General Election Is On
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Re: General Election Is On
I find the idea of studying manifestos and then voting based on presumably believing them rather strange.
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Re: General Election Is On
Well, what else would you suggest?randomclaret2 wrote:I find the idea of studying manifestos and then voting based on presumably believing them rather strange.
Using the Force?
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Re: General Election Is On
Is she really heir apparent? I think a lot of people (including the bookies) have Keir Starmer in that role. Obviously it will partly depend on which direction the party goes in but he's definitely well positioned for it and is one of the few labour party politicians that the public recognise.CrosspoolClarets wrote:The real issue here is one of competence. I agree that RBL is the heir apparent, but to look at her CV she is miles short of what is needed even to be a front bencher, let alone a leader and potential PM (don’t start me on Swinson). She was a bog standard solicitor working on NHS contracts for most of her career, she has minimal political experience, minimal business experience.
Then, after competence, we get to whether objectives align with the electorate. Choosing between a socialist RBL / Corbyn view of the world, and a Johnson view of the world (he is looking like being Tory leader for 5+ years). Brexit aside, the crux appears to be whether Johnson is genuinely going to deliver for left behind communities, poorer people, strivers etc. If he does, he is clearly the best choice by a country mile, if it is all a con to get a majority, we are all stuffed.
(personally, I don’t think it is all a con, I think he is a dreamer, an idealist, and he will want to make these communities blue for a generation when he finally gives up the role, he wants to be cheered to the rafters when he walks down those high streets, though that could be naive on his part).
Re: General Election Is On
Depends on whether you’re using the dark or the light side of the force I think.Lancasterclaret wrote:Well, what else would you suggest?
Using the Force?
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Re: General Election Is On
For some-one who's considering voting for a Government led by Corbyn/McDonnell/Abbott to talk about the scales dropping from people's eyes is actually quite funny ....Lancasterclaret wrote:There is that.
But Labour took my vote in 2017 and effectively used it as a backing of Corbynism and all the things that go with that (good and bad). Granted they have been pulled closer and closer to remain by them actually looking at the analysis of who voted for them but the recent interview with RBL (Corbyn heir apparent) suggests to me that they are perfectly capable of doing it again.
At the moment, I'll be voting labour in my Lab-Con marginal but it will only take a few car crash interviews in which the fragile Labour consensus is shown to be exactly that for that to change.
I wouldn't worry too much at the moment though, the Conservatives election campaign is off to a terrible start.
- Rees Mogg
- Bridgen
- Doctored video
- Front page Stalinism spread in the Daily Johnson
If they keep this level up, then the scales will drop from the eyes of a hell of a lot of people.
If, by chance Labour do get in, they'll be back in 4 years time with the economy in a mess and strikes all over the place, saying they've not performed because they weren't allowed to be Socialist enough ....
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Re: General Election Is On
Its almost like you can't read anything that I've posted.Clarets4me wrote:For some-one who's considering voting for a Government led by Corbyn/McDonnell/Abbott to talk about the scales dropping from people's eyes is actually quite funny ....
If, by chance Labour do get in, they'll be back in 4 years time with the economy in a mess and strikes all over the place, saying they've not performed because they weren't allowed to be Socialist enough ....
Do you have some sort of customised blocker that means you can't see that I'm not keen on voting for either labour or the Conservatives?
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Re: General Election Is On
Evidence aplenty throughout this thread that the tories continue to capture the cloth cap vote along with the hard of thinking crew.
The Corbyn/McDonnell/Abbott axis of evil will strike fear throughout the "ordinary" and disenfranchised population as the truth is marginalised and information commissioned by the fattest pigs at the trough is drip fed into the streets.
I'd be wetting myself if I was Little Lord Mogg..or any of the gobbling pig crew..at the simplicity of it all....just make the plebs scared of Corbyn is a winning strategy...and needs no factual evidence to promote.
The Corbyn/McDonnell/Abbott axis of evil will strike fear throughout the "ordinary" and disenfranchised population as the truth is marginalised and information commissioned by the fattest pigs at the trough is drip fed into the streets.
