General Election Is On

[Spijed]

But it's always the same. We voted leave because we're thick, we voted leave because we're racist, we voted leave because we didn't understand all the issues, we voted leave as a rebuke to the wrong people in an ill-considered tantrum, and now The Guardian is implying us poor, uneducated saps voted leave because the Russian's told us to.

I wish everyone would just accept we voted leave because we wanted to leave the EU.

Perhaps the report implies that Russia had been able to manipulate the vote (hacking), regardless of how people voted in this country.

[aggi]

But it's always the same. We voted leave because we're thick, we voted leave because we're racist, we voted leave because we didn't understand all the issues, we voted leave as a rebuke to the wrong people in an ill-considered tantrum, and now The Guardian is implying us poor, uneducated saps voted leave because the Russian's told us to.

I wish everyone would just accept we voted leave because we wanted to leave the EU.

Well I suspect you weren't the target for ads such as:







but others clearly were and a lot of money was spent getting these out there.

However, my point was more that blocking this report looks quite bad for the Tories. As such, I wonder what is in the report that is worse than the reputational damage of blocking it.

[Spijed]

Ah yes, forgotten about Turkey joining the EU.

We've more chance of winning the Prem than Turkey have of ever becoming a member of the European Union

[Spijed]

Interesting:

https://twitter.com/JamesKanag/status/1 ... 9367252993" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Imploding Turtle]

You've got to wonder what is in this report on Russian interference that it's better optics to delay publication rather than release it
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... r-election" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It must be pretty bad news for Boris Johnson's election chances if he's withholding it from us until after the election.

[martin_p]

Bad news for remainers then, they should be hoping the brexit party do really well.

They can do well enough to deny the Tories some seats without winning any themselves.

[Imploding Turtle]

Perhaps the report implies that Russia had been able to manipulate the vote (hacking), regardless of how people voted in this country.

I doubt it's as direct as something like changing the vote. Unlike the US, where I think that almost certainly happened, we have paper ballots and you can't hack those from Vladivostok or St. Petersburg.

[Spijed]

I doubt it's as direct as something like changing the vote. Unlike the US, where I think that almost certainly happened, we have paper ballots and you can't hack those from Vladivostok or St. Petersburg.

How are postal votes logged?

[Imploding Turtle]

Handy tip when helping someone with GCSE maths:

If you want to Make a percentage change, use the Multiply button. If you want to unDo a percentage change, use the Divide button.

That's the most contrived mnemonic i've ever seen.

[Imploding Turtle]

How are postal votes logged?

I don't believe they're counted until the day of the election. I could be wrong about this though.

[aggi]

How are postal votes logged?

By hand at the election count.

I've got a few friends who have acted as counters or observers and they are done at the same time as everything else.

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

Johnson blocks release of a report into interference of the 2016 referendum until after the election.
Trump ordered to hand over his tax records but will fight it in the supreme court, also on a day he's been sued by a rape victim for defamation.

Two utter scumbags.

I don't how people square teaching their kids the difference between right and wrong and voting for these kind of degenerate arseholes.

Why not just have the courage of your convictions and teach your children to lie, steal and cheat your way as far as you can in life and to hell with everybody else.

Teach your children not to share, to hate the poor and people from other countries, teach them to abuse people of different religions.

Teach them to deny everything if they are caught doing something wrong, teach them to blame it on somebody else but protect people who give them money even if they murder someone in cold blood.

Teach them not to respect women, teach them that they can have any girl they want when they get older by grabbing them and forcing them.

Teach them to burn the evidence, to point the finger, to shift the blame, to do anything, anything to keep hold of power.

We are supposed to be so far away from these people we can see it and we remove them from power, not keep voting them in.

What the hell is wrong with everyone!!??

[dsr]

Perhaps the report implies that Russia had been able to manipulate the vote (hacking), regardless of how people voted in this country.

All the voting papers, which literally are papers, are poured out onto big tables and sorted by hand by the counters. Every hundred votes gets tied into a bundle and placed on a table in a separate row for each candidate. The returning officer and his team then count how many bundles of 100 there are, multiply it up, add the odd numbers, and write down the total which they then read out in front of the assembled company. None of the information has been on any computer at this point, so there is no risk of hacking from Russia or anywhere else.

[If it be your will]

Well I suspect you weren't the target for ads such as:


but others clearly were and a lot of money was spent getting these out there.

However, my point was more that blocking this report looks quite bad for the Tories. As such, I wonder what is in the report that is worse than the reputational damage of blocking it.

