are the one living in the past with your “state is bad and business is good” mantra. Forty years of that has led to a housing crisis, and underfunded infrastructure. Labour just want to rebalance the economy in favour of ordinary people (who you accuse of being too stupid to understand nationalisation in the first place). The economics of thatcher is finished. Greed is not good. Get with the new times.

I couldn't give a toss who runs the railways or any other industry, so long as the tax payer doesn't pick up the bill. I don't care if it breaks even, fine. But if it starts to drain the countrys coffers it's the poor that will pay, I won't suffer. Investment in modern rolling stock, refurbing stations, the ongoing costs are tremendous. In other countries it normally works because the state fund it, I don't believe the state should fund the rail network, as I've stated it takes money away from the Health Service, Pensions etc. If they can achieve that fine, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:29 am

Mala591 wrote:Like it or not this general election IS a second referendum.

Remain - vote Lib Dem
Leave with a deal - vote Conservative

Imo we are likely to have a second REAL general election within 12 months of this one.

It's literally not a referendum. By definition it's not. Like it or not.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:33 am

Colburn_Claret wrote:I couldn't give a toss who runs the railways or any other industry, so long as the tax payer doesn't pick up the bill. I don't care if it breaks even, fine. But if it starts to drain the countrys coffers it's the poor that will pay, I won't suffer. Investment in modern rolling stock, refurbing stations, the ongoing costs are tremendous. In other countries it normally works because the state fund it, I don't believe the state should fund the rail network, as I've stated it takes money away from the Health Service, Pensions etc. If they can achieve that fine, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

So your worry is that it will cost the tax payer more money to subsidise publicly owned and managed railways than it would to subsidise privately-managed railways. Is that correct?

AndyClaret · Post by **AndyClaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:35 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:https://www.politics.co.uk/comment-anal ... olatile-el

Good analysis of each region and how it might vote, and what might happen.

Look, the Tories have to run a terrible campaign not to win, and Labour have to improve massively.

But 2017 was only two years ago, and I don't think the Conservatives have learnt the lesson from that.

They won't make the mistakes of the last disastrous manifesto.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:39 am

AndyClaret wrote:They won't make the mistakes of the last disastrous manifesto.

Well, they've got a fracking lobbyist to write it for them, so they're not off to a great start.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:39 am

I never believed I'd regard Good Morning Britain as the beacon of "how to deal with politicians" but I may have to change my mind

https://twitter.com/GMB/status/1189457934125846528" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:40 am

AndyClaret wrote:They won't make the mistakes of the last disastrous manifesto.

Dunno

They will have to have one for a start, and once you put ideas down on paper, the reality of it can no longer be ignored.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:40 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:Yes, and they're the polling company i respect the most. Do you want to know what their polls showed 42 days before the last election?

Tories had a 16 point lead then.

The polling will most likely narrow, especially when Boris opens his mouth and begins his filthy campaign.

Boris is quite popular up north, which is very rare for a Tory PM. He will run rings around a very old looking Corbyn.

Corbyn has far too many skeletons in his closet, videos of him with the IRA or pictures with other terrorists will constantly be shared around social media.
Posts about his 2nd home being a 7 bedroom mansion and his wife's company going against all that Labour stands for are doing the rounds. He's an easy target. May didn't even campaign against him last time and won.

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:41 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:https://www.politics.co.uk/comment-anal ... olatile-el

Good analysis of each region and how it might vote, and what might happen.

Look, the Tories have to run a terrible campaign not to win, and Labour have to improve massively.

But 2017 was only two years ago, and I don't think the Conservatives have learnt the lesson from that.

Plenty of marginals across the country,you'd imagine the Conservatives can't possibly be as complacent,the issue for the Conservatives is they're likely to suffer losses in London,Scotland and some of the remain voting university towns,so to offset those they'll need to make gains in the north,midlands and perhaps Wales,now if the BP doesn't contest some seats that could tip the balance,the danger for the Conservatives is 2017 repeats and they have a number of near misses in leave voting areas.