I'd be wetting myself if I was Little Lord Mogg..or any of the gobbling pig crew..at the simplicity of it all....just make the plebs scared of Corbyn is a winning strategy...and needs no factual evidence to promote.
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Re: General Election Is On
It's a funny old world, James O'Brien agrees with me that the starmer video was doctored, so it would go viral.
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Re: General Election Is On
This is the bit I don't get thoughAndyClaret wrote:It's a funny old world, James O'Brien agrees with me that the starmer video was doctored, so it would go viral.
Why?
The kind of people who want to see and believe a doctored video are going to vote Tory regardless.
Everyone else will be going "is there anything they won't lie about?"
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Re: General Election Is On
JRM was woefully misquoted tbf , he was giving a conversational example of what you’d do if your house was on fire “ run like fcuk” isn’t too far of what he meant .Insensitive? Yes , appalling ? only for the easily offended left who know ( as we all do) the only chance Corbyn has is to smear the Tories . With Boris having multiple rattling skeletons in the cupboard and a very fragile Tory party as a whole it may yet bear fruit . Or certainly enough for a hung parliament ie a Corbyn victorymartin_p wrote:He asked for an example rather than a (currently) baseless opinion.
But Lancaster has it right, the focus today should be on JRM’s appalling comments (no editing needed).
Re: General Election Is On
Another Tory minister quits.
Re: General Election Is On
Quits the government a few hours before that government ceases to exist. But he hasn’t stood down as a candidate for the election.Spijed wrote:Another Tory minister quits.
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Re: General Election Is On
That debate was done to death a month ago.Lancasterclaret wrote:My problem with all that is that you haven't mentioned that he's a multiple proven liar.
I can understand normally political whataboutery, but under him the Tories have just abandoned that and now just lie.
I can't vote for that.
Ever.
It comes down to a judgement call as to whether you believe he will deliver in a way that benefits you and the people you care about (in my case, my family foremost and then the needs of ordinary UK people who haven't had chance to reach their full potential in life - I say UK because I’m optimistic but not a miracle worker, we can’t sort out the whole planet).
I agree that he has lied a lot, but he hasn’t done it to actively damage ordinary people much, more to cover his own back regarding affairs etc. My judgement is that he will deliver on many ways that I care about, so I’ll vote for him this time. Whereas Corbyn will ruin the lives of those people even more, blaming it on the rich, but ultimately stopping them thriving for the next decade or two. Like I say, if Johnson lets us down, we are all stuffed.
Oh, p.s. I don't think he has lied much recently, the bus is the big exaggeration, but compare and contrast to Swinson’s £50bn “Remain dividend” - total cobblers, and they are all at it, not just Johnson. You can’t vote Lib Dem when taking such a moral high ground on lying.
Re: General Election Is On
His words are there for all to hear. No mention of hindsight, no giving of examples, just a mention of the fire safety advice and that he’d have the common sense to ignore it. The insinuation is unambiguous.AlargeClaret wrote:JRM was woefully misquoted tbf , he was giving a conversational example of what you’d do if your house was on fire “ run like fcuk” isn’t too far of what he meant .Insensitive? Yes , appalling ? only for the easily offended left who know ( as we all do) the only chance Corbyn has is to smear the Tories . With Boris having multiple rattling skeletons in the cupboard and a very fragile Tory party as a whole it may yet bear fruit . Or certainly enough for a hung parliament ie a Corbyn victory
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Re: General Election Is On
We've got different ways of looking at things CC.CrosspoolClarets wrote:That debate was done to death a month ago.
It comes down to a judgement call as to whether you believe he will deliver in a way that benefits you and the people you care about (in my case, my family foremost and then the needs of ordinary UK people who haven't had chance to reach their full potential in life - I say UK because I’m optimistic but not a miracle worker, we can’t sort out the whole planet).