Don't get me wrong, I'd quite like to see the report, too. But it'd only be of academic interest to me. It may be there's something horrendous in it, I don't know (doubt it, though).

I'm pretty convinced the act of blocking this report won't change many - if any - votes though. I get the impression everyone already knows Boris is 'a bit dodgy' and lies all the time, just like everyone knew this about Trump. This doesn't seem to change votes, though. Much to my annoyance, so long as Boris sticks with 'We're definitely going to leave the EU', most leavers will vote for him (though not me, necessarily). I think Boris could do almost anything and still win, so long as he absolutely promises to leave the EU. That's how sick and tired leavers are about politicians refusing to carry out the referendum result. That's how it's got. The media keep saying how unpredictable this election is, yet I see it as an inevitable march towards a handsome Tory win.

[AndrewJB]

Well I suspect you weren't the target for ads such as:







but others clearly were and a lot of money was spent getting these out there.

However, my point was more that blocking this report looks quite bad for the Tories. As such, I wonder what is in the report that is worse than the reputational damage of blocking it.

I’ve seen another version of the “Turkey joining the EU” poster in which Syria and Iraq are coloured yellow. When you look at the red-arrowed surge from Turkey to Britain on the map, it starts off as yellow - suggesting that Iraqis and Syrians also make up the number.

[If it be your will]

Johnson blocks release of a report into interference of the 2016 referendum until after the election.
Trump ordered to hand over his tax records but will fight it in the supreme court, also on a day he's been sued by a rape victim for defamation.

Two utter scumbags.

I don't how people square teaching their kids the difference between right and wrong and voting for these kind of degenerate arseholes.

Why not just have the courage of your convictions and teach your children to lie, steal and cheat your way as far as you can in life and to hell with everybody else.

Teach your children not to share, to hate the poor and people from other countries, teach them to abuse people of different religions.

Teach them to deny everything if they are caught doing something wrong, teach them to blame it on somebody else but protect people who give them money even if they murder someone in cold blood.

Teach them not to respect women, teach them that they can have any girl they want when they get older by grabbing them and forcing them.

Teach them to burn the evidence, to point the finger, to shift the blame, to do anything, anything to keep hold of power.

We are supposed to be so far away from these people we can see it and we remove them from power, not keep voting them in.

What the hell is wrong with everyone!!??

And teach them to break their promises, too. Teach them that their word is definitely not their bond, it's actually irrelevant. Just say stuff now, and forget about it later.

This election is a complete cesspit, whichever way you look at it.

[TheFamilyCat]

I’ve seen another version of the “Turkey joining the EU” poster in which Syria and Iraq are coloured yellow. When you look at the red-arrowed surge from Turkey to Britain on the map, it starts off as yellow - suggesting that Iraqis and Syrians also make up the number.

Amazing really that they had the nerve to base their campaign in such bullshit. And then and then accuse others of project fear.

[Imploding Turtle]

Amazing really that they had the nerve to base their campaign in such bullshit. And then and then accuse others of project fear.

Accuse the other side of what you're doing and then when they accuse you of it it just looks like mud-slinging. It's a pretty simple tactic used to undermine political discourse.

Most people with critical minds saw through it though, which is probably why the lover educated voters skewed much more towards Leave, because they lacked the skills to identify when they were being fed propaganda and disinformation.

[randomclaret2]

'lover educated..'

[Imploding Turtle]

'lover educated..'

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6jJkdRaa04g" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[If it be your will]

Accuse the other side of what you're doing and then when they accuse you of it it just looks like mud-slinging. It's a pretty simple tactic used to undermine political discourse.

Most people with critical minds saw through it though, which is probably why the lover educated voters skewed much more towards Leave, because they lacked the skills to identify when they were being fed propaganda and disinformation.

Theory 1: The less formally educated didn't understand what they voted for, because they lack the required skills to vote sensibly.

Theory 2: The less educated voted in their own interests, just as the highly educated did.

[AndrewJB]

Johnson lying again. Sending out letters with edited quotes, and claiming the NHS will not be used as a bargaining chip for a US trade deal. Nobody can trust a word he says. Possibly why he’s been kept from public appearances and difficult interviews - because his minders suspect he’ll just blurt out a stream of untruths, just as he often did in the referendum.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -to-voters" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Imploding Turtle]

Johnson lying again. Sending out letters with edited quotes, and claiming the NHS will not be used as a bargaining chip for a US trade deal. Nobody can trust a word he says. Possibly why he’s been kept from public appearances and difficult interviews - because his minders suspect he’ll just blurt out a stream of untruths, just as he often did in the referendum.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -to-voters" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A sign of things to come from this guy over the next 6 weeks.