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:43 am

AndrewJB wrote:The rich have been bleeding everyone else here for forty years. Seven hundred deaths of homeless people in the last year. Over a million having to use food banks, including working people. And your “thriving economy to fund a happy country” argument falls apart on the subject of Brexit.

Andrew, you have a very miopic view on the state of this country, of course people on the streets die, its very sad, but it isn't always the fault of the government. Mental Health, drugs they all play a part in how so many people end up on the street. Foodbanks are a necessary evil and I'd much rather they weren't needed, but a lot of it could be prevented with better education, especially social/domestic education. We live in a generation of fast food diets, where you pay twice as much for a meal because it's easier than cooking for yourself. Thats sad. it also distracts from the genuine in need, who don't have the option of cooking for themselves.
In modern Britain, today, people live longer, are healthier, earn more, enjoy more leisure time, more people live in their own homes than ever, more people are in employment, fewer people are unemployed, they have numerous mod cons to make life easier, from TV remotes to computers. The people today have genuinely never had it so good. Seriously, find yourself a 90 year old and ask them what they had to go through, what they had to do without when they were children.
Now I'm not saying life is perfect, because it isn't, and it never will be. There will always be people who slip through the cracks of society, and we should be there to help them, as the good socialists we are, but don't let it blind you to all the things that are right because you are missing out on so much. Your negativity is a millstone around your neck.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:43 am

Quickenthetempo wrote:Boris is quite popular up north, which is very rare for a Tory PM. He will run rings around a very old looking Corbyn.

Corbyn has far too many skeletons in his closet, videos of him with the IRA or pictures with other terrorists will constantly be shared around social media.
Posts about his 2nd home being a 7 bedroom mansion and his wife's company going against all that Labour stands for are doing the rounds. He's an easy target. May didn't even campaign against him last time and won.

Can I be honest here?

I'm not sure that the skeletons in Johnsons closet hold up to scrutiny either.

Certainly don't think he'd come out well if they went down that route.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:46 am

Quickenthetempo wrote:Boris is quite popular up north, which is very rare for a Tory PM. He will run rings around a very old looking Corbyn.

Corbyn has far too many skeletons in his closet, videos of him with the IRA or pictures with other terrorists will constantly be shared around social media.
Posts about his 2nd home being a 7 bedroom mansion and his wife's company going against all that Labour stands for are doing the rounds. He's an easy target. May didn't even campaign against him last time and won.

for two years before the last election the tories had been calling him a jew-hating, terrorist sympathiser who was a threat to national security, and you think that May didn't campaign against him?

p*ss off.

There's only so many times the Tories can tell the same lies about him. They're gonna have to come up with some new ones this time. Maybe they can smear his parents, or criticise how he eats a sandwich, while ignoring Boris' long history of lying and cheating.

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:48 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:So your worry is that it will cost the tax payer more money to subsidise publicly owned and managed railways than it would to subsidise privately-managed railways. Is that correct?

I wouldn't subsidise privately managed railways either. If that's the case Jeremy can just withdraw the subsidies, he doesn't need to renationalise them after all.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:49 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Can I be honest here?

I'm not sure that the skeletons in Johnsons closet hold up to scrutiny either.

Certainly don't think he'd come out well if they went down that route.

I'm sure we're about to find out.

I have been institutionalised as much as the next man into hating all things Tory, but he wins hands down against Corbyn by a big margin.

Hopefully the Brexit party get in here though.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:51 am

Quickenthetempo wrote:I'm sure we're about to find out.

I have been institutionalised as much as the next man into hating all things Tory, but he wins hands down against Corbyn by a big margin.

Hopefully the Brexit party get in here though.

Sounds like Farage has been bought off

You might have to vote Tory.

AndyClaret · Post by **AndyClaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:52 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Dunno

They will have to have one for a start, and once you put ideas down on paper, the reality of it can no longer be ignored.