I agree that he has lied a lot, but he hasn’t done it to actively damage ordinary people much, more to cover his own back regarding affairs etc. My judgement is that he will deliver on many ways that I care about, so I’ll vote for him this time. Whereas Corbyn will ruin the lives of those people even more, blaming it on the rich, but ultimately stopping them thriving for the next decade or two. Like I say, if Johnson lets us down, we are all stuffed.
I don't think Johnson will do any of that, certainly up around here.
I don't know about Corbyn, but I'm struggling to see a downside of taxing billionaires a lot more, though there is a lot more of his policies I need to see written down to be honest.
I'm motivated by family first and foremost, which is why I'm just in favour of who looks best for the economy, so they have jobs and prospects in the future.
That isn't the Conservatives at the moment, and I never thought I'd say that about the economy with a Conservative Govt.
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Re: General Election Is On
And he also agreed that starmer had a mare regardless of the edit.Lancasterclaret wrote:This is the bit I don't get though
Why?
The kind of people who want to see and believe a doctored video are going to vote Tory regardless.
Everyone else will be going "is there anything they won't lie about?"
Re: General Election Is On
Oh well, as long as only some of his lies were designed to actively damage ordinary people that's alright!CrosspoolClarets wrote: I agree that he has lied a lot, but he hasn’t done it to actively damage ordinary people much
Re: General Election Is On
There was an article in the Guardian about this. The Tories believe that things like this being made viral will increase the chances of it being seen by people who will believe it. My take on this is that when I post or retweet it, elderly relatives will see it and be taken in.Lancasterclaret wrote:This is the bit I don't get though
Why?
The kind of people who want to see and believe a doctored video are going to vote Tory regardless.
Everyone else will be going "is there anything they won't lie about?"
We see on here that some people choose not to be worried about Johnson’s lack of honesty. I think most people don’t like him for it, but when it comes to the science of election campaigning I’m sure the Tories know what they’re doing, so I do my best not to give such messages the benefit of my contact lists.
Re: General Election Is On
It shows how out of touch a mansion dweller can be in considering a tower block with only one stair case and fire fighters ascending it. He might as well have said; “they should have gone out and stayed under the cover of one of the out-buildings not set aside for the staff”martin_p wrote:His words are there for all to hear. No mention of hindsight, no giving of examples, just a mention of the fire safety advice and that he’d have the common sense to ignore it. The insinuation is unambiguous.
Re: General Election Is On
Could you ever imagine JRM meeting people involved in the Grenfell Tower disaster and having genuine sympathy for them?AndrewJB wrote:It shows how out of touch a mansion dweller can be in considering a tower block with only one stair case and fire fighters ascending it. He might as well have said; “they should have gone out and stayed under the cover of one of the out-buildings not set aside for the staff”
He would look completely uncomfortable in that environment.
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Re: General Election Is On
Spijed wrote:Could you ever imagine JRM meeting people involved in the Grenfell Tower disaster and having genuine sympathy for them?
He would look completely uncomfortable in that environment.
I think the lower empathy you have in general the more right-wing you're likely to be. And JRM is very right-wing.
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Re: General Election Is On
I just want to thank this message board for being so informative on GE and voting rights of the homeless and others.
It’s amazing what you can do when you know the rules.
I now have my vote and 5 proxy votes plus another 6 in process.
It’s amazing I will have 12 votes to cast.
And legal too.
Up the clarets.
It’s amazing what you can do when you know the rules.
I now have my vote and 5 proxy votes plus another 6 in process.
It’s amazing I will have 12 votes to cast.
And legal too.
Up the clarets.
Re: General Election Is On
I think he exemplifies my thinking on private education: if you throw enough glitter on a turd, it will sparkle.Spijed wrote:Could you ever imagine JRM meeting people involved in the Grenfell Tower disaster and having genuine sympathy for them?
He would look completely uncomfortable in that environment.
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Re: General Election Is On
I've changed my mind. The BBC should just have Tories on their politics shows constantly. We wouldn't even need to edit the interviews to make them look bad.