[Jakubclaret]

You’ve managed to surpass even your normal standard of utter nonsense here.

Instead of rubbishing the post, I can fully logically reason the credibility of the post, remember the surviving (some) lost close comrades in the war & that resentment & emotion doesn't go away easily not when especially some of the soldiers were watching each other backs, I presume you may think this is nonsense & I'm also assuming you've never experienced military service & action. The feelings last a lifetime when you lose somebody so close.

[randomclaret2]

Seems odd that the "only highly educated individuals knew what they were voting for" clique were also suggesting 16 year olds should get the vote last week

[tiger76]

Seems it not just Tory candidates who post daft things on social media.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-cov ... e-50292235

I wonder how many more faux pas will come to light before polling day.

[martin_p]

Instead of rubbishing the post, I can fully logically reason the credibility of the post, remember the surviving (some) lost close comrades in the war & that resentment & emotion doesn't go away easily not when especially some of the soldiers were watching each other backs, I presume you may think this is nonsense & I'm also assuming you've never experienced military service & action. The feelings last a lifetime when you lose somebody so close.

There isn’t an ounce of logic in your post, it’s all guess work and supposition.

[Devils_Advocate]

And the Lib Dem leader down in the gutter just to complete the set

https://www.indy100.com/article/lib-dem ... eo-9183126

[Jakubclaret]

There isn’t an ounce of logic in your post, it’s all guess work and supposition.

So you are honestly trying to tell me? When soldiers are in conflict & the fellow comrades are getting blown up or shot at, the surviving soldiers don't come out mentally scarred & they just forget about what's happened. It's common sense to most people, it's not rocket science.

[martin_p]

And the Lib Dem leader down in the gutter just to complete the set

https://www.indy100.com/article/lib-dem ... eo-9183126

I guess at least this was labelled in the small print as not being what it seemed. Pretty poor from the Lib Dems though.

[martin_p]

So you are honestly trying to tell me? When soldiers are in conflict & the fellow comrades are getting blown up or shot at, the surviving soldiers don't come out mentally scarred & they just forget about what's happened. It's common sense to most people, it's not rocket science.

You’ve now moved from logic to the classic ‘I’m making stuff up’ reasoning of ‘common sense’. Surely it’s also ‘common sense’ that those who saw war in Europe don’t want to see it again and therefore would be supportive of closer ties. What makes your ‘common sense’ better than mine?

[Devils_Advocate]

I guess at least this was labelled in the small print as not being what it seemed. Pretty poor from the Lib Dems though.

Maybe but the intention was clearly there to deceive and would have been somewhat digestible if she held her hands up and said it was wrong and would be addressed.

I will happily highlight and crucify the Tory's for their lies, deceit and underhand tactics but our voices are only valid if we hold all sides to the same standards

[martin_p]

Maybe but the intention was clearly there to deceive and would have been somewhat digestible if she held her hands up and said it was wrong and would be addressed.

I will happily highlight and crucify the Tory's for their lies, deceit and underhand tactics but our voices are only valid if we hold all sides to the same standards

Absolutely.

[Jakubclaret]

You’ve now moved from logic to the classic ‘I’m making stuff up’ reasoning of ‘common sense’. Surely it’s also ‘common sense’ that those who saw war in Europe don’t want to see it again and therefore would be supportive of closer ties. What makes your ‘common sense’ better than mine?

Let me clarify, you are probably right in the case of the older veterans probably voting remain for the reasons above (closer ties ect) I'm not disputing that, but it's fair to not discount or rubbish my assumption that some (not all) would have voted leave based on the dislike of Germany & the WW2 experiences. I'm meeting you halfway here but you can't have it both ways, as some veterans did vote leave as a logical assumption in wanting the UK to be away from Germany (the EU).

[AndrewJB]

Instead of rubbishing the post, I can fully logically reason the credibility of the post, remember the surviving (some) lost close comrades in the war & that resentment & emotion doesn't go away easily not when especially some of the soldiers were watching each other backs, I presume you may think this is nonsense & I'm also assuming you've never experienced military service & action. The feelings last a lifetime when you lose somebody so close.

According to polling done by LSE, a majority of those over ninety voted to remain during the referendum, unlike many people younger than themselves (but over sixty-five.