More money for schools, hospitals and the Police, deliver Brexit, keep it simple.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:53 am

Colburn_Claret wrote:I wouldn't subsidise privately managed railways either. If that's the case Jeremy can just withdraw the subsidies, he doesn't need to renationalise them after all.

You really think it's a good idea to have zero public funding for railways? Really? These things travel at over 100mph on metal strips and sometimes carry hundreds or people. Do you REALLY think the private sector can be trusted like that?

And if they can be trusted, why can't they be trusted to run and fund 100% of our healthcare?

What about roads? Why should railways be 100% privately owned and funded but not roads?

jrgbfc · Post by **jrgbfc** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:53 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Can I be honest here?

I'm not sure that the skeletons in Johnsons closet hold up to scrutiny either.

Certainly don't think he'd come out well if they went down that route.

Murdoch and the Tory press will ignore all of those though. But it showed at the last election his power is waning, barely anyone under 40 reads a newspaper now.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:55 am

AndyClaret wrote:More money for schools, hospitals and the Police, deliver Brexit, keep it simple.

But you have to fund it.

You can't just promise the earth and have an uncosted manifesto.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:55 am

Imploding Turtle wrote: for two years before the last election the tories had been calling him a jew-hating, terrorist sympathiser who was a threat to national security, and you think that May didn't campaign against him? p*ss off.

There's only so many times the Tories can tell the same lies about him. They're gonna have to come up with some new ones this time. Maybe they can smear his parents, or criticise how he eats a sandwich, while ignoring Boris' long history of lying and cheating.

May hadn't been in power for 2 years before the election.

By campaigning, I mean she wasn't all over the TV screens etc.. pushing why she would be great.

the message was basically I don't need to do anything as Corbyn is so bad.

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:05 am

Colburn_Claret wrote:The people today have genuinely never had it so good.

What about trying to get on the property ladder?
What about having to pay to go to university?

And the older generation had generous final salary pension schemes to fall back on.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:12 am

Quickenthetempo wrote:May hadn't been in power for 2 years before the election.

By campaigning, I mean she wasn't all over the TV screens etc.. pushing why she would be great.

the message was basically I don't need to do anything as Corbyn is so bad.

the message was... what?
THE MESSAGE WAS... WHAT?

She didn't campaign against Corbyn, but "the message was basically I don't need to do anything as Corbyn is so bad".

I think we're done here.

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:14 am

Never had it so good.

£10k for a deposit on a house. How do you save up for that when renting for £400 a month and getting minimum wage?

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:15 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:But you have to fund it.

You can't just promise the earth and have an uncosted manifesto.

The Tories can. No other party is allowed to cost their manifesto without the Tories calling it uncosted, but the Tories are allowed to not cost theirs.

AndyClaret · Post by **AndyClaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:18 am

ClaretAndJew wrote:Never had it so good.

£10k for a deposit on a house. How do you save up for that when renting for £400 a month and getting minimum wage?

How about getting a cheaper phone, cutting out netfilx, not buying £3 coffee's. I managed to, bought my first house at 24.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:21 am

AndyClaret wrote:How about getting a cheaper phone, cutting out netfilx, not buying £3 coffee's. I managed to, bought my first house at 24.

HOUSE!

Come off it Andy, not even the thickest of the thick go down that road.

Quickenthetempo · Post by **Quickenthetempo** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:24 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:the message was... what?
THE MESSAGE WAS... WHAT?

She didn't campaign against Corbyn, but "the message was basically I don't need to do anything as Corbyn is so bad".

I think we're done here.

Maybe the message got through first time as she was right?

Boris will campaign far harder and win by more.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:25 am

AndyClaret wrote:How about getting a cheaper phone, cutting out netfilx, not buying £3 coffee's. I managed to, bought my first house at 24.

That's the problem. Spending £7/month on Netflix is why people can't save up £10k for a deposit.

You're so full of ******* ****, Andy.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Thu Oct 31, 2019 11:27 am

Guys. If you cut off your netflix subscription you too can have enough to pay a £10,000 deposit in as little as 118 years.