Re: General Election Is On
Looks like Workington man won't vote for Boris. If that's the case what chance have the Tories in other Labour seats?
https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/statu ... 8754895872" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Lewis Goodall
@lewis_goodall
·
1h
7) Corbyn is unpopular here, huge concern about his views on nuclear industry.
8) nonetheless general consensus is, even among those not voting Lab and who aren’t fans of Corbyn, that Lab bloodlines still too strong, and that Workington at least will stay red.
https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/statu ... 8754895872" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Lewis Goodall
@lewis_goodall
·
1h
7) Corbyn is unpopular here, huge concern about his views on nuclear industry.
8) nonetheless general consensus is, even among those not voting Lab and who aren’t fans of Corbyn, that Lab bloodlines still too strong, and that Workington at least will stay red.
Re: General Election Is On
Is that official Brexit Party policy then?Lowbankclaret wrote:I just want to thank this message board for being so informative on GE and voting rights of the homeless and others.
It’s amazing what you can do when you know the rules.
I now have my vote and 5 proxy votes plus another 6 in process.
It’s amazing I will have 12 votes to cast.
And legal too.
Up the clarets.
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Re: General Election Is On
martin_p wrote:Is that official Brexit Party policy then?
Nope just personal learning from the great and good of this forum.
Plus knowing a few people who won’t vote and are not on the electoral Register.
If you cannot beat Labour, do as they do.
Re: General Election Is On
Glad you’ve accepted you won’t be beating Labour.Lowbankclaret wrote:Nope just personal learning from the great and good of this forum.
Plus knowing a few people who won’t vote and are not on the electoral Register.
If you cannot beat Labour, do as they do.
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Re: General Election Is On
Just caught up on today's events the 10 o'clock news. Boris really is like a parody character isn't he? Talks a lot but says nothing. Waffle, waffle, get Brexit done.
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Re: General Election Is On
Astonishing though it may seem, Johnstons election strategy appears to be based 100% based on the views of the, er, most extreme on this board.
Its certainly an interesting way to try to win an election to unite the whole country.
Its certainly an interesting way to try to win an election to unite the whole country.
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Re: General Election Is On
I'm doing it all the time aren't I?
No way I'm calling him Boris
No way I'm calling him Boris
Re: General Election Is On
Interesting that Lewis Goodall is saying it feels like 2017, too, in the North. I'm just going to pop this here, a post I made on the Brexit thread on 16th September at about the time when some brexiteers were (some still are) wrapping themselves in the comfort blanket of monumental Tory leads in the opinion polls:Spijed wrote:Looks like Workington man won't vote for Boris. If that's the case what chance have the Tories in other Labour seats?
https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/statu ... 8754895872" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
7) Corbyn is unpopular here, huge concern about his views on nuclear industry.
8) nonetheless general consensus is, even among those not voting Lab and who aren’t fans of Corbyn, that Lab bloodlines still too strong, and that Workington at least will stay red.
Spiral wrote:There's always the possibility that his braggadocious disregard for procedure, courtesy, rule of law etc is simply him playing to the gallery in order to nullify Farage - a sort of bombastic, recalcitrant, Trump-style of international 'diplomacy' - but his public appearances from his leasership bid onwards have been much, much weaker than I ever expected from him. Remember the accepted wisdom surrounding Theresa May; from day one of her leadership right through to the 2017 election, she was supposed to usher in a Tory reich, but this otherwise-serviceable stateswoman, up against bloody Jeremy Corbyn! cracked under the pressure and scrutiny of a GE. I'm calling it now: six months from now we'll be discussing how Johnson had the worst election campaign in living memory.
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Re: General Election Is On
At this time I think Burnley will return a Tory MP.martin_p wrote:Glad you’ve accepted you won’t be beating Labour.
As such your correct.
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Re: General Election Is On
Are you and your proxy crew voting Tory or Brexit?Lowbankclaret wrote:At this time I think Burnley will return a Tory MP.
As such your correct.
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Re: General Election Is On
Interesting that the Tories are banging this "get Brexit done then focus on the other important things like the NHS, schools, police...."