[martin_p]

Let me clarify, you are probably right in the case of the older veterans probably voting remain for the reasons above (closer ties ect) I'm not disputing that, but it's fair to not discount or rubbish my assumption that some (not all) would have voted leave based on the dislike of Germany & the WW2 experiences. I'm meeting you halfway here but you can't have it both ways, as some veterans did vote leave as a logical assumption in wanting the UK to be away from Germany (the EU).

You’ve changed your assumption now.

[Jakubclaret]

According to polling done by LSE, a majority of those over ninety voted to remain during the referendum, unlike many people younger than themselves (but over sixty-five.

I'm not disputing the numbers, personally think there are dubious that's by the by, remember some would have died pre referendum who served in the war so it's impossible to know which way they'd would have opted.
I just get the impression you won't recognise/admit that some of the older veterans would have voted leave based on the dislike of germany & the EU, with all due respect to the remainer veterans their vote never won. It's almost as if you are in denial that some leave veterans voted leave because they dislike germany & what happened in the war.

[martin_p]

I'm not disputing the numbers, personally think there are dubious that's by the by, remember some would have died pre referendum who served in the war so it's impossible to know which way they'd would have opted.
I just get the impression you won't recognise/admit that some of the older veterans would have voted leave based on the dislike of germany & the EU, with all due respect to the remainer veterans their vote never won. It's almost as if you are in denial that some leave veterans voted leave because they dislike germany & what happened in the war.

Any poll that hasn’t sought the views of dead people isn’t worth the paper it’s written on!

[aggi]

And the Lib Dem leader down in the gutter just to complete the set

https://www.indy100.com/article/lib-dem ... eo-9183126

Ah yes, I posted this one last week somewhere on here. The small print was very small.

[Jakubclaret]

Any poll that hasn’t sought the views of dead people isn’t worth the paper it’s written on!

STFO
Anymore pearls of wisdom?

[FactualFrank]

Who are people voting for?

[tiger76]

Who are people voting for?

Candidates

[martin_p]

Who are people voting for?

Well I’ve had the local Tory candidate knocking at my door this evening and she was politely informed it wouldn’t be her.

[FactualFrank]

Candidates

I just thought I'd go right into it.

[FactualFrank]

Well I’ve had the local Tory candidate knocking at my door this evening and she was politely informed it wouldn’t be her.

You might be local to me then!

[AndrewJB]

I'm not disputing the numbers, personally think there are dubious that's by the by, remember some would have died pre referendum who served in the war so it's impossible to know which way they'd would have opted.
I just get the impression you won't recognise/admit that some of the older veterans would have voted leave based on the dislike of germany & the EU, with all due respect to the remainer veterans their vote never won. It's almost as if you are in denial that some leave veterans voted leave because they dislike germany & what happened in the war.

There might be some who voted to leave out of a seventy-five year old hate, just like its likely some of those between sixty-five and eighty-five who voted Remain did so because they absolutely love the EU.

[Jakubclaret]

There might be some who voted to leave out of a seventy-five year old hate, just like its likely some of those between sixty-five and eighty-five who voted Remain did so because they absolutely love the EU.

I'm not disputing the points you raise, I'm defending my own points, I like to think I'm fair in conceding when somebody else quashes a point, it's almost as if no middle ground exists. It doesn't really matter if it was a 10-1 ratio remain to leave regarding the veterans vote overturning the 1 would be wrongly so & disrespectful.

[atlantalad]

Who are people voting for?

Indeed, indeed .... a good statement my man. Or should it be "What are people voting for?"

[Claret-On-A-T-Rex]

Johnson lying again. Sending out letters with edited quotes, and claiming the NHS will not be used as a bargaining chip for a US trade deal. Nobody can trust a word he says. Possibly why he’s been kept from public appearances and difficult interviews - because his minders suspect he’ll just blurt out a stream of untruths, just as he often did in the referendum.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -to-voters" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It's just a litany of lies and broken promises...

"Successive Conservative governments have failed to deliver a single new “starter home” despite promising to build 200,000 by 2020, Whitehall’s spending watchdog has found."

[Dy1geo]

With regards Turkey membership of EU, David Cameron on a visit to Ankara in 2010 “that the UK will do everything it can to help Turkey "pave the road from Ankara to Brussels".

As for those that voted remain did they know what they were voting for, in the 1975 election they certainly didn’t vote for the behemoth that it has become today. Do those that voted remain seriously think that it wouldn’t continue to change and evolve.


.