Brexit has obviously dominated the political landscape for the last 3.5 years but surely, if people really stepped back and thought about it, they'd want sorting our public services prioritising before leaving the EU.
Brexit has obviously dominated the political landscape for the last 3.5 years but surely, if people really stepped back and thought about it, they'd want sorting our public services prioritising before leaving the EU.
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Re: General Election Is On
An interesting but far from definitive poll of colleagues and fb friends. 50 people contacted.
2017...actual voted...23 Lab. 12 Con.. 7 LibDem..6 Abstain....2 Other.
2019.. intentions..same people...26 Lab..10 Con...5 LibDem...2 Abstain...5 Other....awaiting 2 responses.
NB..2 of the ""others"" are friends who have returned to Scotland and will be voting SNP. (1Lab + 1 Con)
It doesnt seem to support the Corbyn is unelectable myth that the brainwashed proles have been parroting for the last few years....but, as I said...a sample of 50 isnt definitive...
2017...actual voted...23 Lab. 12 Con.. 7 LibDem..6 Abstain....2 Other.
2019.. intentions..same people...26 Lab..10 Con...5 LibDem...2 Abstain...5 Other....awaiting 2 responses.
NB..2 of the ""others"" are friends who have returned to Scotland and will be voting SNP. (1Lab + 1 Con)
It doesnt seem to support the Corbyn is unelectable myth that the brainwashed proles have been parroting for the last few years....but, as I said...a sample of 50 isnt definitive...
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Re: General Election Is On
The only poll in Workington I've seen suggests the Tories will absolutely walk it.Spijed wrote:Looks like Workington man won't vote for Boris. If that's the case what chance have the Tories in other Labour seats?
https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/statu ... 8754895872" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Lewis Goodall
@lewis_goodall
·
1h
7) Corbyn is unpopular here, huge concern about his views on nuclear industry.
8) nonetheless general consensus is, even among those not voting Lab and who aren’t fans of Corbyn, that Lab bloodlines still too strong, and that Workington at least will stay red.
https://twitter.com/ElectionMapsUK/stat ... 6828580865" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: General Election Is On
2/1 Ladbrokes.Lowbankclaret wrote:At this time I think Burnley will return a Tory MP.
As such your correct.
Edit 9/4 William Hill
Last edited by If it be your will on Wed Nov 06, 2019 11:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: General Election Is On
Have you found out which Eton alumni will be standing in Burnley?Lowbankclaret wrote:At this time I think Burnley will return a Tory MP.
As such your correct.
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Re: General Election Is On
If it be your will wrote:The only poll in Workington I've seen suggests the Tories will absolutely walk it.
https://twitter.com/ElectionMapsUK/stat ... 6828580865" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
thats a bloke...with a twitter account...he'd predict a surge in support gor the Peaky Blinders if you bought him a pint.
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Re: General Election Is On
I'm not saying the poll isn't fixed, anything is possible, but it was conducted on behalf of the Mail, who wrote a story on it. I don't think it's just some bloke making polls up.fatboy47 wrote:thats a bloke...with a twitter account...he'd predict a surge in support gor the Peaky Blinders if you bought him a pint.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -seat.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: General Election Is On
Okay, time for some gold-standard analysis. I reckon you've got four types of Tory: the wet liberal type, posh arsehole type, middle manager/HR type, and the folks-Postman-Pat-met-on-his-paper-round type. May was the latter, Cameron distanced himself from his nature to become the liberal type, Boris is obvious, IDS was sort of amalgamation of HR and posh arsehole type. Then you've got your offshoots: a slightly pi$$ed version of your posh arsehole, a very pi$$ed mid-manager type, and some amalgamations of posh arsehole/denizen of Postman Pat's village, but it all boils down to four archetypes: 'wet', 'posh', 'tw@t' and 'fields of wheat', and the only Tories to win an outright majority in forever have been the slightly likeable, inoffensive wet ones, Cameron and Major. You're welcome, everyone!
Re: General Election Is On
If Corbyn is such a good guy, then why are so many of you embarrassed to openly support him?
Seems strange so many of you pretending to want to vote Lib Dem, yet they have absolutely no chance of winning an election
I always thought it was the tories that nobody wanted to admit voting for haha
Seems strange so many of you pretending to want to vote Lib Dem, yet they have absolutely no chance of winning an election
I always thought it was the tories that nobody wanted to admit voting for haha
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Re: General Election Is On
If it be your will wrote:I'm not saying the poll isn't fixed, anything is possible, but it was conducted on behalf of the Mail, who wrote a story on it. I don't think it's just some bloke making polls up.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -seat.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
with genuine respect...its totally accepted in journalistic circles that when polls are commisioned via these chancers , that they are told what results the paper wants....they are utter jokes...the Daily Mail will have commisioned the result here....not the poll.
Re: General Election Is On
What type of corbynites do you have?Spiral wrote:Okay, time for some gold-standard analysis. I reckon you've got four types of Tory: the wet liberal type, posh arsehole type, middle manager/HR type, and the folks-Postman-Pat-met-on-his-paper-round type. May was the latter, Cameron distanced himself from his nature to become the liberal type, Boris is obvious, IDS was sort of amalgamation of HR and posh arsehole type. Then you've got your offshoots: a slightly pi$$ed version of your posh arsehole, a very pi$$ed mid-manager type, and some amalgamations of posh arsehole/denizen of Postman Pat's village, but it all boils down to four archetypes: 'wet', 'posh', 'tw@t' and 'fields of wheat', and the only Tories to win an outright majority in forever have been the slightly likeable, inoffensive wet ones, Cameron and Major. You're welcome, everyone!
Ok, the main one. People who want other people to pay for their comfortable lifestyle, while not having to put a bit of effort into bettering themselves.
The delusional folk who hear all of his pie in the sky, socialist nonsense, and believe it, without even trying to comprehend who is going to finance it.
The old spinster, with no dependants, who just want to live out their final years living off the fat of the land, with no cares of who will have to pick up the bill.
And thick people who get all of their political news from facebook memes, terrified of having to pay for private healthcare.
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Re: General Election Is On
That I really don't know. I'd be slightly - but not totally - surprised if Survation were basically a 'cash for poll results' organisation. Out of interest, do you think all the polling organisations just produce the results that the commissioner wants (that is, every single poll is complete balls, hardly worth even looking at), or Survation's in particular?fatboy47 wrote:with genuine respect...its totally accepted in journalistic circles that when polls are commisioned via these chancers , that they are told what results the paper wants....they are utter jokes...the Daily Mail will have commisioned the result here....not the poll.
Re: General Election Is On
Surprised nobody has mentioned Bercow admitting that he was a massive remainer all along.
Not that it wasnt clear that he didnt respect his position and remain impartial.
Its little wonder the average man has such little disdain for the elected representatives of this country.
Good riddance to the poisonous dwarf
Not that it wasnt clear that he didnt respect his position and remain impartial.
Its little wonder the average man has such little disdain for the elected representatives of this country.
Good riddance to the poisonous dwarf
Re: General Election Is On
Oh dear heavens, were you under the impression I was referring to voters? Plenty of them are very nice. I'm sorry if I've assaulted your sensitivities, I thought it quite clear I was referring to the greasy pole climbers at the upper echelons of the party.Damo wrote:What type of corbynites do you have?
Ok, the main one. People who want other people to pay for their comfortable lifestyle, while not having to put a bit of effort into bettering themselves.
The delusional folk who hear all of his pie in the sky, socialist nonsense, and believe it, without even trying to comprehend who is going to finance it.
The old spinster, with no dependants, who just want to live out their final years living off the fat of the land, with no cares of who will have to pick up the bill.
And thick people who get all of their political news from facebook memes, terrified of having to pay for private healthcare.
Re: General Election Is On
At least come up with something original rather than some headline you might find in the Sun.Damo wrote: Its little wonder the average man has such little disdain for the elected representatives of this country.
Good riddance to the poisonous dwarf